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  1. #1
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    Default How good is Ten Thousand Stars and/or Monk 6 splash?

    I've never tried this and im wondering what are the chances of it firing additional arrows. I'm thinking about a Monk-Ranger-Cleric build and wondering if 6 monk, 6 ranger, 8 cleric would be better than 2 monk, 6 ranger, 12 cleric.

    The 12 cleric would give BB, Heal, Healing Aura, Divine punishment and Cometfall.
    The 6 monk would give 10k stars and Lvl 6 monk enhancements (that which im not too familiar with.)

    Thanks for reading

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by supott View Post

    The 12 cleric would give BB, Heal, Healing Aura, Divine punishment and Cometfall.


    Thanks for reading
    Apparently it is very good and monkchers are giggling to themselves in happiness

    The problem with only 12 cleric is that the damage form your BB, DP and cometfall will be very low

  3. #3
    Community Member goodspeed's Avatar
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    the chances are very good so long as you stack wis. Every which way the more the better.

    I don't think id go 6 mnk with a cleric though. Clerics are one of the few classes that actually get some benefit out of their class levels still.
    Through avarice, evil smiles; through insanity, it sings.

  4. #4
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    6 Rgr/6 Monk basically gives you "super archer", everything you need for maximal ranged DPS output. The other 8 levels are just there to improve your survivability and utility. Odds are you're going to spend most of your AP in Ranger, Racial, and Monk, so you're not splashing for any specific enhancements.

    8 Cleric gives you a nice suite of support spells like CCW, Death Ward, FoM, status cures, and a couple short-term buffs like Divine Power. It doesn't, however, give you any usable offensive or CC spells, so you'd just be taking Cleric as a toolbox....you'd be a full-time archer who can heal and buff, not a caster/archer hybrid.

    Alternatively, if self-healing isn't really a concern for you, you can go 8 Rogue instead. Sneak die (works well with Sniper Shot and DWS sneak die), trapping, Venomed Blades, and Improved Uncanny Dodge, plus UMD and Wand Mastery for wand/scroll-whip healing.

    The big problem with 6/6/8 archer builds like this is that they're really hard to play up through Heroic...you're waiting for milestones at Rgr 6 (MS) and Monk 6 (10KS), so you're L12 at the earliest before you have your full Archer power, even later if you take some Cleric levels earlier to actually be able to self-heal.
    Last edited by droid327; 09-02-2013 at 11:18 PM.

  5. #5
    Community Member cfelicio's Avatar
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    How about 12 monk / 8 cleric? Would that be better? Improved Evasion, Abundant step, and self-heal? Still an awesome archer or ranger really makes a big difference?

    Could also dump str and go dex / wis / con build... Although some would say overwhelming crit is essential...

  6. #6
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    40 Wisdom is the cut off point for when you start having a chance to fire 4 arrows on some shots.
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  7. #7
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    If you have access to the Morninglord Iconic, it would not be a bad choice to try in order to test run the build. You would have 56AP I think.
    Put 14AP or so points in Morninglord racial to access AA tree
    32AP in AA for Slaying
    You would absolutely need to put 6 AP into Ninja to get the T2 Ninja Core which gives DEX damage to bows.
    Using 2 Fighter levels instead of Ranger would give you basically the Ranged toolset with Cleric 7
    Again this would be a test build just to see if you like the playstyle so obviously no tomes included.

    Code:
    Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.16.01
    DDO Character Planner Home Page
    
    Level 15 Lawful Good Elf Male
    (2 Fighter \ 6 Monk \ 7 Cleric) 
    Hit Points: 176
    Spell Points: 359 
    BAB: 11\11\16\21
    Fortitude: 14
    Reflex: 11
    Will: 14
    
                      Starting          Feat/Enhancement
    Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
    (32 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 15)
    Strength              8                     8
    Dexterity            17                    19
    Constitution         12                    12
    Intelligence         10                    10
    Wisdom               18                    19
    Charisma              8                     8
    
                       Ending           
                     Base Skills        
    Skills           (Level 15)         
    Balance               9             
    Bluff                -1             
    Concentration        18             
    Diplomacy            -1             
    Disable Device       n/a            
    Haggle               -1             
    Heal                 21             
    Hide                  4             
    Intimidate           -1             
    Jump                 -1             
    Listen                4             
    Move Silently         4             
    Open Lock            n/a            
    Perform             n/a             
    Repair                0             
    Search                0             
    Spot                  4             
    Swim                 -1             
    Tumble                5             
    Use Magic Device    n/a             
    
    Level 1 (Cleric)
    Feat: (Selected) Empower Healing Spell
    
    
    Level 2 (Monk)
    Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness
    
    
    Level 3 (Monk)
    Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot
    Feat: (Monk Bonus) Zen Archery
    
    
    Level 4 (Monk)
    Ability Raise: DEX
    Feat: (Monk Path) Path of Harmonious Balance: Fists of Light
    
    
    Level 5 (Monk)
    
    
    Level 6 (Monk)
    Feat: (Selected) Rapid Shot
    
    
    Level 7 (Monk)
    Feat: (Monk Bonus) Ten Thousand Stars
    
    
    Level 8 (Cleric)
    Ability Raise: WIS
    
    
    Level 9 (Cleric)
    Feat: (Selected) Manyshot
    
    
    Level 10 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Precise Shot
    
    
    Level 11 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Ranged Weapons
    
    
    Level 12 (Cleric)
    Ability Raise: DEX
    
    
    Level 13 (Cleric)
    
    
    Level 14 (Cleric)
    
    
    Level 15 (Cleric)
    Feat: (Selected) Improved Precise Shot

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by cfelicio View Post
    Still an awesome archer or ranger really makes a big difference?
    Without Rgr you don't have access to DWS tree. So you give up +75 Positive SP, Sniper Shot, Thrill of the Hunt, Killer, and Merciful Shot, plus 3 sneak die. IMO that's really limiting your ranged toolset, and also restricting you to bluebar-only attacks. Really, in AA, I would just go far enough for Inferno 3/3, Soul Bow, and Force imbue 3/3, plus the Core imbues; I think DWS offers way more for archers.

    You'd JUST be able to fill out the feats you need with 12 monk/8 cleric....PBS, IC:R, PS, IPS, MS, RS, Zen Archery, 10KS, and then Emp Heal is pretty much a must too, and Precision should really be in there. Monk bonus feats can get you Precision and Zen Archery and 10KS, and there's 7 left after that. I'm assuming you wont need to actually spend feats on Monk stances, I know that was changed in the EP but I don't have a Monk.

    Overall, I'm not sure if Improved Evasion and Abundant Step alone are worth giving up DWS.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    Without Rgr you don't have access to DWS tree. So you give up +75 Positive SP, Sniper Shot, Thrill of the Hunt, Killer, and Merciful Shot, plus 3 sneak die. IMO that's really limiting your ranged toolset, and also restricting you to bluebar-only attacks. Really, in AA, I would just go far enough for Inferno 3/3, Soul Bow, and Force imbue 3/3, plus the Core imbues; I think DWS offers way more for archers.
    In terms of the DWS tree, I strongly feel that a lot of the higher up abilities are far from worth it on a monkcher.
    Maxed Thrill of the Hunt averages out to +1 damage on a boss mob for a 6AP expenditure.
    Killer requires investment in Favored Accuracy and Favored Damage.. Even on a Ranger heavy Monkcher build of 14 Ranger/6 monk, you are only talking about 3 FEs.
    And then there is Killer which grants doubleshot which is virtually worthless on a monkcher because all my testing has shown the tooltips for Manyshot and 10KStars are true.
    As for Hunter's Mercy, I have no experience with it since I am unwilling to make the prerequisite AP expenditures to get it. Can that 500 damage be manyshotted for 2000? Is it subject to crit multipliers? I cannot say.
    Sniper Shot, the Positive spell power, the Damage Boost are all worthwhile investments but not getting Slaying Arrows is only good advice if you are in a destiny other than FotW.
    Because if you are in FotW, Slayer arrows can easily net you 40K damage in 41secs on non-crit immune mobs and that is on a DEX based Monkcher without overwhelming Critical.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alfhild View Post
    Can that 500 damage be manyshotted for 2000? Is it subject to crit multipliers? I cannot say.
    Manyshotted yes, critted no. I think it will be multiplied by Adrenaline, too. It only works under 20%, unlike Slayer Arrows, but its also free and faster. Slayer is the best companion to Adrenaline, that's unarguable...but that's one attack every 25 seconds. Since MS+10KS puts out so many multiplied attacks, its better served by having a sustainable rotation of special attacks that can be multiplied, IMO.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    Manyshotted yes, critted no. I think it will be multiplied by Adrenaline, too. It only works under 20%, unlike Slayer Arrows, but its also free and faster. Slayer is the best companion to Adrenaline, that's unarguable...but that's one attack every 25 seconds. Since MS+10KS puts out so many multiplied attacks, its better served by having a sustainable rotation of special attacks that can be multiplied, IMO.
    It is a 20sec CD for Slayer; 15sec CD for Mercy.
    I agree that MS/10K is better served with a solid rotation.
    11 pts can get you DWS's Sniper on a 6sec CD
    Going 32 pts in AA can get you Slayer and say you take 2 out of 3 of Dispel/Shatter/Inferno.
    Dispel and Shatter are both +3[w] and Inferno is +2[W] but with the flame damage which seems to stack with Improved Fire.
    Regardless as to which of the three is best, they all have a 3sec CD.
    I am currently running Sniper, Dispel and Shatter with Slayer.
    Hit your Slayer boosts and then Slayer and then cycle through a "Sniper, Dispel, Shatter, Dispel, Shatter" and repeat until Slayer comes up again.
    It is not the tightest rotation but does allow leeway for other clicks.
    With Soul Magic (and no Moonbow) and 600 Spell Points I have never ran out of spell points on any boss fight with that rotation and the use of Rejuv Cocoon. Hunter's Mercy just seems to situational for me since it can only be used in a rotation 1/5th of the time.

  12. #12
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    12monk/6ranger/2pal, my experience with this build is awesome.
    IGN Manasdirge; guild:excalibur

  13. #13
    Community Member darthhento's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manasdirge View Post
    12monk/6ranger/2pal, my experience with this build is awesome.
    I am very fond of this cleric build also.
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  14. #14
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    thanks all for the replies,

    Alot of nice and helpful input to digest.

    Heres something im thinking. I have posted a thread before on the build idea which will use BB's for kiting and mixing it with archery. Lvl 12 Cleric would give me Lvl 12 BB's, just 3 levels from the max of 15. If those BB's can get 250 damage then that seems worthwhile in addition to the archery. Since a lot of kiting is involved anyway, the two should work well together.

    Enhancements will be tight if I go Elf for the Slaying arrows, but only that will allow me to get Monk6 and Cleric12.
    It will give me 1-2 free feats which could get me stunning fist and g.twf/quicken. A little bit of melee when manyshot/10k stars are on cooldown should be useful especially with a max wisdom for stunning fist.

    The reason I go Cleric instead of Paladin/other classes is for the more reliable healing. Scroll healing would take a lot more time to switch to and switch back. Thats my main concert with Monkchers with 12Monk with only Cure light wounds. Cleric will give me Heal, along with Aura. Max/Empowered Divine Punishment too alongside BB for offense.

    12 cleric, 6 monk, 2 ranger (ELF for AA lvl 5 enhancements)

    1. pbs
    2. ps
    3. ips
    4. manyshot
    5. empower healing
    6. maximize
    7. empower

    8. ic ranged (If get pinion, can switch to g.twf or quicken)
    9. free (stunning fist)

    monk 1. 10kstars
    monk 2. zen archery
    Last edited by supott; 09-03-2013 at 05:48 AM.

  15. #15
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    6 monk 6 ranger 8 wizard

    tenser's transformation
    displacement 50%+ shadow veil 25% + dodge 15%-25% = 65%? of the hits miss
    vampire form for sustained selfheal
    and some other goodies, dimension door, fire shield, enervation, immunity to negative levels
    Last edited by garlor; 09-03-2013 at 07:28 AM.

  16. #16
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    My lvl 28 FVS gets 550 on a normal BB, 1100 on a crit, 260 on a save
    *with max + empower running
    *3 sorc PLs
    *using lvl 28 +4 evoc + crit % + impulse 138 sticks
    *running at 58 wisdom

    So are you going to get half of that at lvl 12 while holding a bow? And remember that mobs are likely to save a lot and I would guess not crit much given your likely gear setup

    You will be fine on EN but higher than that I do not think you will find it a good return. If you go ranger I would try work in a boulder toss twist if you can - big damage every 20 secs

  17. #17
    Community Member TheLegendOfAra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by garlor View Post
    6 monk 6 ranger 8 wizard
    vampire form for sustained selfheal
    Speaking as someone who has made 2 melee wizards, and 1 AA wizard, all of which used Vampire form at some point I can say this is the single worst idea anyone has ever had.(No offense meant of course, I had the same idea. 3 times. It sucked each time.)

    4x light damage is just too much, especially considering all of the caster mobs that just love to spam Searing Light and Divine Punishment. Honestly there's nothing quite like losing all your SP in the very first minute of EE Impossible Demands because the Priestess loves to triple stack DP on you while you're in Vamp form.

    Besides with that class split you'd hardly have enough SP to go around. With short buff durations from both Wizard and Ranger, and self heals through Death Aura, and then the SP draining AA abilities. Your pot usage would be off the charts, or you'd waste so much money UMDing arcane scrolls to save SP for heals you'd be better off just going with a higher DPS class split and UMDing the buffs that way anyways.

    As a purely ranged character focused purely on DPS your best options are probably going to be either 11Ranger/6Monk/3Arti, 12Monk/6Ranger/2Fighter, or 12Fighter/6Monk/2Ranger. Personally I'd go with the ranger split for a more versatile build platform, but to each their own.

    Speaking of which, anyone though of a rehash of the Helves Angel now that 8 Fighter lets you be centered with any weapon?
    Manyshot
    10K Stars
    Dual Khopesh
    Master Earth/Air Stance
    You'd end up with 40-44 Wis, and 50+ str.
    Seems like it would be an absolute beast of a build now, more so than ever before.
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by goldgolem View Post
    My lvl 28 FVS gets 550 on a normal BB, 1100 on a crit, 260 on a save
    *with max + empower running
    *3 sorc PLs
    *using lvl 28 +4 evoc + crit % + impulse 138 sticks
    *running at 58 wisdom

    So are you going to get half of that at lvl 12 while holding a bow? And remember that mobs are likely to save a lot and I would guess not crit much given your likely gear setup

    You will be fine on EN but higher than that I do not think you will find it a good return. If you go ranger I would try work in a boulder toss twist if you can - big damage every 20 secs
    the character can switch to 138 impulse and +4 evoc + crit gear when casting BB.
    BB lasts a long time so i dont see it as a hassle. With divine punishment, can use Radiance items which are more common not needing to hold..
    550 is a good number. 12 cleric i suppose could give 440 +/- following that.

    Thanks
    Last edited by supott; 09-03-2013 at 08:09 AM.

  19. #19
    The Hatchery Wipey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by goldgolem View Post
    So are you going to get half of that at lvl 12 while holding a bow?
    BB caps at lvl 15 so 12 caster levels would be not much lower.
    Just some numbers perspective, adrenalined arrow was 2.5k+ on every arrow before u 19, manyshot was easily 60k in 20 seconds.
    These days adrenalined slayer ( or blitzing ) numbers are just off the charts while BB is still impractical and slow to use.
    Killing power of BB kiting is not even close to archery with ips and blitz/unbridled . It still has fantastic tactical uses of course.
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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by supott View Post
    the character can switch to 138 impulse and +4 evoc + crit gear when casting BB.
    BB lasts a long time so i dont see it as a hassle. With divine punishment, can use Radiance items which are more common not needing to hold..
    550 is a good number. 12 cleric i suppose could give 440 +/- following that.

    Thanks
    There is a good helm from stormhorns (sages skullcap) at 27 with radiance 132, radiance lore 19%, yellow slot and 110% fort that might help there

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