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Thread: Favorite Trap

  1. #1
    Community Member Havok.cry's Avatar
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    Default Favorite Trap

    Three years ago when I started playing DDO, I came from WoW and it's many many clones. I went through korthos and saw the puzzles and was slightly impressed that the dungeon was more immersive than a "long bendy hallway full of mobs with a few bosses interspersed" that was wow and all it's clones. Then I got to my first trap and my reaction was "OMG the dungeon itself can kill you, this is awesome!" That was the moment I truly fell in love with DDO as a game. Thinking back to the first time I ran into many surprises and traps, I started thinking about which one was the most awesome.

    The conclusion I came to was that it was this one trap in monastary of the scorpion. You fall through a puzzle floor just before you complete it and land in water. There is a chest behind a secret door down there. To get back up you have to activate a blower that sends you back up through the air so you can land in the doorway up there. The catch: The blower is keeping several, nearly invisible, gelatinous cubes suspended in the air and will blow you through them repeatedly till you die. I think it is the cleverest and most imaginative trap for a dungeon and it reminds me of many good ol' PnP dungeons.

    My second favorite trap was the greased slope with spikes at the bottom underneath a breakaway floor in Rainbow in the Dark. It was multiple traps elements working together to make a pretty effective trap, and there was no surviving if you were not prepared for it. Very effective against the unwary.

    Those traps were downright interesting. We need more things like that in DDO. Spikes, blades, elemental blasty thingies, and spell wards are fine and all, but we need more traps with some imagination in them. When I die in a trap I want to be imagining some evil genius cackling maniacally in evil glee because no one could have seen that coming. Most traps though, they seem more like some evil random guy is sitting at a monitor thinking, "Really, I can't believe this got anyone at all, how did you even die in it?"

    Maybe the devs could have a contest and have the top five winners get to have a trap of their own design included in the following update's content. Or something along those lines. I know a lot of people who would love to be able to do something like that.
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  2. #2
    Community Member Capricorpus's Avatar
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    I definitely agree that spell wards are boring.

    I suspect that one of the reasons they were implemented is that, unlike many other types of traps, they can simply be dropped into the quest without having to size/manipulate them to fit the space (unlike, for example, a blade trap found in Monastery of the Scorpion that would have to be sized for the hallway).

    Anyways, I concur. Interesting traps are interesting.
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    Community Member Havok.cry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capricorpus View Post
    I definitely agree that spell wards are boring.

    I suspect that one of the reasons they were implemented is that, unlike many other types of traps, they can simply be dropped into the quest without having to size/manipulate them to fit the space (unlike, for example, a blade trap found in Monastery of the Scorpion that would have to be sized for the hallway).

    Anyways, I concur. Interesting traps are interesting.
    Yeah, spell wards are that. I also like them because they gave my casters a reason to carry dispel/greater dispel/disjunction. But boring they very much are.... except for the one that breaks and then animates all the stuff in the area, that one is cool. I want that spell.

    Speaking of dropping spell wards into quests, they should update trapmaking with that capability.
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    Community Member CheeseMilk's Avatar
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    The greatest trap my tabletop group ever came up with was a break-away floor with a dimension door below it that 'ported the person to the ceiling directly above it.

    You essentially fell forever.

  5. #5
    Community Member Cleanincubus's Avatar
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    My favorite one is the dual fire trap in Tempest's Spine, with the lever behind it. It's my favorite, because it gets so many people, even those who know it's there. The fact that pulling the lever isn't even essential to completing the quest, makes it all the better. It's simply there to open another entrance, if you fall off the top. Hilarious.

  6. #6
    Community Member Havok.cry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CheeseMilk View Post
    The greatest trap my tabletop group ever came up with was a break-away floor with a dimension door below it that 'ported the person to the ceiling directly above it.

    You essentially fell forever.
    Lol. My group carried harpoons to save each other from such fates. Nothing is as satisfying as harpooning a party member and then having them thank you for it after.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havok.cry View Post
    Maybe the devs could have a contest and have the top five winners get to have a trap of their own design included in the following update's content. Or something along those lines. I know a lot of people who would love to be able to do something like that.
    I like this idea. I would go with the breakaway floors with spike pits underneath, to spice things up they are placed at the entrance of quests, right where you first step in, though of course not always there. Give a short timer to enter and get moving or go splat.

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    Quote Originally Posted by smeggy1384 View Post
    I like this idea. I would go with the breakaway floors with spike pits underneath, to spice things up they are placed at the entrance of quests, right where you first step in, though of course not always there. Give a short timer to enter and get moving or go splat.
    This is a bad idea, because it will autosplat people who enter the quest late or have long loading times. Traps shouldn't target characters by entry order, just like they shouldn't target people by name length.

    The entry point to a quest is usually safe for very very good reason - this allows people to load into the quest and buff inside.

    Have you noticed that you can have 50 minutes left on a buff... and it ends on stepping into a quest? This prevents cheese where the party wizard buffs everyone while in town/wilderness, rest of party enters, wizard runs to nearest tavern/shrine and recovers full spell points before entering. But the flipside is that if you're going to say that people can't keep their 50 minute buffs in the 2 minutes it takes to run from tavern/town to quest, you should allow people to buff at the entry point, treating the entry point as a sort of location "before starting" where characters can spend time to prepare.

    I appreciate the originality of your idea, but the mechanic is bad.

  9. #9
    Community Member Havok.cry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by smeggy1384 View Post
    I like this idea. I would go with the breakaway floors with spike pits underneath, to spice things up they are placed at the entrance of quests, right where you first step in, though of course not always there. Give a short timer to enter and get moving or go splat.
    I like the idea of traps that are not always there. Also, I like the idea of traps that are not always in the same spot.
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    Community Member kinggartk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Havok.cry View Post
    I like the idea of traps that are not always there. Also, I like the idea of traps that are not always in the same spot.
    /signed!!!!

    Traps are basically useless riight now, becasue they are not really traps. A trap should be a surprise, not something to plan to run around.

    I'm having a blast right now running Necro 1 quests, because it's been so long and I don't remember where the traps are. I just know they are there somewhere.

  11. #11
    Community Member Ovrad's Avatar
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    Spell wards: Yes, these are extremely boring, and they are missing one of the most fun asset of your typical trap, they don't even hurt enemies... They should've been limited to the underdark and not used in anything else, it would've made more sense thematically.

    As far as favorite traps go. Though choice, I'd like to mention the "air mines" in Sins of Attrition. It's a simple one really, get launched into a million spike on the ceiling, but I still love it for the comical effect it creates. Player 1 says "Stay off the middle guys!". You usually hear the air mines go off shortly after and player suddenly disappear..... and DING player 2 has died. 2 seconds later you see his soulstone fall back down.

    You mentioned the greased up slope in rainbow, but that concept is also used in necro 3, unhallowed if I'm not mistaken. These are great because you try to run against the grease and you have time to see the spikes coming but you can't escape it (unless you had fom really handy).

    I'm a big fan of the overkill ones as well. Like the lever in the eastern chamber of Von4, the steps in Frame Work and such

    And the classic, the rolling boulder in undermine, of course.


    ...I miss old traps, spell wards suck.

  12. #12
    Founder Dorian's Avatar
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    All of the the traps in Gianthold are awesome. My personal favorite is the one in Foundation that blows you into a spiked wall. (lol)

    Seriously, the developer(s) that worked on traps in Gianthold deserves some kudos.
    Dorian

  13. #13
    Community Member Saravis's Avatar
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    I love the swiss cheese trap in VoN 4, its just so hilariously overkill.

  14. #14
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Here's my thing with traps, lets say you design a series of dungeons with complicated random traps. You then have to deal with several problems.

    People hate waiting for the "hero" party member whether that is a healer or trapper.

    If people really want to run the quests this makes them figure out ways to do it without a trapper, either a lot more of 1 rogue splashes or 2 rogue/ 2 monk for evasion.

    The problem then moves into the dc system, if you crank up the disarm etc dc so that level 1 splashes can't disarm them, you lock out new players that don't have past lives, twink gear, maxed eds. If you crank up the reflex saves you run into the same problem where new players won't be able to survive accidental hits.

    I liked the trap system when I started playing, however as time has gone on and I've learned more of the game, I'm starting to think it might be more work than it's worth as you either lock out new players or have a system that vets bypass. I really don't see a way to avoid these problems.

  15. #15
    Community Member Havok.cry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charononus View Post
    Here's my thing with traps, lets say you design a series of dungeons with complicated random traps. You then have to deal with several problems.

    People hate waiting for the "hero" party member whether that is a healer or trapper.

    If people really want to run the quests this makes them figure out ways to do it without a trapper, either a lot more of 1 rogue splashes or 2 rogue/ 2 monk for evasion.

    The problem then moves into the dc system, if you crank up the disarm etc dc so that level 1 splashes can't disarm them, you lock out new players that don't have past lives, twink gear, maxed eds. If you crank up the reflex saves you run into the same problem where new players won't be able to survive accidental hits.

    I liked the trap system when I started playing, however as time has gone on and I've learned more of the game, I'm starting to think it might be more work than it's worth as you either lock out new players or have a system that vets bypass. I really don't see a way to avoid these problems.
    That is why I liked the "trap" I mention in the my OP. It is not a "trap" per se, and the solution is to kill the gelatinous cubes before you head back up. No trapper needed. The greased slopes with spikes are defeated by freedom of movement or any immunity to slippery surfaces, again no trapper needed. This is the sort of thing I mean when I say we need more imaginative traps.

    All traps do not need to be instantly lethal. They should be something that hurts, and makes you stop and figure out how to deal with it. I am fine with traps that can be bypassed with other than disable device. Ones that can not be are annoying, and in my opinion, stupid, lazy GM design. Something that causes you to think to get through will always be better than something that is just, "Do you have a trapper? Check! You may pass."

    As to vet's bypassing them... many vets bypass most of the game. I don't think anything will change that. I am certainly not going to try.
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  16. #16
    Intergalactic Space Crusader Livmo's Avatar
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    Default Discs of Fury

    My favorite trap used to be the discs of fury on the floor in the Tide Turns quest from the Sentinels of Stormreach pack. On epic you cannot pull the mob back thru the traps anymore and that was so much fun! You can still do it on heroic.

    My new favorite is the one in Thrall of the Necromancy in the Delara's Tomb pack. The 1st trap before you enter the big room. It's just nasty. Thanks goodness the trap box is in front of the trap. Although I feel the trap box should be behind the trap in general, and allot are, this one is fine the way it is ) It's funny to see the party wipe there and/or get killed by the trap while disarming it when a zerger runs thru it )

    Overall I think the traps in Gianthold are cool as well.

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    so far, no argument with anything in this thread. i like traps. what i don't like, is traps with NO WAY to avoid them. as the turbine provider has become ****oo, according to the devs anyway, and borne out by the fact the maintenance did not resolve the lag issues, the timing traps have become completely unavoidable. did haywire on friday. was nearly immune to fire, or i'd have died trying to turn off the stupid timed fire bursting pipes. no way around, no way to avoid if the server doesn't know precisely where you are, and you're toast. and the server doesn't, believe me. got nailed in a safe spot more than once. traps you must avoid by timing don't work. the provider doesn't work. simple as that.

    the thing that wiped us, though, was the escape. traps you can't avoid, can't time, can't disarm, and hit you one after another. oh, and poison ones at that, so no mitigation. thanks turbine. fix the stupid poison traps or get rid of them. absolutely destroyed the experience. i won't run that one again. wouldn't be that bad if they'd just left the poison traps the way they were, lose a few stat points if you blow a save, no biggie, but 300+ damage, save for half, no other mitigation unless you're evading (which we've already discussed is a bad idea to force folks to have), and nail you with it three times in rapid succession (three projectors after all) is not reasonable at level 12.

    p.s. forgot, this is "favorite" not "least favorite" so i should mention, i actually liked the fall-away floor traps. you can disarm one, you can save yourself from the other pretty easily, although you get some more stupid timing poison traps to do, at least they don't trigger by when you enter the area, they're on timers. and, you get a chest if you're willing to put up with the timing stuff. so that's fine, and even kinda interesting. the run back, however, spoils the whole run.
    Last edited by levesque2004; 09-30-2013 at 02:00 PM.

  18. #18
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    i love the traps in DDO, the good ones make me go "oooh" and "aaaah" just like fireworks do

    i have fond memories of that giant rotating blade in waterworks, the one that is at head height and hidden behind a pillar. i think one reason it is better than other blade traps is you can see it when you move round the pillar, the ones that hide inside the walls lose something.

    i also love the flame pit in STK.

    as for ingenious traps, i love those too. so much that one day i decided to blunder into the rainbow trap just to see what it did (until that point not a single pug had ever wanted to walk in there without a trapper). it was great! i did get out alive but the combination all the different parts put a big smile on my face, and made me realise why pugs didnt even bother trying to get past it. mental note, must try with abundant step...

    air blasts when combined with other stuff are also great, that one in GH cry is a killer if you forget where to jump.

    i miss the days of all gathering up and getting ready to run the traps in CO6 knowing there would be deaths and that we'd have a big fight on our hands on the other side.

    i also dont mind the ease vets bypass them with either, they are still there making wide eyed newbies get hooked on this game while we get to reminisce about how in the good old days we had to walk back from the quest with an arm and a leg in our inventory to get a healer to patch them up after a good trap got us.
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    Community Member Ralmeth's Avatar
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    My favorite trap is in Weapon Shipment, on the way to the optional area. It's never killed me, but it is ingenious how its set up, so i agree with the OP that interesting traps are cool Boring traps that just hose your character are just annoying.
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    Community Member Chaimberland's Avatar
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    Spellwards and bear traps were neat at first but the novelty quickly wore off. They just aren't that interesting or imaginative. I guess the evil geniuses in Ebberon are much smarter than the evil geniuses in the Forgotten Realms.

    My favorite trap is the blade trap guarding the mushroom in the 3rd Depths quest. You just don't expect it. I mean, who traps a mushroom? Its brilliant.
    Last edited by Chaimberland; 09-30-2013 at 03:04 PM.

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