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  1. #61
    Community Member NaturalHazard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charononus View Post
    Griefing flowersniffers has been pretty fun lately. =P
    Im a flower sniffer can you come grief my runs please?

  2. #62
    Community Member Vellrad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ungood View Post
    May not have been due to players complaining, but due to the fact that the Dev's themselves did not want people to run the same 20 quests to the ground.
    IDK, daily playthorugh bonus encourages to run less quests, just few at day.
    Quote Originally Posted by Originally Posted by Random Person #2 View Post
    People who exploit bugs in code are cheaters cheaters cheaters. And they are big fat ****yheads too.

  3. #63

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    The XP ransack mechanic is one of the better things Turbine has done in a long time. It gives us the ability to not worry about how many times we farm Gianthold in heroic before we get to epic levels. It allows us to continually get high amounts of XP out of quests on a daily basis.
    This. Considering the raid timer of 3 days, you always get full xp for the raids. Which is just wonderful. Best change ever. Good times for the laid-back player. The old ransack mechanic was just awful, simply because you could not check how many completions you already had in advance. You needed to join group, run there and step in to see. Now you just need to know if you ran the quest more than 3 times the day before.
    Last edited by morkahn82; 10-15-2013 at 04:20 AM.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by erethizon View Post
    When I got into alpha testing there was a quest called Miller's Debt (which was just a shorter version of the one we have today). This quest consisted of talking to Miller (the quest started in the room with him) killing two iron defenders that attacked you after you spoke with him and then killing the boss iron defender in the room that opens up (exactly like the end of the current Miller's Debt quest). If you held a level running this quest was the fastest way to get to level 7 there was in the game (I think the exp stopped at 1 exp short of level 7 but it may have been 1 exp short of level 8). I leveled up many characters this way during alpha testing. It was boring and did not make for a good impression of the game, but it was certainly very efficient (and remember the level cap was 10 back then so this was a huge percentage of the total experience grind).

    Permanent quest ransacking was added to prevent exactly this type of behavior. Thankfully they recently realized that there was no need to make the ransacking permanent and so we now have quests that go from fully ransacked to totally unransacked in just 36 hours. The trouble with MMO players is that they will find the most efficient way to accomplish a goal, bore the heck out of themselves by using the most efficient method (no matter how tedious it is) and then complain that the game is terrible because it made the most efficient way to accomplish the goal extremely boring. A well designed game needs to make sure that the fastest way to accomplish a goal is also the most fun because a well designed game has to protect the players from their own stupidity. It shouldn't have to work that way, but it does. Games that fail to do this are considered boring by the masses and end up doing much more poorly than they would have if they had been designed to prevent players from ruining them.
    You could see the same behaviour with Impossible Demands and rusted blades, people farming the quests days on end then complaining about it. I guess that's one of the main reasons for the change (although a bit late), second being the valid complaint that quest ransack stuck between heroic and epic level quests and being forced to plan out the leveling process for it.

  5. #65
    Community Member Ivan_Milic's Avatar
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    It was done this way because of epic lvls and turbine raising lvl cap, adding 3 more million xp to get while adding only 15 quests(or how much in this last pack).

  6. #66
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    It's actually easy to adapt to the new system. My friend T (>30 TR's on that toon) and me went from 1 to 20 in 11 days with something less than 4 hours a day on average and it was our first TR with the new ransack system. You can still start at Harbor and hit lvl 3 just by farming Kobold's New Ringleader. That's actually how we did it. We weren't obsessed with max xp per minute: we did reasonable farming of the usual subjects but we also ran pretty much every single quest out there at least once in elite (3BC - restless isles included).

  7. #67
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charononus View Post
    Griefing flowersniffers has been pretty fun lately. =P
    Char, is it possible for you to admit that the NET xp changes have been positive for the players, and the devs appear to be listening?
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gary_Gygax
    No single character has all the skills and resources needed to guarantee success in all endeavors; favorable results can usually only be achieved through group effort. No single player character wins, in the sense that he or she defeats all other player characters; the goal of the forces of good can only be attained through cooperation, so that victory is a group achievement rather than an individual one.

  8. #68
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thrudh View Post
    Char, is it possible for you to admit that the NET xp changes have been positive for the players, and the devs appear to be listening?
    It's been positive for some players and negative for others. It has not been positive for all no matter how much you may want to close your eyes and wish it was so.

    edit*

    and that's the problem it's punitive to some for no reason other than to be punitive.

  9. #69
    Community Member Ausdoerrt's Avatar
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    The new system is great and I like it. Sure, 20% for each extra run is a bit harsh, but it's better than what we used to have, anyway. Encourages variety and gives additional choice.
    "People are stupid; given proper motivation, almost anyone will believe almost anything. ... People's heads are full of knowledge, facts, and beliefs, and most of it is false, yet they think it all true." Terry Goodkind

  10. #70
    Community Member Ryiah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zirun View Post
    For the hardcore XP/min crowd, they can start farming quests like Shadow Crypt 2/3 times per day.
    Even at -80% the Shadow Crypt is still insane XP. One life I did, shortly after the ransack system was introduced, I ran the Shadow Crypt so many times I lost track of the count. It was fantastic XP.
    Ryiah | Raeyah | Reikara
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  11. #71
    Community Member Lanhelin's Avatar
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    While I understand the ransack thing applied to dungeons, it's a bit disappointing that it applies to Wilderness areas too. In Wilderness areas there are Slayer quests with thousands of mobs to be killed as quest objectives, so if you want to complete these quests you have to enter the area multiple times or stay in by design. Obviously it's intended by the Devs to enter multiple times or stay in and wait for respawn, because otherwise the quest objectives are not completable. Eg. in The High Road you can stay for hours and kill the respawn, but there are also random rare encounters which the player has no influence on when or where they spawn. I did the 5k Slayer there within a couple of days and it happened, that the rare encounter "Trader Travels" where to kill a Fire Reaver occured not so rare, and now the chest is always empty. The rare encounter also doesn't disappear once on the map, and it happened, that there were three Fire Reaver "rares" at the same time on my map. I didn't want to kill them anymore, but when I don't do so, they remain there until I leave the map and reset it.

    Maybe it's some kind of luxury problem, but in this case I feel a bit punished by ransack for a thing I have no influence on. To solve this, ransacked rare encounters should simply stop to spawn until the ransack countdown is over, but not letting them spawn again and again with empty chests.

  12. #72
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charononus View Post
    It's been positive for some players and negative for others. It has not been positive for all no matter how much you may want to close your eyes and wish it was so.
    But this is not true anymore... Even before the new announcements, not being able to farm more 4-5 times (instead of 8-9 times) was a negative for powergamers, but gaining a 20% bonus on every quest went a long way to balancing that out.

    But after the new announcements (600k less needed to TR, exp smoothing, boost to Amrath and Cannith quests exp), even powergamers like you WILL be able to TR faster than before.

    So you (barely) had a reason to complain before, but not anymore. You will be able to TR faster than ever before, and yet you still see the devs moves as punitive.

    and that's the problem it's punitive to some for no reason other than to be punitive.
    You are so bitter you can't even see the good changes anymore.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gary_Gygax
    No single character has all the skills and resources needed to guarantee success in all endeavors; favorable results can usually only be achieved through group effort. No single player character wins, in the sense that he or she defeats all other player characters; the goal of the forces of good can only be attained through cooperation, so that victory is a group achievement rather than an individual one.

  13. #73
    Community Member Ausdoerrt's Avatar
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    ^ I think you're talking about a different type of ransack there Or do you mean to say that slayers/explorers lose XP if you reenter the area a few times? This has not been my experience so far...
    "People are stupid; given proper motivation, almost anyone will believe almost anything. ... People's heads are full of knowledge, facts, and beliefs, and most of it is false, yet they think it all true." Terry Goodkind

  14. #74
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kned225 View Post
    Its all about daily logins. Thats why we have daily bonus, daily dice etc. U know...like zynga

    Its for when turbine starts selling ingame advertising. Welcome to the Taco Bell Shard Exchange!
    Can I buy tacos with my shards? They'd at least be good for something then.

  15. #75
    The Hatchery
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    I tried hard to keep hating this, but in practice it's been good for me. Sure, it's cut down on my grind-the-same-quest-over-and-over but that's not a bad thing - I now get the xp I normally got from the repeat grind on other quests due to daily bonus. And come U20, we'll get lower TR xp cost - yay!

    I can see that it is a problem if you only play one (or a very few) character(s) for xp, but for me it's been good.
    <seemingly offensive Army of Darkness quote>

  16. #76
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soulfurnace View Post
    ...Tell me yer toons

    Zerg groups while also griefing flowersniffers sounds like arguably the best group I've joined in ages :P
    You guys need to move to Ghallanda. Tons of griefing targets.

    And you'll be able to hjeal meh.

  17. #77
    Community Member Lanhelin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ausdoerrt View Post
    ^ I think you're talking about a different type of ransack there Or do you mean to say that slayers/explorers lose XP if you reenter the area a few times? This has not been my experience so far...
    No, I mean the rare encounter chest ransack. When you loot a chest too many times, it's empty every time you open it again. While in dungeons, where the most players know where the chests are and doing dungeons mainly for XP, the Wilderness rares spawn by chance and them and their chests are something like a welcome change in the process of killing. Most Wilderness areas are static with no respawn, but the High Road and King's Forest (and I guess the Storm Horns too) are dynamic with mob and rare encounter respawn. Players have no influence on what and where respawning, and the whole respawn design is meant to let players stay in the area and not to leave and reset it, isn't it? So either the chest ransack should not count towards Wilderness chests or the rares shouldn't spawn again until the chest ransack is resetted.

  18. #78
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Strictly speaking from an XP / min perspective and ignoring all else, the only time it was better to farm one quest was when we were at XP cap. Otherwise the ransack penalty was perminent.

    So now, if I am so inclined, instead of waiting and not running specific quests until I am level 28 with capped leveling XP, I can farm the shinola out of them anyhow, and get 12k per run even when at -80% base, which is where the ransack penalty bottoms out - and this is even before potions and tomes for those who buy those for grinding XP.

    If I dont want to grind the same quest multiple times per day, I can grind the same high Xp quests three times per day. Next day I will have zero ransack penalty. It goes down at a rate of 20% per repetition. So first run is at full, second run -20, third run -40. We get back 50% per day. So even after three runs of von 5 today, I can run it again tomorrow, and get 100% XP all over again.
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  19. #79
    Community Member Ausdoerrt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lanhelin View Post
    No, I mean the rare encounter chest ransack. When you loot a chest too many times, it's empty every time you open it again. While in dungeons, where the most players know where the chests are and doing dungeons mainly for XP, the Wilderness rares spawn by chance and them and their chests are something like a welcome change in the process of killing. Most Wilderness areas are static with no respawn, but the High Road and King's Forest (and I guess the Storm Horns too) are dynamic with mob and rare encounter respawn. Players have no influence on what and where respawning, and the whole respawn design is meant to let players stay in the area and not to leave and reset it, isn't it? So either the chest ransack should not count towards Wilderness chests or the rares shouldn't spawn again until the chest ransack is resetted.
    Oh, so yeah, that's a separate issue. Sounds like the respawn mechanic may need some tweaking, but chest ransack is functioning absolutely fine.

    Some rare encounter chests in certain areas can drop rare/valuable/named items or ingredients, and can be farmed easily thanks to reset. Therefore, chest ransack is absolutely necessary on these just like in the quests.
    "People are stupid; given proper motivation, almost anyone will believe almost anything. ... People's heads are full of knowledge, facts, and beliefs, and most of it is false, yet they think it all true." Terry Goodkind

  20. #80
    Community Member kned225's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    Can I buy tacos with my shards? They'd at least be good for something then.
    EE Crunchwraps Supreme

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