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  1. #1
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    Default 2nd epic destiny feat

    Hello,

    I wonder what second epic destiny feat should I take.

    I have FTR/MNK/CLR splash in FotW with two Nightmares to Woo Woo stuff in epics. It works reat so far, the first epic destiny feat is Perfect Two Weapon Fighting.

    Now I wonder what should be the second.

    I like the idea of Holy Strike - anyone who runs Shadowfell can give e any estimate of how much stuf there is evil? Are Shadar-kai evil?
    Then again, I like the Elusive Target - I am already hiding behind improved evasion, Incorporeality, displacement and 27 dodge, so this could help me even more.
    Most interesting choice by far is First Blood - how exactly does this work? I have woo woo sticks (Nightmares), so I will be constantly lowering any mob maximum HP - will that mean that First Blood will work for much longer period of time? Does it make it worth it? I am of course, using sense weaknes, so that may be a factor too.


    Would like advice here - what do you think is the best 2nd epic destiny feat for me a and why?

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    Holy Strike is a 5% chance for 10d6 damage....Ghost Touch is negligible, you should have an Ethereal item anyway :P The damage alone only works out to 1.75 per hit, and only against Evil enemies, which of course is laughable for such a high-level feat.

    The same logic applies to First Blood. 5d20 damage, but only procs every 3 seconds, so you're only adding ~18 DPS, and only 10% of the time. Sticking negative levels will actually cause monsters to drop below the 90% level faster, since that top 10th percentile shrinks, while you continue to do damage at a steady rate.

    I think you're right about Elusive Target, another stacking avoidance is much better than a negligible DPS boost. With 25% Incorp, 20% Conceal, 27% Dodge, you're already avoiding 56.2% of attacks. Stack another 5% on there, and you're up to 58.4%, so that feat is negating almost 3% of incoming physical damage alone.

    Some other options to consider are +2 Tactics DC, if you're big on the Stunning Fist, etc....Mass Frog, too, if you've pumped a lot of WIS, gives you an AOE CC.

  3. #3
    Community Member Soulfurnace's Avatar
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    Holy strike: 10d6 on vorpal. 10-60 on vorpal, (10+60)/2 = 35. 35/20 = 1.75
    1.75 per hit. Sounds pretty average, so I'd avoid that, unless you want ghost touch?

    Elusive target... meh. Assuming easy-to-get defences..
    .5*.75*.9*.95 versus .5*.75*.9*.95*.95 (Displacement+25% dodge+10% incorp+enemy rolls a 1, versus (Displacement+25% dodge+10% incorp+enemy rolls a 1+elusive target)
    Or, 32.1% versus 30.5% chance to be hit.
    Seems pretty meh, but better than nothing.

    First blood deals 52.5 dmg every 3 seconds, or 17.5 dps when enemy hp>90%. Seems pretty worthless, most enemies aren't >90% for long, but each to their own.

    Yeah. They all sound pretty average.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Soulfurnace View Post
    Holy strike: 10d6 on vorpal. 10-60 on vorpal, (10+60)/2 = 35. 35/20 = 1.75
    1.75 per hit. Sounds pretty average, so I'd avoid that, unless you want ghost touch?

    Elusive target... meh. Assuming easy-to-get defences..
    .5*.75*.9*.95 versus .5*.75*.9*.95*.95 (Displacement+25% dodge+10% incorp+enemy rolls a 1, versus (Displacement+25% dodge+10% incorp+enemy rolls a 1+elusive target)
    Or, 32.1% versus 30.5% chance to be hit.
    Seems pretty meh, but better than nothing.

    First blood deals 52.5 dmg every 3 seconds, or 17.5 dps when enemy hp>90%. Seems pretty worthless, most enemies aren't >90% for long, but each to their own.

    Yeah. They all sound pretty average.
    Responding to last persoon that responded, but actually reacting to all of you and thx for reacting)

    Ah, I missed that Holy strike works on vorpal only. Thought its critical. Okay, that one is garbage.


    Elusive target is IMHO decent. 5% is nice. I preffer not to be hit.

    Yeah, Firstblood... meh. Thought it could have some synergy with level drain, but prolly not much anyway.

    So... hmmmm.... what about Guardian Angel?

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    Community Member Soulfurnace's Avatar
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    Oh, damnation! He ninja'd me while I was busy on reddit (with a few dozen tabs open)

    Whatever, I prefer my math, and I didn't resort to ~18. Psh.

    Guardian angel.. +8 to saves, +50 (maybe) to prr, once per 5 minutes... eh. Better than nothing, I guess...

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    30 secs every 3 mins, not 5....so up to 16.67% of the time (no rounding this time :P).

    Guess it depends what your baseline PRR and saves are. If the former is low and the latter is high, this feat benefits you more. Also, if you have something like Reactive Heal or Death Pact or Rise of the Phoenix, you'll get more mileage out of this since it'll synergize with similar "oh-cr@p" boosts.

    Also, if your deaths seem to be from being one- or two-shot (ie traps, big nuke spells) more often than being swarmed, Guardian Angel is worth less since it wont protect you from instagibs that take you from +50% to 0% in one go...

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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    30 secs every 3 mins, not 5....so up to 16.67% of the time (no rounding this time :P).

    Guess it depends what your baseline PRR and saves are. If the former is low and the latter is high, this feat benefits you more. Also, if you have something like Reactive Heal or Death Pact or Rise of the Phoenix, you'll get more mileage out of this since it'll synergize with similar "oh-cr@p" boosts.

    Also, if your deaths seem to be from being one- or two-shot (ie traps, big nuke spells) more often than being swarmed, Guardian Angel is worth less since it wont protect you from instagibs that take you from +50% to 0% in one go...
    Now this is interesting.

    I have 97 PRR and saves that could use a little boosting. I generally dont get two shoted, I get swarmed.

    I have incorp from monk, 27 Dodge, 20 displace and imp evasion.

    Would you consider better addition stacking 5% of miss chance or the angel stuff?
    Last edited by viktorserak; 10-14-2013 at 07:23 AM.

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    Community Member Soulfurnace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by viktorserak View Post
    Now this is interesting.

    I have 97 PRR and saves that could you a little boosting. I generally dont get two shoted, I get swarmed.

    I have incorp from monk, 27 Dodge, 20 displace and imp evasion.

    Would you consider better addition stacking 5% of miss chance or the angel stuff?
    In this instance, I'd say guardian angel. That's just me, but I also messed up how active it was. (It's 1/6, as opposed to the 1/10 I said. Goddamnit, you did round, else we'd still be seeing 6's. Exact values ftw!)

    Either works, but if you pick elusive target, a word of advice. That feat's worth shrinks dramatically as you gain other sources of dmg mitigation, such as displacement. (Tier II aspect of dust on shroud, one fire, one air on a staff (best in the long run imo.))

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    Quote Originally Posted by viktorserak View Post
    Hello,

    I wonder what second epic destiny feat should I take.

    I have FTR/MNK/CLR splash in FotW with two Nightmares to Woo Woo stuff in epics. It works reat so far, the first epic destiny feat is Perfect Two Weapon Fighting.

    Now I wonder what should be the second.

    Would like advice here - what do you think is the best 2nd epic destiny feat for me a and why?
    Epic mage armor would give you significant tankyness. Woo Woo is going away as per the update 20 patch notes, so enjoy it while it lasts. It is being fixed from on crit to chance on crit as the text describes.
    Last edited by Tilomere; 10-14-2013 at 04:02 PM.

  10. #10
    Community Member Soulfurnace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tilomere View Post
    Epic mage armor would give you significant tankyness. Woo Woo is going away as per the update 20 patch notes, so enjoy it while it lasts. It is being fixed from on crit to chance on crit as the text describes.
    I demand a link to this dev post, due to lazy search-fu. (Also, epic mage armour sucks.)

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by Soulfurnace View Post
    I demand a link to this dev post, due to lazy search-fu. (Also, epic mage armour sucks.)
    Its in the Update 20 release notes on Lamannia. No search fu required.

    Basically, it doesn't always drain levels on a critical.

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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by viktorserak View Post
    I have 97 PRR and saves that could use a little boosting. I generally dont get two shoted, I get swarmed.
    Quote Originally Posted by Soulfurnace View Post
    Either works, but if you pick elusive target, a word of advice. That feat's worth shrinks dramatically as you gain other sources of dmg mitigation, such as displacement.
    Conversely, the value of Guardian Angel goes down as your base PRR gets higher, since there's diminishing returns. Going from 97 to 147 PRR only negates about 9% more damage than before (58.79 at 100, to 49.39, at 150). The saves will benefit more than the PRR will.

    Going from 56.2 to 58.4 total avoidance (using my earlier numbers, I think they were right?) negates 3.9% of total incoming physical damage. Going from 49 to 58 PRR reduction, for 1/6 the time (so assuming optimal conditions) negates 3.06, though that also helps with your saves vs spells too.

    I think, overall, the extra Avoidance will help you more, at least statistically, if your problem is usually dying to lots of melee attacks - though GA, when it does trigger, will trigger when you "really need it", which is impossible to quantify Really, its probably 6 one way or half a dozen the other - I personally prefer smaller all-the-time bonuses to larger but situational bonuses, but that's just a preference.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    Conversely, the value of Guardian Angel goes down as your base PRR gets higher, since there's diminishing returns. Going from 97 to 147 PRR only negates about 9% more damage than before (58.79 at 100, to 49.39, at 150). The saves will benefit more than the PRR will.

    Going from 56.2 to 58.4 total avoidance (using my earlier numbers, I think they were right?) negates 3.9% of total incoming physical damage. Going from 49 to 58 PRR reduction, for 1/6 the time (so assuming optimal conditions) negates 3.06, though that also helps with your saves vs spells too.

    I think, overall, the extra Avoidance will help you more, at least statistically, if your problem is usually dying to lots of melee attacks - though GA, when it does trigger, will trigger when you "really need it", which is impossible to quantify Really, its probably 6 one way or half a dozen the other - I personally prefer smaller all-the-time bonuses to larger but situational bonuses, but that's just a preference.
    You guys are forgetting the fact that elusive target only has a chance to proc when you are going to RECEIVE damage. That means, after all concealment, dodge, AC and blur/displacement WAS ALREADY penetrated. From 100% of the attacks that WOULD inevitably hit you, it negates 5%. Seems little, but I do think it helps.
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