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  1. #1
    Community Member Stoner81's Avatar
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    Lightbulb The Shadow Walker Build (Halfling Assassin)


    The Shadow Walker
    Updated for U23.



    About The Build

    Greetings and welcome to my build!

    This build is designed for those who want to remain in the shadows and to kill without being seen and as such a heavy emphasis has been placed on the DC for the Assassinate ability, on top of this you get a crazy amount of Sneak Attack damage thanks to all the enhancements.

    The build itself is really aimed at top end content (level 28) so for leveling in heroic levels it might be slightly trickier than other builds for that reason. However, with the introduction of the Harper tree and getting INT to hit and for damage that should make things easier from a DPS point of view. Unfortunatley the Harper isn't free unless you are VIP and will cost you 495TP for it so that also makes this build a bit more difficult for new players (Turbine have said that the Harper will be avialable as an favor unlock at some point).

    So without further ado I present to you Shadow Walker!

    The Shadow Walker

    Race: Halfling.
    Alignment: True Neutral.
    Class/Level Split: 20 Rogue/8 Epic

    Starting Base Stats At Level 1

    STR = 6
    DEX = 18
    CON = 14
    INT = 18 (all level ups here)
    WIS = 8
    CHA = 8

    For 34 and 36 point varients just increase starting CON, the build could work as a 28pt build but you would have to drop DEX a little in order to do it which would mean needing a +4 DEX tome by level 21.

    The only tome which is required is a +3 DEX tome by the time you reach level 21 in order to qualify for Epic Sneak Attack, naturally any other stat tomes you have will help. An INT tome isn't "required" per se but it will help your Assassinate DC a lot and it will affect your base damage output so try to get the highest one possible as fast as you can.

    Feat Selection

    1 - Two Weapon Fighting.
    3 - Dodge.
    6 - Precision.
    9 - Improved Two Weapon Fighting.
    10 - Improved Evasion.
    12 - Improved Critical: Pierce.
    13 - Oppertunist.
    15 - Greater Two Weapon Fighting.
    16 - Skill Mastery.
    18 - Insightful Reflexes.
    19 - Skill Mastery.
    21 - Epic Sneak Attack.
    24 - Overwhelming Critical.
    26 - Perfect Two Weapon Fighting.
    27 - Epic Damage Reduction.
    28 - Elusive Target.

    Skills

    As a Rogue with maximum skill points (thanks to a high starting INT) you have more skills points than you know what to do with! The main ones to focus on though are as follows (in alphabetical order):

    Bluff.
    Concentration (heal scrolls in combat).
    Diplomacy.
    Disable Device.
    Haggle.
    Hide.
    Jump.
    Move Silently.
    Open Lock.
    Search.
    Spot.
    Tumble.
    Use Magic Device (UMD).

    With the amount of skill points you get you should be able to easily max these out (23 ranks in each) by the time you are level 20, if you have points left over then put them wherever you wish since it shouldn't really matter as long as the above is maxed out.

    Enhancements

    Below are the complete enhancements for once you reach level 20.

    Mechanic (11 AP)

    Core: Arbalester.
    Tier 1: Mechanics I.
    Tier 1: Awareness III.
    Tier 2: Wand and Scroll Master III.

    Acrobat (4 AP)

    Core: Staff Control.
    Tier 1: Faster Sneaking III.

    Harper Agent (12 AP)

    Core: Agent of Good.
    Core: Intelligence.
    Core: Agent of Good II.
    Core: Intelligence.
    Tier 1: Travellers Toughness II.
    Tier 1: Strategic Combat.
    Tier 2: Versatile Adept III.
    Tier 2: Know The Angles III.
    Tier 3: Strategic Combat.
    Tier 3: Intelligence.
    Tier 3: Versatile Adept III.
    Tier 4: Versatile Adept I.

    Assassin (41 AP)

    Core: Knife In The Darkness.
    Core: Dagger In The Back.
    Core: Assassin's Trick.
    Core: Nimbleness.
    Core: Lethality.
    Core: Deadly Shadow.
    Tier 1: Sneak Attack Training.
    Tier 1: Stealthy II.
    Tier 2: Venomed Blades III.
    Tier 2: Sneak Attack Training.
    Tier 3: Critical Accuracy III.
    Tier 3: Sneak Attack Training.
    Tier 3: Intelligence.
    Tier 4: Critical Damage III.
    Tier 4: Killer III.
    Tier 4: Sneak Attack Training.
    Tier 4: Intelligence.
    Tier 5: Assassinate.
    Tier 5: Measure The Foe.
    Tier 5: Knife Specialization.

    Epic Destiny - Shadowdancer

    TBD.

    Twists Of Fate

    TBD.

    Gear Of Note

    Heroic Gear

    Starting out crafted gear is probably your best bet even if you are a new player, there are lots of crafters on all the servers so ask in the trade channels and see about getting some kit from them. Failing that just use whatever you can find, check the vendors in the Marketplace on a regular basis you can find some good bits of kit for pretty cheap.

    At level 8 the Snakeskin vest becomes a valid option for you until level 14 when you can swap to the Gianthold armor/s.

    Upon reaching level 12 when you take the Improved Critical feat stick to daggers since you will do more damage with those especially since you should have the T5 enhancement Knife Specialization by then. Since IC: Pierce also works with short swords you could swap to those if the need arose.

    Epic Gear

    Of particular note are the Epic Midnight Greetings which are just crazy for an Assassin so try and farm those if you can. Check out the the various faction vendors in Eveningstar they have some really really nice kit for your start in to the epic levels, once you get to level 23 Agony - Knife in the Dark is very good for the level.

    Final Gear Set

    This is something I am currently trying to work on but so far I have the following...

    HEAD: Epic Muffled Veneer.
    GOGGLES: Epic Mentau Goggles.
    BODY: Shadow Dragon Hide with Shadow Killer (+2D6 Sneak Attack dice).
    RING:
    BOOTS: Epic Boots of Innocence.
    GLOVES:
    RING:
    BELT:
    CLOAK:
    TRINKET: Manual of Stealthy Pilfering with Diamond of Search +15 slotted (consolidation item).
    NECKLACE: Necklace of Mystic Eidolons.

    Weapons

    Weapons of choice are naturally going to daggers...

    Green Steel Healing Amp 10/20/30 (hot swap for Heal scrolls).
    2x Thunder Forged Dagger - 1st Degree Burns / Dragons Edge / Mortal Fear with a Metoric Star ruby slotted (trash beater).
    2x Thunder Forged Dagger - 1st Degree Burns / Dragons Edge / Crippling Flames with a Metoric Star ruby slotted (boss beater).
    1x Thunder Forged Throwing Dagger - 1st Degree Burns / Dragons Edge / Mortal Fear or Crippling Flames with a Metoric Star ruby slotted (everybody needs a ranged weapon so might as well be the best one possible).

    Stoner81.

  2. #2
    The Hatchery CThruTheEgo's Avatar
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    A decent build but I have a few questions/comments.

    It might just be a visual error, but I notice you do not have an ability increase at level 8. What content are you planning this build for? EE? EH? Any idea what your final assassinate DC will be? If you're looking for some ideas about the gear set, check out the link to my assassin in my sig.

    Precision is pretty much a must have on a pure rogue. 25% fort bypass is huge for a sneak attack based dps build. If you're planning on using EMG and Agony, then you really don't need weapon finesse. Knife specialization actually gives daggers/kukris a better crit profile than rapiers/shortswords. I would drop weapon finesse and take precision in its place.

    You probably don't need skill focus UMD. Calculate what your UMD will be with/without buffs and gear swaps to see how much this is actually needed. You might consider imp crit slash for better dps from EMG. Unless you plan on swapping weapons every 12 seconds when assassinate is off timer, you will pretty much have EMG equipped all the time against trash, so imp crit can be a nice boost. I wouldn't say either skill focus UMD or imp crit slash is a must have (unlike precision), so its really up to you which one you want more. But my guess is you really won't need the UMD boost.

    Blinding speed is available on a variety of gear both named and lootgen. Personally, I prefer to have it in my gear set and use this feat slot for epic damage reduction. You won't get a lot of damage mitigation on a pure rogue no matter what you do, but some is certainly useful to handle the spike damage.

    Tactician should not affect your assassinate DC (it's bugged if it does) as assassinate is not considered a combat feat, so this is useless for you. Consider elusive target instead. It's an automatic 5% miss chance against all physical damage (including spells that do physical damage).

    Regarding the rogue feats. Crippling strike is kind of a waste imo. Enemies are resistant to stat damage on both EE and EH, so its effect is minimal at best. Slippery mind sounds useful but when you realize that the will save of a pure rogue is so low that you are most likely going to fail no matter what, then you see that the feat just allows you to fail twice. Besides that, nearly anything with a will save can be negated through the right buffs. Protection from evil (available as a clicky or wand) will protect you from almost everything requiring a will save. And as a UMD class you should have no problem providing yourself with such buffs. So I would drop both of these feats and take skill mastery instead. That will give you another 2 UMD, in fact, which would make it easier to drop skill focus UMD.

    The last thing I'll mention are enhancements. Points are tight on an int based assassin and its hard to spend much on the racial tree. On a halfling you basically have to choose between 2 points of int from mechanic (1 assassinate DC will make a difference on EE, not so much on EH though), haste boost and subtlety from acrobat, or the halfling sneak attack line. It depends on your goals for the character which of those are most valuable and which are worth sacrificing, but you simply can't take it all.

    For your enhancements, in acrobat I would drop stick fighting and take subtlety rank 3 instead. Threat reduction is vital for all of your dps but stick fighting will only help you when using your triple positive quarterstaff against skeletons, which isn't that often at endgame. In the mechanic tree, I prefer more awareness than mechanics. I find spot to be one of a rogue's weak points against traps and you shouldn't need the boost to disable or trap saves. But this is a personal preference, not vital. In the assassin tree, I would definitely pick up venomed blades. It's a nice dps addition. You need 6 points to get rank 3. You don't need the bonus to hide/move silently, so you can drop those for 3 points. I'd take the other 3 points from dropping/lowering some combination of execute, crit accuracy and damage, and killer.

    Those are my thoughts, I hope they help. How much many of my comments matter depends a lot on your goals for the character. And +1 for your first build.

    EDIT: I just looked at the ED list. You are probably going to want at least some int to boost your assassinate DC.
    Last edited by CThruTheEgo; 10-07-2013 at 08:43 PM.
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  3. #3
    Community Member Stoner81's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CThruTheEgo View Post
    A decent build but I have a few questions/comments.

    It might just be a visual error, but I notice you do not have an ability increase at level 8. What content are you planning this build for? EE? EH? Any idea what your final assassinate DC will be?
    I will double check the ability increase at level and see what is going on. As for content difficulty probably looking at EH at most until fully geared up and then maybe EE but as long as it can do EH that's fine by me as for the Assassinate DC I have no idea how to calculate it manually.

    EDIT - Just checked and it seems I missed the ability increase, new build will have it included

    Quote Originally Posted by CThruTheEgo View Post
    Precision is pretty much a must have on a pure rogue. 25% fort bypass is huge for a sneak attack based dps build. If you're planning on using EMG and Agony, then you really don't need weapon finesse. Knife specialization actually gives daggers/kukris a better crit profile than rapiers/shortswords. I would drop weapon finesse and take precision in its place.
    With everything else I just could not fit Precision in though having said once in to epics could swap Weapon Finesse at level 20 for it though.

    EDIT - Weapon Finesse should work with Celestia due to Assassin enhancements so that will cover breaking DR though the procs on Celestia could cause issues with aggro.

    Quote Originally Posted by CThruTheEgo View Post
    You probably don't need skill focus UMD. Calculate what your UMD will be with/without buffs and gear swaps to see how much this is actually needed. You might consider imp crit slash for better dps from EMG. Unless you plan on swapping weapons every 12 seconds when assassinate is off timer, you will pretty much have EMG equipped all the time against trash, so imp crit can be a nice boost. I wouldn't say either skill focus UMD or imp crit slash is a must have (unlike precision), so its really up to you which one you want more. But my guess is you really won't need the UMD boost.
    Improved Critical: Slashing was taken at lvl 12

    UMD Focus you could well be right to be honest I just could not think of anything better to take.

    EDIT - UMD Focus has been removed and replaced with Great INT since I could see anything better.

    [
    Quote Originally Posted by CThruTheEgo View Post
    Blinding speed is available on a variety of gear both named and lootgen. Personally, I prefer to have it in my gear set and use this feat slot for epic damage reduction. You won't get a lot of damage mitigation on a pure rogue no matter what you do, but some is certainly useful to handle the spike damage.
    I keep having a similar thought about my fighter to be honest on Blinding Speed so will look in to this.

    EDIT - Blinding Speed removed and replaced with Epic DR.

    Quote Originally Posted by CThruTheEgo View Post
    Tactician should not affect your assassinate DC (it's bugged if it does) as assassinate is not considered a combat feat, so this is useless for you. Consider elusive target instead. It's an automatic 5% miss chance against all physical damage (including spells that do physical damage).
    That's a bummer ah well Elusive Target it is then

    EDIT - Added Elusive Target.

    Quote Originally Posted by CThruTheEgo View Post
    Regarding the rogue feats. Crippling strike is kind of a waste imo. Enemies are resistant to stat damage on both EE and EH, so its effect is minimal at best. Slippery mind sounds useful but when you realize that the will save of a pure rogue is so low that you are most likely going to fail no matter what, then you see that the feat just allows you to fail twice. Besides that, nearly anything with a will save can be negated through the right buffs. Protection from evil (available as a clicky or wand) will protect you from almost everything requiring a will save. And as a UMD class you should have no problem providing yourself with such buffs. So I would drop both of these feats and take skill mastery instead. That will give you another 2 UMD, in fact, which would make it easier to drop skill focus UMD.
    Yeah I see your point, these feats I find a little "lackluster" to be perfectly honest and your reasoning here makes perfect sense

    EDIT - The two lousy feats have been replaced with Skill Mastery instead.

    Quote Originally Posted by CThruTheEgo View Post
    The last thing I'll mention are enhancements. Points are tight on an int based assassin and its hard to spend much on the racial tree. On a halfling you basically have to choose between 2 points of int from mechanic (1 assassinate DC will make a difference on EE, not so much on EH though), haste boost and subtlety from acrobat, or the halfling sneak attack line. It depends on your goals for the character which of those are most valuable and which are worth sacrificing, but you simply can't take it all.

    For your enhancements, in acrobat I would drop stick fighting and take subtlety rank 3 instead. Threat reduction is vital for all of your dps but stick fighting will only help you when using your triple positive quarterstaff against skeletons, which isn't that often at endgame. In the mechanic tree, I prefer more awareness than mechanics. I find spot to be one of a rogue's weak points against traps and you shouldn't need the boost to disable or trap saves. But this is a personal preference, not vital. In the assassin tree, I would definitely pick up venomed blades. It's a nice dps addition. You need 6 points to get rank 3. You don't need the bonus to hide/move silently, so you can drop those for 3 points. I'd take the other 3 points from dropping/lowering some combination of execute, crit accuracy and damage, and killer.
    Enhancements were a frickin' nightmare to be honest and I'm still not overly happy with them, could really do with another 4-6 points or so then I would be happy

    Quote Originally Posted by CThruTheEgo View Post
    Those are my thoughts, I hope they help. How much many of my comments matter depends a lot on your goals for the character. And +1 for your first build.

    EDIT: I just looked at the ED list. You are probably going to want at least some int to boost your assassinate DC.
    Thanks for the constructive/productive feedback was exactly what I was looking so again thank you! As for ED's it was just something I could think of straight away really nothing more, the build needs fine tuning which I expected since it's my first proper build so to speak. I will take in everything you have suggested and look at it all tomorrow and post up a new version of it.

    Stoner81.

  4. #4
    Community Member Stoner81's Avatar
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    First post updated with the new build thanks for the suggestions, defo going to leave enhancements till tomorrow now though.

    Stoner81.

  5. #5
    The Hatchery CThruTheEgo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stoner81 View Post
    Improved Critical: Slashing was taken at lvl 12
    Ah, I just assumed it was imp crit pierce. My main point was it's useful to have both for a DC based assassin since you'll likely be using Agony and EMG most of the time. Only having one of the imp crits means a dps loss. I'd take pierce at 12 since there's a variety of good named daggers and few kukris.

    Regarding weapon finesse, what weapons do you plan to use in heroic levels that will make this feat useful?
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  6. #6
    Community Member Stoner81's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CThruTheEgo View Post
    Ah, I just assumed it was imp crit pierce. My main point was it's useful to have both for a DC based assassin since you'll likely be using Agony and EMG most of the time. Only having one of the imp crits means a dps loss. I'd take pierce at 12 since there's a variety of good named daggers and few kukris.

    Regarding weapon finesse, what weapons do you plan to use in heroic levels that will make this feat useful?
    Envenomed Blades from the LoD chain are awesome for the level and work very well up to cap then switch to EMG's (once I have grinded for them), other than that though pretty much anything would work. Originally I used Khopeshes for leveling until I reached 16 then got the Envenomed Blades but I built the character to go with STR and some DEX over huge INT for leveling purposes, then the enhancement pass arrived and everything changed and I wanted to go INT/DEX based. Also once in to epics Weapon Finesse will come in to play with Celestia since it's a short sword.

    As for Imp Crit Pierce to some degree I don't see the point in getting it, Agony has Keen I so it won't stack with IC:Pierce and EMG's do slashing damage however, for leveling up in heroics it could be useful.

    Stoner81.

    PS - I am working on the enhancements now

    PPS - New enhancements are done, dropped Stick Fighting (which I didn't want to do but had to) and got the full Subtlety line and Wand & Scroll Mastery II for Heal scrolls.

  7. #7
    The Hatchery CThruTheEgo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stoner81 View Post
    Envenomed Blades from the LoD chain are awesome for the level and work very well up to cap then switch to EMG's (once I have grinded for them), other than that though pretty much anything would work. Originally I used Khopeshes for leveling until I reached 16 then got the Envenomed Blades but I built the character to go with STR and some DEX over huge INT for leveling purposes, then the enhancement pass arrived and everything changed and I wanted to go INT/DEX based. Also once in to epics Weapon Finesse will come in to play with Celestia since it's a short sword.

    As for Imp Crit Pierce to some degree I don't see the point in getting it, Agony has Keen I so it won't stack with IC:Pierce and EMG's do slashing damage however, for leveling up in heroics it could be useful.

    Stoner81.

    PS - I am working on the enhancements now

    PPS - New enhancements are done, dropped Stick Fighting (which I didn't want to do but had to) and got the full Subtlety line and Wand & Scroll Mastery II for Heal scrolls.
    I forgot Agony has keen on it. Imp crit pierce works with Celestia if you're planning to use that. I have a crafter so I just use crafted DR breakers. If you have access to a crafter you could just make them all kukris and then not have to worry about imp crit pierce at all, although there are some decent named daggers but only one named kukri worth having.
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  8. #8
    Community Member Stoner81's Avatar
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    My TR toon is a crafting monkey and can make recipes up to level 100 atm so that is certainly an option. I am surprised about IC:Pierce working with Celestia since it does Light damage but hey ho you learn something new everyday

    As for IC:Pierce feats are just too tight on a Halfling, if it was Human then it could be doable due to the extra feat but on a 32pt build the starting stats suffer on a Human since Halflings get +2 DEX at creation, I might make up the stats for 34pt and 36pt builds in case anybody wants them.

    So far I have only run this toon with guild buddies but it has worked very well (not the build in the first post) being in a group it really has shined but I guess that is where a Rogue excels anyway so you would expect that to be the case. Once I switch over to the build in the first post I am convinced it will be even better than what it is now.

    Stoner81.

  9. #9
    Community Member Bolo_Grubb's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stoner81 View Post
    Envenomed Blades from the LoD chain are awesome for the level and work very well up to cap .
    Just in case you were not aware, Envenomed blades can use dex for hit and damage. So no need to take weapon finesse for just those.
    Kill'em all and let their favorite deity sort'em out
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    Community Member Stoner81's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bolo_Grubb View Post
    Just in case you were not aware, Envenomed blades can use dex for hit and damage. So no need to take weapon finesse for just those.
    <insert monumentally epic facepalm.jpg here>

    I can't believe I didn't spot that! Either way Weapon Finesse is needed since it's a STR dump build so as you can at least hit the broad side of barn (just about ) will look at doing 34pt stats and 36 point stats in a short while.

    Stoner81.

    PS - Updated the first post now with 34pt and 36pt variants, also updated gear lists a little too.

  11. #11
    Community Member sephiroth1084's Avatar
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    Two things:

    First, if you have GTWF, and Perfect TWF, why would you want to be using a quarterstaff for any reason? Wit the Assassin core enhancements, you should be able to get Dex-to-damage with light maces if you have Weapon Finesse--that's a decent reason to have the feat. That there are also some pretty good named shortswords and rapiers serves to improve the stock of Weapon Finesse, especially if you are in the process of acquiring the really good daggers and kukri.


    Second, a query: I've noticed across a few similar threads (including Hassan's Assassin) that no one mentions Radiance weapons any more. Has everyone just decided that Blindness is too irritating to deal with? I'm still using my Radiance II greendsteel (a rapier until I get around to crafting a dagger), and it has continue to prove very useful. On stuff you can't Assassinate, but can blind (orange named), and stuff with saves too high to Assassinate (or who rolled well against your attempt) and with enough HP to be dangerous for a while, the blindness effect ensures you have your sneak attack damage running, even when you have aggro (useful when soloing, too), and gives everyone Displacement vs. that creature. Just wondering why this useful effect, previously a staple of rogues everywhere, goes entirely unmentioned by most people these days.
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  12. #12
    Community Member Stoner81's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sephiroth1084 View Post
    First, if you have GTWF, and Perfect TWF, why would you want to be using a quarterstaff for any reason? Wit the Assassin core enhancements, you should be able to get Dex-to-damage with light maces if you have Weapon Finesse--that's a decent reason to have the feat. That there are also some pretty good named shortswords and rapiers serves to improve the stock of Weapon Finesse, especially if you are in the process of acquiring the really good daggers and kukri.
    It was the best thing I could think of to beat down skeletons with.

    Quote Originally Posted by sephiroth1084 View Post
    Second, a query: I've noticed across a few similar threads (including Hassan's Assassin) that no one mentions Radiance weapons any more. Has everyone just decided that Blindness is too irritating to deal with? I'm still using my Radiance II greendsteel (a rapier until I get around to crafting a dagger), and it has continue to prove very useful. On stuff you can't Assassinate, but can blind (orange named), and stuff with saves too high to Assassinate (or who rolled well against your attempt) and with enough HP to be dangerous for a while, the blindness effect ensures you have your sneak attack damage running, even when you have aggro (useful when soloing, too), and gives everyone Displacement vs. that creature. Just wondering why this useful effect, previously a staple of rogues everywhere, goes entirely unmentioned by most people these days.
    With the sheer amount of power that characters can have stuff just doesn't last that long for Radiance to be used imho, plenty of people still swear by it but personally I have never used it but I will look in to it.

    Stoner81.

    PS - Swapped Toughness for Precision at lvl 6. With items, ED's etc I suspect this could still see 500HP at level cap.

  13. #13
    Community Member sephiroth1084's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stoner81 View Post
    It was the best thing I could think of to beat down skeletons with.
    It's more time and ingredients, but I think you'd be better off with a pair of Triple Pos Light Maces. With PTWF, you've got almost 95% more attacks than you do with the quarterstaff.* Remember, you have 80% off-hand from GTWF, 5% DS, and 10% off-hand DS. That's a LOT of damage you're losing by using a two-hander.


    *Ignoring base differences in attack speed (I believe quarterstaves have always been near the top of the curve for attack speed, so you may be looking at maybe being at a 60% increased attack rate).


    With the sheer amount of power that characters can have stuff just doesn't last that long for Radiance to be used imho, plenty of people still swear by it but personally I have never used it but I will look in to it.

    Stoner81.
    Depends what you're running, and who with, I suppose. I did about half of an EE GH Saga run the other night with a good group (no deaths, fairly quick runs), and I found the Radiance to be quite helpful: on casters it keeps them from throwing spells to a degree, which is a big boon. As the rogue in the group, I'd sneak past the heavies and try to assassinate the clerics or wizards hanging out further back, and if I failed, I'd get them blinded in short order. The Aurum casters have quite a lot of HP, so it's not like you're going to finish them off in one Bluff or some such, or even get a vorpal kill quickly, so dropping some no-save CC on them is a big plus in my book. Their running around is kind of a pain, but you can fence them in a little, by using the environment and your allies, or just chase them around. Unless your group is tearing through everything, or it's the last mob standing, one or two enemies running around like chickens with their heads cut off instead of attacking or casting isn't a bad thing, especially when those attacks come with a 50% miss chance stapled on, and being open to your sneak attacks.

    I don't know that I would use it full-time once I get something like Agony, but it's worth having in your arsenal, in my opinion. Mind you, Radiance appear(ed) on random loot, so you don't necessarily need a greensteel version (and the random epic loot will be at +1[W] instead of +0.5), but having some control over what other effects you have on the weapon is a good thing, obviously, and bursts and blasts are well worthwhile on 15-20/x3 weapons.
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  14. #14
    Community Member jakeelala's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sephiroth1084 View Post
    It's more time and ingredients, but I think you'd be better off with a pair of Triple Pos Light Maces. With PTWF, you've got almost 95% more attacks than you do with the quarterstaff.* Remember, you have 80% off-hand from GTWF, 5% DS, and 10% off-hand DS. That's a LOT of damage you're losing by using a two-hander.


    *Ignoring base differences in attack speed (I believe quarterstaves have always been near the top of the curve for attack speed, so you may be looking at maybe being at a 60% increased attack rate).



    Depends what you're running, and who with, I suppose. I did about half of an EE GH Saga run the other night with a good group (no deaths, fairly quick runs), and I found the Radiance to be quite helpful: on casters it keeps them from throwing spells to a degree, which is a big boon. As the rogue in the group, I'd sneak past the heavies and try to assassinate the clerics or wizards hanging out further back, and if I failed, I'd get them blinded in short order. The Aurum casters have quite a lot of HP, so it's not like you're going to finish them off in one Bluff or some such, or even get a vorpal kill quickly, so dropping some no-save CC on them is a big plus in my book. Their running around is kind of a pain, but you can fence them in a little, by using the environment and your allies, or just chase them around. Unless your group is tearing through everything, or it's the last mob standing, one or two enemies running around like chickens with their heads cut off instead of attacking or casting isn't a bad thing, especially when those attacks come with a 50% miss chance stapled on, and being open to your sneak attacks.

    I don't know that I would use it full-time once I get something like Agony, but it's worth having in your arsenal, in my opinion. Mind you, Radiance appear(ed) on random loot, so you don't necessarily need a greensteel version (and the random epic loot will be at +1[W] instead of +0.5), but having some control over what other effects you have on the weapon is a good thing, obviously, and bursts and blasts are well worthwhile on 15-20/x3 weapons.
    if you don't have GS or Celestia you can turn in 15 Cleric comms for a Star of Day which has a pretty good chance of spawning Radiance on it (i got mine the first turn in). But really Radiance GS daggers would probably be the best for the 15-20x3 Crits though

  15. #15
    Community Member psykopeta's Avatar
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    polycurse dagger, don't forget the polycurse dagger, paralyzing is meh, u have to do it really wrong to need paralyzing weapons as a rogue

    and y, i made a similar toon, spending int on lvl ups for assassinate dc and enhancements on dex and halfling SA line for dps (ring of lies rules, rad2 on main hand too, only 1)

    iirc dc was 55 or so, more than enough for EH, also if you push dc higher(not hard, just hit with the nerf bat to everything dex related) u'll be useful assassinating on EE, but useless soloing on EH at bosses

    btw, if u have lvled this toon, will notice that restore potions are ur best friend: ray of enfeeblement = heavy encumbered (til lvl 11 or so when 3 tome + 2 buffs + 6 item keep u over the encumbered line)

    2was funny tho
    psykopeta is finally baconpletionist because there isn't anything to delay it more - thelanis, where the gimps claim to be pros and noobs claim to be pros, no newbies allowed(unless they claim to be pros), we have enough drama w/o them. PS: I post only in the latest thread shown in main page, in the weird case u want something from me, feel free to send pm

  16. #16

  17. #17
    The Hatchery CThruTheEgo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sephiroth1084 View Post
    First, if you have GTWF, and Perfect TWF, why would you want to be using a quarterstaff for any reason? Wit the Assassin core enhancements, you should be able to get Dex-to-damage with light maces if you have Weapon Finesse--that's a decent reason to have the feat. That there are also some pretty good named shortswords and rapiers serves to improve the stock of Weapon Finesse, especially if you are in the process of acquiring the really good daggers and kukri.
    Quote Originally Posted by sephiroth1084 View Post
    It's more time and ingredients, but I think you'd be better off with a pair of Triple Pos Light Maces. With PTWF, you've got almost 95% more attacks than you do with the quarterstaff.* Remember, you have 80% off-hand from GTWF, 5% DS, and 10% off-hand DS. That's a LOT of damage you're losing by using a two-hander.
    This is a good point, if you're taking weapon finesse then you should definitely be using dual triple positive light maces over a quarterstaff. And now you've got me thinking about fitting in weapon finesse on my build for just this purpose. I don't think it matters for most skeletons but the most run raid in the game right now has a sleleton for a boss, so it's probably a good idea to max your damage against him. I've got a lot of coms to farm out...

    Quote Originally Posted by sephiroth1084 View Post
    Second, a query: I've noticed across a few similar threads (including Hassan's Assassin) that no one mentions Radiance weapons any more.
    I have a rad2 rapier from my first life and now a rad2 dagger since the enhancement pass. The dagger is still almost always in use but I'm also in heroics with my build atm. I'm sure it'll still be something I swap to on occasion even at endgame but, as you mentioned, once you get something like Agony it probably won't be in full time use. That's the main reason why I didn't mention it.

    Quote Originally Posted by psykopeta View Post
    polycurse dagger, don't forget the polycurse dagger, paralyzing is meh, u have to do it really wrong to need paralyzing weapons as a rogue
    Polycurse dagger is great, especially when used with the trinket that prevents you from getting cursed constantly. I agree that paralyzing is pretty weak. It doesn't proc even half as much as the paralyzing from an arcane archer. Rad2 dagger and polycurse dagger is a great combo though and my main weapon set for trash.
    Last edited by CThruTheEgo; 10-10-2013 at 08:59 AM.
    Unarmed monk guide with builds|The Arcane Warrior: wiz/fighter hybrids|White Feather Sniper: CC/dps focused deepwood stalker|The Divine Cuisinart: divine crusader tempest|The Count of Monte Cristo: swashbuckler|Hassan's Assassin: dex assassin|Dubbell O'Seven: WF artificer|Santa's Little Slayer: dragonmarked elf centered kensai

  18. #18
    Community Member Stoner81's Avatar
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    Yeah it is a very good point about the light maces, I will set about looking more in to gear and stuff this weekend with a bit of luck and see if I can pad out the build a bit more to be more comprehensive with everything.

    Stoner81.

  19. #19
    Community Member Stoner81's Avatar
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    With the new Harper tree incomming which allows INT for to-hit and for damage rolls I will be looking at re-doing this build for that. Now depending on how many AP's are need Assassinate might go out the window since they are tighter than a tight thing already and I don't know where to pull stuff from.

    It could could end up being max INT with just enough in DEX for the TWF feats and whatever is left in to CON.

    Stoner81.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stoner81 View Post
    With the new Harper tree incomming which allows INT for to-hit and for damage rolls I will be looking at re-doing this build for that. Now depending on how many AP's are need Assassinate might go out the window since they are tighter than a tight thing already and I don't know where to pull stuff from.

    It could could end up being max INT with just enough in DEX for the TWF feats and whatever is left in to CON.

    Stoner81.
    I've got a first life shadarkai lined up to test this as soon as it comes out.

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