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  1. #81
    Community Member djl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jskinner937 View Post
    That is your opinion...my opinion is that if you think I care at all about my forum reputation then you are mistaken. I have real life friends and relationships and that is what matters to me. Not a virtual reality.
    And this is applicable to this debate, how? I'm happy for you that you have real life friends and relationships, but that is an irrelevant detail that tries to draw attention away from the argument at hand.

    Furthermore, if you don't care, why are you even posting here about this subject, at all?

  2. #82
    Community Member Jay203's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivan_Milic View Post
    Why are you playing the game if it isnt fun?
    If all the people who are using this bug would get banned ddo would lose half of its players.
    what are you saying?
    that half of the DDO players are pathetic destiny exploiters??
    PS: Greensteel RUINED the game! and you all know it!
    less buffing, more nerfing!!!
    to make it easier for those of you that wants to avoid me in game, all my characters are in "Bladesworn Mercenaries"

  3. #83
    Community Member XiaNYdE's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wanesa View Post
    Still you dont understand. Using ED in H is clasified as exploit. That means - unfair technique, swindle, fraud. All others examples such overpowered casters and clerics BB are WAI atm, i cannot report them as cheating, i can report it as bug (I also posted bug ticket about ED to remind this issue to the devs. And i going to repost this until they fix it)
    Remind them?? You really think they have forgotten lol As has been constantly pointed out to you, it is not WAI, those who use them will eventually forfeit them, we all know that.
    While it may not be enjoyable for you, (as i said earlier, don't run with those using twists at heroic lvls) it is not game breaking and quite obviously is not high on the priority list for turbine, they will fix it, probably (with luck) about the same time as the ladder bug or the lag, the latter affects my gameplay more then any twists.


    Oh and FYI you do realise discussing exploits are against forum rules, as such i hope you have reported yourself??
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  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by uncleblue View Post
    This entire post just reeks that you really have no clue about the game and are just full of it and want to sound important. I really need to name for you the quests that have some challenge to them? I think you do not know them. I think you do not know them because you haven't played them. I think you haven't played them because you zerged through the easiest and highest xp/min quests on all your lives, and now you think you beat the game. I think that your impression of EE being hard is based on mob HP and saves, not on actual quest difficulty. I think you don't do optionals. I think you don't craft. I think you avoid wilderness areas. I think you might even spend a lot of time in the harbor, maybe showing off to the new kids?

    I don't care what your build is. I would rather party with practically anyone that had a better attitude. Because it's a game.

    The fact that you like Teh_Troll speaks volumes about your character. I could easily say he is the one forum poster that most consistently shows a negative attitude. I personally think it is in the best interest of the game to give both of you forum perma-bans.
    Oh here we go the new kids trying to tell the old schoolers that they are so evil.

    Gawds did I really used to sound like this back when I had a high horse and one of those clubs from the deleras series jammed so far up my arse I thought something like morals mattered on a video game?

    Yes I know I did, then I learned to stop hating people for how they played and hate the devs for their sloppy half assed work ethic.

    I do use ED twists in heroic, I use them on builds otherwise so falvorfilled and gimp they probably would end up shelved mid life otherwise. I do so for the sheer simple fun of taking such a concept character finding twists that fit said concept and revelling in the power that as far as I am concerned I fairly earned already in a previous life, and payed for the right to use by sacrificing that maxxed character. To me it is the only actual reason to ever TR, and should be made WAI and use as a good incentive to encourage other players especially those who previously balked at TRing to give it a whirl for a truly different way to lvl.

    As others have said and quite truthfully, complaining about abilities that actually only can be accurately called OP in the lvl 1-4 range, and afterwards quickly pale in comparison to wizards packing fireballs and lightning bolts. About the only real use I find for them after that early range is the heals or passive buffs to compliment a build, like easy ki regen on a monk or extra assassin DC on my rogue etc.

    If anyone thinks a silly boulder toss, primal scream, or the like is even remotely OP in the shadow of a series spell caster, then they have never played a serious spell caster, and probably ***** and moan just as much about PKing sorcerers one shotting every mob on an elite tempest spine at lvl and try to actively get that player killed just to be a griefer.

    OP get a grip, get a clue, and go play by yourself if your going to be a tattle tale.

  5. #85
    Community Member djl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wanesa View Post
    Still you dont understand. Using ED in H is clasified as exploit. That means - unfair technique, swindle, fraud. All others examples such overpowered casters and clerics BB are WAI atm, i cannot report them as cheating, i can report it as bug (I also posted bug ticket about ED to remind this issue to the devs. And i going to repost this until they fix it)
    You report overpowered casters/clerics BB as a bug? Am I reading that right? I sincerely hope I am not.

    But if you are, what you are really saying, is you don't like for your groups to run smoothly. You like for them to take an hour to complete a quest, have many deaths along the way, and have a fairly significant chance of an outright wipe. Is that what you are implying? Because that's what will happen, if the Devs listen to you and nerf casters.

  6. #86
    Community Member Qhualor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by XiaNYdE View Post
    Remind them?? You really think they have forgotten lol As has been constantly pointed out to you, it is not WAI, those who use them will eventually forfeit them, we all know that.
    While it may not be enjoyable for you, (as i said earlier, don't run with those using twists at heroic lvls) it is not game breaking and quite obviously is not high on the priority list for turbine, they will fix it, probably (with luck) about the same time as the ladder bug or the lag, the latter affects my gameplay more then any twists.


    Oh and FYI you do realise discussing exploits are against forum rules, as such i hope you have reported yourself??
    Not running with people who use EDs would be near impossible. Its more rare to find a group not using them. How are people supposed to know when they join a group if they will be using EDs? We have to start asking now if players will be using this bug? And than, even if they say they won't be using it, what's to stop them? People need to specifically put it in the lfm notes because if it doesn't say it, I assume players will be playing the game as intended.

    The ED bug has been confirmed to be not WAI and labeled as a bug. There is no against forum rule violation for talking about bugs.

  7. #87
    Community Member enochiancub's Avatar
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    Not really sure what kind of outcome you were expecting considering how every other thread on the topic went.

    Main: 18 Artificer, Thelanis

  8. #88
    Community Member djl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Karavek View Post
    Oh here we go the new kids trying to tell the old schoolers that they are so evil.

    Gawds did I really used to sound like this back when I had a high horse and one of those clubs from the deleras series jammed so far up my arse I thought something like morals mattered on a video game?

    Yes I know I did, then I learned to stop hating people for how they played and hate the devs for their sloppy half assed work ethic.
    This, so very much. I have always maintained that in games, the useful exploits make up for the harmful bugs, which are almost always far more abundant. I don't think people who use the ED bug should feel guilty at all, not when you have Sagas being removed TWICE, a door that permanently shuts in VON1 locking everybody out of a shrine (as well sealing anyone who is shrining inside that room, with a DDOR or recall/renter being the ONLY way out), epic quests from your NEW BLOODY EXPANSION that give heroic end rewards, a multitude of enhancements that do not work, and the end boss in What Goes Up who decided after 19.2 that he sometimes doesn't want to spawn at all rendering the quest uncompletable. And those are just some of the more egregious examples I can think of off the top of my head.
    Last edited by djl; 09-29-2013 at 11:25 AM.

  9. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by uncleblue View Post
    /facepalm

    It's not an insult to point out someone is acting like a 12 year old, especially if they happen to be 12 years old. There is no shame in that, but as an adult, I try not to waste too much time on arguments with children.

    The fact that you yourself can not name a quest that has any challenge not directly related to HP/Saves is really my point. You have a very narrow definition of challenge. I can name off the top of my head: Rainbow in the dark w/ no twitch skills, Monastery of the Scorpion when you suck at puzzles, The Crucible with no evasion, ... in fact, so elite waterworks at-level (the whole chain) without evasion or trap skills and tell me no challenge, so I can flat-out call you a liar.

    You do not have "basic human rights" in video games, kid. News flash. You relinquish them in the EULA. Here is another news flash: using twists in heroics is an exploit. EVERYONE KNOWS NOW, so acting innocent no longer flies.

    Your argument about time required to kill a mob with SP vs. Melee is irrelevant, and here is why:

    A: The ability to use twists at heroic levels is not WAI, and is in fact a confirmed bug.

    B: Spellcasters make trade-offs to be able to cast those spells, such as lower hp/ac, and nearly no melee ability. What trade-offs does a fighter make to be able to cast the spell Rejuvenation Coccoon? None.

    C: Melees can swing their weapons infinitely, while casters are limited to a pool of SP.


    The sad thing is that you know all this and are just being difficult for the sake of being difficult. As you said, this is entertaining for you.
    For me, it's much less fun. I liken it to having to explain to a child why cheating is bad.
    But cheating isnt bad, its only bad if one is caught cheating. Then one might risk retribution from those they cheated if the cheater lacks the ability to defend themselves.

    Take for example a true life and death example of cheating. Cheating at cards in the wild west where each player carried a loaded gun. If someone is cheating, say for example billy the kid, and the others suspected, the question would not be if cheating was wrong, but whether or not anyone else at the table has the guts and ability to beat the kid in a quick draw.

    As then as now, inspite of what so called modern civilized folk want to think, its violence, and the ability to unleash it that forces others to abide by their rules. Modern governments are no better then large well organized mobs who use their numbers and resources to bully and threaten all others into walking a line that leads them towards the herd.

    Gamers, nerds, the social outcasts have long been prided by their own peer group for being out of the box thinkers, for being hackers and crackers, for being more anarchist then orderly sheep. Yet people like you and the OP delude yourselves into thinking we are going to play Fair with a company, any company? The corporation will always be the enemy, anything it puts out a toy for us to use, and misuse as we see fit.

    Our fun is ours to find and take however we wish to, those who dont like how we run are free to leave us be, but those trying to bind us with their own belief structure will find as with all cultural conflicts, that one will start a war far sooner then creating a lasting peace.

  10. #90
    Community Member Wanesa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by djl View Post
    You report overpowered casters/clerics BB as a bug? Am I reading that right? I sincerely hope I am not.

    But if you are, what you are really saying, is you don't like for your groups to run smoothly. You like for them to take an hour to complete a quest, have many deaths along the way, and have a fairly significant chance of an outright wipe. Is that what you are implying? Because that's what will happen, if the Devs listen to you and nerf casters.
    That is the point.

    First let me introduce self. I am not a child,I am 38 old and i have family with two children. After busy day i can find one or two hours to play DDO and I want to see action and difficulties to be hard to overcome. I dont have problem with carrying the soulstone or casting Raise Death from expensive scroll (that why I am buying them) I want to feel self useful in the quest.

    And now see the situation: I join the party through LFM and after long run while reaching the ppls already in the quest i am finding self only running after leader without being useful to anyone. And it makes me angry to realise that leader is cheating. My expensive hour of time to play is wasted.

    I dont expecting that you will feel it the same. Especially someone who can play 3 hours every day and more.

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  11. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by djl View Post
    and the end boss in What Goes Up who decided after 19.2 that he sometimes doesn't want to spawn at all rendering the quest uncompletable.
    Last Boss, bridging fingers: "Yes, I have a new plan in dealing with those pesky adventurers."
    Minion: "What is that m'lord?"
    Last Boss: "Tardiness."
    (Dramatic music, zoom in on boss's face, random color filter used)
    Anything can be explained by drunken wizards.

    "Hey! I got a piece of the +1 Butter Knife of Victory! Ah-oh, wait, wait. It's just a crummy, normal +1 dagger of ghostbane..."

  12. #92
    Community Member Cetus's Avatar
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    Somebody get the OP a tissue
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  13. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by djl View Post
    And this is applicable to this debate, how? I'm happy for you that you have real life friends and relationships, but that is an irrelevant detail that tries to draw attention away from the argument at hand.

    Furthermore, if you don't care, why are you even posting here about this subject, at all?
    Ummm...this was a response to a post that quoted me...how is that not relevant?

  14. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by djl View Post
    You report overpowered casters/clerics BB as a bug? Am I reading that right? I sincerely hope I am not.

    But if you are, what you are really saying, is you don't like for your groups to run smoothly. You like for them to take an hour to complete a quest, have many deaths along the way, and have a fairly significant chance of an outright wipe. Is that what you are implying? Because that's what will happen, if the Devs listen to you and nerf casters.
    That actually sounds like more fun to me. Not that I expect the game to move in that direction as most seem to feel that putting in the time is all that should be expected of them.

  15. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qhualor View Post
    Not running with people who use EDs would be near impossible. Its more rare to find a group not using them. How are people supposed to know when they join a group if they will be using EDs? We have to start asking now if players will be using this bug? And than, even if they say they won't be using it, what's to stop them? People need to specifically put it in the lfm notes because if it doesn't say it, I assume players will be playing the game as intended.
    Strange, as I have yet to see this bug used.

  16. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by djl View Post
    And this is applicable to this debate, how? I'm happy for you that you have real life friends and relationships, but that is an irrelevant detail that tries to draw attention away from the argument at hand.

    Furthermore, if you don't care, why are you even posting here about this subject, at all?
    I care because I enjoy the game and I think people that post stuff that is blown out of proportion only hurts this game. Not everyone is using exploits and the contrary, in my estimation only maybe 5-10% are using twists in heroic PUGs. Those that are using it have no problems not using them if you ask or they will politely leave if they can't. How is this affecting anyone? If someone was destroying the economy or something that would be a different story, but this is not game breaking for anyone.

    These forums were created with a purpose...to enhance peoples game playing experience and to help new players out. I care about the community and want to see this game succeed, but I could care less about my virtual reputation on these forums. Many think their reputation matters, but I choose to believe that my reality is my physical reality and not my virtual one.

    Again whatever you respond to, I could care less, and if you must respond again, I won't respond again to this since it is off topic now and I could care less. So feel free to leave your virtual comments about my posts or myself in-general... I don't care, but if it makes you feel better....

  17. #97
    Community Member Ivan_Milic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay203 View Post
    what are you saying?
    that half of the DDO players are pathetic destiny exploiters??
    Idk if they are pathetic, but they are using it, most of the trs are using it.

  18. #98
    Community Member djl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gremmlynn View Post
    That actually sounds like more fun to me. Not that I expect the game to move in that direction as most seem to feel that putting in the time is all that should be expected of them.
    There is a difference between designing content that it is difficult-- like Epic Lord of Blades was pre-MOTU-- and simply nerfing our toons to MAKE things more difficult. I suppose the end result is the same, but one is the right way to go about it and one is the wrong way.

    If they were to destroy casters, so that they would once again become buff-bots, then I'm pretty sure that all the people who have been "on the fence" for a while would go ahead and topple over.

  19. #99
    Community Member djl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jskinner937 View Post
    I care because I enjoy the game and I think people that post stuff that is blown out of proportion only hurts this game. Not everyone is using exploits and the contrary, in my estimation only maybe 5-10% are using twists in heroic PUGs. Those that are using it have no problems not using them if you ask or they will politely leave if they can't. How is this affecting anyone? If someone was destroying the economy or something that would be a different story, but this is not game breaking for anyone.

    These forums were created with a purpose...to enhance peoples game playing experience and to help new players out. I care about the community and want to see this game succeed, but I could care less about my virtual reputation on these forums. Many think their reputation matters, but I choose to believe that my reality is my physical reality and not my virtual one.

    Again whatever you respond to, I could care less, and if you must respond again, I won't respond again to this since it is off topic now and I could care less. So feel free to leave your virtual comments about my posts or myself in-general... I don't care, but if it makes you feel better....
    So if you could care less, that means you do actually care that it is off topic and thus have the capacity to care less about it? Sorry, I had to point that out.

    Anyway, we appear to be arguing for the same outcome. I am ambivalent about the heroic twists-- they are fun but hardly necessary. They don't affect anybody. If you get upset about someone using them, that is YOUR fault, you are CHOOSING to let it upset you. You are choosing to run with strangers, instead of your friends who know and respect your desire not to use twists.

  20. #100
    Community Manager Cordovan's Avatar
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    Please don't rehash old, closed arguments. As previously stated, this is not working as intended, and will be addressed.
    Have fun, and don't forget to gather for buffs!
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