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Thread: More immersion?

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    Community Member SimplyC's Avatar
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    Lightbulb More immersion?

    I was just thinking of a couple of things that would make DDO more immersive and decided to share. Now, first let me clarify that this are ideas, not suggestions. I'm aware that some of the things that I'll present would be almost impossible to implement without remaking the whole game. That said, I just wanted to throw a few out there and hear other people's opinions and ideas. Who knows? Maybe some of them are doable and the devs might like and implement them in the future. Another warning I should make is that this post is going to be long. I'm often going to go on tangents to give examples and explain/defend the statement. I apologize for that.

    Let's start with the obvious. It would be great to see the PC's walk animation fixed. It's odd because the NPC's walk just fine but player's toons have this awkward limping half-run. It's so weird when you're in a quest where an NPC is leading you somewhere and instead of walking beside them you have to run a few paces, wait and then run a few more. I also dislike running in places like taverns and such. Walking around seems more plausible. And while on the subject of animations, more emotes would be good. I think the current list is very limited and could definitely be improved upon.

    Something else I would love to see is more interaction with the world. So, I'm not a hard-core gamer. Never was and I expect never will be. I couldn't care less about achievements, ranks and such. I normally play a game like an interactive book. Either give me an open world where I can make my own story or give me a solid story-line and I'm happy. MMOs can actually give you both with a bonus: It's a never ending story! Or at least a very very long one.
    My first mmo was World of Warcraft. Wait! WAIT! Don't close this thread just yet! Please let me finish the thought. We good? Okay, thanks. The thing I liked the most about it where the little details. First time, I played as a night-elf. They start in an island and, after finishing the quests there, are sent to the mainland. When it was my turn to leave home, an NPC told me to get a ride on a griffon. So on I go already excited to ride a half-eagle half-lion beast and when I get there, no loading screen! I was in awe that I got to sit through the whole flight. So I get to my destination and spot a dock with a bunch of ships. I decide to go check them out and jump in one. After a while running around I'm ready to move on when it starts moving. The ship that I thought was just for decoration was moving and taking me somewhere. I was so excited (yes, I am that easily impressed) that I got careless, fell off and got killed by a sea monster.
    Those kind of thing just make the game feel alive. Just getting from point A to point B was an adventure in and of itself and it would have been great if DDO had been made like that. Now, I understand that in the current setting ships are useless but every single trip is a loading screen so far. Not to mention, some of the big cities in WoW had benches you could actually sit on and even chairs around tables that where interactive.
    This would be great in DDO. You have this chairs in the taverns that are far enough apart from the table but the only way to sit on them is to awkwardly "walk" around the surface until you feel you're in the right place and then activate the sitting emote. If your calculation were off, you end up with part of the toon's body being engulfed by the chair. Why not do it like LOTRO where, if you are close enough to a chair and use the sit emote, a chair shows up and your avatar sits on it. It would be great to be able to sit in a tavern while I'm preparing spells or waiting for my spell and hit points to regenerate after an adventure gone wrong.

    And what about adding a second floor to some taverns with rooms and beds? I mean, a port city like Stormreach not having inns is preposterous. It would make logging off during roleplaying more fun. You can just say "I think I'll retire for the day", walk to a room and presto! Your character is sleeping while you go deal with your life. Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that DDO did everything wrong. It is, so far, my favorite and the dungeons themselves are very immersive. I love the DM describing the setting and even changing his/her voice when talking for another character. I love that when you summon hirelings they say something and even emote. Most of all, I love that thing can go very differently than what you expected and the adventure ends up being more exciting because of it. But then you go back to the city run around, talk to vendor, stand around while you prepare yourself, talk to NPC and run to the next dungeon. Even if you are roleplaying, isn't it more fun to have your character act out simple actions instead of having to type them out?

    Which brings me to my final idea (finally, right?). The wilderness areas should be public instead of instanced. Picture this: You have just been hired by Lady Pompousbottom to recover a family heirloom she lost when her caravan was raided by bandits just outside the city. You stock on supplies and set out. After investigating the sight of the attack, you walk around looking for signs that might lead you to the bandits. Suddenly, you see a group of people in the distance around a campfire. You cautiously approach them with your weapon in the ready but, as you get closer, you catch bits of their conversation and realize they're not bandits at all. In fact, they're also tracking a group of bandits. You let your presence be known and, after talking, it is decided that you should join forces against the common enemy. BAM! You just found a party to help you without having to open the LFM window. Then you all go happily to the bandit camp (which of course would be an instance). For people like me who love it when spontaneous roleplay happens out of nowhere, that would have been a great occurence.

    Anyway, what do you guys think? What are your ideas? Or do you think all this would just be a waste of game code?
    Last edited by SimplyC; 09-19-2013 at 08:24 PM.

  2. #2
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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  3. #3
    Community Member SimplyC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charononus View Post
    Sorry ^^U. But I did give a warning.

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    I'll be honest, I kinda skimmed through that wall (I would suggest splitting up that third paragraph by the way, it was uncomfortable to get through), I agree on the fixing the walk animation etc.

    Not keen on the idea of Explorer Areas being Public Instances to be honest.

    The last thing I want is for that Rare I've been trying to get for ages finally spawning but someone else kills it and I'm SoL.


    To be completely honest though, it's pointless trying to suggest ways to increase immersion (Though I'm sure your heart is in the right place) when Turbine keeps monetising everything and shoving it in our faces.

    Kinda hard to immerse oneself into the game when simply looking at the characters stat sheet, inventory or general UI throws up constant reminders to spend money.

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    Community Member SimplyC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Archangel_666 View Post
    I'll be honest, I kinda skimmed through that wall (I would suggest splitting up that third paragraph by the way, it was uncomfortable to get through), I agree on the fixing the walk animation etc.

    Not keen on the idea of Explorer Areas being Public Instances to be honest.

    The last thing I want is for that Rare I've been trying to get for ages finally spawning but someone else kills it and I'm SoL.


    To be completely honest though, it's pointless trying to suggest ways to increase immersion (Though I'm sure your heart is in the right place) when Turbine keeps monetising everything and shoving it in our faces.

    Kinda hard to immerse oneself into the game when simply looking at the characters stat sheet, inventory or general UI throws up constant reminders to spend money.
    Sorry about that.
    But, anyway, I don't think is that bad in DDO. Specially compared to other MMOs out there.

  6. #6
    Community Member Qhualor's Avatar
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    how much for immersion? ive got 20 flawless whites.

    or

    want to trade TP code for immersion

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    Community Member Postumus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SimplyC View Post
    Either give me an open world where I can make my own story or give me a solid story-line and I'm happy.

    I think making a quest chain that gives you different outcomes ( end rewards and favor) for completing different quest objectives throughout the chain would be interesting.


    Say a chain where you can choose to help the Harpers or the PDKs. Depending on how you complete the quest, you would get Harper favor and a Harper related end reward or PDK favor and a PDK related end reward.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SimplyC View Post
    Sorry about that.
    But, anyway, I don't think is that bad in DDO. Specially compared to other MMOs out there.
    I disagree, but I won't go into detail because all that would happen is others would jump in the thread, arguing would ensue and it'd get locked and while I disagree with some of your suggestions I don't believe you deserve that.

    I will say one thing though, just in passing.

    There may indeed be other games that are worse in that regard, but the thing you need to remember is that I'm not playing those other games.

  9. #9
    Community Member SimplyC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Postumus View Post
    I think making a quest chain that gives you different outcomes ( end rewards and favor) for completing different quest objectives throughout the chain would be interesting.


    Say a chain where you can choose to help the Harpers or the PDKs. Depending on how you complete the quest, you would get Harper favor and a Harper related end reward or PDK favor and a PDK related end reward.
    That would be great! And maybe lose favor with the faction you didn't side with making it harder to get other quests from them?

  10. #10
    Community Member SimplyC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Archangel_666 View Post
    There may indeed be other games that are worse in that regard, but the thing you need to remember is that I'm not playing those other games.
    Touché

    What I was trying to say was that in DDO it seems rather easy to ignore.

    Quote Originally Posted by Archangel_666 View Post
    I disagree, but I won't go into detail because all that would happen is others would jump in the thread, arguing would ensue and it'd get locked and while I disagree with some of your suggestions I don't believe you deserve that.

    I will say one thing though, just in passing.
    Oh no please, elaborate. Isn't that what forums are for, after all? Discussing things?

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    Quote Originally Posted by SimplyC View Post
    Oh no please, elaborate. Isn't that what forums are for, after all? Discussing things?
    Around here? Only in theory. lol

    This is probably going to sound somewhat sarcastic, I can't help it at this point, but the sarcasm is aimed at Turbine, not you.



    Didn't get the loot you were after?

    Been farming that quest for six months trying to get that named item for your build?

    Oh dear, you're not having much luck are you?

    Tell you what, pay us money and we'll let you try again.

    What do you mean, we could just increase the droprates?

    Don't be silly, that would unbalance the game, just pay us money like a good little boy.



    Oh dear, your character didn't have enough in that skill to make the check?

    Tell you what, pay us money and you don't need to worry about that.



    Then there's the stupid permanently on screen A$ display at the bottom of the screen, I've mostly covered it with my Focus Orb, but it still likes to be seen now and again.



    Or the stupid reminder that we can buy Tomes on the DDO Store when looking at our stats.

    Yes Turbine, I know that.


    I don't need constant reminders that I have sod all money in Real Life.

    I'm playing to forget about Real Life for a little while.

  12. #12
    Community Member SimplyC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Archangel_666 View Post
    Around here? Only in theory. lol

    This is probably going to sound somewhat sarcastic, I can't help it at this point, but the sarcasm is aimed at Turbine, not you.



    Didn't get the loot you were after?

    Been farming that quest for six months trying to get that named item for your build?

    Oh dear, you're not having much luck are you?

    Tell you what, pay us money and we'll let you try again.

    What do you mean, we could just increase the droprates?

    Don't be silly, that would unbalance the game, just pay us money like a good little boy.



    Oh dear, your character didn't have enough in that skill to make the check?

    Tell you what, pay us money and you don't need to worry about that.



    Then there's the stupid permanently on screen A$ display at the bottom of the screen, I've mostly covered it with my Focus Orb, but it still likes to be seen now and again.



    Or the stupid reminder that we can buy Tomes on the DDO Store when looking at our stats.

    Yes Turbine, I know that.


    I don't need constant reminders that I have sod all money in Real Life.

    I'm playing to forget about Real Life for a little while.
    Oh, those. Well, when you're playing with immersion in mind things like legendary loot and name items an so on take a backseat so that's why I haven't been bothered by it yet. As for the tome reminder in the stats screen I have to admit I haven't seen it because I very rarely consult my stats unless I'm leveling up but i can see how it would be annoying.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SimplyC View Post
    Oh, those. Well, when you're playing with immersion in mind things like legendary loot and name items an so on take a backseat so that's why I haven't been bothered by it yet. As for the tome reminder in the stats screen I have to admit I haven't seen it because I very rarely consult my stats unless I'm leveling up but i can see how it would be annoying.
    Yes and no.

    I can definitely understand your point of view, but the way I look at it is that there are different kinds of immersion.

    One can be immersed in a story (Difficult to do when you've run through the story fifty times, but easily doable on the first few runs, or if you're extremely forgetful I suppose).

    One can be immersed in one's character (I'll be honest, while I won't mock another for Role Playing and wish them much happiness, it's just not something that appeals to me these days, I've been there, done that and got several T-Shirts).

    One can be immersed in gameplay (This is pretty much where I am. When I'm on my Monk, and the bugs are not too noticeable, I'm not thinking about Real Life, I'm thinking Stunning Fist, Fist of Light, Quivering Palm, Hah! Take that caster! Oh no you don't archer, you're not going anywhere, have a Stunning Fist to the face. Even on loot runs it's possible to be immersed in the flow of the combat. And then you get to a chest...).

  14. #14
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Postumus View Post
    I think making a quest chain that gives you different outcomes ( end rewards and favor) for completing different quest objectives throughout the chain would be interesting.


    Say a chain where you can choose to help the Harpers or the PDKs. Depending on how you complete the quest, you would get Harper favor and a Harper related end reward or PDK favor and a PDK related end reward.
    Umm no, that would be a pug headache and further decrease the pug count as people argued about which actions to do, and people griefed with it. This idea works wonderfully in single player and lan type games where you know the other players but in a pugged game it's just asking for trouble.

    I do like these kinds of quests but I think their place is not in mmo's.

  15. #15
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Archangel_666 View Post
    Yes and no.

    I can definitely understand your point of view, but the way I look at it is that there are different kinds of immersion.

    One can be immersed in a story (Difficult to do when you've run through the story fifty times, but easily doable on the first few runs, or if you're extremely forgetful I suppose).

    One can be immersed in one's character (I'll be honest, while I won't mock another for Role Playing and wish them much happiness, it's just not something that appeals to me these days, I've been there, done that and got several T-Shirts).

    One can be immersed in gameplay (This is pretty much where I am. When I'm on my Monk, and the bugs are not too noticeable, I'm not thinking about Real Life, I'm thinking Stunning Fist, Fist of Light, Quivering Palm, Hah! Take that caster! Oh no you don't archer, you're not going anywhere, have a Stunning Fist to the face. Even on loot runs it's possible to be immersed in the flow of the combat. And then you get to a chest...).
    I'm with you on this. After the first run you can't be immersed in the story unless maybe you've been drinking so much you pretty much don't remember how to play. RP is not my thing and to be honest I don't understand the allure of it to some people. Immersion in combat can very much happen, you concentrate on what you're doing and forget some of the real world stress you have for a time.

  16. #16
    Founder & Hero Uska's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charononus View Post
    I'm with you on this. After the first run you can't be immersed in the story unless maybe you've been drinking so much you pretty much don't remember how to play. RP is not my thing and to be honest I don't understand the allure of it to some people. Immersion in combat can very much happen, you concentrate on what you're doing and forget some of the real world stress you have for a time.
    I love role playing in games but very few computer games are really made for it and even fewer if any MMO's really work in way for true good role play. I dont see mmo's as being very immersive but they can be and usually are a good real world distraction and stress reliver.

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