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  1. #1
    Community Member DeKalbSun's Avatar
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    Default is anyone happy with how Pally's turned out?

    With the new enhancements i lost 200hp and unyielding soverignty. My res is now a spell instead of an enhancement and
    I'm sure there are other things I havent had time to noitice yet. I'm sure there are some good things buried in there somewhere
    and I'm trying to look on the brightside of this. Is anyone happy with the state of the Palidin now? What are some of the new Paly builds
    people are coming up with.
    Mangas Geronimo (Paladin) Grocery Baggs (Ranger) Naiche Geronimo (Cleric)

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  2. #2
    Community Member bsquishwizzy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeKalbSun View Post
    With the new enhancements i lost 200hp and unyielding soverignty. My res is now a spell instead of an enhancement and
    I'm sure there are other things I havent had time to noitice yet. I'm sure there are some good things buried in there somewhere
    and I'm trying to look on the brightside of this. Is anyone happy with the state of the Palidin now? What are some of the new Paly builds
    people are coming up with.
    Errr...what?

    You can get it as a feat. In fact, there are three feats related to this. I took it.

    As for HP and PRR, I actually went up, though not as much as I had planned in Lammania.

    if worse comes to worse, I think you're going to get two bites at the LR apple - a free LR in house J, and a lesser heart of wood in your inventory.

  3. #3
    Community Member bsquishwizzy's Avatar
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    let me take back some of the snarkiness of that previous post: I just went in and LR-ed anyways after what I saw on Lamannia. So I started out in that direction from the get-go. If you didn't LR, you'd probably be a little stunned you lost it as an enhancement.

  4. #4
    Community Member goodspeed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeKalbSun View Post
    With the new enhancements i lost 200hp and unyielding soverignty. My res is now a spell instead of an enhancement and
    I'm sure there are other things I havent had time to noitice yet. I'm sure there are some good things buried in there somewhere
    and I'm trying to look on the brightside of this. Is anyone happy with the state of the Palidin now? What are some of the new Paly builds
    people are coming up with.
    Theirs this ancient subforum in the class section that turb reverted back to the original down there. And so far from the way ive seen all these boxes work, being anywhere near pure kinda blows as far as enhancments are concerned except for a few classes that have something half way worth it from class level (like a rog's SA dmg per lv) or in the core stuff.

    Besides those 6 levels, 12 tops if the core is great and some ap is gonna net ya alot more for a mix. Expecially with the kensei one. With the base formula of that tree, im expecting to see a great range of 3 class mixes besides your average 12 6 2. Least as far as melee goes.

    Oh ya and stalwart blows. If ever there was a tree to make you sadder then the pally stereotype true and not combined lol.
    Through avarice, evil smiles; through insanity, it sings.

  5. #5
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    Two levels of pally has gained a ton more. All small splashes have gained this update.

  6. #6
    DDO Trivia Champion alancarp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DeKalbSun View Post
    With the new enhancements i lost 200hp and unyielding soverignty. My res is now a spell instead of an enhancement and
    I'm sure there are other things I havent had time to noitice yet. I'm sure there are some good things buried in there somewhere
    and I'm trying to look on the brightside of this. Is anyone happy with the state of the Palidin now? What are some of the new Paly builds
    people are coming up with.
    I have yet to re-spec via the +20 LR HoW - and won't until I'm sure the Epic XP problem is fixed. That means I will lose the Religious Lore feats and the accompanying Unyielding Sovereignty [I had previously blown the free LR]. Until then, I'll have to be satisfied with compromise Action Point re-specs I'll be trying ... likely at a fairly steep platinum cost.

    For the first attempt, I went for a 'big damage' run. I have previously dumped Improved/Greater 2-handed Fighting with the theory that Improved/Overwhelming Critical would trump this in terms of damage. I believe that's be shown to be a good plan. So I enhanced last night with most everything I could find to bolster strength, crits, temp dmg boosts - whatever. That left me with around 30-ish pts that were dumped into the Sacred Defender side. I am currently running with the Legendary Dreadnaught ED.

    Before: Defender of Siberys; ~1100 HP in stance (more using Unyielding Sent/less with Legny. Dread.). STR about 40-44, AC 95; 120-ish w/Shield.
    After: Mostly Knight of Chalice; 710-730 HP. 836 in Sacred Def. stance w/Shield. AC 55. STR can peak at 51.

    Bonuses? STR definitely, extra dmg (up to 900-1200 in melee; often 500-750). Healing Ampl of ~40-50% was excellent. Healed almost 600 per Lay on Hands (was ~360-390).
    Problems: Armor class, for sure. 0 Spell Resistance (casters had their way with me during an EH Big Top solo test), substantially reduced Saves. Losing 400 HP was obviously a problem given the significant armor class reduction. Endless Lay on Hands (not sure it was working... need to check/make sure it was twisted). The healing amp was pretty impressive, though - helped keep me alive.

    Compromise will be necessary. Will first try Unyielding Sentinel to see what help I can get there for both HP and AC.

    Things I do not like:
    1. Human Adaptability: being unable to repeat an Ability increase (can't choose STR or CON multiple times for same enhancement class).
    2. Being forced to choose (pretty much) between a longsword Intim shield-wielder or a bad-a** damage do-er with little room in between. If I can up the AC, Saves, and some spell resistance on this basher I have, then I'd be satisfied.
    3. Loss of toughness add-ons. I think I had at least 6 on the prior spec.
    4. Not having free feat-swap privileges whilst we collectively work out what we can do with what we now have available.
    5. Not having free Action pt. re-spec privileges (for SURE).
    6. Improved Sacred Defense: 3 tiers at each level; can only take one of 3 'improvements' per level (frankly, all three should be automatic at EACH level - at a cost of 2 AP per level.... 6 pts total. Currently it requires 9).
    7. Having to take Human Versatility II before taking Human Adaptability II... and then being limited on that to choosing something not selected before. I want more damage, not more attack or skills.

    Things I think I like:
    1. Defender of Siberys required a ton of points dumped into things I didn't want - so there seems to be fewer wasted points. Then again, that's also now part of my armor class losses.
    2. The increased healing amp is the best thing. Even though I lost 400 HP, the heals and the dmg increase kinda make up for that (more effective healing; enemies don't survive as long to dmg me).

    Will keep working with it. Jury still out.
    Last edited by alancarp; 08-20-2013 at 01:21 PM.

  7. #7
    DDO Trivia Champion alancarp's Avatar
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    One piece of advice for those doing the LR/TR: On that 'free LR' I did a few months ago, I dumped enough build points into INT (yes, believe it or not) to give my human pally a +1 Mod for that stat. The skill point increase was awesome; maxed out intim and still had lots of points to spare.

  8. #8
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    Default Not happy

    I used the +20LR on my 18 Pali 2 Monk, 1100 to 600 hp, 149 to 80 ac. My epics appear to not be working with all feats greyed out.

    No more monk wis, tortoise etc. as I have yet to work out how to put 20 points in the monk tree that benefit me. So seriously rethinking the monk splash which gets me a bit of dodge, evasion...so need to reweigh benefits. Also this build was specific to the mechanics and not need to see how defense is working.

    I am highly surprised there hasn't been much of an uproar over the significant loss of HP, regardless of healing amp you have half the buffer to absorb crits on you between heals. Surprised at that and wondering if my character is bugged as I expect a lynch mob on the forums if the epic destinies are locked out as mine appear to be.

  9. #9
    DDO Trivia Champion alancarp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mooboy View Post
    I used the +20LR ... Surprised at that and wondering if my character is bugged as I expect a lynch mob on the forums if the epic destinies are locked out as mine appear to be.
    Did you get your Epic XP back? Lots of reports of that being bugged out after using the +20LR... unless you click on the gal a few thousand times. That would explain the ED's failing.

    Waiting for the announcement about the emergency downtime to fix that bug.... Buhler? ... Buhler?

  10. #10
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by alancarp View Post
    Did you get your Epic XP back? Lots of reports of that being bugged out after using the +20LR... unless you click on the gal a few thousand times. That would explain the ED's failing.

    Waiting for the announcement about the emergency downtime to fix that bug.... Buhler? ... Buhler?
    It's buggy but I got a positive bug was 25 logged in, lr'ed and ended up 600k from 28 at 27.5. No idea how or why.

  11. #11

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    Yes! I always have been bastardsword+Tower shield paladin tank for 3 yrs. It was badly designed at first til defender of Siberys came in that made my day but not that great til bastardsword finally can use 2h feats that made me even happier then Unyielding Sentinel destiny came that made my day.. Now, heroic tree change that only made 1h+shield tank even better! I'm happier now even though I lost my favorite unyielding Sov but can get that via feat tho.

    I noticed that my AC improved by large margin by 25 AC more to 142 AC and PRR enjoys largest gain from 121 PPR to 172 PPR now. My Hp is about same before or after change at 1288 hp. It was little over 1300 but no biggie. I am overjoyed when I learn that I finally got REZZ so I'm happy because my guild is only 6 and we partied up every Sat night and I'm only tank of the party so 1h+shield tank is a must so the change is most welcome to my role.

    One thing that hurts me is that I lost weapon of good capstone and capstones got expanded to cover each class tree so I ended up getting Eternal defender capstone instead. I will miss Weapon of Good (Champion of Good now) capstone but something that I have to trade to improve my defender role.. Eternal defender is pretty nice one tho especially during epic elite runs and raids..

    I put 63 AP in sacred defender tree so you can see why it helped me a lot.
    Last edited by Nocifer_Deathblade; 08-20-2013 at 02:12 PM.

  12. #12
    DDO Trivia Champion alancarp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charononus View Post
    It's buggy but I got a positive bug was 25 logged in, lr'ed and ended up 600k from 28 at 27.5. No idea how or why.
    Guess you won't be worried about quest XP decay issues, then - congrats, I guess! Only other thought: when I took my free LR, I had to re-visit the fatespinner to activate my Epic destiny...
    Last edited by alancarp; 08-20-2013 at 02:30 PM.

  13. #13
    DDO Trivia Champion alancarp's Avatar
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    ..
    Last edited by alancarp; 08-20-2013 at 02:30 PM.

  14. #14
    DDO Trivia Champion alancarp's Avatar
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    ..
    Last edited by alancarp; 08-20-2013 at 02:31 PM.

  15. #15
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by alancarp View Post
    Guess you won't be worried about quest XP decay issues, then - congrats, I guess! Only other thought: when I took my free LR, I had to re-visit the fatespinner to activate my Epic destiny.
    Only on that one toon, the repeat penalties effect tr's much more imo during heroics.

  16. #16
    Community Member maddmatt70's Avatar
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    For S&B tank pallys I would be happy with how the enhancement pass turned out. The extra healing amp they get is a big benefit and overall they do not lose a lot in other areas. For all other pallys I would be pretty unhappy especially since several other classes like ranger got a big buff. My offensive pally Norge is on the LR+20 chopping block and soon to be a ranger likely because he is a two weapon fighting character.
    Norg Fighter12/Paladin6/Monk2, Jacquiej Cleric18/Monk1/Wiz1, Rabiez Bard16/Ranger3/Cleric1, Hangover Bard L20, Boomsticks Fighter12/Monk 6/Druid 2, Grumblegut Ranger8/Paladin6/Monk6, Rabidly Rogue L20, Furiously Rogue10/Monk6/Paladin4, Snowcones Cleric 12/Ranger 6/Monk 2, Norge Barbarian 12/FVS4/Rogue4. Guild:Prophets of The New Republic Khyber.

  17. #17
    Community Member Chaimberland's Avatar
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    Not sure how this will turn out yet. My main toon was a pally but I tr'd him a couple weeks ago. A guild mate though said he had lost 300hp. But he went out to epic giant hold and had very good success in killing giants very quickly.

  18. #18
    DDO Trivia Champion alancarp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chaimberland View Post
    Not sure how this will turn out yet. My main toon was a pally but I tr'd him a couple weeks ago. A guild mate though said he had lost 300hp. But he went out to epic giant hold and had very good success in killing giants very quickly.
    Agree - it's a work in progress. As for damage: a combination of Divine Might (which I could not confirm ever worked before - does now) plus max'd out Exalted Smite is actually pretty awesome.

    >> Need to know whether the Human Versatility Dmg boost (20%) stacks with KofChalice Tier 2 Damage Boost (10/20/30%). If not, then I will gladly save 6 AP and go with the former alone.

  19. #19
    DDO Trivia Champion alancarp's Avatar
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    Default Found another bug - somewhat subtle.

    On the Paladin Sacred Defender Tree: you can take enhancements that are dependent on the activation of the Sacred Defense stance without actually having the Sacred Defense Core Ability. There should be a prerequisite requirement present to prevent this, but it's not there.

  20. #20
    2016 DDO Players Council Qhualor's Avatar
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    with the change to DM, im curious how its working and how much investment is required to make it worth taking.

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