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  1. #101
    Community Member PermaBanned's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Delacroix21 View Post
    The whole beauty of TRing is that you get a FREE feat (no one really cares about the purchaseable ones). The problem is the "master achievement" of TRing offers nothing.... UNLESS you spend a feat slot.


    This needs to be changed....


    I would also like to see a 2nd and 3rd completionist feat for double and triple completionists as well. Am I a completionist? Nope... I am a first lifer sitting on 14 ottos boxes. Make these changes and you will expect even more ottos boxes to be purchased by me. =)
    Completionist going passive needs to happen, totally agree! But stacking 3 times? No. With ETR wer're getting 2 more build points (unless that's changed?) IMHO a 38 point build with +6 to all stats & skills sounds a bit excessive. The most I could get on board with is an "Epic Completionist" feat (also passive) that grants an additional +2, but even that seems like a lot in total.
    Now excuse me while I wander off to arm myself with Grilled Cheese Sandwiches and hunker down behind my Armored Beer Refrigerator, while I have the UFO's take control of the Congresional Wives with the help of the International Cocaine Smugglers and the Evil Geniuses for a Better Tomorrow

  2. #102
    Community Member Deathdefy's Avatar
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    Is my understanding that you can apply the 'sphere points' earned in one destiny toward any other destiny within the same sphere correct?

    So I could gather all past lives just in Draconic (Arcane), Unyielding (Divine), Shadow Dancer (Martial) and Fury (Primal)?

    If so, great.

    On suggestions for past-life feats:

    -Draconic +1 Evocation DC, +20 (All) Elemental Spell Power.
    -Magister +1 All Spells Dc, +2 Spell Pen
    -Fatesinger +1 Enchantment DC, +1/+1 Inspire Courage Attack and Damage, +1 Songs per day

    -Shadowdancer +1 Assassinate DC, +2 Hide / Move Silently, +1d6 Sneak Attack Damage
    -Legendary Dreadnaught +2 Tactics DC, +2 Damage per hit
    -Grandmaster of Flowers +1 Stunning DC, +1 Passive Ki Generation

    -Fury +1 STR, +2 Damage per hit
    -Primal Avatar +1 Wis, +1 Str
    -Shiradi +30 Force Spell Power, +2 Ranged Damage

    -Exalted Angel +5% Heal Amp, +20 Postive Spell Power, Empower Healing Metamagic costs 2 less SP.
    -Unyielding Sentinel +5% Heal Amp, +10 PRR.
    Khyber: Aggrim (Completionist!)
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  3. #103
    Developer Vargouille's Avatar
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    We currently expect the "return to level 20" part of Epic Reincarnation to essentially mean sacrificing your Epic class level progress (you keep Epic Destiny progress) while retaining your Heroic progress exactly as it is. There are other forms of Reincarnation for affecting Heroic advancement.

    Quote Originally Posted by Deathdefy View Post
    Is my understanding that you can apply the 'sphere points' earned in one destiny toward any other destiny within the same sphere correct?
    Yes, it's true that you aren't spending points associated with an Epic Destiny. Though you don't exactly apply earned points towards Epic Destinies per se, as Epic Past Lives are not associated with any destiny, nor are the points you are earning in the Sphere.

    So I could gather all past lives just in Draconic (Arcane), Unyielding (Divine), Shadow Dancer (Martial) and Fury (Primal)?
    Yes, or whatever Epic Destiny you prefer in each sphere.
    Last edited by Vargouille; 09-13-2013 at 09:35 PM.

  4. #104

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    Quote Originally Posted by PermaBanned View Post
    Completionist going passive needs to happen, totally agree! But stacking 3 times? No. With ETR wer're getting 2 more build points (unless that's changed?) IMHO a 38 point build with +6 to all stats & skills sounds a bit excessive. The most I could get on board with is an "Epic Completionist" feat (also passive) that grants an additional +2, but even that seems like a lot in total.
    Autogrant first please, feats are precious.

    Well, if they did stack completionist feat for multiple completionist, it would be more reasonable to assume something like:
    +2 ~ Completionist earned once
    Upgrade to +3 ~ Completionist earned twice
    Upgrade to +4 Completionist earned thrice


    Epic Completionist probably should take a different approach such as:
    Extra Twist Slot tier two ~ Epic Completionist earned once
    Upgrade Extra Twist Slot to tier three ~ Epic Completionist earned twice
    Upgrade Extra Twist Slot to tier four ~ Epic Completionist earned thrice


    Iconic Completionist probably should take a different approach yet:
    Free Extra Heroic Feat ~ Iconic Completionist earned once
    Upgrade to Free Extra Epic Feat ~ Iconic completionist earned twice
    Upgrade to Free Feat of anysort you qualify for ~ Iconic completionist earned thrice.

  5. #105

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vargouille View Post
    We currently expect the "return to level 20" part of Epic Reincarnation to essentially mean sacrificing your Epic class level progress (you keep Epic Destiny progress) while retaining your Heroic progress exactly as it is. There are other forms of Reincarnation for affecting Heroic advancement....
    Makes sense and easy to code.
    ....Yes, or whatever Epic Destiny you prefer in each sphere.
    Nice.

    For example, Fawngate the casting favored soul could do well enough with Draconic for arcane, Primal or Shiradi for Primal, and Shadowdancer for Martial.
    She probably would TR into an Iconic some work on an Epic Past Life or two giving her even more flexibility.

  6. #106
    Community Member Cetus's Avatar
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    I think that there must be a passive and active component to these epic past life feats because I assume that it is in your interest to make this system as ubiquitous throughout the class spectrum as possible. The problem with the old past life feats and completionist was that the feat starved classes were completely discouraged from participating in this system aside from earning the passive feats.

    As a result, the passive aspect of this system is utilized nonspecific of what class you actually play, and this is always a good thing.

    A good alternative is to actually give everyone say, 2 free epic past live feats slots which may receive any heroic/epic active feat or heroic/epic completionist feat. This way, completionist becomes useful for everyone if they so see fit to sacrifice any other alternatives, and the feat rich classes may just take multiple feats. This allows most of us to profit one way or another.

    Feat Ideas for martial sphere:

    Martial:

    1. Cooldown of tactical feats is reduced by 50%

    2. Action boosts may regenerate at a rate of 1 every 120 seconds

    3. Trip makes your target helpless when landed successfully

    4. Duration of your tactical abilities are extended by 100% when landed successfully

    5. Tactical abilities no longer fail on a 1

    6. Melee attacks no longer miss on a 1

    etc

    Also, this is worth mentioning for the thousandth time - heroic completionist needs to be granted. I ground that out back when we had 20% pots max, no bravery, no tomes, much less quests, and lower first time N/H/E bonuses. It would be a nice gesture to respect that kind of devotion and free it up for us.
    Last edited by Cetus; 09-13-2013 at 10:35 PM.
    Cetus Heroic Lives: #32/32 | Epic Completionist: #20/24 | Iconic Lives: #6/6
    Cetusz - Pure Sorcerer: Heroic Lives: #24/24 | Epic Lives: #6/12 | Iconic Lives: #1/3
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  7. #107

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cetus View Post
    A good alternative is to actually give everyone say, 2 free epic past live feats slots which may receive any heroic/epic active feat or heroic/epic completionist feat. This way, completionist becomes useful for everyone if they so see fit to sacrifice any other alternatives, and the feat rich classes may just take multiple feats. This allows most of us to profit one way or another.
    Interesting idea.

    Or create a past life enhancement tree and let us spend point in it, but your idea is probably better.
    Also, this is worth mentioning for the thousandth time - heroic completionist needs to be granted. I ground that out back when we had 20% pots max, no bravery, no tomes, much less quests, and lower first time N/H/E bonuses. It would be a nice gesture to respect that kind of devotion and free it up for us.
    I'll believe it when I see it, however I have seem many things this day already that fall under that category....

  8. #108
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    Default before you say "rewrd for efforts"

    Quote Originally Posted by Glin View Post
    To get to the point: We have really changed direction from what was previously proposed; and I for one am very pleased that the systems team has taken that direction from 'power from pain' to something more palatable, like 'rewarded for efforts.'
    Please devs make note: Playing in a NON CORE DESTINY IS HORRIBLE. It is NOT fun. It is really painful, boring, slow, and makes me walk away from the game every single day I do it. If you implement a system where this is what you envision us doing in this "Epic TR" system, forget it because nobody likes doing that at all. Even in the slightest.

    It is a lot different from TR 1-20 because when you play a class you play a class. It not like saying "here play this Pali class with the rogue enhancement line and have fun!!!", which is basically how it seems it will work to me.
    RTFM on Khyber, Toy Soldiers.

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  9. #109

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    I wouldn’t mind seeing a passive past life feats allow you to open up PrE's from classes that you don't have levels in. (Kind of like Racial PrEs are supposed to, you know, if they had actually gotten implemented like Turbine said they would.)
    Things that if Turbine went all EXTREME PREJUDICE™ on, would actually make the game fun again.:
    • Giving us the racial PrE’s we were promised, before rolling out DDOStore™ Enhancement Trees.
    • Fixing physical defense for Rangers and Rogues. It’s ridiculous that you’re better off wearing Heavy Armor and ignoring your innate feats on these classes.
    • Cannith Crafting.
    • Update the named loot to put them on the same system.
    • Fixing the Cannith Challenges so that they can be 6 starred without incredible luck or store bought items.
    • Fixing all challenges to give us decent XP and ingredient returns for the unreasonable time we have to spend in most of them.

  10. #110
    Community Member Cyr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vargouille View Post
    The details regarding these Epic Past Lives are still being designed. Early thoughts are that these are likely to stack three times, like Heroic Past Lives.

    If you have amazing ideas for possible Epic Past Lives, now is a good time to try to squeak those ideas into our ears!
    I presume this means that you can get each feat three times (not just three feats from each sohere with the option of just choosing one three times). If not that needs to be changed as it presents a problem for future feat options in that early adopters could miss out on better feats for their toons and it could present the same issue for those whose builds change due to system changes making their old builds not so hot or just because they want to do something different (which TR's allow now).

    So here are some ideas with the idea that you can get each feat three times with no limit to the total number of feats from a sphere you can get beyond that.

    Elementalist (Arcane Sphere)
    * You gain +20 Fire/Cold/Electric/Acid/Sonic and +1 Evocation/Conjuration DC.

    Basic <Insert Destiny Name> Training (Appropriate Sphere per destiny)
    * You gain the first core ability of the selected destiny. If selected twice you also gain the second core ability. If selected three times you also gain the third core ability. This ability only functions for inactive destinies.

    Fate Bender (Arcane Sphere)
    * All beneficial proc effects that apply to your abilities or items you have equipped are increased by 50% (example an effect which normally occurs 7% of the time would occur 7 + 3.5 = 10.5% of the time if you had this feat one time). Note, this only applies to effects which have a percentage proc rate and has no effect on dc effects, to hit, or other types of dice rolls.

    Swift Feet (Martial Sphere)
    * You gain +5% movement rate.

    Let Your Rage Empower You (Primal)
    * While raged, whenever you vorpal hit an enemy (20 attack role) you have a 33.3% chance of gaining a counter of every type which applies to epic destiny abilities (ex. shadow charges).

    Self Centered (Martial)
    * You are treated as if you were always centered for the purposes of using core abilities and destiny abilities of tier 2/4/6 or lower. You also no longer lose ki for being uncentered and gain ki as if you were always centered.

    Master Archer (Primal)
    * All core abilities which apply to attacks and all tier 2/4/6 or lower destiny abilities also apply to ranged attacks if they do not already. Additionally, abilities which only apply to specific types of ranged attacks now apply to all ranged attacks (from the previously list of abilities). Example, any abilities which state 'melee' attacks grant something now grant that for ranged attacks also.

    Master of Melee Arts (Martial)
    * As Master Archer except applies to melee abilities.
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  11. #111
    The Hatchery Scraap's Avatar
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    Growth without stacking:

    Divine:
    Grants empower healing, empower, maximise.
    or
    Mental toughness, improved mental toughness, epic mental toughness.

    Martial:
    Grants Two weapon fighting, improved two weapon fighting, greater two weapon fighting.
    or
    Grants Two handed fighting, improved two handed fighting, greater two handed fighting.

    Primal:
    Grants Power attack, cleave, great cleave.
    or
    Point blank shot, precise shot, improved precise shot.

    Arcane:
    Grants Spell pen, improved spell pen, epic spell pen.
    or
    Spellfocus X, greater spell focus X, Epic spell focus X.

  12. #112
    Hatchery Hero BOgre's Avatar
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    1st ER
    Grants access to 4th Twist slot, slot is specific to ER'd Sphere, Tier 1.

    Additional ERs in Sphere
    Upgrades Sphere Twist Slot one Tier, max Tier 3.

    1st ER in another Sphere
    Grants Access to 5th Twist slot, slot is specific to ER'd Sphere, Tier 1

    And so on until all Sphere Twist Slots unlocked and upgraded to Tier 3 (Completionist)

    Completionist
    Upgrade 1 Sphere Twist Slot to Tier 4

  13. #113
    Community Member psykopeta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glin View Post
    Yup. Iconics get a whole section on how they fit into TR.
    Reincarnation and Iconics is pretty straight forward but I think it makes more sense when the whole system is laid out.
    pls would be great if instead of doing something weird with iconics just use em as races (because they are races, have their different enhancement racial tree, not different class tree)

    they start the 1st life at lvl 15? no trouble, it's 1st life, but they NEED to LR (and maybe someone decides to tr from it) specially the bladeforged we had BEFORE the u19(and now are almost useless due to changes in enhancements and skills, i have my +20LR but can't use it, just want the same build with different feats and skills U_U)

    someone wanna tr into an iconic? feel free to do so, no starting gear and u'll be lvl 1, because if u force iconics to lvl til 28 to TR, dunno if ppl will TR it (they lose 6,6M from epics - 850k they needed to cap if had to go from 15 to 20 = 5,75M doesn't worth nor benefit)

    so pls, think about iconics as "an easy button to skip 1 life" (like ppl is doing with otto's/bigby's they pay $$ to skip grinding 1 life, is ok with me, i just wanna be able to LR my iconic XD)
    psykopeta - hoarding pl, for the sake of hoarding, the day i become ubercompletionist will be because there isn't anything to delay it more - thelanis, where the gimps claim to be pros and noobs claim to be pros, no newbies allowed(unless they claim to be pros), we have enough drama w/o them. PS i'm not a pro, maybe if i reincarnate in RL...

  14. #114
    Community Member eachna_gislin's Avatar
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    Is there any intention to provide clerics and artificers with their missing destinies?

  15. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vargouille View Post
    If you have amazing ideas for possible Epic Past Lives, now is a good time to try to squeak those ideas into our ears!
    Divine Sphere:
    1) Stepping wisely. 1/3 the Wisdom modifier is added to reflex saves.
    2) The higher of WIS and CHA is used to determine DC when casting divine spells.
    3) The higher of WIS and CHA is used to determine number of divine spell points.

  16. #116
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    Default Looking good!

    Keeping destinies, epic TR to 20 and keeping heroic TR as it is - looks great direction!

    (I'm assuming you don't loose your epic destinies if you heroic TR - its not explicitly stated as so....)

  17. #117
    Founder & Hero Uska's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arianka View Post
    Plz make so only WF can TR into bladeforged, Only humans into shader kai, only elves into morning lords, humans into purple dragon knights. Come up with other iconics that only dwraves, drow, and hobbits can TR in to.
    UMMMM HELL NO! What you want people to quit in droves?

    The ANTI-Realms FANBOI NUKE THE REALMS ITS THE ONLY REAL WAY TO BE SURE

  18. #118
    Founder & Hero Uska's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kierg10 View Post
    Are the devs gonna say anything on whether you keep the same build or auto level to 20 a new build?

    Would really like some input here :P
    I would bet if you only do the epic TR that your lvls 1-20 wont be touched

    The ANTI-Realms FANBOI NUKE THE REALMS ITS THE ONLY REAL WAY TO BE SURE

  19. #119
    Founder & Hero Uska's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RTFM View Post
    Please devs make note: Playing in a NON CORE DESTINY IS HORRIBLE. It is NOT fun. It is really painful, boring, slow, and makes me walk away from the game every single day I do it. If you implement a system where this is what you envision us doing in this "Epic TR" system, forget it because nobody likes doing that at all. Even in the slightest.

    It is a lot different from TR 1-20 because when you play a class you play a class. It not like saying "here play this Pali class with the rogue enhancement line and have fun!!!", which is basically how it seems it will work to me.
    You shouldn't be able to use one ED to get exp. in another and if I understand you that is what you want, sorry that's a bad idea you want to get through a ED you need to play through it.

    The ANTI-Realms FANBOI NUKE THE REALMS ITS THE ONLY REAL WAY TO BE SURE

  20. #120

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    Quote Originally Posted by Uska View Post
    You shouldn't be able to use one ED to get exp. in another and if I understand you that is what you want, sorry that's a bad idea you want to get through a ED you need to play through it.
    We don't want to get through the off destinies, though. All we want are fate points and the ability to epic TR, neither of which need to be related to off destinies at all.

    Happily the devs' responses have already made it clear that epic tr points will not be tied to specific destinies, meaning we'll have to level with the destiny of our choice active from the sphere we want the past life from. This is a good direction.

    All we need to do now is get fate points decoupled from destiny levels and the system will be perfect.

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