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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gempoult View Post
    i have the feeling i might have contributed to that boredom and frustration, sorry, yes, my caster has 90% of the kills in eh and old ee content (like the chrono which i believe you are talking about), doesn't change the fact it is completely useless in new(er) ee
    Not sure who this is, but regardless please don't take it personally. It wasn't any one quest or event, just an overall realization that having to beat down even yellow-named mobs for a long time while mashing buttons was simply not fun.

    I still enjoyed the new content and look forward to trying it again when I level back up.

  2. #62
    Community Member djl's Avatar
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    DC casting requires debuffing mobs to be effective. Use all your tools before you complain about something not working-- I run around with a 57 DC on my Evoker Sorc and I can handle myself just fine in EE, even the new quests. Throw up Solid Fog and use Waves of Exhaustion followed by Electric Loop on a group of mobs before nuking them with DBF or Energy Burst. With the exception of a few particular mobs with exceptionally high saves, I rarely ever see saves/evasion.

    On a PM, utilize enervation/energy drain. Utilize the Magister ability that lowers saves 15% of the time (I twist this for evo on my sorc). SR is not nearly as big a problem in the new content as it was in MOTU, so you can still be very effective on a PM.

  3. #63
    Community Member redoubt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Koshei View Post
    And that is why after dozens of lives on my two main characters - one sorc, one wizard I stopped.
    NOTHING you do will make you as effective as a first life war forged shiradi in epic elite. Worse, nothing you do will make you of any use at all, no items, no past lives. Having multiple caster past lives is pointless, what good is +9 spell pen when the only spells you actually cast have "magic" and "missile" in their name.

    No hearts, no xp pots, no boxes. Past lives are useless for casters, so might as well save money and more importantly time. I suppose that it also explains why I don't play this game much anymore.
    I too have stopped playing my wizard for this reason.
    /sigh

  4. #64
    Community Member redoubt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    i don't think you can hit that, but you can break 60.
    if I am inferring correctly, necro DCs can get to 66+ but enchant can only just break 60. Is this correct?

    Second question: has the idea of specifically boosting enchantment school spells been discussed? i.e. spell focus enchant being worth 2 points of DC instead of 1? (or something along those lines.) Its seems that many people feel instakill is no fun and not a team sport, but that enchantment casters are okay in team sports?
    /sigh

  5. #65
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by redoubt View Post
    if I am inferring correctly, necro DCs can get to 66+ but enchant can only just break 60. Is this correct?
    i THINK so, I 'm not sure and can't calc it on the new system off of memory.

  6. #66
    Community Member maddmatt70's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TimethiefXVI View Post
    First of all, im sr i cant answer all points setup so far due to limited time.
    2 things i want to stress out:
    1) my necro DC is at 66 right now, with Yugo pot running, possible raise options are listed.
    2) I dont want a cakewalk EE, I want a reason NOT to choose schiradi and be usefull

    There are different ways of teamwork aviable. Some tactics can include someone draging the party till the boss fight, some require the sam etoon to hold back to take care of the trash during the boss fight, some may require a high focus on melee and buffing them, some focus on strong casting. However you decide how you want to play, these are given options and all should be viable.

    Am i more powerfull on lower difficulties? most likely. am i overall more powerfull than a shiradi, hard to tell, as my spells have significant higher sp cost, and timer combined with lesser dmg. The shiradi therefore clearl has the advantage against mobs with dw, db, red and purple namend. I would vote both styles get the job done pretty well.

    But pls consider, i am not talking about anything less than EE.
    The dcs compared on EH to EE are pretty off scale. This is my concern right now. Not only that I have major problems, but i again want to clearify, if a toon like mine has such troubles, what about those with less gear/pls.
    Sorry but i do not agree with anything you really say OP. In whelon a very high fort dc wizard can land things a ton. On my pure rogue with a 56 dc assasinate I am landing assasinate 50% or so on melee mobs and close to 100% on caster mobs. A caster with a dc fort insta kill in the low to mid 60s is going to absolutely trounce the mobs in that content. I see casters finger the assasins in whelon a lot which is a great tactic because they can mess up melee.

    In Stormhorns the devs put in Giants and Orcs and they have higher fortitude saves which means a wizard and a party has to have different tactics for those sorts of mobs which I think is great. You the OP sounds like you want this game to be a boring insta kill game where only one tactic is supereme - instakilling.

    You might have to change your build from the one trick insta kill boring *** pony that you have it now and fit in enchantment feats oh and debuffs are a good idea. Crushing despair, energy drain, etc..
    Norg Fighter12/Paladin6/Monk2, Jacquiej Cleric18/Monk1/Wiz1, Rabiez Bard16/Ranger3/Cleric1, Hangover Bard L20, Boomsticks Fighter12/Monk 6/Druid 2, Grumblegut Ranger8/Paladin6/Monk6, Rabidly Rogue L20, Furiously Rogue10/Monk6/Paladin4, Snowcones Cleric 12/Ranger 6/Monk 2, Norge Barbarian 12/FVS4/Rogue4. Guild:Prophets of The New Republic Khyber.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by djl View Post
    DC casting requires debuffing mobs to be effective. Use all your tools before you complain about something not working--
    On a PM, utilize enervation/energy drain. Utilize the Magister ability that lowers saves 15% of the time (I twist this for evo on my sorc). SR is not nearly as big a problem in the new content as it was in MOTU, so you can still be very effective on a PM.
    And burn through how many pots? Wizzy's can get a respectable Spell Point Pool, but if you're having to debuff everything before you can cast the finisher you're going to run out rather quickly.

  8. #68
    Community Member redoubt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    I did all the new EE quests within the first two days and the only one that gave me an issue was WGU the first time on EE because of the end-fight mechanics and my general cluelessness.
    What build were you running?

    Did you drink any sp potions? If yes, how many.

    I am trying to decide if I will ever play my enchantment spec'd wiz again, but I stopped playing him at the beginning of the summer so I don't know what the new stuff is like on a caster. Some data on how people are completing epic elite might help me with that process.

    thanks.
    /sigh

  9. #69
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Archangel_666 View Post
    And burn through how many pots? Wizzy's can get a respectable Spell Point Pool, but if you're having to debuff everything before you can cast the finisher you're going to run out rather quickly.
    You might burn through all your SP if you're trying to solo EE... but you don't have to kill everything if you're in a group...

    SP management is part of playing a caster. Besides, there's a ton of shrines...

    Get some debuffs via your SLAs... Much cheaper. Hypnotism gives you an AOE +3 to enchantment, isn't Energy Drain or Enervation a SLA if you go Necro path in ArchMage too?

    Wizards have a ton of spell slots that you can change easily. Use some of them instead of just hitting Wail and FoD and getting mad if you don't get a 95% success rate.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gary_Gygax
    No single character has all the skills and resources needed to guarantee success in all endeavors; favorable results can usually only be achieved through group effort. No single player character wins, in the sense that he or she defeats all other player characters; the goal of the forces of good can only be attained through cooperation, so that victory is a group achievement rather than an individual one.

  10. #70
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by redoubt View Post
    What build were you running?

    Did you drink any sp potions? If yes, how many.

    I am trying to decide if I will ever play my enchantment spec'd wiz again, but I stopped playing him at the beginning of the summer so I don't know what the new stuff is like on a caster. Some data on how people are completing epic elite might help me with that process.

    thanks.
    I would suggest you play your wizard yourself instead of reading anything on these boards... 90% of the people who post here exaggerate wildly when they complain.

    (I include myself in that 90% since it may be more like 60%, but I had to exaggerate wildly to make my point).

    Seriously though, go TRY it yourself.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gary_Gygax
    No single character has all the skills and resources needed to guarantee success in all endeavors; favorable results can usually only be achieved through group effort. No single player character wins, in the sense that he or she defeats all other player characters; the goal of the forces of good can only be attained through cooperation, so that victory is a group achievement rather than an individual one.

  11. #71
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by redoubt View Post
    What build were you running?
    Pure human 20 Wizard PM. A bunch of Wizard PLs, +5 INT tome, etc . . . Necro focused AM/PM with the new Enh system. Draconic because I only need magister for max spell-pen and stuff still needs to be nuked.

    Quote Originally Posted by redoubt View Post
    Did you drink any sp potions? If yes, how many.
    0-2 a quest for the first run through as we were learning them on EE. Exception was WGU EE, the first two runs of that were pot-swilling bloodbaths until we removed out heads from our rectums and stopped trying to brute-force what needed to be finnessed.

    Quote Originally Posted by redoubt View Post
    I am trying to decide if I will ever play my enchantment spec'd wiz again, but I stopped playing him at the beginning of the summer so I don't know what the new stuff is like on a caster. Some data on how people are completing epic elite might help me with that process.

    thanks.
    I might be switching my focus to enchant, I'll make that call after I get her to cap. I rarely solo so I'm looking for whatever gets the fastest/smoothest completions in groups.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Spirit View Post
    So your solution for the borked Shiradi ED is to enable another caster type the same overpowered ability to trivialise EE content and make other teammembers obsolete?
    Shouldn't the solution to overpowered first life Shiradis be something that involves Shiradis? And not making another Class/ED combination as overpowered?
    Are shiradi's more powerful than masters blitzers? More powerful than fury manyshot?

    With +5 tomes and weapons hitting for thousands of hit points, the impact of TRing is diminishing over time. DC casting is one of the few places where it makes a difference.... but not enough of a difference to matter. I like having first life toons being viable, that is good for the game. TR should however provide a meaningful benefit.

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by SirValentine View Post
    You didn't test enough. "Spell Focus" (new name for old "Spell Focus Mastery) items, all of them, not just Tablecloth, stack just fine with school-specific DC boosts of any school, not just Necro. Considering the name change and description change, I'm assuming this change is WAI, unless a dev clearly states otherwise.
    Did even more testing and it seems that nether orbs (various spell schools) stack with the spell focus of the tablecloth with the exception of the enchant one, other items do not stack (don't have all schools yet so haven't tested all)

    edit: so far transmutation, necro, conjuration and evocation nether orbs stack, enchant orb doesn't. enchant (+5) scepter and sage boots (conjuration focus +5) do not stack.
    Last edited by Gempoult; 08-30-2013 at 12:18 PM.

  14. #74
    Community Member maddmatt70's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gempoult View Post
    Did even more testing and it seems that nether orbs (various spell schools) stack with the spell focus of the tablecloth with the exception of the enchant one, other items do not stack (don't have all schools yet so haven't tested all)
    Yeah the nether orbs are bugged and will be fixed in the future almost certainly - of course the future could be a very long time knowing Turbine.
    Norg Fighter12/Paladin6/Monk2, Jacquiej Cleric18/Monk1/Wiz1, Rabiez Bard16/Ranger3/Cleric1, Hangover Bard L20, Boomsticks Fighter12/Monk 6/Druid 2, Grumblegut Ranger8/Paladin6/Monk6, Rabidly Rogue L20, Furiously Rogue10/Monk6/Paladin4, Snowcones Cleric 12/Ranger 6/Monk 2, Norge Barbarian 12/FVS4/Rogue4. Guild:Prophets of The New Republic Khyber.

  15. #75
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    This has come up so many times, and the answer is two fold, one problem with design, and one problem with lazy players:

    1. Every mob should have a weak save, a mid save, and a high save. For EE something like 30/50/60 (so 49/69/79 for 95% success). In most of the game this is basically true, but EGH was a problem, so far Wheloon and stormhorns appear to return to this sytem. I can quake darn near anything in stormhorns, but not wheloon, and the other way around for my bard's disco.

    2. Debuffing is your friend. There's way to much whining about having to debuff. There's more ways to do it than energy drain. learning a few debuff tricks will make up for half a dozen past lives.

    For my Spell DC toons:
    Druid: mantle of the icy soul (-4 reflex, -4 fort, slow) + solid fog clicky (-5 reflex) +quake
    Bard: Crushing despair (-5 no save) + mid fog (-10/w save so an effective "save twice") + disco (maybe hypnotism also)

    Works like a charm.
    Gildus, Sabathiel, Einion, Yhvain

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  16. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thrudh View Post
    You might burn through all your SP if you're trying to solo EE... but you don't have to kill everything if you're in a group...

    SP management is part of playing a caster. Besides, there's a ton of shrines...

    Get some debuffs via your SLAs... Much cheaper. Hypnotism gives you an AOE +3 to enchantment, isn't Energy Drain or Enervation a SLA if you go Necro path in ArchMage too?

    Wizards have a ton of spell slots that you can change easily. Use some of them instead of just hitting Wail and FoD and getting mad if you don't get a 95% success rate.
    If you read my original post again, i am not relying on a one trick pony here, although my feats may suggest otherwise. I am fully aware that instakilling a barbarian like class should be harder than a caster class. on the other hand the barbarian class should be more vulnable to hold monster mass compared to wizards/divine with high will saves. but even here i have trouble landing the spells. my web is mainly ignored (even though i get 3 bonus from my clr pls) the same goes for my mass holds. if i can make one or 2 out of 10 stand its a lot, and they break quite fast free, leaving the effect of the cast as a mainly waste of SP.
    My beef here is NOT that my fod isnt landing good enough and i want to be able to instakill everything on sight, I try to point out that besides to heavy debuffing the vast majority of the dc spells arent working.

    About the debuffing and nuking, this might work for sorcerers, but then again, they have higher dmg on the spells and faster casting time. in the time you hit them with 2 dbf, i might only land 1 which has less power.
    Thelanis: Errtu-1, Cherubael, Nararian, Seyria, Yarrrkk, Apothecarius, Tarcus-1, Kheradruakh, Evesor, Experimentum

  17. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by SerPounce View Post
    This has come up so many times, and the answer is two fold, one problem with design, and one problem with lazy players:

    1. Every mob should have a weak save, a mid save, and a high save. For EE something like 30/50/60 (so 49/69/79 for 95% success). In most of the game this is basically true, but EGH was a problem, so far Wheloon and stormhorns appear to return to this sytem. I can quake darn near anything in stormhorns, but not wheloon, and the other way around for my bard's disco.

    2. Debuffing is your friend. There's way to much whining about having to debuff. There's more ways to do it than energy drain. learning a few debuff tricks will make up for half a dozen past lives.

    For my Spell DC toons:
    Druid: mantle of the icy soul (-4 reflex, -4 fort, slow) + solid fog clicky (-5 reflex) +quake
    Bard: Crushing despair (-5 no save) + mid fog (-10/w save so an effective "save twice") + disco (maybe hypnotism also)

    Works like a charm.
    and in the meantime i trade out fw/icestorm to do so and am left with even less appealing options for red/purple
    Thelanis: Errtu-1, Cherubael, Nararian, Seyria, Yarrrkk, Apothecarius, Tarcus-1, Kheradruakh, Evesor, Experimentum

  18. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by maddmatt70 View Post
    Yeah the nether orbs are bugged and will be fixed in the future almost certainly - of course the future could be a very long time knowing Turbine.
    Appears so, but that will bring down the DCs by 2 when they fix and make the problem bigger.

  19. #79
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Just want to clarify my earlier posts, we did those on ee as a first time, I was on a druid and a guildy was on a first life wiz. My druid was very well geared and his wiz was moderately geared. We drank 0-2 on most quests. The two bad ones where we drank more were wgu, and breaking the ranks but that was because it was the first time in and we were brute forcing rather than playing smart with a plan. Playing with a plan even those would be down to 0-2 and the others probably definately 0.

  20. #80
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    Some things:

    1.) What is really being asked, though it's not being spelled out completely, is for people to have God status on all DDO content.

    2.) I absolutely refuse to believe that people allowed to be a God in all content is a good thing for the game. Turbine has created a system where these people can play quests in this manner. It's call EN and EH. This also leaves a challenge for those in the form of EE.

    3.) The quest list where a high-dc caster can't be a god, even on EE, is very very small. And the new quests already step away from this.

    4.) I do not believe that TRing and past lives are supposed to make a character a God. I think the system was designed for people smart enough to realize the ridiculousness of the idea of endgame in an MMO that isn't pvp-centric. The idea that past lives should make you uber-powerful is a completely player created idea, so complaining that this idea doesn't work is a little strange. You're the only one saying that's how it works. Clearly it doesn't.

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