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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ungood View Post
    I would have guessed around 30% to 50% of the player base used it directly, or took advantage of it indirectly.
    From what I remember less than 30% of the players even knew there was going to be an enhancement pass the day before it happened. The odds that such a high percentage of people both knew of and used an exploit seems very unlikely. Maybe 30-50% of the end game players in end-game guilds. They are the most knowledgeable players and tend to be the ones most likely to cheat (all the while complaining that the game has gotten too easy as they cut every corner possible to make the game easier).
    Everyone who is not in the true definition of "hardcore" is looked down on as a "casual", unwilling or incapable of understanding the true brilliance of having twelve-year-olds insult you while they are teabagging your virtual corpse. - Christian Ward columnist for The Escapist

  2. #62
    Community Member Qhualor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by erethizon View Post
    From what I remember less than 30% of the players even knew there was going to be an enhancement pass the day before it happened. The odds that such a high percentage of people both knew of and used an exploit seems very unlikely. Maybe 30-50% of the end game players in end-game guilds. They are the most knowledgeable players and tend to be the ones most likely to cheat (all the while complaining that the game has gotten too easy as they cut every corner possible to make the game easier).
    that's quite the statistical opinion I would say. this exploit could have started from a casual player that just started playing 2 weeks ago. you do know how the exploit even worked right?

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qhualor View Post
    that's quite the statistical opinion I would say. this exploit could have started from a casual player that just started playing 2 weeks ago. you do know how the exploit even worked right?
    How exactly the exploit worked I do not know (I know it had something to do with using the bank), but in general the people that I learn the most exploits from are the highly skilled players that know the most about the game. I run a lot of PUG's and the people I see exploiting or using cheese tactics tend to be the people with 5+ lives under their belt, not the total newbs. While you are correct that anyone could have been the first person to discover this exploit, it was most likely someone that played on the test server and that server is mostly full of highly skilled and knowledgeable players of the game.
    Everyone who is not in the true definition of "hardcore" is looked down on as a "casual", unwilling or incapable of understanding the true brilliance of having twelve-year-olds insult you while they are teabagging your virtual corpse. - Christian Ward columnist for The Escapist

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2pleasegimmie View Post
    Or, it might be because the game has gone so far down in quality that a lot of people simply dont care if they get banned anymore. For several days the servers, banks, and auction houses were busy while lots of people clearly had some good times.
    The huge effort made to try and intimidate people, mess with inventory, etc, rather than address the issue head on as a QA problem is just the latest in a long line of abject failures - not just in business functionality, but creativity, etc.

    Nobody at Turbine company is having fun any more. There's certainly no exitement or enthusiasm. Go watch the videos from the GW2 developers, then watch some of the stuff put out by Tolero and the others. Contrast is amazing.

    I wonder how many of the banned folks will just reverse any CC charges and write off their accounts? I'll bet there were several already over the fiasco that was the latest "expansion" and the "enhancement pass" + the other great ideas like loot homoginizing, etc.

    As to the issues of "morality", etc; there simply isn't any because this is a fantasyland - just opinions. The BS eulas that get crammed down everyone's throats also means that everyone's conduct was perfectly legal, so this is the end of it.
    Geez if you bash on the quality of DDO at least leave GW2 out of it. Arenanet broke every single promise they made about their game. They turned every single promise about it 180 degrees in 3 month. At least DDO had a few years to do the same thing. If anyone at Arenanet is happy with what they are doing it only means they have no conscience at all, something turbine is all too often accused of.
    GW2 is one of the few games i turned away from out of disgust.
    Last edited by Pandir; 10-12-2013 at 08:59 PM.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zer0AcmE View Post
    Per Tolero:

    "While we're not able to comment on specific/individual action regarding what's become of particular accounts, I can speak in general terms regarding the type of issues we are investigating...

    - 14 days is the minimum. Some may end up extending longer (or permanent) based on severity.
    - Accounts that return from their break will have a significantly reduced inventory, as items are being removed from the characters with extreme prejudice. "

    I wonder, did the Devs ever wonder why 80% (educated guess) or more of entire server populations were taking advantage of the latest server exploit or do they just believe that most of their client base are "evil" cheaters out ruin the world?

    Did you "the Devs" ever consider that this is just mass emotional explosion from the populace crying out "We're so over the grind!".

    Should we the players truly be asked to grind a single quest over 200 plus times (another educated guess) to upgrade a single raid item to enjoy?

    Seriously this is a game (although a business too) and I for the life of me can't really see who got hurt here? So the DDO IN GAME economy took a dive, its digital currency, its make believe!!! I know turbine didn't take a hit financially, they made out like bandits, is Turbine going to return all the money for points bought during this time to purchase bags and shards, I HIGHLY doubt it.

    In reality you had a server population that had never been more alive, we were able to craft freely, upgraded items they would have had to wait months or longer for. Truth be told I had never been happier playing DDO then during the last several days, it was a true joy.

    DDO is truly a remarkable game, some of the design aspects are second to none, the graphics are without equal. But if you the Devs continue to go down this path you are going to alienate your fan base/customers (the people that pay your salaries) and then what will you be left with?
    If nobody got hurt, then by that logic the cheaters aren't going to get hurt when the stuff they didn't earn gets taken away. And in reality it's a small cesspool of cheaters that did this, and they will not get to keep what they didn't earn. Boo hoo.
    Last edited by Mystera; 10-12-2013 at 09:03 PM.

  6. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by ICU View Post
    You know what i just find totaly amazing. The fact that everyone is complaining about the economy in the game and what this "exploit" did . Lets see who benifited from all this shal we.


    John Q player ( bought things extremly cheap via AH or SH , made armors from said purchases ,weps, items)

    The Exploiter ( made cash, got items, weps, astral shards)

    TURBINE: $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ from all the sales from differnet bags to astra shards


    Now who got screwed over ?
    If nobody got hurt, then by that logic there will be no hurt caused when the cheater has to give back the stuff he didn't earn. Don't act like the other 95% of the server got a whole **** load of free stuff, because that didn't even remotely happen.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by kned225 View Post
    I thought tolero's post was great. Seems very fair to me. Anybody who was doing this must have known this was coming, right? I cant imagine anyone figured they were really just gonna make all this stuff and just live happily ever after in candyland.

    I don't know where all the anger comes from. Its not like the police are coming. If i had done this and was now banned, id just laugh it off. Hey, we had fun and we got caught. Oh well

    I keep seeing exploiters wonder why everyone is so worked up over pretend money in a game. But then i wonder why they're so upset when it gets taken away

    Even if this exploit was entirely harmless, i think its important to send a message to hopefully make some people think twice next time, in case that one truly is game-breaking
    Nicely said.

  8. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ungood View Post
    I would have guessed around 30% to 50% of the player base used it directly, or took advantage of it indirectly.
    You must live and breath in a high end guild that takes advantage of exploits and not get out much. More like <5%.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mystera View Post
    If nobody got hurt, then by that logic the cheaters aren't going to get hurt when the stuff they didn't earn gets taken away. And in reality it's a small cesspool of cheaters that did this, and they will not get to keep what they didn't earn. Boo hoo.

    Lol i agree, if it didn't do any harm than i think it's ok to leave every cheater without any gear he got from any quest and let them start with level 1 gear, i mean after all it's only pixels that don't matter right ? Surely the people cheating to get their stuff wouldn't have a problem earning their basic gear back, after all it has no value.

  10. #70
    Community Member Havok.cry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pandir View Post
    Lol i agree, if it didn't do any harm than i think it's ok to leave every cheater without any gear he got from any quest and let them start with level 1 gear, i mean after all it's only pixels that don't matter right ? Surely the people cheating to get their stuff wouldn't have a problem earning their basic gear back, after all it has no value.
    Personally, and I am speaking as one of the cheaters who are obviously subhuman scum, they aren't being harsh enough. We need to be exterminated with extreme prejudice! Exploiting bugs in DDO should hereby incur the death penalty in real life!
    Matt Walsh:
    But Truth is eternal, so it can never be old or new. It never ‘was’ or ‘will be.’ It just ‘is.’ It always ‘is.’

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by DakDeFrosted View Post
    Just because a drug dealer spreads his money around to honest businesses and people doesn't excuse him for being a drug dealer. And just because the police confiscate his money and drugs when he's caught doesn't make them the bad guys.
    And if the police are taking a cut of said dealers profits???
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  12. #72
    Community Member Ungood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mystera View Post
    You must live and breath in a high end guild that takes advantage of exploits and not get out much. More like <5%.
    <5%? LOL, Your heads in the sand, or you're just totally out of the loop, did you not see the piles of people hanging around the banks?

  13. #73
    Community Member Ungood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pandir View Post
    Geez if you bash on the quality of DDO at least leave GW2 out of it. Arenanet broke every single promise they made about their game. They turned every single promise about it 180 degrees in 3 month. At least DDO had a few years to do the same thing. If anyone at Arenanet is happy with what they are doing it only means they have no conscience at all, something turbine is all too often accused of.
    GW2 is one of the few games i turned away from out of disgust.
    I have no idea what promises you are talking about but none the less, you leaving GWII is entirely Your Loss, I loved GWII, and the only reason why I am playing DDO today is because GWII is in fact too addictive.

  14. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zer0AcmE View Post
    I for the life of me can't really see who got hurt here
    While I actually agree with some of your post (i.e the grind) I can't quite get over this bit.

    The exploit *does* hurt me. Not immediately, but inexorably.

    I didn't exploit, so I missed out on some gear. Many people did exploit and got that gear. People complain that DDO is too easy, so the devs make quests harder to challenge the current average player with average gear.

    The problem is that the gear average went up but my gear didn't.

    So I run quests with my guild mates who also didn't exploit, and we have to settle for lower XP and Favor rewards, even if we never actually see an exploiter.

    I'm not saying I'm out for a kidney or anything, but I think it's important to understand how this incident relates to game difficulty and widening the gap between player groups.

    I'm not going to play more if exploiters get crucified, and I'm not going to play less if exploiters get pardons, but scaling the game such that I get even less reward for my grind most certainly has a major impact on my decisions where to spend my entertainment time and dollars.
    I'm only an occasional player since ShadowFell, please forgive me if I'm not up to speed on anything that's changed since then.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pandir View Post
    Geez if you bash on the quality of DDO at least leave GW2 out of it. Arenanet broke every single promise they made about their game. They turned every single promise about it 180 degrees in 3 month. At least DDO had a few years to do the same thing. If anyone at Arenanet is happy with what they are doing it only means they have no conscience at all, something turbine is all too often accused of.
    GW2 is one of the few games i turned away from out of disgust.
    Way to miss the point. The fact that both companies may suck from the standpoint of "promises to the players" etc is relevant.

    I wasn't talking about the game, or anything other than directly comparing the attitude of the people appearing in videos. Focus, lad - focus!

    If Turbine had half that energy and creativity we'd be having a lot more fun with a lot more people right now though. GW2 has vastly superior marketing of the game, too.

  16. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by LucidLTS View Post
    While I actually agree with some of your post (i.e the grind) I can't quite get over this bit.

    The exploit *does* hurt me. Not immediately, but inexorably.

    I didn't exploit, so I missed out on some gear. Many people did exploit and got that gear. People complain that DDO is too easy, so the devs make quests harder to challenge the current average player with average gear.

    The problem is that the gear average went up but my gear didn't.

    So I run quests with my guild mates who also didn't exploit, and we have to settle for lower XP and Favor rewards, even if we never actually see an exploiter.

    I'm not saying I'm out for a kidney or anything, but I think it's important to understand how this incident relates to game difficulty and widening the gap between player groups.

    I'm not going to play more if exploiters get crucified, and I'm not going to play less if exploiters get pardons, but scaling the game such that I get even less reward for my grind most certainly has a major impact on my decisions where to spend my entertainment time and dollars.
    Your true complaint is with game structure and Turbine values/goals, then.

    Make the game fun and rewarding = good times for all, and lots of folks to group with. If those goals were paramount, you'd not even care one whit about anything on your list, and profit would roll into Turbine, too.

    Unfortunately, the reality is these folks wont even fix major bugs, and continually mess around with the stuff people DO like about the game. It's like they're on crack or something.

  17. #77
    Community Member Ungood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LucidLTS View Post
    While I actually agree with some of your post (i.e the grind) I can't quite get over this bit.

    The exploit *does* hurt me. Not immediately, but inexorably.

    I didn't exploit, so I missed out on some gear. Many people did exploit and got that gear. People complain that DDO is too easy, so the devs make quests harder to challenge the current average player with average gear.

    The problem is that the gear average went up but my gear didn't.
    It may have went up, but it did not go up because of this exploit. Red Dragonscale was more for show then any real stats, and I myself have had 20 scales sitting in the bank for months now, I did not make a suite today for the same reason I have not made one in the past, it's not that great armor.

    Now Loot-gen, gave a boots to the average player, giving easily 4 effects on a single suit of armor, 2 of which can be chosen, and be level proper, and 2 of which scale with your level, this all but invalidating all the older raid gear and hard to find items. The devs already pretty much killed the grind and spat on the efforts players had put in, in the past, with this current loot pass, When U20 hits, and there are even more options added, it will just serve to further devalue all named and raid gear, or worse, they will upgrade the raid gear, and force the players to grind it again, in either case, the players who earned their gear and items in the game already have gotten screwed over by the development staff themselves.

    In light of that, this bug hurt no one, on any level.

  18. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ungood View Post
    It may have went up, but it did not go up because of this exploit. Red Dragonscale was more for show then any real stats, and I myself have had 20 scales sitting in the bank for months now, I did not make a suite today for the same reason I have not made one in the past, it's not that great armor.

    Now Loot-gen, gave a boots to the average player, giving easily 4 effects on a single suit of armor, 2 of which can be chosen, and be level proper, and 2 of which scale with your level, this all but invalidating all the older raid gear and hard to find items. The devs already pretty much killed the grind and spat on the efforts players had put in, in the past, with this current loot pass, When U20 hits, and there are even more options added, it will just serve to further devalue all named and raid gear, or worse, they will upgrade the raid gear, and force the players to grind it again, in either case, the players who earned their gear and items in the game already have gotten screwed over by the development staff themselves.

    In light of that, this bug hurt no one, on any level.

    A person might get in trouble for throwing garbage out their car window, but more if their garbage kills someone

    I think the punishments that have been handed out so far were just for littering and would have been worse if ppl had really gotten "hurt", as you say

  19. #79
    Community Member Ungood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kned225 View Post
    A person might get in trouble for throwing garbage out their car window, but more if their garbage kills someone

    I think the punishments that have been handed out so far were just for littering and would have been worse if ppl had really gotten "hurt", as you say
    LOL, and what Punishment did people suffer for the Bloodstone scam?

    Or the people that sell quivers on the AH for plats when they get the quivers from vendor for silvers, those people are taking advantage of other players, where is their reckoning?

  20. #80

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    I still see plenty of Draconics on the asah. Hell of a way to tell us that exploiting bugs pays off in this game Turbine.

    Message received tywm.


    Btw. what was the method you used?

    was it SELECT player_ID WHERE number_of_globe_of_imperial_blood > 50?

    Oh, but a few players that went rly crazy with greed and forgot to keep a low profile got a slap on the wrist? Ouch! They "might" even loose all the stuff they duped more than 50 times when they return after a short break? Oh the horror! And now complaints? I don't get it... what is the purpose of this thread? To convince all us ignorant ppl you were doing all of this for the benefit of the comunity?
    NESALOMLJIVI, Thelanis

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