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  1. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xianio View Post
    Oh obviously. It's not really the content of what he's said that's causing people to make fun of him - it's the delivery of the content that is resulting in him being mocked. After all, you two have "effectively" said very similar things yet nobodies mocking you. This of course is because you didn't enter this thread claiming the OP was a liar, insulting them and many others while comically misusing terms in an attempt to sound superior, only to later satire yourself almost perfectly.

    Ungood is just proving to be the "Bill O'reilly" of the DDO forums. If you don't know who that is just youtube it - TONS of people like to make fun of that guy. It's just a cheap laugh.

    lol. by all means, mock me too. afterall, i have also doubted the veracity of the OP's claims... i've just done so in a more diplomatic fashion.

    meh. thread has gone on too long as it is... with not much to show for it. bored now.

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  2. #82
    Community Member Ungood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xianio View Post
    I'm mocking you Ungood. To put it more bluntly, I'm using the same argumentative techniques that you have employed in order to show how silly you've been in this thread to provide a good chuckle for those reading who happen to care for one.
    LOL, So, you think are. But hey you admitted to arguing against what you already know is true. Thanks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Xianio View Post
    Oh obviously. It's not really the content of what he's said that's causing people to make fun of him - it's the delivery of the content that is resulting in him being mocked. After all, you two have "effectively" said very similar things yet nobodies mocking you.
    Last edited by Ungood; 10-17-2013 at 08:33 AM.

  3. #83
    Community Member Qhualor's Avatar
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    I could get behind a lfm check box or something to that affect that prevented hires from being summoned, but what happens when the party changes their mind half way through the quest? The party leader able to uncheck the box to summon hires?

    Another thing to think about are summons. I thought summons and Arty dogs were coded similarly to hires. Imagine the rage if a check box borked summons.

    I still won't sign party leaders having the power to boot hires.

  4. #84
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    lol. by all means, mock me too. afterall, i have also doubted the veracity of the OP's claims
    I wouldn't mock someone for having a difference of opinion. That's rude and makes me the ****. The OP might very well have been exaggerating, how could we know? Like I said, it's not the content of Ungood's arguments - it's the delivery.

    It's why it's funny to mock him while it would be rude to mock you. You don't mock the guy politely saying "I'm sorry, but I doubt the veracity of your claims as I have a significant amount of experience in this area and have yet to encounter what you describe." You mock the guy saying, "F you! You're a liar you liar! How dare you lie, prove it or gtfo. I refuse to accept other individuals claiming the same they're liars too! Pics or it didn't happen!"

    That guy is comedy gold.

    \/ Your need to make us somehow "understand" each other doesn't make my mocking of you any less spot on, nor does it allow you to save face.
    Last edited by Xianio; 10-17-2013 at 08:50 AM.

  5. #85
    Community Member Ungood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qhualor View Post
    I could get behind a lfm check box or something to that affect that prevented hires from being summoned, but what happens when the party changes their mind half way through the quest? The party leader able to uncheck the box to summon hires?

    Another thing to think about are summons. I thought summons and Arty dogs were coded similarly to hires. Imagine the rage if a check box borked summons.

    I still won't sign party leaders having the power to boot hires.
    Arti Dogs don't take up the same kind of slot in the party UI, that means their affect as far as the party goes is very different then how a Hire works, also, you can have a dog/pet on a raid but not a hire, so the code for such a feature is in the game already.

  6. #86
    Community Member Ungood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xianio View Post
    I wouldn't mock someone for having a difference of opinion. That's rude and makes me the ****. The OP might very well have been exaggerating, how could we know?
    Wow, we agree.

  7. #87
    Community Member kned225's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qhualor View Post
    I could get behind a lfm check box or something to that affect that prevented hires from being summoned, but what happens when the party changes their mind half way through the quest? The party leader able to uncheck the box to summon hires?

    Another thing to think about are summons. I thought summons and Arty dogs were coded similarly to hires. Imagine the rage if a check box borked summons.

    I still won't sign party leaders having the power to boot hires.
    Agreed. Where does it end? At some point players need to accept the risk that comes with playing with strangers

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  8. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ungood View Post
    There is no reading fail on my part, to be blunt, I don't believe they said in the LFM panel "No Hires", I believe they put up BYOH and left it at that.
    Irregardless, when the leader asks a party member to get rid of the hire because a player wants to join, then the hire should be dropped. period.
    Party member hires should in no way hold precidence over a leader trying to invite real players to join a party

    I believe the inability of the leader to remove hires from their own party when a player fails to do so is a failing of the DDO quest mechanic.
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    and several once viable raiding alts dumped into the packmule stables..

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  9. #89
    Community Member jonqrandom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ungood View Post
    I never said they didn't happen at all, and at no point was my argument based on "they don't exist"

    Where do you people get this stuff?
    pardon me, you didn't actually come right out and state that they didn't exist. now, i'm not sure that i or many other people believe you mean "very rare" instead of "non-existent" by "fertile mule", but if that's what you're claiming i'll live with that.

    so, if you accept that "no hires" LFMs exist, then your only reason for assuming that the OP is lying is that they're rare?


    Quote Originally Posted by Ungood View Post
    Trying to have discussions on this forum is like trying to argue with someone on an acid trip where they just make up what other people say and respond to that no matter how ignorant or foolish they look or sound doing so. No wonder I can't have discussions or make points with people like you. Maybe today you will learn how to read what people actually write.

    I don't think you will, in fact, I don't think you ever will, and as much as I may one day like to be, I don't believe I will ever be proven wrong either by the likes of you.

    TL-DR: If you can't respond to what I have actually said, stop showing your stupidity by quoting me and responding to some made up straw-man of yours.
    dear me, it seems i was in error about your opinion regarding the existence of "no hires" LFMs. how remiss of me.

    so tell me, how is it better that your outspoken belief that the OP is lying is based only on a likelyhood rather than a perceived certainty?
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  10. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ungood View Post
    And this is why I believe the OP just put up a BYOH-IP and is simply embellishing what they put in the LFM for the sake of their side of the discussion.
    Please list your in game characters.

    Cheers

  11. #91
    Community Member kned225's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonqrandom View Post
    so, if you accept that "no hires" LFMs exist, then your only reason for assuming that the OP is lying is that they're rare?
    Thats not why i assumed hes lying. I figured the op lied because he didnt want his thread derailed. He wanted to focus on the hireling mechanic, not the art of posting lfms and at what point its too late to recall/reform

    Do i KNOW hes lying? No. But i assume he is because it makes sense and i probably would have too

  12. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by kned225 View Post
    Thats not why i assumed hes lying. I figured the op lied because he didnt want his thread derailed. He wanted to focus on the hireling mechanic, not the art of posting lfms and at what point its too late to recall/reform

    Do i KNOW hes lying? No. But i assume he is because it makes sense and i probably would have too
    ^^ this here is a good example of the Mind Projection fallacy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mind_Projection_Fallacy

    But then again it is obvious that both sides of the argument appear not to respect each other, so "moar" fallacies please.

  13. #93
    Community Member jonqrandom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kned225 View Post
    Thats not why i assumed hes lying. I figured the op lied because he didnt want his thread derailed. He wanted to focus on the hireling mechanic, not the art of posting lfms and at what point its too late to recall/reform

    Do i KNOW hes lying? No. But i assume he is because it makes sense and i probably would have too
    hey, that's personal choice (and, uhhmm, interesting. thanks for sharing that).

    you know what you didn't do? you didn't pop up on the first page of the thread and call the OP a "total jerk" and accuse them of lots of "butt hurt" and needing to "grow some hair on your chest" in a post that has since disappeared but is quoted here (gee, i wonder why it vanished).

    it's one thing to have an opinion, and express it. it's another to act out and lay into another individual on the basis of that opinion, especially when that opinion is formed with no apparent evidence.
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  14. #94
    Community Member kned225's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enoach View Post
    ^^ this here is a good example of the Mind Projection fallacy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mind_Projection_Fallacy

    But then again it is obvious that both sides of the argument appear not to respect each other, so "moar" fallacies please.
    Mind projection fallacy is my friend. We figure out the world together. Right now its telling me you're a really cool guy

  15. #95
    Community Member Ungood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonqrandom View Post
    pardon me, you didn't actually come right out and state that they didn't exist. now, i'm not sure that i or many other people believe you mean "very rare" instead of "non-existent" by "fertile mule", but if that's what you're claiming i'll live with that.
    "Fertile Mule" or "When Mules Foal", is just a fancy way to say "Once in a Blue Moon" or other such phrasing to mean very rare.

    so, if you accept that "no hires" LFMs exist, then your only reason for assuming that the OP is lying is that they're rare?
    It was a matter of deduction, I found it very nonplussing that they would claim that they put "No Hires" in the LFM but in their second example, they were obviously OK with Hire for the start of the quest, and only had an issue once someone else wanted to join, so that leads me to believe that there was not any real "No Hire" directly stated in the LFM.

    Now, here is a good question, What is your motive to believe them beyond they said so, they could be lying or embellishing, and you have no way to know, so what is your motive to believe they are in fact telling the truth?

  16. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ungood View Post
    "Fertile Mule" or "When Mules Foal", is just a fancy way to say "Once in a Blue Moon" or other such phrasing to mean very rare.
    Berrrt - incorrect try again.

    A "fertile mule" is impossible, by definition. When using that phrase you're not saying "once in a blue moon" (which would mean rare, as blue moons DO happen, just extremely rarely) you're actually saying "never" because you're equating what you said to an impossibility.

    Swing and a miss my friend.

  17. #97
    DDO Trivia Champion alancarp's Avatar
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    Countdown to when Tolero or Cordovan closes this once-promising thread due to the degeneration into personal attacks: 5... 4... 3...

  18. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xianio View Post
    Berrrt - incorrect try again.

    A "fertile mule" is impossible, by definition. When using that phrase you're not saying "once in a blue moon" (which would mean rare, as blue moons DO happen, just extremely rarely) you're actually saying "never" because you're equating what you said to an impossibility.

    Swing and a miss my friend.
    Just to make sure you are clear on this; It is possible for a mule to foal, however, only 1 in a thousand embryos actually survive - It is documented and honestly rarer than a Blue Moon.

    But to be fair we don't know how often Ungood looks at the LFMs, what times they commonly play, so it is possible that in their mind the occurrence of such LFMs are rare, for them it is True. It may not matter to them that others have chimed in with different views, because these views cannot be substantiated by their own knowledge and view of the DDO world.

  19. #99
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    Lol really? Well I guess I'm wrong on that. Stupid 3 seconds of internet searching not being reliable.

  20. #100
    Community Member jonqrandom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ungood View Post
    It was a matter of deduction, I found it very nonplussing that they would claim that they put "No Hires" in the LFM but in their second example, they were obviously OK with Hire for the start of the quest, and only had an issue once someone else wanted to join, so that leads me to believe that there was not any real "No Hire" directly stated in the LFM.
    perhaps it's a mood thing - i can't know, you probably can't either. perhaps by that point they'd given up on bothering posting "no hires" because people ignored it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ungood View Post
    Now, here is a good question, What is your motive to believe them beyond they said so, they could be lying or embellishing, and you have no way to know, so what is your motive to believe they are in fact telling the truth?
    i didn't say they were telling the truth, or even that i thought they were telling the truth. i can't be bothered to rant about strawmen. here's a convenient rant from earlier. you may recognise it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ungood View Post
    Where do you people get this stuff? Trying to have discussions on this forum is like trying to argue with someone on an acid trip where they just make up what other people say and respond to that no matter how ignorant or foolish they look or sound doing so. No wonder I can't have discussions or make points with people like you. Maybe today you will learn how to read what people actually write.

    I don't think you will, in fact, I don't think you ever will, and as much as I may one day like to be, I don't believe I will ever be proven wrong either by the likes of you.

    TL-DR: If you can't respond to what I have actually said, stop showing your stupidity by quoting me and responding to some made up straw-man of yours.
    yeah, that'll do. right back at ya

    what i think is that it doesn't matter one way or the other, because whatever your beliefs regarding the probabilities are, the situations described are plausible (unlikely perhaps, but not implausible), and i'm going to respond to that because that's what's there on the page. if it's untruthful, then the OP is screwing themselves out of an honest discussion, but since i have (at least in this instance) no way of knowing one way or the other, it's irrelevant to me.
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