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  1. #81
    Community Member enochiancub's Avatar
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    Regardless of how you feel about the topic, fighting as you are is absolutely ridiculous and unbecoming of two grown people.

    Reel it back a bit.

    Main: 18 Artificer, Thelanis

  2. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by bartharok View Post
    He got exactly what he paid for. Now he wants something he hasnt paid for. Thats something for nothing in my book. Just because he doesnt like actually playing the game as it has been made doesnt entitle him to get it..
    God, you're waste of your own air. Really? It went this deep for you?

    Quote Originally Posted by bartharok View Post
    I believe a person should be taught not to whine about how he cant get everything he wants is good practice. Unfortunately peole nowadays seem to think the fact that they exist entitles them to anything they wish. I find this disgusting.
    Sad, that you believe in staying shut. I believe a person should speak up about what they find wrong or unfair, or what they dislike. It's called standing up for what you like. But, Que more generalizations that have no place here, please.

    Quote Originally Posted by bartharok View Post

    Oh, i know that people have the right to be of whatever opinion they wish, but freedom of opinion without being responsible for their opinions is not freedom at all. Its just tyranny of the many (and many tyrannies of one). If he wisg´hes to lay out a plan that people dislike (and any plan will be disliked by some), he can do so. But he will have to face the opinions of others, sometimes nasty ones. If he is protected from these opinions, he will not learn anything.

    I know that learning nothing is the utopia of many, but as my sig says: Dystopia is utopia achieved.

    Since people wish for utopia they will strive for it, and notice what they have paid for it and lost on the way only when it has been achieved. And that is everything. For safety, freedom, for freedom, justice, for justice, innocence, for innocence, reason. for reason humanity, and so forth.

    So do not tell me about my evils, i know myself, and judge myself accordingly. And judge others by the same standard.
    ^ More self righteous, self serving drivel that is solely written for the purpose to be admired by the writer himself.

  3. #83
    Community Member bartharok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rubbinns View Post
    God, you're waste of your own air. Really? It went this deep for you?

    Sad, that you believe in staying shut. I believe a person should speak up about what they find wrong or unfair, or what they dislike. It's called standing up for what you like. But, Que more generalizations that have no place here, please.



    ^ More self righteous, self serving drivel that is solely written for the purpose to be admired by the writer himself.
    Im standing up against you, see. If you have a problem with that, youre being rather hypocritical.

    Lets just end this and let the thread get buried, ok?

    If you wish to rage, go ahead, but it wont help anybody.
    Dystopia = utopia achieved

  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rubbinns View Post
    Sad, that you believe in staying shut. I believe a person should speak up about what they find wrong or unfair, or what they dislike. It's called standing up for what you like. But, Que more generalizations that have no place here, please.
    I don't get it. If you feel the game is wrong or unfair to you, why do you choose to play in the first place?
    It's neither wrong, nor unfair, it's just the product they are offering you. Take it or leave it. It's quite simple really. Don't like what they are offering, walk away.

  5. #85

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    Quote Originally Posted by SSFWEl View Post
    Summary of this post:
    I'm a proud member of the MeNow Generation.
    Now that's a good summary!

    Teleports I always thought should be better coded into the game. Personally I would have loved if we could have customized a definitive number of spots we could teleport from/to, and move them at will. However they didnt go this route. No bigs.

    They added areas, and added free and paid alternatives to get there. Do you jump in a cab and ask for free transport to the stadium so you can watch a game? No. Turbine has a right to charge for a quality of life enhancement to the game. Hey, I'll just tell you what the cabbie would have told you if you asked for a free ride... WALK!

    Moar wild areas, moar quests, please. I'll get there.
    Last edited by LeslieWest_GuitarGod; 08-26-2013 at 06:42 PM.


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  6. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gremmlynn View Post
    I don't get it. If you feel the game is wrong or unfair to you, why do you choose to play in the first place?
    It's neither wrong, nor unfair, it's just the product they are offering you. Take it or leave it. It's quite simple really. Don't like what they are offering, walk away.
    I like playing the game. Being charged for teleport to quest seems unfair to me. Not the entire game, not everything in its entirety comes down to players being charged for teleports. I love many thngs about this game, this one thing in particular irritates me more so than any thing else currently.

    A product can be as wrong or unfair. It is not to you, but I view it as such. It is not as simple as take or leave it. Have you never complained about any thing Turbine does? Really.

  7. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rubbinns View Post
    A product can be as wrong or unfair. It is not to you, but I view it as such. It is not as simple as take or leave it. Have you never complained about any thing Turbine does? Really.
    No, a product is a product. You either decide it's what you want or close enough to what you want and buy it, or you simply don't.

    Free teleports or the sort you want simply aren't part of the deal Turbine is offering. That's neither right nor wrong, fair nor unfair. Simply what they are offering. We in no way have any right to demand they offer us exactly what we want. Just a right walk away from offers we don't like. Making us completely happy isn't their goal. Making us only as happy as they have to for us to buy their product is. Any happier just means they could have gotten more out of us.

    Saying I don't like having to pay for a teleport, but did anyway, just means they got it right. People either leaving the game over it, or being happy about using it means they messed up by charging to much or to little for the option.

  8. #88
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeslieWest_GuitarGod View Post
    Now that's a good summary!

    Moar wild areas, moar quests, please. I'll get there.
    I for one want more quests and if they have explorer areas fine. What i don't like is huge explorers that force me to play in them for poor xp, poor loot, and don't even offer a challenge other than not falling asleep at the keyboard. You have to either p2w, (before anyone gets started, not having to do content that has struck out on loot, xp, and challenge is a win) or play in content that offers nothing for you to find the camps before you can run the quests.

    Besides this large explorers offer other downsides. People that want to play the quests and not lead others to get the camps then play the quests don't throw up pugs. I know I sure don't. Besides the guild channel effect that has been happening to pugs lately, you now have added large explorers that people won't pug because of how leading others will result in a bad experience. If for some reason they do get pugged, I and many others will toss up lfms as "byoh, know your way, ip" because of the explorers if for no other reason.

    There are many well done explorers, vale of twilight, and orchard come to mind. They offer some loot in the form of taps, and gs base ings, as well as quests that can be gotten to in minutes from the central hub of meridia without first spending time getting camps which creates a sort of mini flagging for the area.

    To make things worse their solution of adding as teleports makes them look like they're doing a money grab similar to how pwe does things in their games, which makes someone looking into this game think it's going to be a horrible idea.

    So some don't like them
    They hurt pugging
    The teleport system creates negative pr

    Why are you guys defending the system and not pushing for it to be more of an optional similar to vale or orchard? Oh yeah because for all of the just play the way you want to play comments you indulge in you secretly mean "you must play the way I like or gtfo"

  9. #89
    Community Member Postumus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rubbinns View Post
    Being charged for teleport to quest seems unfair to me.
    Hey, that NPC is risking his life to get you there safely, and you want to stiff the poor guy? Even Snake Plisskin had to make deals to get a guide to take him to the end boss. And believe me, you are no Snake.


  10. #90
    Community Member Vint's Avatar
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    I just hope you whales keep paying. I’d wager that we are seeing these (teleport cost things) because so many people have gotten upset about all the “schemes” that Turbine has implemented and have quit spending or have just quit al together. You apologists keep spending. I am sure Turibne will implement even crazier ideas as more and more people quit spending. You just keep the game going for me and keep spending.

    I just had a little chuckle. If we logged on after U20 and see that we have to pay 3 AS to enter the marketplace, would you people still claim that it was a great move by Turbine? Honestly I could care less as I make 200-500 AS on the ah. A cash grab like this does not bring people into the game, it causes them to walk away.
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  11. #91
    Community Member arkonas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SSFWEl View Post
    Summary of this post:
    Let us teleport for free to every new quest entrance.

    I have already complained about the huge and deceptive maps, but now I am truly upset and angry and, and, and AAAAAHHRG ^%*$.

    Last night we were doing some EE Wheelon and, as we all know, the map is designed as a bait and switch. Bait you to come pay for (which is fine - I love this game and gladly paid for it) and play new content and then, (the fraud part), make such a nudging and horrible and painful map, they you pay MORE to get to the quest.

    Yes, I don't HAVE to pay.
    Yes, I can run to the quest.

    BUT NOT WHEN ITS SO LAGGY THAT YOU DIE GETTING THERE. THREE TIMES. 3 different instances. As I was in a good group of players I like playing with, and I wanted to play, I ended up paying to play for something I ALREADY PAID FOR. in REAL MONEY.

    And even when not lagging, it takes so much time to get to the quest, so many loading screens, so far away, THEY SHOULD LET YOU TELEPORT TO EVERY QUEST FOR FREE.

    Personally I hate wildernesses. It's there if you want it. I don't like it. Let me spend my time the way I want to and let me play what I PAYED for without making me waste more of my limited time, or paying more.

    I am getting sick of this.
    For the first time I started playing, I have this feeling of despair. Sure, I complained plenty about many small things in this game, but ever I knew that I would go back on later that night. For the first time, I am feeling, so disgusted, so punched in the stomach, that I don't know. I don't know.

    And I am not even talking about the abysmal loot. thats another thread. yea.
    i hate posters like this that talk about bait and switch. you know nothing of what that term means. There is NO bait and switch with the wheloon or storm horn areas. turbine didnt trick you into anything. they brought you exactly what they said 10 quests 2 slayer area. not one time did i see any promises of the transporter dude being free. in fact even on lammania it was only astral shards.

    Now he can teleport you to 3 camps for free in stormhorn. as for the prison you could always run the slayer areas on heroic. gasp what an idea right? 2 quests right off the bat are easy to get too. when you do one it opens up the hall transporter. do the last quest it will open the last one up. prison isnt as big and using the roof to cover the distance is also smart.

    So anyways stop using wording if you have 0 clue what it means. turbine offered exactly what it said. it didnt trick you on anything. Convenience with the astral shards is not bait/switch. ugh

  12. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vint View Post
    I just had a little chuckle. If we logged on after U20 and see that we have to pay 3 AS to enter the marketplace, would you people still claim that it was a great move by Turbine? Honestly I could care less as I make 200-500 AS on the ah. A cash grab like this does not bring people into the game, it causes them to walk away.
    I would simply walk away. Others though, it seems, would be more likely to pay it and complain how they "forced" to do so.

    It's Turbines game to succeed or fail with however they find best after all. We have no right to demand they please us, just to decide whether they do or not.

  13. #93
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gremmlynn View Post
    I would simply walk away. Others though, it seems, would be more likely to pay it and complain how they "forced" to do so.

    It's Turbines game to succeed or fail with however they find best after all. We have no right to demand they please us, just to decide whether they do or not.
    Have you ever sent food back to the kitchen at a restaurant? It's the same thing, letting the company know you are not satisfied with their product. Honestly you need to be glad of people complaining. People complaining means they still care about the game and want it to be better. When the forums are full of people doing nothing but praising Turbine you'll know that the servers are about to close because no one but the diehards will be left.

  14. #94

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    Quote Originally Posted by Charononus View Post
    Why are you guys defending the system and not pushing for it to be more of an optional similar to vale or orchard? Oh yeah because for all of the just play the way you want to play comments you indulge in you secretly mean "you must play the way I like or gtfo"
    I actually mostly agree with ya. Except for your last part here. I am for more challenging/rewarding wild areas... and free teleports (even custom set ones, which would never happen)... but the reality is Turbine has a right to make money.

    Personally, I am very upset with charging as much as they do for these summer expansions. I have not made the purchase, I waited, in fact STILL have not paid. What I did do was wait to buy with Turbine Points, which I have already earned through the ViP program, and will pick up the expansion at no additional cost to me. To me, I saw (barely) enough value to spending the points on it.

    As for paying for transport, again, I do not believe ViPs should have to pay, but you know what, Im over it. They have a right to make money. They are in it to make a profit after all.

    As for the Turbine pulling a PWE... its not EVEN close. Nowhere in the same continent. At least you cant play for one-two weeks and proceed to buy all the best gear in the game in the AH!! Deals such as $40+ for a mount??....

    However PWE needs to do that, because they charge $ZERO for content, so they need to make up a metric forkton of cash to profit.

    I will gladly take Turbine's methods to make money over PWE. This doesnt mean I havent noticed a zinga like approach to DDO in the past 2 years. That does need to subside or else we will continue to lose more great long lasting DDO community members.
    Last edited by LeslieWest_GuitarGod; 08-26-2013 at 07:23 PM.


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  15. #95
    Community Member Vint's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gremmlynn View Post
    I would simply walk away. Others though, it seems, would be more likely to pay it and complain how they "forced" to do so.

    It's Turbines game to succeed or fail with however they find best after all. We have no right to demand they please us, just to decide whether they do or not.
    This is my fear. Soon it will only be apologists left and I don’t know if they will be able to support the game on their own.

    I agree that it is Turbines BBQ and they can do as they wish.
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  16. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charononus View Post
    or play in content that offers nothing for you to find the camps before you can run the quests.
    306k XP isn't nothing.

    Is what we got on our one run to find the explorers, killing stuff and exploring along the way. That was with either a 5% or 10% pot from a daily dice roll, and we just stayed out after the ship buffs ran out so lost the XP buff from that. I'm sure others could get a lot more if they tried.

  17. #97
    Community Member Vint's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeslieWest_GuitarGod View Post
    I actually mostly agree with ya. Except for your last part here. I am for more challenging/rewarding wild areas... and free teleports (even custom set ones, which would never happen)... but the reality is Turbine has a right to make money.
    Of course Turbine has a right to make money. I just wonder if this is the right way to go about it. If you went to McDonalds and they were charging $15 bucks for a Big mac, would you buy one and say they need the money, or would you tell them that you will not spend until they figure out a way to charge people that does not drive them away.

    3 AS is not much to pay for this, but the more and more that people adopt this as the “norm”, the more and more we will see obstacles that are placed in the game. Sure this might only drive away a small percentage of the people, but if they do keep doing this in every update, the more and more you will drive people away.
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  18. #98
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deadlock View Post
    306k XP isn't nothing.

    Is what we got on our one run to find the explorers, killing stuff and exploring along the way. That was with either a 5% or 10% pot from a daily dice roll, and we just stayed out after the ship buffs ran out so lost the XP buff from that. I'm sure others could get a lot more if they tried.
    That xp amount is good for about 30mins of playtime. Since ship buffs ran out I assume that you took longer than 30 mins for it. Epic xp my goal is 10k per min or close to it.

  19. #99

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vint View Post
    Of course Turbine has a right to make money. I just wonder if this is the right way to go about it. If you went to McDonalds and they were charging $15 bucks for a Big mac, would you buy one and say they need the money, or would you tell them that you will not spend until they figure out a way to charge people that does not drive them away.

    3 AS is not much to pay for this, but the more and more that people adopt this as the “norm”, the more and more we will see obstacles that are placed in the game. Sure this might only drive away a small percentage of the people, but if they do keep doing this in every update, the more and more you will drive people away.
    Sad but true. As for McDonald's, it seems as if they've taken their dollar menu and done the hokey pokie, as they figured out a way to improve their bottom line which has been struggling. Small fries and small drinks were replaced with equally non-nutritious ice cream cones and cookies. No doubt it does change spending habits.. so families may not go out as often if they can't afford to.

    Cost of doing business in today's marketplace has gone up. Businesses must adapt to the market and their client base in order to keep churning a profit. As for Turbine, they are finding other ways to make money. Is it greed? Is it simply to milk what they can out of a dying playerbase? Is it to attempt to turn a healthy profit? Has an email/phone call been dropped on them by WB that states turn a $___.00 profit this year or we are closing up shop? Maybe its not any one of these but several of them, or something similar. All I know is the game I loved for so long keeps changing, and I keep changing with it. Change it too much... simplify it too much... and I'll lose interest.

    Turbine is trying to reinvent the wheel again, and there have been pros and cons to it. I'm not a fan of much of what Feather of the Sun is doing (sorry FoS) and decisions by top brass has me wondering if they give a rat's arse about the ViPs at all at this point.

    There is more money in the f2p market because there are more bodies. But to recycle a game like DDO around into micro-transactions in order to entertain the Steam/Zinga/Facebook audience just doesnt seem to fit this playerbase's spending habits. DDO is a niche game, and the players are too used to a certain pay structure. They are playing with fire here, and if I was a bettin' Leslie, I'd bet Turbine succeeds in keeping enough of the f2p crowd to satisfy WB... but at the expense of even more of our long time players. They got away with it this year, by less of a margin I believe than they got away with it last year. Much of the heat and dissatisfaction they never heard because of how much of a colossal PITA this website has turned into that most people dont even bother coming here any longer. Next year will be yet another paid expansion. But can they afford the cost of even more long time paying players leaving? The other thing is many in the PWE or Zinga crowd doesnt even like DDOs F2P model because they consider DDO old, and not free enough, ... they are actually much more used to the micro transactions and look for a short term free thrill - 2 to 4 weeks, pay what they want if anything then bounce...

    So there ya go Vint... I feel I see both sides but I also feel I cant control it. All I can control is my own fun. I am still having fun playing DDO... so I keep playing (and paying.) I have plenty of friends & guildies that play. But I believe more micro-transactions are coming, and I just hope they keep their eyes on their long term paying players, and new players looking for a more complex game than a Zinga game, a more customizable game than Neverwinter, and a game more D&D-like than any other mmo on the market.
    Last edited by LeslieWest_GuitarGod; 08-27-2013 at 01:05 AM.


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  20. #100
    Community Member bartharok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vint View Post
    I just hope you whales keep paying. I’d wager that we are seeing these (teleport cost things) because so many people have gotten upset about all the “schemes” that Turbine has implemented and have quit spending or have just quit al together. You apologists keep spending. I am sure Turibne will implement even crazier ideas as more and more people quit spending. You just keep the game going for me and keep spending.

    I just had a little chuckle. If we logged on after U20 and see that we have to pay 3 AS to enter the marketplace, would you people still claim that it was a great move by Turbine? Honestly I could care less as I make 200-500 AS on the ah. A cash grab like this does not bring people into the game, it causes them to walk away.
    Umh... you do know that the teleports are purely optional, and totally unnecessary for getting to the quests. They are likely to be used by people who want the xp/mint to stay as high as possible, the same ones that keep buying xp pots and stones from the store. I am bout as likely to use them as i am to buy an xp stone (i prefer actually playing the game).

    They actually gave people another option for skipping playing and you call it a money grab? If they grab someones money it the money of the ones that dont actually like the game as it is. Which is fine by me.
    Dystopia = utopia achieved

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