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  1. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivan_Milic View Post
    If they fix it, I want them to fix all bugs, not just the ones that benefit players.
    Do you think its fair to us that they dont want to fix bugs for years, but can fix bugs like this?
    You're so completely clueless about game design. In the future, you may wish to think before you post. This is very embarrassing for you. The exploit mentioned in the OP is the most detrimental thing currently going on in the game. It gives rule breakers an unfair advantage, and people who wish to follow the rules get screwed. Things like this completely ruin a game.

  2. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    Ok wait wait, time out. Myself, thrudh, hendrik, AND troll are agreeing in the same thread. How is there any other trolling here, I thought we controlled exclusive rights. The rest of you owe us royalties. Please have the checks in the mail before the vortex opens up and swallows the multiverse due to massive division by zero.
    Well if it is WAI then that just means you guys would be the trolls in this thread:P

  3. #123
    Community Member Kalimah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hendrik View Post
    You have agreed not to cheat/exploit.

    If you cannot live up to that agreement why shouldn't you be reported and held accountable for your actions?
    Feel free to report me at any time, I have no worries whatsoever on any issue we discuss. My challenge to you is to prove to me that it is an exploit. Not by stating your opinion but by factual evidence that this is considered an exploit or a cheat.

    There are a LOT of things in this game that may be considered an exploit but they have become part of the standard acceptable behavior over the years. Is this different? If it is different why? Who says? Is it you?

    The argument is moot anyway. If you dont want to play with folks twisting then dont. How hard is that to understand?

  4. #124
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by McFlay View Post
    I find it highly offensive you question people's integrity and accuse people of going to hell based on this, especially when there aren't even people in the thread denying they do it. If I thought it was cheating and wanted to do it but didn't want to get caught I'd only be twisting passive buffs and cocoon for self use only. I wouldn't be twisting party buffs and saying I do so on the forums if I had anything to hide.
    Bah, integrity is over-rated. And let's be honest . . . if anything somebody says on an internet forum is a threat to your integrity you never had any in the first place.

    It is a bug, it is an exploit, it's an awesome fun bug but keep it real.

  5. #125
    Community Member Hendrik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by McFlay View Post
    That's funny, the devs have never made a statement on the issue, and its not in the list of known bugs. If they want to clarify for us or add it to the bugs list, then I'd agree with you all day.

    Otherwise at this point, I think you people for calling for mass bans need to realize that its not going to happen, because nobodies cheating, and if it did happen for some stupid reason, they might as well just shut the servers down, they'd lose far too many players by deciding to retro punish people for doing something that as far as we know is working as intended whether you like it or not.
    I have not called for any bans, mass or not.

    And when this is fixed, you will know it was not WAI. Then we all can have some fun reading all the nerdrage, I QUIT!, you nerfed my easy button threads.

    BTW, use that memory of yours. How many time has something not gone on the Known Issues or not had a statement made until it was fixed? Evasion in Heavy Armor ring a bell? Perching in FoT?

    And you also know they NEVER comment on Exploits. They do not want to bring attention to it and have more people doing it so it will never be on any bug list we see.

    Best thing you can hope for is a locked thread, only indication you will get. So when this one is locked, you will know it is not WAI.

    Quote Originally Posted by hsinclair
    I heard the devs hate all wizards, bards, clerics, fighters, and fuzzy bunnies and only want us to play halfling barbarian/paladin shuriken specialists!

    It's totally true, I have a reliable source. You better reroll now.
    Adventurer, Bug Reporter, Mournlander.

  6. #126
    Community Member Kalimah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jalont View Post
    You're so completely clueless about game design. In the future, you may wish to think before you post. This is very embarrassing for you. The exploit mentioned in the OP is the most detrimental thing currently going on in the game. It gives rule breakers an unfair advantage, and people who wish to follow the rules get screwed. Things like this completely ruin a game.
    Better edit this or we'll be locked hehe.
    Last edited by Kalimah; 09-10-2013 at 10:21 AM.

  7. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalimah View Post
    Not even close to the most detrimental exploit in the game. It may be the most deterimental that you are aware of but make no mistake there are others that are much worse if they were widespread.
    There's a lot of IFs in there, proving my point. If another exploit becomes as widespread, then we can upgrade that to the most detrimental thing in the game. Until that time, my point stands.

  8. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalimah View Post
    Better edit this or we'll be locked hehe.
    It'll get locked anyway, just like all the other daily posts on this subject gets locked. I have no idea why it's taken this long.

  9. #129
    Community Member Hendrik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalimah View Post
    Feel free to report me at any time, I have no worries whatsoever on any issue we discuss. My challenge to you is to prove to me that it is an exploit. Not by stating your opinion but by factual evidence that this is considered an exploit or a cheat.

    There are a LOT of things in this game that may be considered an exploit but they have become part of the standard acceptable behavior over the years. Is this different? If it is different why? Who says? Is it you?

    The argument is moot anyway. If you dont want to play with folks twisting then dont. How hard is that to understand?
    Can't be done and you know that. Only official statement would be from Turbine and you know they do not discuss exploits.

    So, prove to me that it is not. How can it be WAI that a L1 should be using twists from L20+?

    I don't play with cheaters. I have a fantastic Guild/Friends that don't cheat nor have the need to justify cheating in any way, shape, or form. Our moral compass, even in a video game, points in the right direction. Bonus to being an adult and surrounding yourself with like minded people.

    Quote Originally Posted by hsinclair
    I heard the devs hate all wizards, bards, clerics, fighters, and fuzzy bunnies and only want us to play halfling barbarian/paladin shuriken specialists!

    It's totally true, I have a reliable source. You better reroll now.
    Adventurer, Bug Reporter, Mournlander.

  10. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hendrik View Post
    I have not called for any bans, mass or not.

    And when this is fixed, you will know it was not WAI. Then we all can have some fun reading all the nerdrage, I QUIT!, you nerfed my easy button threads.

    BTW, use that memory of yours. How many time has something not gone on the Known Issues or not had a statement made until it was fixed? Evasion in Heavy Armor ring a bell? Perching in FoT?

    And you also know they NEVER comment on Exploits. They do not want to bring attention to it and have more people doing it so it will never be on any bug list we see.

    Best thing you can hope for is a locked thread, only indication you will get. So when this one is locked, you will know it is not WAI.
    This policy is really unfortunate. I can understand not advertising it in bug lists, but refusing to comment on the forums just perpetuates this (obviously bogus) rationalization by some that "we don't really know it's not WAI".

    What I especially do not get about this is that it has been going on for ages. I was away for the first six months or so if this year and it was around even before then. We've had a major update and a number of patches since, and it's still there. This is very hard to understand, and the lack of comment on it makes that worse.

    I hope Turbine will reconsider and clarify this matter.

  11. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qaliya View Post
    This policy is really unfortunate. I can understand not advertising it in bug lists, but refusing to comment on the forums just perpetuates this (obviously bogus) rationalization by some that "we don't really know it's not WAI".

    What I especially do not get about this is that it has been going on for ages. I was away for the first six months or so if this year and it was around even before then. We've had a major update and a number of patches since, and it's still there. This is very hard to understand, and the lack of comment on it makes that worse.

    I hope Turbine will reconsider and clarify this matter.
    Turbine has clarified the matter. This gets posted about at least once a week, and every single of them gets locked and deleted.

  12. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by jalont View Post
    You're so completely clueless about game design. In the future, you may wish to think before you post. This is very embarrassing for you. The exploit mentioned in the OP is the most detrimental thing currently going on in the game. It gives rule breakers an unfair advantage, and people who wish to follow the rules get screwed. Things like this completely ruin a game.
    Nope. There were/are worse. You just don't know about them.

    Some fact about the twist bug:

    - It's in the game for looooong, long time, more than a year.
    - Fixing would take a couple of hours for 1! developers. Only thing to code, resetting ED points at every TR. Shouldn't be rocket science.
    - Epic Destinies were on sale more than 3 times in this period...

  13. #133
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by McFlay View Post
    Well if it is WAI then that just means you guys would be the trolls in this thread:P
    First off its not WAI. Defining cheezing the game by using abilities that are designed for post level 20 usage in quests well below level 20 as WAI is hilarious.

    Second off, trolling definition has nothing to do with whose right or wrong.
    Last edited by Chai; 09-10-2013 at 10:29 AM.
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  14. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by jalont View Post
    Turbine has clarified the matter. This gets posted about at least once a week, and every single of them gets locked and deleted.
    That's not a clarification. It's the forum equivalent of "no comment".

  15. #135
    Community Member Luxgolg's Avatar
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    Where has a DDO rep ever said ED Twists are not supposed to work at heroic levels?

  16. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    First off its not WAI. Defining cheezing the game by using abilities that are designed for post level 20 usage in quests well below level 20 as WAI is hilarious.

    Second off, trolling definition has nothing to do with whose right or wrong.
    Its no different then getting twink gear on a 20+ before you tr.

  17. #137
    Community Member Kalimah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hendrik View Post
    Can't be done and you know that. Only official statement would be from Turbine and you know they do not discuss exploits.

    So, prove to me that it is not. How can it be WAI that a L1 should be using twists from L20+?

    I don't play with cheaters. I have a fantastic Guild/Friends that don't cheat nor have the need to justify cheating in any way, shape, or form. Our moral compass, even in a video game, points in the right direction. Bonus to being an adult and surrounding yourself with like minded people.
    Yeah man we agree on this...just different sides of what is right/wrong. We as a community are not the game police. IF the game wants to tell us something they have given us is a mistake and we should refrain from using it then I'd be 100% on the side comdemning folks who use this. Since there is no guidance, it is left to our interpretation.

    You do the same as I man, I play with those folks I like...my buds, my guildies. Every now and then I'll join a pug to run something....but its always with an eye toward the weirdo hammer dropping and everthing going sideways.

    My primary point in this discussion is that if you folks have such a red arse over it and the process is ruining their game experience then change who they are gaming with.

    We are all left to make our own determination of if this is acceptable or not. Its pretty poor form to get all riled up because other gamers you meet dont share your opinion on something.

    Not singling anyone one individual out here..just the thought process in general. YOU DO HAVE CONTROL over who you play with or not. IF it matters so much then dont put yourself into position to have your game ruined.

  18. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luxgolg View Post
    Where has a DDO rep ever said ED Twists are not supposed to work at heroic levels?
    First of all, let's be clear here. Twists do not just work in heroic. I don't actually know how to take advantage of this exploit, but simply moving a twist to your hotbar in heroic isn't how you do it, because I've tried. No matter what I do, I can't actually make the twists work. So there's something that has to be done to get this to work. That should be the first clue to all of you.

  19. #139
    Community Member Kalimah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jalont View Post
    Turbine has clarified the matter. This gets posted about at least once a week, and every single of them gets locked and deleted.
    Actually, the threads are being closed because we get personal in our arguments and it becomes a flame fest.

  20. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by McFlay View Post
    Its no different then getting twink gear on a 20+ before you tr.
    yes it is! If you're not finding it to be significantly better you're not cheating hard enough.

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