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  1. #1
    Community Member Trillea's Avatar
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    Default Suggestion for new endgame..

    Devs..

    DDO is dying a slow death.. again. There are many reasons, age being one of them, high learning curve for newbies being a second (this was somewhat helped by the enhancement pass), and complete lack of an endgame. You can't turn back the clock, so the game is not going to get any younger. More steps to reduce the learning curve for new players will go far as well, but once you have attracted those players and gotten them to level a character to cap, what is there to keep them? Many (like my wife) will not be interested in TRing because they lose so much for little gain. Loss of all their favor and having to re-level an entire character with more XP for a couple build points and a free feat is a turnoff for many. So what to do to keep paying customers like these? WORK ON YOUR ENDGAME!!!

    Right now, there are 1 1/2 raids for endgame - FoT and CitW. I say 1 1/2 because while FoT is ran quite a bit, due to the loss of flag as soon as you TR (another flaw in the system) many people never flag/reflag for CitW until they are on what they consider their last life. So how to fix this? There are several steps that will need to be taken:

    1) Raise the level cap to 30 ASAP. Then - and I mean it - state clearly, loudly, and firmly that THIS IS A HARD CAP AND WILL NOT BE RAISED - mostly due to the next couple steps.

    2) Add - in addition to the current epic level raids - a new type of epic called Capped that you can only access when you are level 30 - and do this for EVERY RAID IN THE GAME. It would also really help to add 1 or 2 more raids as well. New Capped loot will have to be refigured for all the new raids. The loot MUST BE BETTER THAN WHAT YOU CAN GET RANDOM GEN! If necessary, add new effects that are ONLY available on Capped loot. Or even better, add effects that mimic but stack with current prefixes/suffixes/whatever. Such as Capped Deadly V that stacks with Deadly X if we must use the current vernacular.

    3) In addition to the refurbished old raids, add level 30 quests that - instead of giving XP since you are already capped - give token fragments similar to Epic token fragments. What these Capped tokens would do is be usable at an altar at the end of every Capped raid. Once you have 10 Capped tokens, once per raid you can upgrade a piece of Capped raid loot in ways similar to the upgrades for raid loot in EGH and such. After 20 Capped raid completions, you get a Supreme Capped Token that you can use after getting your 20th end reward to trade for your choice of 1 piece of Capped raid loot. You would only ever get 1 of these per raid - so Supreme Capped Token at 40 or 60 etc.

    This would take a lot of work but would extend the endgame of DDO beyond your playerbase's wildest dreams and would help keep people around for a looong time. And happy vets are paying vets..
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  2. #2
    Community Member susiedupfer's Avatar
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    There's a section of the forums named "Suggestions and Ideas".
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  3. #3
    Community Member Soulfurnace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by susiedupfer View Post
    There's a section of the forums named "Suggestions and Ideas".
    This gets more views.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trillea View Post
    1) Raise the level cap to 30 ASAP. Then - and I mean it - state clearly, loudly, and firmly that THIS IS A HARD CAP AND WILL NOT BE RAISED
    /signed

    Quote Originally Posted by Trillea View Post
    <other stuff omitted>
    Also some interesting ideas about raids & loot. I don't want to /sign that EXACT proposal, but, yes, something along those general lines.

  5. #5
    Community Member zDragonz's Avatar
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    Why stop at at level 30? Level 30 just seems too small.

    I think level 48 should be the cap, because then EPIC toughness and toughness are the same feat. Beyond level 48 and epic toughness becomes a dead feat.

  6. #6
    Community Member DeKalbSun's Avatar
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    Some interesting ideas. The only problem i see is it might be hard to fill a raid when only lvl 30s can get into it. Agreed they need something
    that keeps players around for endgame though.
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trillea View Post
    WORK ON YOUR ENDGAME!!!
    They have already stated that level 30 will be a stopping point for the foreseeable future. Which is indeed a great decision, since the game is sorely in need of fleshing out all of these new levels that have been added!

    However, they will not be getting there for quite awhile yet, definitely not the first update of 2014 at least. At this point I really don't know what endgame players will be left to create an endgame for. A lot of people have been unhappy about the endgame situation since Update 14. And after waiting an entire year, and a second expansion, without seeing anything being done about this problem they have walked away. Two people on my nearly-maxed friends lists have been on when I have checked over the last couple weeks. Custom channels that used to have 60+ people at all times have 10 people at prime-time.

    Epic Gianthold was the closest that DDO has had to having an endgame at all since the first expansion. And even then, the endgame was 1 and 1/2 raids (as the OP puts it) and maybe a couple of quests that had highly desired items. It has been tossed about by Turbine staff that Raids get very little in-game traffic. But I think that has a lot more to do with there being no point to running them (CitW weapons come very quickly, save those few extremely unlucky souls, and just after FoT came out the level cap re-increase was announced) rather than no desire too. Look at all of the activity that ToD, Shroud, LoB, VoD, etc got before U14 was announced. But after two years without any real endgame, how many of the endgame players aren't going to now be into something else already?

  8. #8
    The Hatchery Wipey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zDragonz View Post
    Why stop at at level 30? Level 30 just seems too small.

    I think level 48 should be the cap, because then EPIC toughness and toughness are the same feat. Beyond level 48 and epic toughness becomes a dead feat.
    No, level cap should be random, random is fun !

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  9. #9
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    30 hard cap I can live with...

    the rest? no thanks.

    More raids are good.. but restricting them to capped players? terrible idea.
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  10. #10
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    I think perspective is a problem here. I've been hanging out with Tortoisse on cap for a while before they raised it, and finally got off my tr cleric long enough to near cap again with her (only 600K to go) and from my point of view there are more than two raids to do. Epic vons, dq, and chrono as well as FOT and CITW. I also join Hound, TOD, and VOD when I see them going (and am flagged, I skipped amrath this life nad keep forgetting to go until I see a tod up, and then it's too late).

    I don't only raid for virtual pixel loot gain though. I raid because it's fun. I do quests because their fun, not just for xp per minute or loot gain. With that perspective, there is PLENTY to do. Because I want to do it and have fun. On the gain side, if there must be one, some xp for my destinies (although they're nearly all capped too) and loot I can sell to increase my plat stores, but mostly good times with good people when I'm lucky and pull a fun great group.

    And I tr because it's fun and lets me play the game again. Not for the gain. If you don't feel like I do that's fine too, but I just wanted to point out that player perspective is an issue here also. If you only play for that sense of 'material gain' from the xp loot, then there is never going to be enough. They could add 10 endgame raids tomorrow, and in a month or two people will have what they wanted from them and be bored again.
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  11. #11
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Encair View Post
    No, level cap should be random, random is fun !
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by zDragonz View Post
    Why stop at at level 30? Level 30 just seems too small.

    I think level 48 should be the cap, because then EPIC toughness and toughness are the same feat. Beyond level 48 and epic toughness becomes a dead feat.
    I'd normally assume there's a sarcasm roll involved in the above and leave it at that.

    But since we've heard some really stupid things on the forums recently, I can only reply incase you're serious:

    Do the arithmetic to work out what xp would be needed to hit a level cap of 48

  13. #13
    Community Member rest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Impaqt View Post
    30 hard cap I can live with...

    the rest? no thanks.

    More raids are good.. but restricting them to capped players? terrible idea.
    What did I ever do to you?

  14. #14
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    The big problem with the OP suggestion is that whether people like it or not, TRing is the new Endgame. Which is why the dev focus for the next update seems to be Epic TRing (final proposals still to be confirmed). Since the cap was raised to 28, I would add "lack of storage" to the barriers in the way for people TRing - when I was running through my lives on Quijonn, I had my inventory and bank space finely honed so I could easily clear out my TR cache before speaking to Kruz. Since I've not had to do that, I've now got a bucketload of 25 and 28 gear that I'd rather not toss just so I can Epic TR.

    The problem we have with pushing the cap to 30 too soon is we don't have the breadth of content to support it properly. And it'll just bring even more storage problems.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by zDragonz View Post
    Why stop at at level 30? Level 30 just seems too small.

    I think level 48 should be the cap, because then EPIC toughness and toughness are the same feat. Beyond level 48 and epic toughness becomes a dead feat.
    I like the thinking, but I'd tweak that a bit:

    EPIC Toughness should obviously be BETTER than non-Epic plain-old Toughness. So, really, we should not exceed level 47.

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