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  1. #81
    Community Member fco-karatekid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Braegan View Post
    Some people are mice.

    And in your example, it wouldn't matter much I am sure insurance companies would be wondering about my lack thereof of security.
    Whoa - next killer MMO mechanic - player-run insurance agencies!

  2. #82
    Community Member Mephisto-Helix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaelaros View Post
    I am very disturbed by the turn DDO has taken recently. Players being banned for exploits is wrong. If something is not working as intended, it is Turbine's responsibility to fix it.

    This isn't like stealing from an unlocked but closed grocery store. That is against the rules of society (a.k.a. the law).

    The rules of DDO are programmed into the game. My brother once said "How do you cheat at a computer game?" Short of hacking I would say that you can't. What qualifies as an 'exploit/cheat' is a matter of opinion. I have met players who consider artificers and/or other casters to be an exploit/cheat. The line between exploit/cheat and being a good player who uses the rules well is subjective.

    To see Turbine waste resources 'investigating accounts', instead of fixing problems, ticks me off. I reported the conjure bolts bug about 2 years ago, as far as I can tell, all they have done is add it to the list of known issues. A player named Kalda threatened to hunt me down and kill me (in real life) because I had a toon with a name that started with the letters k-a-l, he was not banned. At most he received a tell. So death threats are OK, but if a player uses the rules THAT TURBINE PROGRAMMED in a way Turbine failed to anticipate and doesn't like, they will get banned? The thing I love about this game is that I have tremendous flexibility to come up with novel approaches, and new ways to use the rules to maximize my effectiveness. I am not interested in continuing to play if I need to worry about getting banned for using the rules that they programmed.

    I spend several hundred a year on this game (which again, some players will consider a cheat/exploit). I will be checking back to see how this 'investigation' is handled. I am too disgusted to play tonight. If something is broken like this, or not WAI, Turbine should fix it. If Turbine continues this new policy of regularly banning players instead of fixing things, I will cancel my subscription. I am not interested in participating in a pretend society where we should live in constant fear that the secret police will ban us for some infraction that shouldn't have been possible if they consider it an infraction.

    First, great post, really well said.

    Secondly, the bolded, just wow ...... that is pretty disgusting on Turbines part that something like that was not handled the same way they wanna handle this. I'm sorry you had to go through something like that ruining your experience.

  3. #83
    Community Member fco-karatekid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qhualor View Post
    ...would you feel the need to run Shroud? ...
    funny story about that...

  4. #84
    Community Member Ryiah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sirgog View Post
    The game may not survive another large round of false bannings like Maban.
    It may not survive another large round of bannings false or not. As much as I feel like I'm claiming something that can't happen, I do have to wonder how the game will fare if a large portion of the player base has been taking advantage of this bug.


    Quote Originally Posted by Kaelaros View Post
    To see Turbine waste resources 'investigating accounts', instead of fixing problems, ticks me off.
    As much as I hate to say this, it is par for the course with Turbine. They don't have their priorities straight.
    Last edited by Ryiah; 10-08-2013 at 01:03 AM.
    Ryiah | Raeyah | Reikara
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  5. #85
    Community Member fco-karatekid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NaturalHazard View Post
    ...didnt a whole bunch of people get banned when they where innocence in the past and the servers where ghost towns? i dont really remember because I think I was away during that time.
    Yah, that was the "Maban" incident alluded to both by other posters and Tolero herself. I dunno about "ghost towns" per se, because I was one of the innocents who got the banhammer.

  6. #86
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    I heard this has been around since update 19.... I can't start to imagine the number of players involved. I'm not sure what their decision will be but it's a little similar to an experience I had a few years ago at a cash machine that was giving out £20 where it should of given out £10 notes.... Do I take this opportunity and double my entire bank account??? After all, it's the bank who either programmed the machine incorrectly or filled it wrong I simply used the machine they created.
    I am a refugee of Devourer, abandoned by Coadmasters and washed up on the shores of the new world Thelanis under the rule of the Turbine empire. The locals are primative, the monsters are tough, and to survive in this savage land i must live by one philosophy... trust no one.

  7. #87
    Community Member Deathdefy's Avatar
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    What about:

    - Delete all duped items. If they're socketed into another item and therefore unavailable due to code limitations, so be it.

    - PermaBan/TempBan/Warn/De-Level/Other Strange Punishment people who definitively did exploit.

    - Reward those who definitively didn't. +5 Tome or something.
    Khyber: Aggrim (Completionist!)
    All of my builds are grossly out of date. Just roll a human or drow mechanic / assassin rogue thing.
    Blind insta-kills floating eye balls.

  8. #88
    Community Member fco-karatekid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deathdefy View Post
    ...
    - Reward those who definitively didn't. +5 Tome or something.
    reward u for not doing something you knew you shouldn't? you should talk to my kids about that proposal.

  9. #89
    Community Member debo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fco-karatekid View Post
    reward u for not doing something you knew you shouldn't? you should talk to my kids about that proposal.
    When my nephews do something wrong they usually have a chair to sit in for time out. The other day one of them started walking to the chair saying he knows he gonna get in trouble so he was gonna sit in it since he gonna be there soon anyways.

  10. #90
    Community Member fco-karatekid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by debo View Post
    When my nephews do something wrong they usually have a chair to sit in for time out. The other day one of them started walking to the chair saying he knows he gonna get in trouble so he was gonna sit in it since he gonna be there soon anyways.
    rofl, nice!

    I don't even wait for infractions - i just leave the board for a while.

  11. #91
    Community Member kyostal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaelaros View Post
    I am very disturbed by the turn DDO has taken recently. Players being banned for exploits is wrong. If something is not working as intended, it is Turbine's responsibility to fix it.

    This isn't like stealing from an unlocked but closed grocery store. That is against the rules of society (a.k.a. the law).

    The rules of DDO are programmed into the game. My brother once said "How do you cheat at a computer game?" Short of hacking I would say that you can't. What qualifies as an 'exploit/cheat' is a matter of opinion. I have met players who consider artificers and/or other casters to be an exploit/cheat. The line between exploit/cheat and being a good player who uses the rules well is subjective.

    To see Turbine waste resources 'investigating accounts', instead of fixing problems, ticks me off. I reported the conjure bolts bug about 2 years ago, as far as I can tell, all they have done is add it to the list of known issues. A player named Kalda threatened to hunt me down and kill me (in real life) because I had a toon with a name that started with the letters k-a-l, he was not banned. At most he received a tell. So death threats are OK, but if a player uses the rules THAT TURBINE PROGRAMMED in a way Turbine failed to anticipate and doesn't like, they will get banned? The thing I love about this game is that I have tremendous flexibility to come up with novel approaches, and new ways to use the rules to maximize my effectiveness. I am not interested in continuing to play if I need to worry about getting banned for using the rules that they programmed.

    I spend several hundred a year on this game (which again, some players will consider a cheat/exploit). I will be checking back to see how this 'investigation' is handled. I am too disgusted to play tonight. If something is broken like this, or not WAI, Turbine should fix it. If Turbine continues this new policy of regularly banning players instead of fixing things, I will cancel my subscription. I am not interested in participating in a pretend society where we should live in constant fear that the secret police will ban us for some infraction that shouldn't have been possible if they consider it an infraction.

    you just made it possible for me to sleep... i couldnt have said it any better.... if it was not their intention for use to use this feature.. it would have been fixed when the first post showed up about it after u19 hit... we went through 3 updates, and then a server update before finally having it brought to the publics attention that it will be looked into...

  12. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyostal View Post
    you just made it possible for me to sleep... i couldnt have said it any better.... if it was not their intention for use to use this feature.. it would have been fixed when the first post showed up about it after u19 hit... we went through 3 updates, and then a server update before finally having it brought to the publics attention that it will be looked into...
    Devs wanted this. They made it.

    It devalues plat and reduces AS numbers increasing value of them further. EE gear more valuable. New xpack sold more for housing loot. They knew for a good long time. And are still allowing players to do it......

  13. #93
    Community Member Hawkwier's Avatar
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    Angry Hammer them. Hard.

    Y'know what?

    This exploit has not affected me directly one iota. Never even knew about it until I saw the notice when I went to log on this morning.

    BUT

    It still p's me off enormously that there are players out there who will cheat like this at the expense of fellow players.

    And please - spare me the hand-wringing "but they left the cookie jar open" amorality - Wrong is wrong, and grown-ups know the difference.

    (Mice? gimme strength!)

    Devs, when you find out who has engaged in this you MUST throw the book at them - short-term bans in this context are completely unnaceptable. Perm bans for the worst offenders, and deletions of all affected characters and items for the rest please, with returned shards/plat and removal of items for those innocently caught up.

    Less than that and you short-change the rest of the population.

    It hasn't affected me directly one iota - but like EVERYONE else, it has affected me. Some folk might even have parted with hard-earned cash for AS to buy these "bargains".

    You must end them. Once and for all, please.

    Then, maybe the next time, there wont be such a gold rush mentality around these issues either.

  14. #94
    Community Member brucelee82's Avatar
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    I think they should ban the cheaters during Mabar. Then they will miss out on the 1/day items from mabar. Allowing non cheaters to get some good loot and cheaters wont have access.
    Signed

  15. #95
    Community Member tammyaline's Avatar
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    Default Perma Ban? Give me a break

    The biggest offenders will be the biggest real money spenders in the game. Bite the hand that feeds you ... I don't think so.

    Two week ban, maybe three to make them miss out on the +5 Mabar tomes, sure, but more than that? Wouldn't that be counter productive for Turbine? I think about even just the people I know on Thelanis that went ahead with this exploit and they would be losing too much money to Perma ban them all.

    Since Turbine knew about this exploit and are just getting around to doing something about it now makes me think there was an agenda or something to the timing of the whole thing. Time will tell.

  16. #96
    Community Member psykopeta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mystera View Post
    Wait, I didn't realize the extent of this until I saw the screenshots of stacks of 100s of scales and heard about hundreds of lvl 25-28 augments and true globes of imperial blood being created https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...y-ruined/page2. If Turbine doesn't reverse the stacks of 100s of these items people created, and ban them, I am leaving the game. I have spent 4 years building up my fortune and storing it in items like scales. If Turbine made these obsolete overnight, and don't reverse the damage, I am quitting the game. No need to have my fortune completely obliterated because someone else exploited.
    oh poor child, his fortune lost by a matter of 0 and 1, in minute of silence pls, in that minute start uninstalling wow, u're so useful to ddo as the dupers, well not, u're less

    btw, when i finally logged (late yesterday) there were still some green scales in thelanis at 2M the 100 stack

    omfg, green scales? that guy looks more dumb than the ones that were posting 100 scales for 100 lds, i mean, posting each for 5 shards would net em far more cash, but guess that luck and intelligence don't come at once
    psykopeta - hoarding pl, for the sake of hoarding, the day i become ubercompletionist will be because there isn't anything to delay it more - thelanis, where the gimps claim to be pros and noobs claim to be pros, no newbies allowed(unless they claim to be pros), we have enough drama w/o them. PS i'm not a pro, maybe if i reincarnate in RL...

  17. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by CarpeNoctu View Post
    We were arrogant enough to bestow upon ourselves the title "**** sapiens sapiens".
    It seems silly to me that this was asterisked out.

  18. #98
    The Hatchery sirgog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tammyaline View Post
    The biggest offenders will be the biggest real money spenders in the game. Bite the hand that feeds you ... I don't think so.

    Two week ban, maybe three to make them miss out on the +5 Mabar tomes, sure, but more than that? Wouldn't that be counter productive for Turbine? I think about even just the people I know on Thelanis that went ahead with this exploit and they would be losing too much money to Perma ban them all.

    Since Turbine knew about this exploit and are just getting around to doing something about it now makes me think there was an agenda or something to the timing of the whole thing. Time will tell.
    You think they will lose money permabanning people?

    Some of them will make new accounts and rebuy the packs. Possibly quite a percentage.
    I don't have a zerging problem.

    I'm zerging. That's YOUR problem.

  19. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyostal View Post
    So, can you foretell what the expected outcome for those who used this duplication process will be? and what will be done with all the materials obtained from it? with how long it has been in game.. will it require a rollback or will it be something less drastic? permaban or tempban... (sorry to flood you with questions, i just know a lot of people who used this and would like to know what will happen)
    Personally. I think the item duplication is good for the game. How many public groups have you been in where underequipped noobs cause the party to fail. I had THREE, that's right THREE consecuitive raid failures the other day due to the luck of the draw. I say if folks want to have some decent gear, let them. It will only make LFG more viable and spare people the mind numbing grind of running the same lousy quest 89 times and eventually leaving the game for good out of frustration. A wide distribution of decent gear improves the overall gameplay satisfaction level and keeps players invested in the game. invested players tend to open their wallets more because they are happy with their game experience. Sure you'll have some whiners who cry because they spent 5000 hours playing and feel others need to as well, but the reality of the situation is the folks who spend money on the game work. These working folks don't have 1000s of hours to spend grinding. They don't advance as quickly, eventually become frustrated, and leave. Sure you'll get some new players and some rich kids with no job, but your good money, your steady money, comes from satisfied players. The current duplication increases overall game satisfaction. Satisfied people stick around. Stop the duplication if you feel you must, but in general I see the impact as positive.

  20. #100
    2014 DDO Players Council
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    Quote Originally Posted by sirgog View Post
    Let's see.

    Three days ago if I wanted an EH dragon helm with a good +3 stat I could search through my ingredients bag and ask people 'hey, I'll offer 4 flawless reds for that'.

    Now, 200 FRDS would not be accepted.

    The in-game economy is a real loss PVP arena, and so cheating in a big way in it has far-reaching effects.
    See this is why I don't care. Because I don't like trading much I trade for items on the actual shard exchange so I don't have to deal with poeple so I use shards and not items. And they haven't been able to duplicate items it seems (well everything linked has been small stuff). So I do actually wonder if this has actually *boosted* the shard exchange because it has actually stopped exactly the sorts of free trade transaction that you've described. Also it's so lowered a number of items into potentially genuinely available ranges that people might be thinking "hmmm. I could buy a few shards with real money and I might be able to actual purchase that".

    Maybe this whole stupid scenario is balancing the market? I don't know about this stuff and would be curious for those who do.

    Those sources and sinks... atm we have a lot more sinks? I know that I managed to get up to ~360 shards by someone buying a skill tome off me (perform. go figure) for a lot of shards (why is it that there is no buyout for skill tomes?) but I'm now down to 76 through rerolling chests at 15 shards a pop on those difficult to do EE quests that I only get a shot at every so often.
    ~Thelanis ~ Khyber ~

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