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  1. #1
    Community Member humbleroller's Avatar
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    Default The Banish spell acting backwards.

    I was running Devils Assault (EN) today on my Palemaster and noticed something very odd.

    Orthons (evil outsider) are immune (not failing, just immune) to banishing. Trogs (reptile scum) are not. Devils also could be banished.

    So am I doing something wrong or is the spell just acting up ?
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  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by humbleroller View Post
    I was running Devils Assault (EN) today on my Palemaster and noticed something very odd.

    Orthons (evil outsider) are immune (not failing, just immune) to banishing. Trogs (reptile scum) are not. Devils also could be banished.

    So am I doing something wrong or is the spell just acting up ?
    None of them should be banishable - I thought all the EOs in Devil Assault had "Mandate of Shavarath" or whatever it was that made them count as non-extra-planar

  3. #3
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    Fairly cetain the mandate shavarath is only on the Shock Trooper types...Othons and Barbazaus, while Barbazau Captains may be subjected to banishing.

  4. #4
    Community Member FlaviusMaximus's Avatar
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    I'm disappointed to learn that "The Banish spell acting backwards" doesn't mean that demons and devils are being teleported into the realm when cast.

  5. #5
    Community Member Soulfurnace's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlaviusMaximus View Post
    I'm disappointed to learn that "The Banish spell acting backwards" doesn't mean that demons and devils are being teleported into the realm when cast.
    I was hoping it worked backwards... by banishing the caster.
    Ah well, another time perhaps. (C'mon Turbine, pleeeease. Make the DC casters suffer, just like you made palemasters die to paladins)

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    None of them should be banishable - I thought all the EOs in Devil Assault had "Mandate of Shavarath" or whatever it was that made them count as non-extra-planar
    The fire elementals have always been banishable iirc.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by humbleroller View Post
    I was running Devils Assault (EN) today on my Palemaster and noticed something very odd.

    Orthons (evil outsider) are immune (not failing, just immune) to banishing. Trogs (reptile scum) are not. Devils also could be banished.

    So am I doing something wrong or is the spell just acting up ?
    Could it be the old Devil Assault monster-type-screw-up bug? All the mobs are considered their equivalents on Heroic Normal for Monster Manual, including viewing their hit points. Maybe also for whether they can be banished?

  8. #8
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    Why is this so hard to understand? When you are in Shavarath, YOU are the outsider! The demons and devils there are on their home plane. When they are outside of Shavarath and you banish them, where do you think they go? Here, I'll help you: THEY. GO. TO. SHAVARATH! Why do you think you need boots of anchoring when running Tower of Despair? Here, I'll help you again: Because you are NOT on YOUR home plane and are therefore BANISHABLE.

    So, of course the fire elementals (and other elementals) you encounter there are banishable! They are NOT on THEIR home plane!

  9. #9
    Community Member BigSlugger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coyopa View Post
    ...When you are in Shavarath, YOU are the outsider!...
    True, but we're not on Shavarath, we're in the marketplace barracks.

  10. #10
    Community Member humbleroller's Avatar
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    it doesnt take place on Shavarath, they are coming thru the portals from there, but thats for taking the time to hold down the shift key.
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  11. #11
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    Oh, sorry. I forgot about that quest as I never do it. Then, yea, they should be banishable.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coyopa View Post
    Why is this so hard to understand? When you are in Shavarath, YOU are the outsider!
    No. You are extraplaner. Outsider is completely different.

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    Quote Originally Posted by oweieie View Post
    No. You are extraplaner. Outsider is completely different.
    Semantics. If you are extraplanar, then you are outsider to that plane and its native inhabitants.

  14. #14
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    As others have said, pull up the monster's info on the targeting reticle. Its likely some have the mandate of shavarath and some don't. Think of it like they have boots of anchoring, and are giving it to their best troops rather than grunts. Or, you can think of it like the giants in Reavers Reach and the Sorjek ward of something or other, a way for devs to inflate difficulty by putting in place a blanket immunity against a common spell/tactic other than beat mob for x amount of time. (Not actually sure if that ward is still there its been a while since I ran it)

    The trogs you see in there are also likely fiendish trogs, so they are from another plane. Just like tieflings they are the fiendish equivalents of monsters from our plane, just from another plane.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigSlugger View Post
    True, but we're not on Shavarath, we're in the marketplace barracks.
    I thought the whole point of that quest was that Shavarath was made coterminous in that room, so it counted as both the Marketplace (Material) and Shavarath, simultaneously

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigSlugger View Post
    True, but we're not on Shavarath, we're in the marketplace barracks.
    That is something they call "artifact code".

    Devil Assault was originally an event quest (like Crystal Cove) that took place when the devils did a weird ritual and opened a huge portal over the marketplace's tent. Because of proximity with such planar energies, the devils around were considered to be on Shavarath, and thus immune to banishment.

    Event was over, people liked it, and devs put DA as a permanent quest. However, the devils in the quest still have the effects of that event and are immune to banishment. Later, when they added Amrath to the game, they reused the code to those devils, and that is why they share the quality "Mandate of Shavarath".
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  17. #17
    Community Member Philibusta's Avatar
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    Would've been downright hilarious if it would've truly acted backwards and banished the caster (in undead form) to Dolurrh.
    All that is wrong with DDO, life, taxes, poltics, religion, music, fast food, education, the criminal justice system, the weather, society, the universe, and previously-discontinued-but-now-on-their-way-back snack cakes, is all the fault of Wizards of the Coast. I know this because Fred told me so, and Mind Flayers are smart.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coyopa View Post
    Semantics. If you are extraplanar, then you are outsider to that plane and its native inhabitants.
    Again, no. It is as much semantics as vacationers and Americans. They mean completely different things. Extraplaner = not on home plane, vacationers. Outsider = someone from a non-prime plane, no American citizenship.

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  19. #19
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    OK. You win. Too bad we can't neg rep anymore.
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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Philibusta View Post
    Would've been downright hilarious if it would've truly acted backwards and banished the caster (in undead form) to Dolurrh.
    I took backwards to mean it was summoning more devils I was so disapointed to see it was that the spell just wasnt effective

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