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  1. #21
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by erethizon View Post
    They have to be careful about handing out bans that are too long because if a person is banned long enough to break the habit of logging into DDO there is a reasonable chance they will never come back. DDO does not have a lot to offer people at the moment other than a temporary fix for their addiction. If you ban someone long enough that they get over their DDO withdrawl they may never return.
    Excellent. First, some would likely crank out a freebie forum account to complain about being banned, and that in and of itself would serve as a deterrant for future exploitation. Perhaps that is what is needed to put an end to the "exploit early and often" mentality that plagues this game.
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    Excellent. First, some would likely crank out a freebie forum account to complain about being banned, and that in and of itself would serve as a deterrant for future exploitation. Perhaps that is what is needed to put an end to the "exploit early and often" mentality that plagues this game.
    I don't deny it would be nice. There is nothing I dislike more than unenforced laws. I have a lawful personality and thus feel compelled to follow the rules. When a rule is not enforced it means I know I don't need to follow it, but since it is still a rule I feel like I should. Either rules should be enforced or they should not exist at all. The world would be a much simpler place if every law was enforced by the death penalty (or ban hammer in the case of a video game since that is as close to killing a person as they can do over the internet). All that would be left were lawful personalities and everyone would know to take the rules seriously. More importantly, if a rule is not important enough to kill over then IT SHOULD NOT BE A RULE. That is what I find the most frustrating. Don't tell me I am not allowed to do something if you don't care if I do it or not. Either make a rule and enforce it or don't make a rule at all. There are a lot of laws out there that should be repealed since no one seems to care if you break them.

    This message brought to you by an extreme member of the Libertarian party, encouraging people to adopt a society with as few laws as possible.
    Everyone who is not in the true definition of "hardcore" is looked down on as a "casual", unwilling or incapable of understanding the true brilliance of having twelve-year-olds insult you while they are teabagging your virtual corpse. - Christian Ward columnist for The Escapist

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charononus View Post
    Probably a few hundred per server but with only a few hundred per server online at any one time during the day it could have a serious cascade effect if they were perma banned. On the other hand the moral brigade might quit if they don't. So Turbine is in a no-win situation. Sadly if it wasn't for the asah clouding things with making people feel like they lost real money the moral brigade would be much smaller. There's a reason blizzard is removing it from d3.
    Only a hundred people on at any given time? What server are you playing on? Eek.

  4. #24
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by erethizon View Post
    I don't deny it would be nice. There is nothing I dislike more than unenforced laws. I have a lawful personality and thus feel compelled to follow the rules. When a rule is not enforced it means I know I don't need to follow it, but since it is still a rule I feel like I should. Either rules should be enforced or they should not exist at all. The world would be a much simpler place if every law was enforced by the death penalty (or ban hammer in the case of a video game since that is as close to killing a person as they can do over the internet). All that would be left were lawful personalities and everyone would know to take the rules seriously. More importantly, if a rule is not important enough to kill over then IT SHOULD NOT BE A RULE. That is what I find the most frustrating. Don't tell me I am not allowed to do something if you don't care if I do it or not. Either make a rule and enforce it or don't make a rule at all. There are a lot of laws out there that should be repealed since no one seems to care if you break them.

    This message brought to you by an extreme member of the Libertarian party, encouraging people to adopt a society with as few laws as possible.
    philosophically, power (kingship, money, etc) has always allowed the elite to ignore any law no matter what no matter when. I think this is just human nature, your stance and beliefs will leave you to constantly be disappointed. Embrace chaos and learn that rules exist only to be broken.

  5. #25
    Community Member Qhualor's Avatar
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    i wouldn't say it would be a wasteland. its been tough to pug for a long time now anyways and the population has been declining for months. the banning, if at all, would really have to depend on how exploitable this bug was by players. it would not hurt my feelings any if the ones who took full advantage got the worst of the punishment and it was a more than usual vacation, but Turbine needs to set an example by this that they will not tolerate exploits. I don't care whats happened in the past and Turbine just needs to accept a potentially temporary loss to provide a healthier gaming atmosphere which in turn could prove more profitable. squashing exploits immediately saves them money in the long run and others who do not like to participate in them would be more inclined to stay. if exploiters don't like this, they can find a different game to manipulate and I wouldn't miss their "contribution" to the game one bit. due to all the exploiting these days, I question any achievements players have been able to do and that's pretty sad when you doubt someone for accomplishing extraordinary things and wonder how they really did it or how they were able to get that kind of gear.

  6. #26
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jalont View Post
    Only a hundred people on at any given time? What server are you playing on? Eek.
    only a few hundred, not a hundred.

  7. #27
    Community Member Ungood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZeebaNeighba View Post
    It's funny, someone a couple days ago bumped a 5 year old thread crying doooom over another cloning exploit.
    ^ This, a Million Times THIS!

    Really, if the game died every-time someone cried DOOM, it would have died on day 1 of release. Good grief people, Gamers and their Doom threads is like this endlessly bad meme, give it a rest.

  8. #28
    Community Member HernandoCortez's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ungood View Post
    Really, if the game died every-time someone cried DOOM, it would have died on day 1 of release. Good grief people, Gamers and their Doom threads is like this endlessly bad meme, give it a rest.
    I'm not saying this is DOOM. I just stated that this is really the worst exploit I've seen in the game so far. And from what I've seen on Ghallanda, the exploiters were too many and smarter than the ones on Sarlona. Auction House didn't went crazy (didn't check the AS AH much to be honest) which means the exploiters were waiting for the dust to settle.

    What I've meant is this time its really on Turbine's hands. They can bring the game to its end IMO.
    EXTREME PREJUDICE™ - by Turbine.
    GHOSTBANE™ - by Turbine.
    LMAO! M...D...? Seriously? - You have received an infraction...

  9. #29
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    Never really understood all the Doom threads. http://ddowiki.com/page/Doom ok sure it has some things going for it, but if you really want to panic go with http://ddowiki.com/page/Cause_Fear. Not enough for you? Well then its time to go big http://ddowiki.com/page/Implosion.

  10. #30
    Community Member ThePrincipal's Avatar
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    I didn't cheat. I have no problem being the only account on Agro if that's what shakes out.

  11. #31
    Community Member Ungood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    Excellent. First, some would likely crank out a freebie forum account to complain about being banned, and that in and of itself would serve as a deterrant for future exploitation. Perhaps that is what is needed to put an end to the "exploit early and often" mentality that plagues this game.
    No. What would put an end to it, is if they did not keep putting out half assed trash all the time, really, with how buggy this game, all the time to point that it is a sad joke with their player base begging them to fix their **** and get their act together, it's bound to happen that bugs will slip out that will profit the players as opposed to constantly screw them over.

    When they give players a solid game, a game that does not have them stuck in walls, losing fort, losing spell power, not able to get credit for a quest if they were dead at the end of it, not to mention there are STILL mobs in House C that do not have a death animation, you know what will stop Exploiters,when they stop with the buggy **** they pump out and focus on fixing their damn game so it runs right.

    What do they spend time? Revamping Loot gen so we have Funbane 4 Greataxe of Boredom 3

    The heck with the exploiters, Turbine needs to spend the time focusing on fixing the Game! It was not the players fault that this happened, it was TURBINIES FAULT the bug was there to start with, if anyone should be blamed, it's Turbine.

    Every second, every hour they spend hunting down a player to punishing them for what... Turbines screw up? is time they are NOT fixing the game, it;s time they are not correcting bugs, and personally, the only group of people who should be punshed, is the People at Turbine that let this happen.

    Fix your GAME!

  12. #32
    Intergalactic Space Crusader
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ungood View Post
    ^ This, a Million Times THIS!

    Really, if the game died every-time someone cried DOOM, it would have died on day 1 of release. Good grief people, Gamers and their Doom threads is like this endlessly bad meme, give it a rest.
    Owell, I started this game too late to be on the Doom Train. I just have to be pateirnt and bide my time. I'll get my first Doom somedoay.

  13. #33
    Community Member Gauthaag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qhualor View Post
    i wouldn't say it would be a wasteland. its been tough to pug for a long time now anyways and the population has been declining for months. the banning, if at all, would really have to depend on how exploitable this bug was by players. it would not hurt my feelings any if the ones who took full advantage got the worst of the punishment and it was a more than usual vacation, but Turbine needs to set an example by this that they will not tolerate exploits. I don't care whats happened in the past and Turbine just needs to accept a potentially temporary loss to provide a healthier gaming atmosphere which in turn could prove more profitable. squashing exploits immediately saves them money in the long run and others who do not like to participate in them would be more inclined to stay. if exploiters don't like this, they can find a different game to manipulate and I wouldn't miss their "contribution" to the game one bit. due to all the exploiting these days, I question any achievements players have been able to do and that's pretty sad when you doubt someone for accomplishing extraordinary things and wonder how they really did it or how they were able to get that kind of gear.
    like almost everything was not for sale before. how many folks are there running in EE stuff wo visiting EE once? thats the achievement u re looking for?

  14. #34
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    If you go to a local gaming group (boards, cards, whatever) and get caught cheating, you're probably not going to be asked back... and some of these groups might be four men and a cat. The brilliant thing about MMORPGs is that they can support hundreds, thousands of players from all over the world: we can survive without people who'd abuse such a massively harmful issue in such a flagrant manner.

  15. #35
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clatterfist View Post
    If you go to a local gaming group (boards, cards, whatever) and get caught cheating, you're probably not going to be asked back... and some of these groups might be four men and a cat. The brilliant thing about MMORPGs is that they can support hundreds, thousands of players from all over the world: we can survive without people who'd abuse such a massively harmful issue in such a flagrant manner.
    You can survive sure but depending on numbers Turbines profit margins may not which would mean that the game doesn't. That's the big question, how many actually duped, only turbine knows, and they won't say, the rest of us are just spewing bad smelling hot air.

  16. #36
    Community Member Qhualor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gauthaag View Post
    like almost everything was not for sale before. how many folks are there running in EE stuff wo visiting EE once? thats the achievement u re looking for?
    the P2WAH is more controlled. this exploit was not. my opinion on P2WAH is pretty well known, so I will always have issues with it as long as it is around.

  17. #37
    Community Member Ungood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clatterfist View Post
    If you go to a local gaming group (boards, cards, whatever) and get caught cheating, you're probably not going to be asked back... and some of these groups might be four men and a cat.
    They are also not asking you to chip in to pay the rent either,

  18. #38
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    If Turbine doesn't follow up with some harsh consequences for those that participated knowingly in the exploit it will simply reinforce the already prevalent view that the rewards for cheating far out weigh the risk of punishment.

    I believe a permanent ban on any account that used the exploit is justifiable.

    Let the exploiters start fresh with a new account, maybe they'll have learned a lesson.

  19. #39
    Community Member ThreeEyedBob's Avatar
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    I was around for the infamous Platinum scarab exploit in Asheron's Call 1 (another Turbine game) back in 2001-2002 I think it was.

    It's ok to permaban hardcore exploiters, unless that means cutting off 25%+ of the game income by doing so.
    Member and owner of "The Mad Midgets" of Khyber.
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  20. #40
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DakDeFrosted View Post
    Let the exploiters start fresh with a new account, maybe they'll have learned a lesson.
    Except they probably won't, and turbine loses that customer. Now in most cases this is ok or even desired inspite of that because you keep the other people that didn't. However we don't have the numbers on how many exploited, if it's huge, that's game killing. If it's small yeah perma-bans make sense, if it's in the middle the answer will involve coorperate greed and we know that that will be an accounting game to try to predict which way makes the most money.

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