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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Singular View Post
    After 20, Alchemical xbows outdo GS ones in damage output by enough to count. They also have CC capabilities if you build for that and give you a stacking +2 con/dex or str, depending. Once I got my first alchemical, I shelved all my GS xbows except for the triple pos, b/c of its great situational use on undead. When I got Needle, I shelved everything except for the +++ and the cold-cold-cold alchemical for use on fire stuff. Needle outclasses every other xbow - although I haven't tried the new lvl 27 one.
    most interesting.

    so, if you were starting from scratch and hadn't been stuck at cap farming the highest content how would you plan your repeater progression? i'm thinking doublecross and silver slinger as low hanging fruit, but what next? would you knock off a greensteel to help farm the higher raids or would you just dive into the higher raids and grind out those upper tier bows? how would you mix the need for a high DPS boss beater vs a trash killing CC weapon? also how would you balance progressing in levels vs slowing down to farm a raid?

    i can see needle is a good one to aim for due to that juicy crit profile, didn't realise the alchemical ones had CC though. i was thinking of focusing on a rad II next to get an epic ready trash CC bow (or to be more precise, trash SA generating bow). hmm after pulling it up on the wiki it seems to all be DC based CC which i'm assuming has a finite shelf life. they do look tasty for just the DPS though, but i'm thinking the on-crit with no save blindness of the rad II would be the more future proof trash beater as i doubt the elemental procs will out DPS a pure rogue's sneak attack dice. that said my current aim for end game is only epic hards, and with a DC of 35 that should proc often enough, certainly more than the DC22 doublecross bow would.

    anyway, enough rambling, looking forward to some more input on this from you and others
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  2. #62
    Community Member voodoogroves's Avatar
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    I'm making a GS just to have from 12 -> needle on a few lives. I've got the others (Silver Slinger, Doublecross - epic and not) but the non-epics aren't really available until 16. I just like having that DPS boost available.
    Ghallanda - now with fewer alts and more ghostbane

  3. #63
    Community Member walkin_dude's Avatar
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    For the repeaters I've actually been able to try out, doublecross is amazing for levels 16-19 or so. Silver slinger is a great DR breaker and goes incredibly well with Hand of the Tombs. Slaver's hand crossbow is for the epic levels what doublecross is to the upper heroics. I haven't managed to get needle yet, so I have that to look forward to.

    The named bows tend to have the special effects, like draining CON or causing sleep. For straight DPS, some loot-gen bows I've collected have been amazing. Boreal of lacerating and holy burst of pure good are both top damage-dealers.

  4. #64
    Community Member Singular's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ReaperAlexEU View Post
    most interesting.

    so, if you were starting from scratch and hadn't been stuck at cap farming the highest content how would you plan your repeater progression? i'm thinking doublecross and silver slinger as low hanging fruit, but what next? would you knock off a greensteel to help farm the higher raids or would you just dive into the higher raids and grind out those upper tier bows? how would you mix the need for a high DPS boss beater vs a trash killing CC weapon? also how would you balance progressing in levels vs slowing down to farm a raid?

    i can see needle is a good one to aim for due to that juicy crit profile, didn't realise the alchemical ones had CC though. i was thinking of focusing on a rad II next to get an epic ready trash CC bow (or to be more precise, trash SA generating bow). hmm after pulling it up on the wiki it seems to all be DC based CC which i'm assuming has a finite shelf life. they do look tasty for just the DPS though, but i'm thinking the on-crit with no save blindness of the rad II would be the more future proof trash beater as i doubt the elemental procs will out DPS a pure rogue's sneak attack dice. that said my current aim for end game is only epic hards, and with a DC of 35 that should proc often enough, certainly more than the DC22 doublecross bow would.

    anyway, enough rambling, looking forward to some more input on this from you and others
    Thanks

    If I was starting an artie from scratch, life one, no farmed items... If you don't mind using the plat AH, get:

    +1 of lacerating of bleeding (for low levels) - if they still exist
    + 1-5 of good. Mix and match w/ holy, cold, fire, acid, electricity or, best, thundering (few things resist sonic; elemental types are best against those mobs that take extra damage from them)
    - some kind of ghostbane (go w/good or holy of ghostbane; failing that, thundering or eldritch); until you get some kind of item that makes all your shots hit, like the spectral gloves or whatever

    You absolutely need one each of:

    - smiting (for House C stuff)
    - disrupting (for undead stuff)
    - banishing (for Vale stuff - used in Running w/t Devils and you will get the kill count)

    * when you can, replace the above effects via rune arm. Disciplinator, Hand of the Tombs, and Animus respectively.

    Some kind of paralyzing is great in GH, but loses usefulness in higher levels.

    Yes, you're correct - the fastest way to get a decent named xbow is through the LOD chain. Those are good repeaters. They don't produce the dps output that GS lit II or +++ do, but they're much faster to acquire and can be made epic (if that concerns you).

    For quick farming, do the Evenstar challenges. They decreased the costs by half and made the ingredients bta - so, good stuff. Prior to getting my alchemical repeaters built - lengthy, lengthy process - I built two of these. I lucked out in getting one fire and one cold, plus they had decent CC in that they slowed opponents. After I got my alchemicals built, I recycled them back into ingredients, just in case I wanted to build something else.
    Last edited by Singular; 10-10-2013 at 10:28 AM.

  5. #65
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    runearm effects dont replace banishing smiting disrupting, unfortunately...they only imbue the vorpal effect, worth 5 dph, but you also want the 4d6 bane damage from the weapon version, worth three times as much almost - 14 dph - plus the hidden +2 enchantment bonus, worth another 2+crit

  6. #66
    Community Member Singular's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    runearm effects dont replace banishing smiting disrupting, unfortunately...they only imbue the vorpal effect, worth 5 dph, but you also want the 4d6 bane damage from the weapon version, worth three times as much almost - 14 dph - plus the hidden +2 enchantment bonus, worth another 2+crit
    I'm not super worried about damaging the baddies I'm trying to banish; I just want them to be banished.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Singular View Post
    I'm not super worried about damaging the baddies I'm trying to banish; I just want them to be banished.
    That only works when they have <1000 HPs, still. And you wont even make it out of Heroic Hard before most Banish-able enemies will clear that mark easily...so it ends up becoming just a 5% chance to do 100 untyped damage. Banishing RXB of Something + your best runearm. eg Lucid Dreams > almost any other repeater (incl. Lit II) + Animus.

    I know its not as satisfying as an instakill, but you'll kill Outsiders faster, statistically, with the bane damage than with the kill-on-vorp.

  8. #68
    Community Member Singular's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    That only works when they have <1000 HPs, still. And you wont even make it out of Heroic Hard before most Banish-able enemies will clear that mark easily...so it ends up becoming just a 5% chance to do 100 untyped damage. Banishing RXB of Something + your best runearm. eg Lucid Dreams > almost any other repeater (incl. Lit II) + Animus.

    I know its not as satisfying as an instakill, but you'll kill Outsiders faster, statistically, with the bane damage than with the kill-on-vorp.
    A Lit II wouldn't hurt them much. They're immune to lightning. I use an earth-earth tier 2 alchemical + animus and always get the kill count. I'm probably knocking them down to under 1000 (with help from group members) then bannishing them.

    But, yeah, you might be right. I haven't used a straight out bannisher w/Lucid Dreams b/c the alchemical produces so much damage. It's worth a try, though, at some point in the future. The fireballs from Animus sometimes kill them, too.

    Hey...if it is the old style of bannish, does it just work regardless? I wonder if that's why it works so well for me.

  9. #69
    Community Member OrodelaSol's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    That only works when they have <1000 HPs, still. And you wont even make it out of Heroic Hard before most Banish-able enemies will clear that mark easily...so it ends up becoming just a 5% chance to do 100 untyped damage. Banishing RXB of Something + your best runearm. eg Lucid Dreams > almost any other repeater (incl. Lit II) + Animus.

    I know its not as satisfying as an instakill, but you'll kill Outsiders faster, statistically, with the bane damage than with the kill-on-vorp.
    Once they get below 1000 hp the banishing/smiting/disrupting rxb works awesome on them. but if u want just "damage" dealer get a rxb with "nightmare" works like a charm on most everything!

  10. #70
    Community Member Bolo_Grubb's Avatar
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    I love my GS repeater with Sunder Ooze guard. At level 16 I also wear my DT robe with Sunder Ooze guard. Ok maybe not the great for DPS but I find it funny too see mobs going after my pet Oozes instead of me.
    Kill'em all and let their favorite deity sort'em out
    Quote from a shroud run "I am an idiot, not a newb"

  11. #71
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    Ex-Rogue Mechanic here. I loved that class and I clung to my Great Crossbow for a very long time. Around level 12 I think I have one with Keen II and Bloodletter, or was it Heartseeker? Anyways it scored big crits, and often. The base damage number was 26, I thought it was amazing.

    But I came to learn something eventually. The BULK of your DPS comes from Sneak Attacks. To maximize this, you need a good repeater. They also benefit from the INT to damage. Though they look weaker when you compare the base damage numbers, the difference in DPS is night and day. Especially if you stay pure rogue, then dip into Assassin tree near the end to get Lethality and Deadly Shadow. Your SA dice are huge and kill on vorpal, and vorpals happen a lot* when you're firing a repeater.

    I recommend going Human for that build. The extra feat, extra skill boosts in the tree to invest AP in, and you get +2d6 ranged sneak attack and a 2m range extension on ranged SA and point blank shot.

    Also with your high UMD, you can cast Sleet Storm just in front of yourself, and then fire through it. Mobs have to run into the storm, they're blinded, you're getting more sneak attacks, and it takes them a little longer to reach you.

    I'd also like to mention that firing a Repeater seems to interrupt the Bluff animation so you get more use out of that small window of time.

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