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  1. #21
    Community Member FestusHood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alfhild View Post
    Pre-U19 Manyshot and 10K shared a 30 second cooldown which prevented them from being used concurrently and also meant you had to wait 10 seconds to activate 10K if you started with Manyshot whereas you could proceed to Manyshot directly after 10K because the 30 sec CD had expired.

    Nothing has changed post-U19
    Thanks for this. I have a friend who is building a monkcher and was quite worried about this. I'll be happy to tell them that they won't have to do something else with it.

  2. #22
    Community Member schelsullivan's Avatar
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    The weirdness continues.

    I have tested my actually doubleproc vs training dummy compaired to the visually doubleshot arrows.

    With improved precise shot enabled its possible to see how many "graphic arrows" per attack vs actual hits on the training dummy and guess what, its a wonk.

    Actual doubleshot hits on the dummy with single graphic arrows AND actual single shot hits on the dummy with doubleshot arrow graphics.

    In other words you cant trust the range animations, I find that disappointing.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by schelsullivan View Post
    The weirdness continues.

    I have tested my actually doubleproc vs training dummy compaired to the visually doubleshot arrows.

    With improved precise shot enabled its possible to see how many "graphic arrows" per attack vs actual hits on the training dummy and guess what, its a wonk.

    Actual doubleshot hits on the dummy with single graphic arrows AND actual single shot hits on the dummy with doubleshot arrow graphics.

    In other words you cant trust the range animations, I find that disappointing.
    Well at least we know the graphic animation is utterly unreliable. Can you do tests with manyshot with a set amount of consumables and after each volley check your combat log to see if it corresponds to the arrows you used?

  4. #24
    Community Member schelsullivan's Avatar
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    Testing with the training dummy has shown me that doubleshot procs during and directly after many shot. With manyshot activated and using single attacks to assure im not confusing previous attacks, I occasionally get 5 hits in one attack. I also get double shots hits immediately after manyshot expires. This was confirmed with over mob head damage and via the combat log.

    The amount of arrows used isnt important to me because I almost always use summoned arrows (occasionally I use silver arrows where silver and good/holy is needed)

    For me this confirms that Doubleshot is a useful feat for pure rangers.
    Last edited by schelsullivan; 09-05-2013 at 10:49 AM.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by FestusHood View Post
    Thanks for this. I have a friend who is building a monkcher and was quite worried about this. I'll be happy to tell them that they won't have to do something else with it.
    Still very worth it I would say. So far with 40 Wis my DPS is boosted by 100% with 10k stars with equates to a 50% overall DPS boost while Doubleshot only does 20-25% and that is ignoring the debuff manyshot is supposed to have on Doubleshot. And really that is only 15% since that is what Shadow Arrow imbue and the capstone in AA gives you.

    Course there is the question of how much dmg is lost due to raw dmg being lower but I think that the more tendency of your 10k stars proccing on your +2 or +3[W] shots will more than makeup the loss of raw dmg.

    Really the only change to the Moncher is that you don't need 12 levels of monk to get the +1 crit multiplier on 19-20 rolls for Master Earth Stance, instead at char level 12 you can feat for master stance. So seems like 6 monk levels is all you really need.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by schelsullivan View Post
    Testing with the training dummy has shown me that doubleshot procs during and directly after many shot. With manyshot activated and using single attacks to assure im not confusing previous attacks, I occasionally get 5 hits in one attack. I also get double shots hits immediately after manyshot expires. This was confirmed with over mob head damage and via the combat log.

    The amount of arrows used isnt important to me because I almost always use summoned arrows (occasionally I use silver arrows where silver and good/holy is needed)

    For me this confirms that Doubleshot is a useful feat for pure rangers.
    Actually is makes Dobuleshot useful for all archers and not just for pure rangers.

    But this is all under the assumption that this is WAI which I find doubtful as it contradicts what the tooltip says. What happens when they fix the bug if it is in fact doing what everyone think it is doing.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by saco View Post
    But this is all under the assumption that this is WAI which I find doubtful as it contradicts what the tooltip says. What happens when they fix the bug if it is in fact doing what everyone think it is doing.
    It seems interesting that the tooltips in question use the earlier terminology of extra shot as has been pointed out. That they did not upgrade the tooltip to reflect the new term leaves open the possibility they did not update the coding which provides the debuff to include the new term thus rendering the debuff inert for doubleshot..

  8. #28
    Community Member schelsullivan's Avatar
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    It would be nice to have a dev chime and let us know if it is working as intended. Ill be running with it and if it changes, well I'll just go see Fred.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by schelsullivan View Post
    It would be nice to have a dev chime and let us know if it is working as intended. Ill be running with it and if it changes, well I'll just go see Fred.
    Spent a Sib shard and swapped in Doubleshot. Previously when testing I only had access to a +3% item. Now with both doubleshot and a +6 item I was able to test more reliably.
    Bought a 1100 consumable arrows and loaded them in my Quiver of Poison and 100 into ammo. Went to the dummy and positioned my inventory screen so it was right beside the dummy so that I could see both the ammo count and damage text in close proximity.
    Results? Yes I got a number of 5 shot volleys in manyshot as well as a number of 2 shots in the 50 seconds after Manyshot expired.
    For testing with 10K Stars, I lowered my unbuffed 39 WIS to 36 by removing my +3 Insightful. Based on previous testing this would get around a 30/45/25 ratio in terms of 1/2/3 shots. Realizing it would be hard to distinguish whether a triple shot was a 10K 3 shot or a 10K 2 shot + a doubleshot, my aim was to see if I get a 4 shot which would indicate that doubleshot was working since 36 WIS does not grant a 4 shot with 10K stars since 42 WIS is required based on previous testing.
    I was surprised to see a 4 shot on my 3 volley in my first 10K stars session. However I did not see another one again until my 5th. So assuming a) all previous testing was 100% accurate and b) that the unknown formula governing 10k Stars has not changed, I would also conclude doubleshot is working with 10K as well as Manyshot.

  10. #30
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    I have a hard time believing that Doubleshot applying during 10k/MS is working as intended. I would not invest in Doubleshot itemization.

    Feat swaps are cheap. Use the Doubleshot feat while it lasts.
    Last edited by Carpone; 09-06-2013 at 01:10 PM.
    U19 Kensei: Centered Cleaver | TR Junkie Leveling Framework

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  11. #31
    Community Member schelsullivan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carpone View Post
    Investing in Doubleshot is suboptimal for a toon that utilizes both 10k Stars and Manyshot. There's only a 15 second window every 2 minutes (12.5% of the time) where Doubleshot is applied.
    Incorrect, doubleshot has been tested and is infact working during and immediately after both manyshot and 10kstars. We dont know if this is WAI, but its working now.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carpone View Post
    I have a hard time believing that Doubleshot applying during 10k/MS is working as intended. I would not invest in Doubleshot itemization.

    Feat swaps are cheap. Use the Doubleshot feat while it lasts.
    Agreed, but getting Dev clarification on this would be nice since on the slim chance it is WAI, the feat, itemization, and perhaps a 2 splash in druid would make for an interesting build since a fellow earlier said the druid doublestrike boost was working with archery.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alfhild View Post
    Agreed, but getting Dev clarification on this would be nice since on the slim chance it is WAI, the feat, itemization, and perhaps a 2 splash in druid would make for an interesting build since a fellow earlier said the druid doublestrike boost was working with archery.
    Nature Warrior Action Boost Double Strike did not work with bows when I tested it pre-patch 1. IMO it should, but then again, I also think that every occurrence of Doublestrike in the game should apply Doubleshot as well.
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