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  1. #1
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    Default I think melee is good now...can we have some ranged?

    Its pretty clear that Update 19 is the Age of Meelefication...19.0 saw the devs try to boost melee Artis, making it much easier and more powerful to be a BS/D.axe Arti. Then Clerics and FVS got Warpriest, some melee ability. Now Arcanes are getting Eldritch Knight, so they can have some in-class melee ability as well.

    That's great and good, and I'm all for diversification of classes, not everyone is forced into the same cookie cutter. However....WHY all the focus on MELEE? People want to build ranged characters too!

    We got AA, and that was fantastic, finally bow users have something other than spamming the old Slaying Arrows and hoping for vorps. But so much of the new stuff since U19 has been obligately melee - it doesn't work with ranged weapons. It especially doesn't work with xbows. You cant synergize any of the new stuff with ranged combat... As a result, ranged chars are still largely confined to cut the same 2-3 cookies as they always were:

    Repeaters = Arti. Mechanic doesn't really get anything special, and you probably will splash /2 Arti anyway for runearms and Summon Bolts, which cant be scrolled

    Bows = Monkcher. There still isn't any way to get a decent ROF without cycling in 10KS; anything without 10KS is ultimately a flavor build, or at least a non-DPS build (buffer, healer, hybrid archer-caster, etc.). There isn't really enough deep in DWS or AA to warrant going pure Ranger for archery.

    Can we see a little love tossed towards ranged combat? Attacks that work with ranged as well as melee combat. Bonuses to bows and xbows. Defensive passives that don't require S&B/TWF. Some meaningful Doublestrike that isn't confined to capstones (like the T-A doublestrike attack, but ranged) so archers can achieve a decent ROF. Some AOE ability, aside from IPS and hoping the enemies stay lined up for you. Tweaks to Warpriest/EK(/Warchanter?) that make it feasible to use them with bows/xbows (especially since SF favored weapon IS a bow, for WP).

  2. #2
    Community Member Raoull's Avatar
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    Unfortunately.... it would probably be a really bad idea to further boost ranged combat.

    The problem is EE, and the mobs AI. The mobs do so much damage, that being able to avoid being hit is a huge advantage. And nothing say "you can't hit me, nyah nyah" than simply hitting them from a distance while running around like a crazed chicken.

    And the current state of power for a ranged toon... is rather huge. Mind you, most of that is in Fury shot, but that alone is pretty ridiculous.

    And your options aren't quite as limited as you make them out to be. Rangers are still very viable (or maybe, are now very viable), and you see a number of melees who'll dip into ranged for Many shot (not unlike the core abilities of a ranger).

    Sure, some of the more flavorful ranged builds could use a boost, but it is very hard to do that in such a way that doesn't also boost more powerful ranged builds. Perhaps something in the lvl 18/20 core enhancements of Mechanic
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  3. #3
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Default

    DWS added a lot to pure or small splash ranger ranged builds.

  4. #4
    The Hatchery Urist's Avatar
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    It would be nice if archery were a viable option in heroic levels.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raoull View Post
    And the current state of power for a ranged toon... is rather huge. Mind you, most of that is in Fury shot, but that alone is pretty ridiculous.
    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    DWS added a lot to pure or small splash ranger ranged builds.
    Agreed, once you get maxed out in Fury, your power level rises exponentially. However, that's the Epic extension of the Heroic cookie-cutting I was talking about...

    Plus, I think the damage there is already done. Adrenaline + Slaying Arrows is already there, and I don't think if they made any other Enhancement attacks ranged-compatible, it would be any more powerful than what's already in game....you can only Adrenaline one attack at a time, after all.

    DWS added sniper shot and a handful of sneak die. And, really, after you take your 6 RGR levels for that, what else do you do? Take 6 monk levels for 10KS. And then....whatever, 8 Fighter for Kensei? 8 Cleric for self-heals? Just more Monk? In Heroic, there is Ranger and there is Monk (for bow archery), and nothing else really syngergizes with archery past that. In Epic, there is Fury for DPS and Shiradi for CC. Those are your cookies, enjoy...

  6. #6
    Community Member Teen's Avatar
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    Ranged damage is so op anyway no way in the world do I want to see it boosted anymore.

    Heroic levels are a joke anyway

    Like chai said DWS adds damage to bows, and stuff.


    Melee artis aren't even alive, u19 only helped divine melees , besides being able to be stanced with a weapon type/get monk stances, but most ranged builds already had this so...
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  7. #7
    Community Member Lonnbeimnech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teen View Post
    Melee artis aren't even alive
    I had noticed a dramatic drop in the amount of juggernauts running around, what happened exactly?

  8. #8
    Community Member Eistander's Avatar
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    I have to agree with the previous posters, as DDO has come a heck of a long way to where ranged combat was a total (and cruel) joke, to where it is now, to where those "cookie-cutter" options that we have now are now so powerful in the right circumstances, that boosting the non-cutter (I loathe that term, but its the best I got) options will only further push those who are multiclassed to maximize their efficiency. Rangers on their own do have some significant options to them now compared to before, and are much better off for it. Artificers have their own tricks available to them as well (sure, as a stand-alone class, they are tough to get to the level of multiclass splits, but that is the reality of the system). I would rather see melee, especially pure class options have that special something to really make it worthwhile to everyone to stay pure. The capstones and options in the trees while nice do not nearly work as well as a good split.

    Paladins, I am looking at you (and having a geared Helves Angel turned Monkcher), as well as my barb.. I hate IV'ing to another, or tickling things that can't necessarily kill me either. Just my 2 copper.
    Science may be theory, but stupidity is proven.

  9. #9
    Community Member Teen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lonnbeimnech View Post
    I had noticed a dramatic drop in the amount of juggernauts running around, what happened exactly?
    Enhancement pass to battle engineer ; People now TWF jugg but isn't nearly as popular now\.
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  10. #10
    Community Member Phaeton_Seraph's Avatar
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    It feels like my paralysing repeaters have been nerfed. While rangers can paralyse everything.

  11. #11
    Community Member FlaviusMaximus's Avatar
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    I feel pretty good about ranged DPS right now and saying this goes against every self-serving fiber in my body, since I have a couple ranged characters. One is a monkcher at 26, one is a repeater build in heroic levels (12 rogue/6ranger/ 2 arti). Perhaps ranger could use an additional slight boost to ranged dps at 18 or 20 to make up for not taking 10k stars, but the fact that rangers that skip 10k can be strength based rather than wisdom based (giving them more damage per hit) and access overwhelming crit easier helps to even them out a bit already.

    One thing that I would really like to see get altered, is the way that sniper shot works with a repeater. I haven't had a ton of practice using sniper shot on the repeater yet, and I imagine it will get easier, but since the crossbow is in the midst of being reloaded 2/3 of the time, it is difficult for me to not waste half my sniper shots by missing the narrow window to trigger it. You can click sniper shot anytime and put it back on timer whether a shot fires or not. If clicking sniper shot on a repeater applied to the next shot fired or if it wasn't clickable during reloading phases, it would be helpful.
    Last edited by FlaviusMaximus; 10-13-2013 at 07:53 PM.

  12. #12
    Community Member HernandoCortez's Avatar
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    Barbarians still suck...

  13. #13
    Community Member NaturalHazard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Urist View Post
    It would be nice if archery were a viable option in heroic levels.
    Yeah AA's being able to lock down nearly everything with archery at heroic levels is just so weak sauce........................

  14. #14
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Ranged need nothing at this time.

  15. #15
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HernandoCortez View Post
    Barbarians still suck...
    Yup.

  16. #16
    Community Member NaturalHazard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    Ranged need nothing at this time.
    Maybe melee needs an ability where they can still do some dps while jumping around backwards like a bunch of reversing kangaroos on krack?

    Like epic level bleed dots, we hit em, dance backwards they bleed out, for 1/3 or even 1/4 of the dps we would normally do to em standing toe to toe? then we hit em again to restart the dot.........even that be weaksauce to caster/ranged dps from a safe distance lawl.

  17. #17
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NaturalHazard View Post
    Maybe melee needs an ability where they can still do some dps while jumping around backwards like a bunch of reversing kangaroos on krack?

    Like epic level bleed dots, we hit em, dance backwards they bleed out, for 1/3 or even 1/4 of the dps we would normally do to em standing toe to toe? then we hit em again to restart the dot.........even that be weaksauce to caster/ranged dps from a safe distance lawl.
    Or they can spend a few feats, invest in a ranged option, and stop being gimps.

  18. #18
    Community Member NaturalHazard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    Or they can spend a few feats, invest in a ranged option, and stop being gimps.
    yeah I mean cause its so cheap to get the so called ranged option.............once you do that you might as well go the whole deal and just be ranged anyway.

    going to get the dex high enough for improved precise shot, many shot and all that jazz..........oh what are we going to do when manyshot is off timmer? Might as well do monk splash and get 10k stars, ok dex/wis based now? might as well range most the time and only melee to build up Ki for 10k stars whats that? oh yeah.
    Last edited by NaturalHazard; 10-13-2013 at 08:54 PM.

  19. #19
    Community Member Soulfurnace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NaturalHazard View Post
    yeah I mean cause its so cheap to get the so called ranged option.............once you do that you might as well go the whole deal and just be ranged anyway.

    going to get the dex high enough for improved precise shot, many shot and all that jazz..........oh what are we going to do when manyshot is off timmer? Might as well do monk splash and get 10k stars, ok dex/wis based now? might as well range most the time and only melee to build up Ki for 10k stars whats that? oh yeah.
    Manyshot is the highest burst DPS option you really get.

    Sure, it's feat heavy, but is it worth it?

    Yes. Yes it is.

  20. #20
    Community Member NaturalHazard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soulfurnace View Post
    Manyshot is the highest burst DPS option you really get.

    Sure, it's feat heavy, but is it worth it?

    Yes. Yes it is.
    yes it is, but when you get it, you get tempted........improved precise shot.............damn.........now 10k star.........damn......................

    It sucks though when you use it then you got 2minutes plinking away while the monkchers, and casters are tearing everything apart, i often give up and chase mobs chasing the kangaroos on krack, whacking em on the back, till they turn lol or hopefully die.

    sheesh I like melee toons, with a ranged option, I think thats cool, thats why I so wanted to play a ranger when I first got into this game, get to have 2wf and the ranged feats!!!

    But im a bit disapointed with the mobs though and EE basically just jump and Kite around ftw!!!! even the latest mobs support this tactic, rinse repeat........meh, wish they could come up with something different that might make people rethink using this tactic exclusively for 100% of content is all.
    Last edited by NaturalHazard; 10-13-2013 at 09:07 PM.

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