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Thread: Twist of Fate

  1. #21
    Community Member thegreatneil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by anivaj View Post
    If the posts explaining how to do it are being cubed, then I agree it is an exploit.
    Three total that stated how to do it have been removed.
    You'll bend to my will - With or without your precious sanity.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blerkington View Post
    Everyone who is more effective than me is OP, and should be nerfed.
    Everyone who has more stuff than me cheated to get it, and should be punished.
    Everyone who plays differently to me is a bad person, and should be mistreated.

  2. #22
    Community Member LightBear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soulfurnace View Post
    From some random (maybe trustable) website, the definition of exploit is:

    • 1make full use of and derive benefit from (a resource):


    • 2make use of (a situation) in a way considered unfair or underhand:

    So.. By that definition this is an exploit - as it's considered unfair and underhanded, correct?
    Nope, by that definition it's:
    • 1make unwanted use of a benefit


    And that's it really. It's not like you can determine the difference between deliberate use and the piggy bag.

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  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deadlock View Post
    The matter would be moot if all twists were removed from your character when you TR. Can't think of a single good reason why it's not been done already.
    Because Turbine is selling Ed's.

    Best thing to happen to TRing.

  4. #24
    Community Member toaftoaf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thegreatneil View Post
    Three total that stated how to do it have been removed.
    my bet is only becuse they dont know how to stop it. shame on them

  5. #25
    Community Member PermaBanned's Avatar
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    Default It's Turbine, what did you expect?

    There will be no bans handed out over this. There are two specific cases I can look back on that led to the end of banning exploiters:

    •Mabar Scale Debacle
    In attempting to ban everyone who manipulated their instance to recieve 2 scales, they also banned those who innocently received the benefit during a DC, and many people who never participated in the process one way or the other; this resulted in lots of bad press on gaming sites & tons of bad press via word of mouth (their primary form advertising).

    •The Shears of Fate
    Turbine learned that some particular exploi- *ahem* "non-wai features" were quite profitable. Since they raked in a small fortune selling the magic scissors - knowing full well what was being done with them before putting them on sale - they seem to have decided that banning the open wallets was a bad idea. This was ratified with the whole Otto's Stone receiving xp boosts issue, which they eventually admitted (during the whole Bigby fiasco) had not been wai. However the non-wai function was significantly more profitable than what they intended, so they left it as-is.

    Hands, feeding, biting...

    Is anyone buying EDs just to benefit during TRing? IDK.
    Is anyone buying ToF just to benefit during TRing? Again, IDK.
    If people are, will Turbine make a move to cut off a potential - even if non-wai - revenue source? History says no. Will Turbine punish those who benefitted from non-wai "features?" Again, history says no.

    Preventing this heroic twisting issue is laughably simple. Heroic level toons can't converse with Epic level quest givers, so other conversations should be similarly easy to prevent... If they wanted to...

    Edit:
    Another super-simple fix: you just simply can't click the "make active" button on any destiny while in heroic levels, so just apply that to another particular button and "problem" solved.
    Last edited by PermaBanned; 10-03-2013 at 04:43 PM.
    Now excuse me while I wander off to arm myself with Grilled Cheese Sandwiches and hunker down behind my Armored Beer Refrigerator, while I have the UFO's take control of the Congresional Wives with the help of the International Cocaine Smugglers and the Evil Geniuses for a Better Tomorrow

  6. #26
    Community Member MultiFaceted's Avatar
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    Default Nope -that won't fix it...

    Quote Originally Posted by PermaBanned View Post
    Preventing this heroic twisting issue is laughably simple. Heroic level toons can't converse with Epic level quest givers, so other conversations should be similarly easy to prevent... If they wanted to...
    Your assumption here is wrong. I thought the same, that this could "fix" it. I hear that "this step" is not necessary and "it" can be done a different way... (I will not confirm or deny to remain ambiguous... will this save me from the potential b'hammer?) The fix will require a different change...

  7. #27
    Community Member Ryiah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deadlock View Post
    The matter would be moot if all twists were removed from your character when you TR.
    Actually this wouldn't solve anything unless twists were outright made non-functioning. An easier solution would probably be to reset your EDs, in a similar manner as when you swap a feat, when you TR and force you to reallocate them. As far as I know you cannot allocate points while sub-20.
    Ryiah | Raeyah | Reikara
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  8. #28
    Community Member PermaBanned's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MultiFaceted View Post
    Your assumption here is wrong. I thought the same, that this could "fix" it. I hear that "this step" is not necessary and "it" can be done a different way... (I will not confirm or deny to remain ambiguous... will this save me from the potential b'hammer?) The fix will require a different change...
    I'm not VIP so I can't confirm that. Iirc there's also a Store item that allows you to make certain modifactions without having that conversation, but not able to log in ATM & check nor would I actually spend the points anyway. However, given that the only way(s?) to achieve heroic twists without that conversation would involve spending money (either through sub or points expenditure) I'm even more surprised they haven't made it so...

    Edited my earlier post with this other super-simple fix: As you can't click the "make active" button on any destiny while in heroic levels, just apply that to another particular button, and the "problem" is solved.

    However ^that^ fix would prevent circumvention by $pending so I find it to be a much less likely solution.
    Last edited by PermaBanned; 10-03-2013 at 04:48 PM.
    Now excuse me while I wander off to arm myself with Grilled Cheese Sandwiches and hunker down behind my Armored Beer Refrigerator, while I have the UFO's take control of the Congresional Wives with the help of the International Cocaine Smugglers and the Evil Geniuses for a Better Tomorrow

  9. #29
    Community Member MultiFaceted's Avatar
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    Default Thought of that too...

    Quote Originally Posted by PermaBanned View Post
    I'm not VIP so I can't confirm that. Iirc there's also a Store item that allows you to make certain modifactions without having that conversation, but not able to log in ATM & check nor would I actually spend the points anyway. However, given that the only way(s?) to achieve heroic twists without that conversation would involve spending money (either through sub or points expenditure) I'm even more surprised they haven't made it so...

    Edited my earlier post with this other super-simple fix: As you can't click the "make active" button on any destiny while in heroic levels, just apply that to another particular button, and the "problem" is solved.
    I don't think it requires VIP, or store items. Without going into specific details (with the hope I won't end up like your forum title...) I'd say that this won't fix it ether. i.e. The steps that require talking to NPC's and manipulating which ED is active can be performed before you TR... leaving the final two steps for once you have finished the TR process, of which I don't think require VIP? Correct me if I'm wrong on this bit - I'm pretty sure the last two "steps" can be done at any time during the heroic levels to make changes to which twists you are "using".

    In any case I think it needs a more detailed coding fix, to the ED interface screen to only allow a specific UI feature while in epic levels... which is probably why it is taking so long as this sounds like it would be hard to change if they are using standard UI functions (e.g. that are also used for hotbars... for the last step... if you get my drift).

    In any case I'll be quiet now, as this is enough info for the Dev's reading this in case they weren't aware of these potential workarounds to those potential fixes...

  10. #30
    Community Member burningwind's Avatar
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    hope they allow this, give some advantage to tr a character =P

  11. #31
    Community Member NaturalHazard's Avatar
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    They haven't been had the best record with banning people who exploit, remember making plat appear out of thin air and unlimited +3 tomes back in the day? Hardly anyone got a bann for that. If the whole ED thing bothers you that much be more careful who you pug with, though as you level up higher they wont be as obvious, have fun with the PM's instant killing everything before you get to it, lol.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by MultiFaceted View Post
    I don't think it requires VIP, or store items. Without going into specific details..
    It's still a process that requires a conscious effort in order to use. I'm betting none of this will matter in the end, because if it's taken Turbine this long to figure out how to deal with it I suspect it's beyond their means to fix it within the code without breaking the whole thing. My money's on the Shears fix, where twists will either disappear or get nerfed to oblivion.

    Whatever the result, there's not really a way to justify repercussions when you've let something slide for this long without even a subtle warning.

  13. #33
    Community Member bartharok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vint View Post
    The no ML rings were not WAI and I do not think anyone got banned for wearing them all the way up until they fixed them. Twists are the same way. You people need to try harder to troll or go find another forum to cry on.

    A long time ago on these forums I complained about people that died in quest and cost me 10p. I was told that I should not pug and stick with guild/channel if puggers bothered me that much. Same advice to you. If puggers are bothering you for what they do, solo or only do guild/channel.
    You DO know that picking up money that someone has dropped is quite different from picking someones pocket for the same amount?
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  14. #34
    Community Member AzB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by burningwind View Post
    hope they allow this, give some advantage to tr a character =P
    Seriously? I'm currently soloing a bard... a *bard*, and am at 16th level. Every quest on elite, and no hires except for the Korthos quests. I have grouped for a few quests, but only out of boredom and not out of necessity. Except for the quests that require another person, like the necro 3 quest where you have to pass a gear. For the most part, it has been a cakewalk.

    My God people, how easy do you need this game to be?

    And I don't buy the "it makes it faster" theory. The perception may be that it makes it faster, but I've tr'ed with a couple folks doing this trick over the last few lives. It's not any faster, or at least not enough to make any difference. When we split to solo towers in wiz king or whatever, they were never done any faster than I was. It's just completely unnecessary.

  15. #35
    Community Member AzB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by anivaj View Post
    Correction: It is not WAI, but also not an exploit. If it were an exploit, people would be getting banned for using them.

    By that logic, if you're driving down the highway and don't see any cops and no one is getting pulled over, then driving as fast as you want is not illegal even though the speed limit signs indicate the top speed allowed.

    You sound like my brother. His favorite saying is "it's not illegal if you don't get caught". Yeah, it kinda still is. You're just not getting caught.

  16. #36
    Community Member Jeromio's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vint View Post
    The no ML rings were not WAI and I do not think anyone got banned for wearing them all the way up until they fixed them. Twists are the same way. You people need to try harder to troll or go find another forum to cry on.

    A long time ago on these forums I complained about people that died in quest and cost me 10p. I was told that I should not pug and stick with guild/channel if puggers bothered me that much. Same advice to you. If puggers are bothering you for what they do, solo or only do guild/channel.
    This is so true. There have been other bugs in the past that favored players like e.g. recall on the run and using evasion with medium and heavy armour (remember the batman builds? ).
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  17. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gempoult View Post
    ... the game will die in couple of days instead of the several months that has left
    The day ddo will die is the day when ddo 2 is released. And even this is questionable.

    None of the countless rumors about ddo is dying has proven to be valid.

  18. #38
    Community Member psykopeta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soulfurnace View Post
    From some random (maybe trustable) website, the definition of exploit is:

    • 1make full use of and derive benefit from (a resource):


    • 2make use of (a situation) in a way considered unfair or underhand:

    So.. By that definition this is an exploit - as it's considered unfair and underhanded, correct?
    the best you could do to know if it's an exploit or not, is report someone for bug exploit and see what the gm will tell you:

    - If the game allows you to do so (in that case was stepping in epic quests at heroic lvls, posting lfm etc etc) it's not an exploit, which makes sense, could be called glitch.

    then you could try to report someone for bug abuse, and the gm answer will be:

    - If the game allows you to do so (in that case was stepping in epic quests at heroic lvls, posting lfm etc etc) you're not abusing a bug, which makes not much sense, could be called...feature?

    then you could put a ticket asking if it's legit or not, and the answer you would get is "we can't answer"

    which makes ingame gm's attitude quite laughable

    same way than is laughable seeing ppl talking about "you don't need to talk to fatespinner once you tr" when they know it's false, just are trying to extend the "feature duration"

    also they should remove whatever item from the store(if really exists, which is a trouble, a store item to reset twists/upgrade twists) however vips would get advantage, however everybody can change their twists at any moment in a public area (that's remove your cocoon for example and place another ability in the same twist)

    the solution is quite easy: ED tab locked til lvl 20, and you all know that's what they will do, same way that they decided that everybody in a party must be certain lvl for you to step in a quest, call it "having no clue about the game they have in their hands" and addind duct tape wherever they want

    also remember: bug/explot is not what you decide, is what they decide, same way happens with how otto/bigby/lr/tr etc works/worked

    there's no need looking for an answer in the net when you have in front

    to the op: if you noticed it, almost everybody that posted in the thread knows the way, but they don't say it, maybe scared that it would be removed...faster?XDDDDDDDDDDDDD has past YEARS til ppl started using the "heroic toons stepping in epic quests feature" and then it got fixed, luckily this "heroic toons using ED feature" has been posted even in the wiki, so the knowledge has spread faster, in over 1 year since it was released, it will get fixed
    psykopeta - hoarding pl, for the sake of hoarding, the day i become ubercompletionist will be because there isn't anything to delay it more - thelanis, where the gimps claim to be pros and noobs claim to be pros, no newbies allowed(unless they claim to be pros), we have enough drama w/o them. PS i'm not a pro, maybe if i reincarnate in RL...

  19. #39
    Community Member Ryiah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzB View Post
    Seriously? I'm currently soloing a bard... a *bard*, and am at 16th level. Every quest on elite, and no hires except for the Korthos quests. I have grouped for a few quests, but only out of boredom and not out of necessity. Except for the quests that require another person, like the necro 3 quest where you have to pass a gear. For the most part, it has been a cakewalk.
    In the hands of a skilled player a Bard is quite possibly the easiest to keep alive. There is no excuse for them to not be capable of dealing damage (melee or ranged), good healing, and strong crowd control. All three of these are naturally provided by the class. A well-played Bard can be a big asset to a party and is easily capable of soloing difficult content.
    Last edited by Ryiah; 10-04-2013 at 02:59 AM.
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  20. #40
    Community Member AzB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryiah View Post
    In the hands of a skilled player a Bard is quite possibly the easiest to keep alive. There is no excuse for them to not be capable of dealing damage (melee or ranged), good healing, and strong crowd control. All three of these are naturally provided by the class. A well-played Bard can be a big asset to a party and is easily capable of soloing difficult content.
    Sorry, did not mean to step on anyone's toes. The bard is fun to play and can be made pretty capable through some metagaming or by very skilled players.

    This isn't about the bard, I simply used the bard as an example of one of the more difficult classes to solo not needing epic destinies in heroic levels to survive and complete.

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