Quote Originally Posted by deahamlet View Post
You are completely right. I always bemoaned all that searching for epic pieces but back then I had a list of things I wanted to get eventually... and goals. It made raids fun even on bad days or disasters. It made even the most hated raid something I looked forward to getting better at (damn you Abbot). It made people come together and have things to do. Even for TR purposes you sometimes stayed at cap to get those 20 raids done or a few more just in case that TOD ring or that base item dropped which you could use for TR and even use in endlife for ultimate gear load.
That's how I met people... helping eachother get better at raids, get better at helping eachother get the shineys we wanted.
When MOTU came down we were excited, but the first things we did were a sure sign of why this was bad. We went and solo-ed or posted runs to ransack on certain chests. And even then the excitement of getting what you wanted wasn't there cause I could get the wisdom robe and sell it/exchange it for the charisma robe. Yes, I got what I wanted faster... but I had LESS fun doing it.

I've been waiting. In the meantime I've played other MMOs and other games and to be honest, I come back ONLY for nostalgia. I prefer playing a japanese MMO running home-made translations and scripts because whenever I want to play DDO to see if things are better... I still find no reason to stay.
Waiting loses you people. I've made new friends, new goals... when people walk away to "wait", they may not come back.

I gave MOTU a chance. It ruined my long term plans, my carrots were all gone and to be honest I don't find it enough to just run raids for "fun". When you ran a raid 20+ times with several toons, it is no longer just for fun. There has to be some sort of carrot. It did indeed ruin raiding and they've yet to find suitable replacements for that grind at the end.

Because not everyone's cup of tea is the XP grind. Not everyone's cup of tea is finding random lootgen. Some of us like gear load-outs and piece-mail grind like Shroud and even that LOTB were genius ideas (albeit LOTB could have served up more interesting loot). The old epic item system was a long term carrot that gave you a path... There was a nice transition, a growing (if you will) of your character to reach higher levels of difficulty.

I started with running the easier raids at cap. I crafted a couple of stand-in pieces. I ran the easiest epics after a bit of experience and gearing. I ran a lot of epics and raids until I DARED, yes DARED, step into the desert epics. Those epics were a goal... a thing you geared for. I ran Shroud all throughout to get my two pieces of GS gear that I knew would be useful running epics and for leveling up if I TR-ed.

That was a rather worthwhile and EXCELLENT system, in my eyes. Yes, more and new content was needed. But content that still worked within that system, that maybe gave you decent named loot to propel you to the new challenges of EE and higher level epics and raids.

Instead we got MOTU. And eGH was a brave attempt but not when the person making the loot seems to have zero clue about progression and how to make enticing NAMED loot. Random lootgen is an insult to progression. Random lootgen reminds me of Asian love for RNG and let me tell you... North Americans are not Asians and they unilaterally hate it.

I'm waiting. The work they've been doing in the past year does not give me hope that this new end-game and system will be great.
You need a system that both allows you to grow your character through XP grind and through gear progression. And hopefully something that isn't WOW with their love of rendering gear obsolete every update.

I don't have high hopes they can nail it.
All this. Ever since motu, I've had friends/guild members (quality, skilled players) slowly leaving due to the shift away from raiding and 6 man epic-component-grinding. These days you have the odd people soloing/duoing ee quests with no postings and 0 pugs posted. The end game needs to go back to it's roots, and I posted this on the items thread in closed beta.

You NEED the carrot, and items are it in these types of games - you guys just have to realize that. Also, listen to your players (within reason) - we kind of know best, since we play every day.