Page 15 of 16 FirstFirst ... 5111213141516 LastLast
Results 281 to 300 of 317
  1. #281
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    187

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by wtorchia View Post
    6 sorc gives you firewall for the early levels. Sorc, Paladin, and Cleric can all make use of a high Char so they all play well together. The way I look at a build like this is that you will be hard pressed to get into groups. So you have to be able to solo. Going Warforged could make that easier. You could then drop the cleric side without any problems.

    I looked at a 12 wiz build for wraith. I would think that would be more of a monk type build. Not a big fan of those. Maybe Warforged Monk, paladin, Sorc could work? High char with paladin will give you good saves. Maybe 12 paladin / 6 sorc / 2 monk.

    If I could get the aura from cleric and the burst from EK I would be happy. What type of numbers are being put out by the Eldritch Tempest attack?
    about 400-500 damage with a a 1 handed weapon at 300 acid spell power and 170 force. I would assume at 300 force and an actual Epic level 2 hander the damage would be around the 800s. Part of the reason the damage is getting crippled so far is that the spell portion of the eldritch attacks can't crit and they are unaffected by metas. They will however almost never miss. Best defense and spell damage potential I found was sorc 20 41 savant/39 ek split, Best melee potential was 20 wizard AP depends on what Slas you valued and if you wanted to use cleaves. Any sorc that going to want healing needs to splash 3 wizard and go zombie. Death auras will do around 100-200 every 2 seconds healing in sub par negative gear and negative burst will heal 300-500+. If your a sorc forgo splashing a fighter / cleric for heavy armor your going to get more hp boost, faster access to healing and almost the same PRR. Cleric splashes seem to need far more investment and levels to generate the same amount of healing from just 3 wizard. You also don't need to sac even more gear slots and ap for things like healing amp.

    Wizard could splash some barb for another cleave if they were going LD. They would have enough feats to support having all the cleaves.

    So 20 sorc, 20 wizard, 17 sorc/ 3 wizard, 17 wizard/ 3 barb. EDs will probably be between Avatar or Drednaught depending on if you are two weapon fighting or two handed fighting.

  2. #282
    2014 DDO Players Council
    Alt-pletionist
    IronClan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    7,171

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by HatsuharuZ View Post
    It would be awesome if the max caster levels of those spells could be uncapped via an enhancement in the EK tree. And unlike more traditional casters, an EK has a reason to use these.
    No one uses them because they are awful, finicky, fiddley, "you're not facing mob x" as well as underpowered at best. And they put you in close proximity to things that can kill you quickly which this PrE is only very poorly addressing (it adds no where remotely enough survival to make melee viable on a sorc, and only has synergy with a PM due to PM tree having 30 hit points, wraith form incorp, and Wiz abundance of feats making it easier to take shields and armor for PRR, and melee feats.)

    Besides a nifty flavorful but still probably EE viable "armored apparition" build PM/archmage/EK build that occasionaly melees to finish off stragglers but mostly shiradi spams (only really investing in the first core cleave and a few ASF tid bits for heavy armor PRR with the rest of your ap's spent elsewhere) I'm not seeing the sorc love here.
    You guys filibustering a new mode have already succeeded in scaring the Dev's into not doing it the right way and re-scaling the existing settings, why in the world are you still filibustering? Drunk on your success? Schadenfreude? Spitefulness?

  3. #283
    Community Member Saravis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    1,406

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by IronClan View Post
    I'm not seeing the sorc love here.
    Agreed, the only "advantage" the sorc can get is the extra strength splashing a class with Divine Might and the better saves with the Paladin class. Overall this PrE is so absurdly favorable to the wizard.

  4. #284
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    265

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by wtorchia View Post
    So I took a stab at a hybrid build. Let me know your thoughts.

    Level 28 Lawful Good Human Male
    (8 Paladin \ 6 Cleric \ 6 Sorcerer \ 8 Epic)

    The planner does not have the EK enhancement yet. They will be taken to tier 5 for the cleave, ASF and Tenser's Transformation. The idea behind this build is to have good melee damage, self healing, and some party healing. The high CHR should give 15+ turns for the burst. I went TWF with the intent to fit in Ameliorating Strike, but there just are not enough AP.
    Nice idea, but it needs some key improvements.

    Heavily feat starved, I would not go two weapon. Just go 2-hander, grab cleave+great cleave, and ignore the 2h feat-line. I would pick cleave at level 1, it just makes early levels so much easier (assuming TR and not LR of course).

    Extend. With low levels of each caster class, your buffs are going to be pain to manage. Especially haste and displacement, and if you don't use those, why go arcane melee in the first place? I've leveled a couple of 8bard/x/y builds, and with extend, the duration of haste/displacement is just bearable. Without, the 30+second duration is just too painful. Sure, you can activate them for the big fights, but especially for haste, might as well use the 30-second potions, same short effect, no mana.

    Spell selection. With 6 sorc levels you're hurting. 7th sorc would give a second 3rd level spell, fitting both haste and displacement (early levels: fireball). For firewall you would need the 8th sorc level. Probably doable as well, but it would push the gained PL from paladin to sorc. I'm thinking 7 paladin / 7 sorcerer / 6 cleric would work the best, second level paladin spells are pretty meh so you can get away with 7. Or even 2/4/6 paladin, 6 cleric, rest sorc.

  5. #285
    Community Member Dylvish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    528

    Default

    I like the concept over all, however there are a couple of things I have seen (and also encountered) that I do feel strongly need to be changed.

    1) REMOVE the spell point drain on the weapon buff. Give it an initial cost for turning on the toggle, and leave it alone. Losing spell points every 6 seconds just for having it going just drains it too fast, and removes one of the advantages of the PRE (longevity of spell bar).

    2) Increase the weapon damage buffs a bit. They don't have to hit like outright spells nukes, but they should do more than they do currently. EK will probably not tank as well as a true tank, they should do more damage at least. Maybe let a small portion of spell damage affect it, or as a bonus for actually buying all elements of it, let them toggle 2 (or add secondary effects).

    3) I agree with what others have said about Eldritch Blade. Just compare it to what the other classes and PRE's get and I think you will understand why we think it is so underwhelming. +10% melee damage, and +25 SP on an arcane class, and only for a very short duration is simply not worth the point expenditure. Change it to what? I do not know, but this is not it.

    4) Put in the ability (deep in the tree) to use INT / CHA for hit & damage mods. As stated, it is not only appropriate, it is nothing that other classes do not already have. Maybe include it in the Tensers Toggle to make it more desirable.


    Other than that, I actually enjoy the pre, and don't have some of the problems others have listed (but then, I actually enjoy S&B style). I do think that 99% of EK builds are either going to be Warforged, have undead forms, or paladin / Fighter mixes though simply for the synergy, which will be a bit of a shame (I like having pure as a viable option as well). But it will be hard to turn down the idea of a semi offensive tank with very nice buffs that self heals better than a paladin.

    Either way, I look forward to playing around with it more on live.

    ~Dylvish
    Last edited by Dylvish; 11-03-2013 at 09:25 AM.

  6. #286
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    265

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dylvish View Post
    1) REMOVE the spell point drain on the weapon buff. Give it an initial cost for turning on the toggle, and leave it alone. Losing spell points every 6 seconds just for having it going just drains it too fast, and removes one of the advantages of the PRE (longevity of spell bar).
    I would argue for a lower spcost for the core strike too. Fireball SLA 6second 6sp 10d3+30 or 50 base before spellpower/crit/etc. Eldritch Strike 12second 10sp doing 0-56 (at level 28) or 28 base before multiplications. Sure, core instead of tier 5, but still.

    Using eldritch strike on cooldown is 50sp/minute, the weapon buff is only additional 10sp/minute.

    Assuming this PRE will be mainly used by split classes, so with 6 wiz/sorc you get 2d4 elemental damage for 10sp/minute. A bit harder to quantify due to the variable melee hits with cleaves, running etc. Just stand and spank and a ballpark amount of 100 hits / minute, that's 500 damage for 10sp. Not bad, but might as well use a fireball SLAs instead, for the same damage with the same amount of sps, just taking seconds instead of minutes. I like the spellsword effect as such, but not the cost.

    The elemental damage and eldritch strike are nice as such, but the spcost indeed makes them less than stellar. Pretty useless for full casters who can just use spells, and draining for those low-sp deep splits that seem to be the main focus for this PRE.

    3) I agree with what others have said about Eldritch Blade. Just compare it to what the other classes and PRE's get and I think you will understand why we think it is so underwhelming. +10% melee damage, and +25 SP on an arcane class, and only for a very short duration is simply not worth the point expenditure. Change it to what? I do not know, but this is not it.
    This is actually on par with almost all other prestige cores: ignore it and multiclass. This one is no exception. Signed: pure caster sorc with 18sorc/2paladin split for the saves.

    4) Put in the ability (deep in the tree) to use INT / CHA for hit & damage mods. As stated, it is not only appropriate, it is nothing that other classes do not already have. Maybe include it in the Tensers Toggle to make it more desirable.
    Half the people say this is mandatory for the tree to be useful. Other half say the first half are silly, because strength can get so much higher. I'd say both are right, for serious melee builds the int/cha hit/dam is pretty fully useless. But, it would enable full casters to respec for some melee when going through melee destinies, and honestly, it wouldn't be that overpowered, with all the strength boosts the int/cha-hitters are missing.


    Other than that, I actually enjoy the pre, and don't have some of the problems others have listed (but then, I actually enjoy S&B style). I do think that 99% of EK builds are either going to be Warforged, have undead forms, or paladin / Fighter mixes though simply for the synergy, which will be a bit of a shame (I like having pure as a viable option as well). But it will be hard to turn down the idea of a semi offensive tank with very nice buffs that self heals better than a paladin.

    Either way, I look forward to playing around with it more on live.

    ~Dylvish[/QUOTE]

  7. #287
    Community Member HatsuharuZ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    2,333

    Default

    To reiterate, the eldritch damage toggles should not be, in my opinion, core abilities. The best core abilities are usually some sort of passive ability that encourages the player to take class levels in order to obtain them. These toggles, I'm afraid, do not pass that test.

  8. #288
    Community Member wtorchia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    91

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by era42 View Post
    Nice idea, but it needs some key improvements.

    Heavily feat starved, I would not go two weapon. Just go 2-hander, grab cleave+great cleave, and ignore the 2h feat-line. I would pick cleave at level 1, it just makes early levels so much easier (assuming TR and not LR of course).

    Extend. With low levels of each caster class, your buffs are going to be pain to manage. Especially haste and displacement, and if you don't use those, why go arcane melee in the first place? I've leveled a couple of 8bard/x/y builds, and with extend, the duration of haste/displacement is just bearable. Without, the 30+second duration is just too painful. Sure, you can activate them for the big fights, but especially for haste, might as well use the 30-second potions, same short effect, no mana.

    Spell selection. With 6 sorc levels you're hurting. 7th sorc would give a second 3rd level spell, fitting both haste and displacement (early levels: fireball). For firewall you would need the 8th sorc level. Probably doable as well, but it would push the gained PL from paladin to sorc. I'm thinking 7 paladin / 7 sorcerer / 6 cleric would work the best, second level paladin spells are pretty meh so you can get away with 7. Or even 2/4/6 paladin, 6 cleric, rest sorc.
    I agree with you on all of your points except skipping the THF line. You get a lot of extra damage from the glancing blows. On my BCs it adds a lot of damage. After playing around with things more it looks like the pal/soc/clr set up is just not vialble. The class splits could work, you just do not have the AP to get everything you need. Going Wiz def has way more going for it. Maybe wiz 18/ fighter 2. You pick up heavy armor and can fit in all of the feats still. Somthing like this:

    Code:
    Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 04.19.03
    DDO Character Planner Home Page
    
    Level 28 Lawful Good Human Male
    (2 Fighter \ 18 Wizard \ 8 Epic) 
    Hit Points: 384
    Spell Points: 1490 
    BAB: 11\11\16\21
    Fortitude: 14
    Reflex: 6
    Will: 11
    
                      Starting          Feat/Enhancement
    Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
    (36 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 28)
    Strength             18                    26
    Dexterity             8                    11
    Constitution         16                    20
    Intelligence         16                    19
    Wisdom                8                    11
    Charisma              8                    11
    
    Tomes Used
    +1 Tome of Strength used at level 3
    +1 Tome of Dexterity used at level 3
    +1 Tome of Constitution used at level 3
    +1 Tome of Intelligence used at level 3
    +1 Tome of Wisdom used at level 3
    +1 Tome of Charisma used at level 3
    +2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7
    +3 Tome of Strength used at level 12
    +3 Tome of Dexterity used at level 12
    +3 Tome of Constitution used at level 12
    +3 Tome of Intelligence used at level 12
    +3 Tome of Wisdom used at level 12
    +3 Tome of Charisma used at level 12
    
                      Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                     Base Skills         Modified Skills
    Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 28)
    Balance               1                    19
    Bluff                -1                     8
    Concentration         7                    36
    Diplomacy            -1                     8
    Disable Device        n/a                  n/a
    Haggle               -1                     8
    Heal                  1                    19
    Hide                 -1                     8
    Intimidate           -1                     8
    Jump                  6                    33
    Listen               -1                     8
    Move Silently        -1                     8
    Open Lock            n/a                    n/a
    Perform              n/a                    n/a
    Repair                3                    12
    Search                3                    12
    Spellcraft            7                    35
    Spot                 -1                     8
    Swim                  4                    16
    Tumble               n/a                    9
    Use Magic Device      1                    19
    
    Level 1 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Human Bonus) Cleave
    Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Extend Spell
    Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Cleric
    Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Cleric
    Feat: (Selected) Power Attack
    
    
    Level 2 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 3 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Selected) Empower Spell
    
    
    Level 4 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 5 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Maximize Spell
    
    
    Level 6 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Selected) Two Handed Fighting
    
    
    Level 7 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Great Cleave
    
    
    Level 8 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 9 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Selected) Quicken Spell
    
    
    Level 10 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 11 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Augment Summoning
    
    
    Level 12 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Handed Fighting
    
    
    Level 13 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 14 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 15 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons
    Feat: (Selected) Toughness
    
    
    Level 16 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 17 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Mental Toughness
    
    
    Level 18 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Selected) Spell Focus: Necromancy
    
    
    Level 19 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 20 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 21 (Epic)
    Feat: (Selected) Epic: Overwhelming Critical
    
    
    Level 22 (Epic)
    
    
    Level 23 (Epic)
    
    
    Level 24 (Epic)
    Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Handed Fighting
    
    
    Level 25 (Epic)
    
    
    Level 26 (Epic)
    Feat: (Epic Destiny) Epic Destiny: Perfect Two Weapon Fighting
    
    
    Level 27 (Epic)
    Feat: (Selected) Epic: Epic Damage Reduction
    
    
    Level 28 (Epic)
    Feat: (Epic Destiny) Epic Destiny: Perfect Two Handed Fighting
    Enhancement: Human - Human Versatility: Damage Boost (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Dark Reaping (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Shroud of the Zombie (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Shroud of the Vampire (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Shroud of the Wraith (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Shroud of the Lich (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Necrotic Touch (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Deathless Vigor (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Deathless Vigor (Rank 2)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Deathless Vigor (Rank 3)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Spell Critical: Negative Energy I (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Skeletal Knight (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Skeletal Knight (Rank 2)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Skeletal Knight (Rank 3)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Negative Energy Conduit (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Negative Energy Conduit (Rank 2)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Negative Energy Conduit (Rank 3)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Corpsecrafter (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Corpsecrafter (Rank 2)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Corpsecrafter (Rank 3)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Bone Armor (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Bone Armor (Rank 2)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Bone Armor (Rank 3)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Necrotic Bolt (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Constitution (Rank 1)

  9. #289
    Community Member Saravis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    1,406

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by wtorchia View Post
    I agree with you on all of your points except skipping the THF line. You get a lot of extra damage from the glancing blows. On my BCs it adds a lot of damage. After playing around with things more it looks like the pal/soc/clr set up is just not vialble. The class splits could work, you just do not have the AP to get everything you need. Going Wiz def has way more going for it. Maybe wiz 18/ fighter 2. You pick up heavy armor and can fit in all of the feats still. Somthing like this:

    Code:
    Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 04.19.03
    DDO Character Planner Home Page
    
    Level 28 Lawful Good Human Male
    (2 Fighter \ 18 Wizard \ 8 Epic) 
    Hit Points: 384
    Spell Points: 1490 
    BAB: 11\11\16\21
    Fortitude: 14
    Reflex: 6
    Will: 11
    
                      Starting          Feat/Enhancement
    Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
    (36 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 28)
    Strength             18                    26
    Dexterity             8                    11
    Constitution         16                    20
    Intelligence         16                    19
    Wisdom                8                    11
    Charisma              8                    11
    
    Tomes Used
    +1 Tome of Strength used at level 3
    +1 Tome of Dexterity used at level 3
    +1 Tome of Constitution used at level 3
    +1 Tome of Intelligence used at level 3
    +1 Tome of Wisdom used at level 3
    +1 Tome of Charisma used at level 3
    +2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7
    +3 Tome of Strength used at level 12
    +3 Tome of Dexterity used at level 12
    +3 Tome of Constitution used at level 12
    +3 Tome of Intelligence used at level 12
    +3 Tome of Wisdom used at level 12
    +3 Tome of Charisma used at level 12
    
                      Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                     Base Skills         Modified Skills
    Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 28)
    Balance               1                    19
    Bluff                -1                     8
    Concentration         7                    36
    Diplomacy            -1                     8
    Disable Device        n/a                  n/a
    Haggle               -1                     8
    Heal                  1                    19
    Hide                 -1                     8
    Intimidate           -1                     8
    Jump                  6                    33
    Listen               -1                     8
    Move Silently        -1                     8
    Open Lock            n/a                    n/a
    Perform              n/a                    n/a
    Repair                3                    12
    Search                3                    12
    Spellcraft            7                    35
    Spot                 -1                     8
    Swim                  4                    16
    Tumble               n/a                    9
    Use Magic Device      1                    19
    
    Level 1 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Human Bonus) Cleave
    Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Extend Spell
    Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Cleric
    Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Cleric
    Feat: (Selected) Power Attack
    
    
    Level 2 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 3 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Selected) Empower Spell
    
    
    Level 4 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 5 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Maximize Spell
    
    
    Level 6 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Selected) Two Handed Fighting
    
    
    Level 7 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Great Cleave
    
    
    Level 8 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 9 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Selected) Quicken Spell
    
    
    Level 10 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 11 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Augment Summoning
    
    
    Level 12 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Handed Fighting
    
    
    Level 13 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 14 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 15 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons
    Feat: (Selected) Toughness
    
    
    Level 16 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 17 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Mental Toughness
    
    
    Level 18 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Selected) Spell Focus: Necromancy
    
    
    Level 19 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 20 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 21 (Epic)
    Feat: (Selected) Epic: Overwhelming Critical
    
    
    Level 22 (Epic)
    
    
    Level 23 (Epic)
    
    
    Level 24 (Epic)
    Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Handed Fighting
    
    
    Level 25 (Epic)
    
    
    Level 26 (Epic)
    Feat: (Epic Destiny) Epic Destiny: Perfect Two Weapon Fighting
    
    
    Level 27 (Epic)
    Feat: (Selected) Epic: Epic Damage Reduction
    
    
    Level 28 (Epic)
    Feat: (Epic Destiny) Epic Destiny: Perfect Two Handed Fighting
    Enhancement: Human - Human Versatility: Damage Boost (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Dark Reaping (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Shroud of the Zombie (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Shroud of the Vampire (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Shroud of the Wraith (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Shroud of the Lich (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Necrotic Touch (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Deathless Vigor (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Deathless Vigor (Rank 2)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Deathless Vigor (Rank 3)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Spell Critical: Negative Energy I (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Skeletal Knight (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Skeletal Knight (Rank 2)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Skeletal Knight (Rank 3)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Negative Energy Conduit (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Negative Energy Conduit (Rank 2)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Negative Energy Conduit (Rank 3)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Corpsecrafter (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Corpsecrafter (Rank 2)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Corpsecrafter (Rank 3)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Bone Armor (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Bone Armor (Rank 2)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Bone Armor (Rank 3)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Necrotic Bolt (Rank 1)
    Enhancement: Pale Master (Wiz) - Constitution (Rank 1)
    Do you think you can get sufficient DCs for SF: Necro to make a difference? I'd take Insightful Reflexes instead.

  10. #290
    Community Member wtorchia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    91

    Post

    Quote Originally Posted by Saravis View Post
    Do you think you can get sufficient DCs for SF: Necro to make a difference? I'd take Insightful Reflexes instead.
    The necro dc was a mistake. I thought I took it off. Insightful reflex is a better choice for sure.

  11. #291
    Community Member SealedInSong's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    San Francisco
    Posts
    997

    Default This makes sense

    Quote Originally Posted by Lauf View Post
    things like cursespewing, roaring, shattermantle, all offer great utility for an arcane that is likely to be without spell focus/penetration feats, and would make for more interesting buffs than 4 elemental weapons.
    Dispelling Shot: Ranged Archery Attack: Performs a ranged attack that deals +1/+2/+3[W] damage and dispels 1/2/3 beneficial effects from your target. (Activation Cost: 5 SP. Cooldown: 3 seconds)

    Shattermantle Shot: Ranged Archery Attack: Performs a ranged attack with +1/+2/+3[W] damage. On hit: Target gains 1/2/3 stack of Reduced Spell Resistance (-1 Spell Resistance. This effect can stack 100 times) on Vorpal Hit: Shattermantle (-100 spell Resistance for 10 seconds. Will DC 10/14/18 + Half Ranger Level + Wisdom Modifier negates.) (Activation Cost: 4 SP. Cooldown: 3 seconds)

    From AA, if adapted for melee, I'd be all for it.

    Lots of folks complain about the amount of clickies in the enhancement pass, but I actually feel as if it's breathed a lot of new life into the game.

    I always go for as many clickes as possible (within reason) as the dynamic game play always feels more fresh.

    If you want to just hit auto attack, you still can.

    The ability to do a +X[W] hit that may also help you land spells like Otto's Irresistible or Energy Drain on high SR mobs, or do fun things like strip Deathward off casters is really nice.
    Character Compendium
    __________________
    Sarlona*Eternal Wrath
    __________________

  12. #292
    Community Member SealedInSong's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    San Francisco
    Posts
    997

    Default Warchanters are very depressing right now

    Quote Originally Posted by Systern View Post
    Eldritch Knight get Martial Training at tier 2. Warchanters get it at Tier 5. EKs get added doublestrike to boot. (It even adds DAxe prof for dwarves.)
    EK's get Medium Armor Proficiency at tier 4. Warchanters get it at Tier 5. EKs get the added ASF reduction to shields which I begged for Warchanters. Althought the amount of ASF reduction is trivial. Small shields add 10% ASF. Large 25%. Towers 40-50%... -5% ASF is insufficient; even the total -20% in the tree is insufficient.

    WC level 18 core adds a combat rider to a buff- Inspire Courage. Bards longest duration buff that's never performed in combat. The WC capstone adds +1 damage to Inspire courage, and a net loss to DPS (I don't do damage for 6 seconds, you get +5 damage for 12.)

    The best warchanter post U20 is a 16 Bard/4 wizard split with the bulk of their points spent in EK and Spellsinger. A Bard with medium armor, full martial proficiency, and spell song vigor as well. When the best thing you can do for your Prestige is take 4 levels of another class and spend 30 AP in their tree, something's wrong.


    This tree completely obsoletes warchanters, which weren't very relevant to begin with.
    +1 to this sadly true statement
    Character Compendium
    __________________
    Sarlona*Eternal Wrath
    __________________

  13. #293
    2014 DDO Players Council
    Alt-pletionist
    IronClan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    7,171

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by wtorchia View Post
    I agree with you on all of your points except skipping the THF line. You get a lot of extra damage from the glancing blows. On my BCs it adds a lot of damage.
    It also gets you lots of aggro you don't have the hitpoints or damage mitigation for. As a Melee caster you're already going to have half the party looking askance at the 18 wizard who's jumping around swinging a weapon.
    You guys filibustering a new mode have already succeeded in scaring the Dev's into not doing it the right way and re-scaling the existing settings, why in the world are you still filibustering? Drunk on your success? Schadenfreude? Spitefulness?

  14. #294
    2014 DDO Players Council
    Alt-pletionist
    IronClan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    7,171

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SealedInSong View Post
    +1 to this sadly true statement
    I agree, sadly the Bard trees appear to have been designed by the same person that did the unimaginative Paladin trees and the "so bad it got replaced" protection tree.

    Sadly the Bard class is so incredibly unpopular that it failed to generate enough torches and pitch forks to get the Devs attention.
    You guys filibustering a new mode have already succeeded in scaring the Dev's into not doing it the right way and re-scaling the existing settings, why in the world are you still filibustering? Drunk on your success? Schadenfreude? Spitefulness?

  15. #295
    Community Member Saravis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    1,406

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by IronClan View Post
    Sadly the Bard class is so incredibly unpopular that it failed to generate enough torches and pitch forks to get the Devs attention.
    A cyclical issue, a lack of popularity towards the class causes a lack of effort on the devs towards improving the class, which causes a lack of popularity towards the class.

  16. #296
    Community Member HatsuharuZ's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    2,333

    Default EK Problems

    1) EK core abilities fail to convince me to take more than 5 levels of wizard or sorc for an EK build. Core abilities should have a passive portion that is hard to get from other places. The damage toggles and force spellpower do not pass this test, sadly. The same goes for the capstone.

    2) This tree gives lots of prociencies, but no synergy with combat feats. How about an ability that lowers the cooldown penalty given by stances like Resilience and Combat Expertise?

    3) Lots of force spellpower here, but how about a debuff that only applies when the caster deals force damage? Like, say, an AC penalty, or a penalty to movement speed. Something that would help my squishy melee arcane survive better.

  17. #297
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    265

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by IronClan View Post
    It also gets you lots of aggro you don't have the hitpoints or damage mitigation for. As a Melee caster you're already going to have half the party looking askance at the 18 wizard who's jumping around swinging a weapon.
    Then you're playing it wrong.

    The barbarian/fighter with 1000 hp and cocoon twisted in gets 500 - 20%(blur) = 400 damage, hits cocoon and runs like a girl to keep the temp hp up to keep healing during the 12 seconds of cocoon. The 600+ hp melee wizard gets 500 - 50%(displacement) = 250 damage, presses reconstruct button and heals 400hp instantly. Alternatively wraith with 35% incorp that accounts for most of the other mitigation differences, and the aura heals you constantly without having to look after the temp-hp.

    Sure, it takes some building to melee against many EE mobs at a time, but that applies to the traditional melees too. Self-cast displacement is awesome for the 95+% of us who don't craft tons of shroud displacement clickies.

    You're right about the weird looks of course.

  18. #298
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    265

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by HatsuharuZ View Post
    1) EK core abilities fail to convince me to take more than 5 levels of wizard or sorc for an EK build. Core abilities should have a passive portion that is hard to get from other places. The damage toggles and force spellpower do not pass this test, sadly. The same goes for the capstone.
    Maybe that's the plan. Taking 5 wizards gets conveniently both haste and displacement, there's really no need for any more wizard levels, unless you aim for 12 for Wraith.

    And again sorcerer gets the shaft, you need 7 levels to fit both haste and displacement.

  19. #299
    Community Member Wizza's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    2,794

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by era42 View Post
    Then you're playing it wrong.

    The barbarian/fighter with 1000 hp and cocoon twisted in gets 500 - 20%(blur) = 400 damage, hits cocoon and runs like a girl to keep the temp hp up to keep healing during the 12 seconds of cocoon. The 600+ hp melee wizard gets 500 - 50%(displacement) = 250 damage, presses reconstruct button and heals 400hp instantly. Alternatively wraith with 35% incorp that accounts for most of the other mitigation differences, and the aura heals you constantly without having to look after the temp-hp.

    Sure, it takes some building to melee against many EE mobs at a time, but that applies to the traditional melees too. Self-cast displacement is awesome for the 95+% of us who don't craft tons of shroud displacement clickies.

    You're right about the weird looks of course.
    Just FYI, most melees have enough displace clickies to be displaced through an entire raid for the whole duration of it.

    Your "Barbarian/Fighter" is just a noob. A pure fighter/melee will have much more PRR, more Dodge, more tactics to prevent incoming damage, Reconstruct soon (Bladeforged cough cough) and more HP.

    So no, you will have a lot more problems on a melee/caster than on a pure melee.

    EK sucks, plain and simple. It's just a fail. The only PrE with FOUR useless cores PLUS an useless Capstone. Nothing screams "MULTICLASS ME!" like this PrE.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rys View Post
    Severlin and Severlin Online. PLAY FOR FREE* NOW!

    *maybe
    Farwil, Chaos Gamblers - Argonessen.

  20. #300
    Community Member voodoogroves's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    North Cackalacky
    Posts
    9,593

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Wizza View Post
    EK sucks, plain and simple. It's just a fail. The only PrE with FOUR useless cores PLUS an useless Capstone. Nothing screams "MULTICLASS ME!" like this PrE.
    Like a Rogue 2 / Monk 6 / Wizard 12 swinging Sireth or Stout Oak or similar. Bladeforged, of course, because two recons are better than one.
    Ghallanda - now with fewer alts and more ghostbane

Page 15 of 16 FirstFirst ... 5111213141516 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

This form's session has expired. You need to reload the page.

Reload