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  1. #1
    Community Member Annex's Avatar
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    Default Can Some Enemies Bypass Deathblock?

    About two weeks ago, while running Tomb of the Shadow King (a level 8 quest) on Elite, my level 13 Rogue was instantly killed by something. At the moment this happened, my Rogue was at or near full hit points (about 170), burdened, and wearing a Mabar Cloak of Night, Minimum Level 12, with Deathblock.

    I can provide more information. A friend and I, each with a Cleric hirling, were making our way through the tomb. A third character with a Cleric hirling remained at the tomb entrance and was not involved in the fight (6 party members, total). We engaged a mixed group of monsters including about 6 Umbral Gargoyles and at least one Wraith. My Rogue was dancing in and out of the pack, trying to maintain the attention of the enemies, when hit by a Ray of Enfeeblement or something else that drains Strength. She immediately became Burdened but, to my knowledge, not helpless. I successfully backed her out of the pack, began to order a Heal from her hirling Cleric, and then she was struck instantly dead.

    After a pause of shock, I quickly went to the Combat Log to see what happened. The log showed all her buffs removed (Blur, Super Heroism, Protection from Evil, Protection from Elements), then a death statement, but no line for what caused the death. To my knowledge, she did not sustain massive damage before her death.

    My first thought was that I accidentally equipped her Cloak of the World Shaper and she was then struck by an instant kill spell, but her Mabar Cloak of Night was equipped. My second thought was that Ray of Enfeeblement left her helpless and this turned off Deathblock, but there was no indication of a Helpless state before her death.

    Can any of you offer an explanation of what happened and, perhaps, a counter? Perhaps I misread the Combat Log? Perhaps she was Helpless and Deathblock ceased functioning? Perhaps she was hit by some massive damage attack while helpless? This continues to bother me so I decided to come here and ask for advice. Alas, I did not save the Combat Log as I have no idea how. For what it is worth, all my characters now carry large stacks of Lesser Restoration potions.

    Thank you!

  2. #2
    Community Member redspecter23's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Annex View Post
    About two weeks ago, while running Tomb of the Shadow King (a level 8 quest) on Elite, my level 13 Rogue was instantly killed by something. At the moment this happened, my Rogue was at or near full hit points (about 170), burdened, and wearing a Mabar Cloak of Night, Minimum Level 12, with Deathblock.

    I can provide more information. A friend and I, each with a Cleric hirling, were making our way through the tomb. A third character with a Cleric hirling remained at the tomb entrance and was not involved in the fight (6 party members, total). We engaged a mixed group of monsters including about 6 Umbral Gargoyles and at least one Wraith. My Rogue was dancing in and out of the pack, trying to maintain the attention of the enemies, when hit by a Ray of Enfeeblement or something else that drains Strength. She immediately became Burdened but, to my knowledge, not helpless. I successfully backed her out of the pack, began to order a Heal from her hirling Cleric, and then she was struck instantly dead.

    After a pause of shock, I quickly went to the Combat Log to see what happened. The log showed all her buffs removed (Blur, Super Heroism, Protection from Evil, Protection from Elements), then a death statement, but no line for what caused the death. To my knowledge, she did not sustain massive damage before her death.

    My first thought was that I accidentally equipped her Cloak of the World Shaper and she was then struck by an instant kill spell, but her Mabar Cloak of Night was equipped. My second thought was that Ray of Enfeeblement left her helpless and this turned off Deathblock, but there was no indication of a Helpless state before her death.

    Can any of you offer an explanation of what happened and, perhaps, a counter? Perhaps I misread the Combat Log? Perhaps she was Helpless and Deathblock ceased functioning? Perhaps she was hit by some massive damage attack while helpless? This continues to bother me so I decided to come here and ask for advice. Alas, I did not save the Combat Log as I have no idea how. For what it is worth, all my characters now carry large stacks of Lesser Restoration potions.

    Thank you!
    Any chance there were shadow creatures around? They give you strength damage as they hit you with an added debuff that instantly kills you if your str drops to 0. This will bypass deathblock, though deathward will prevent the str damage to begin with. This seems to be the likely cause of your death if I had to guess.
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  3. #3
    Community Member voodoogroves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by redspecter23 View Post
    Any chance there were shadow creatures around? They give you strength damage as they hit you with an added debuff that instantly kills you if your str drops to 0. This will bypass deathblock, though deathward will prevent the str damage to begin with. This seems to be the likely cause of your death if I had to guess.
    Likely this. Death from stat damage.
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  4. #4
    Community Member Annex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by redspecter23 View Post
    Any chance there were shadow creatures around? They give you strength damage as they hit you with an added debuff that instantly kills you if your str drops to 0. This will bypass deathblock, though deathward will prevent the str damage to begin with. This seems to be the likely cause of your death if I had to guess.
    Oh! Yes, there were many Shadows in the tomb and I recall seeing at least one in the pack, so that would explain what happened. Thank you both very much!

  5. #5
    Community Member cdr's Avatar
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    Yep; stat damage will kill you deathblock or not. Death Ward (spell) prevents shadow stat damage, but wraiths in Necro II spam Dispel which will get rid of Death Ward pretty fast.

    Spawn Screen also prevents shadow stat damage, and it's easy to scroll cast with UMD in a pinch (bet you thought it was completely useless).

  6. #6
    Community Member Annex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cdr View Post
    Spawn Screen also prevents shadow stat damage, and it's easy to scroll cast with UMD in a pinch (bet you thought it was completely useless).
    Now that is very interesting! I was a bit late discovering the usefulness of Use Magic Device but will keep working on the skill and try that trick. I can always fall back on the Lesser Restoration potions.

  7. #7
    Hero LOOON375's Avatar
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    A 1000 point Necrotic ray will bypass deathblock.

    That is instant death to most toons.
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  8. #8
    Community Member Llewndyn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cdr View Post
    Yep; stat damage will kill you deathblock or not. Death Ward (spell) prevents shadow stat damage, but wraiths in Necro II spam Dispel which will get rid of Death Ward pretty fast.

    Spawn Screen also prevents shadow stat damage, and it's easy to scroll cast with UMD in a pinch (bet you thought it was completely useless).
    I refuse to believe there is a legitimate use for spawn screen in this game.
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Llewndyn View Post
    I refuse to believe there is a legitimate use for spawn screen in this game.
    a few of the raids have players killed raised as wraiths when they die, so spawnscreen is useful in stopping that. FOT is one, which with all of the other effects flying around, another enemy wraith is the last thing you want.

  10. #10
    Community Member Annex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LOOON375 View Post
    A 1000 point Necrotic ray will bypass deathblock.

    That is instant death to most toons.
    Uh oh. I have Visor of the Flesh Render Guards on two of my three mid-level characters, but as an earlier poster pointed out, Dispel Magic trumps them. It looks like I need a layered defense with Death Ward, Deathblock, Spell Absorption, Potions, and Scrolls. Time to get to adventuring.

  11. #11
    Community Member Ivan_Milic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cdr View Post
    Yep; stat damage will kill you deathblock or not. Death Ward (spell) prevents shadow stat damage, but wraiths in Necro II spam Dispel which will get rid of Death Ward pretty fast.

    Spawn Screen also prevents shadow stat damage, and it's easy to scroll cast with UMD in a pinch (bet you thought it was completely useless).
    I didnt know that, time to get some scrolls.

  12. #12
    Hero LOOON375's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Annex View Post
    Uh oh. I have Visor of the Flesh Render Guards on two of my three mid-level characters, but as an earlier poster pointed out, Dispel Magic trumps them. It looks like I need a layered defense with Death Ward, Deathblock, Spell Absorption, Potions, and Scrolls. Time to get to adventuring.
    Make no mistake, even if you have all of it, you can still get instantly killed. Spell absorption only lasts until the charges run out, and then you are SOL.

    In EE content, your spell absorption items can be drained in the first couple of fights, rendering it useless or next to useless throughout the rest of the quest.

    You can only do so much to prepare, and then it's a crapshoot.

    I have been playing my WF EK Sorc solidly in EE content for the last two weeks WITHOUT a spell absorption item. And only once has he been killed instantly. And it was the 1000 point necrotic ray that Im speaking of.

    It was in the mabar chamber in PoP in gianthold. And usually by the time I get there, on any toon I play, spell absorption items are already drained and rendered useless.

    Prepare as best you can and call it a day.

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  13. #13
    Community Member tkneip1874's Avatar
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    I was under the impression that stats dropping to zero no longer caused instant death. If that is the case then why does wounding of puncturing not work?

  14. #14
    Community Member Crann's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tkneip1874 View Post
    I was under the impression that stats dropping to zero no longer caused instant death. If that is the case then why does wounding of puncturing not work?
    Only for the monsters

  15. #15
    Community Member redspecter23's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tkneip1874 View Post
    I was under the impression that stats dropping to zero no longer caused instant death. If that is the case then why does wounding of puncturing not work?
    Normally, you are correct. However, shadows have a special debuff that they inflict along with the stat damage. It's the debuff that instantly kills you when you hit 0 strength, not the fact that you hit 0 in a stat.
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  16. #16
    Community Member brian14's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cdr View Post
    Spawn Screen also prevents shadow stat damage, and it's easy to scroll cast with UMD in a pinch (bet you thought it was completely useless).
    Just shadow stat damage or all stat damage? Or just all STR damage?
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  17. #17
    Community Member cdr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brian14 View Post
    Just shadow stat damage or all stat damage? Or just all STR damage?
    I haven't actually used it in years, but I think just shadow damage - presumably how they implemented the "prevents allies from rising as undead" since the rising is part of the damage effect.

  18. #18

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    Death by stat drain is unique to Shadows and Pit Fiends. Shadows do it with str damage on their melee attacks, Pit Fiends have it as a secondary effect on their poison bite. It hits for 1000 con damage and kills you.

    FOT is one, which with all of the other effects flying around, another enemy wraith is the last thing you want.
    Please, like a CR 5 wraith is some big danger to eleven level 28s. It will die almost the instant it pops up from a random glancing blow from an eSoS or energy burst or DBF or Shiradi AOE proc, or any one of a thousand other things that will trivially one-shot a monster so weak.
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  19. #19
    Community Member FestusHood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matuse View Post
    Death by stat drain is unique to Shadows and Pit Fiends. Shadows do it with str damage on their melee attacks, Pit Fiends have it as a secondary effect on their poison bite. It hits for 1000 con damage and kills you.
    The medusa boss in eyes of stone uses some sort of poison attack that kills you when the timer runs down. I think it is similar to the pit fiend poison.

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