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  1. #41
    Community Member jakeelala's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firewall View Post

    - Ranger special attacks add a nice amout of situational and burst damage but i'm not fond of having lots of buttons with special attacks maintaining all cooldowns and micromanage situational usefulness. Others may prefer a different playstyle but with my build you have all the damage and procs on your weapon all the time and the only thing you have to manage is the cooldown of your ten thousand stars.
    This is a HUGE advantage. 10K stars, hold down attack (or hotbar Attack) and you ONLY worry about living, and doing maximal IPS damage by lining tings up and Pinning them. It's epic.

    Quote Originally Posted by Firewall

    - Vorpal on every attack at full range! I think many people underestimate vorpal. It adds 100 Points on damage on mobs above 1000 HP which averages to 5 points per hit but in addition it also has a chance of doing up to 999 points of damage if it hits a mob below 1000 HP which is quite a lot
    This is a bit overrated.

    Quote Originally Posted by Firewall
    - +2 crit range! This is in my opinion the best advantage of the build. I think you misunderstood me in that i want the improved crit range for the poison proc and added base damage. Thats absolutely not the case! The improved crit range is necessary (especially on epic elite!) to proc weapon effects that activate on crit and have no save which in combination with Improved Precise Shot adds a lot to CC and survivability:
    Obviously, this is horribly broken, and therefore moot (Crit Threat)

    Quote Originally Posted by Firewall
    - +20% running speed and abundant step: In my opinion the bread and butter of every ranged build which enables easier kiting and reaching safe spots. Abundant Step is especially useful to get out of hairy situations too
    This is awesome, but you get +20% running from Monk 12, and it you can always get a little from dipping monk.

    Quote Originally Posted by Firewall
    Fury of the Wild's Sense Weakness does not stack with the Ninja Spy's No Mercy. Not sure if this is intended or not. That makes Fury not really worth taking in my opinion.
    False. I just tested this on the Dummy today with Pin and and out of Fury. Defintely stacking. 75 Avg damage with Pin in vs. about 100 with Pin and Fury (Sense Weakness). Both counts done with No Mercy trained. This is EXCELLENT damage when you combine them.

    20 Monk is very compelling, but I think there are a lot of multiclasses that are good or better. For instance, I'm working on a 15 Wizard, 3 Monk, 2 FvS Archmage Shiradi Blaster that Pins and Nerve Venoms (and Double Rainbows) with shuriken when MM and CM are on cooldown. Almost Infinite SLA SP, Haste, Displace, and Tensors, etc. Until the enhancements get fixed it's basically the same RoF and damage as the 20 monk but with A LOT more firepower for bosses, AoE, and CC (Ice Storm/CK).

  2. #42
    Community Member Firewall's Avatar
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    @Vorpal: I'm not overrating but simply telling what it does in other words. If you have a vorpal hit on a monster that has 999 HP you will instakill it and have the same effect as if you would do 999 points of damage in that one hit. If it has 678 HP then you will do the equivalent of that amount of damage. That's how vorpal works plain and simple.

    @running speed: I've been backward-kiting the end boss in EE friends in low places until he died. I don't think you can run backwards to throw stars at a monster while kiting it and not have it reach you with only +20% speed bonus. I never tested it though.

    @Sense Weakness: Maybe they fixed it. I didn't test it lately since i have Fury capped and level other ED's while questing. But if it works it sure is nice while leveling Fury of the Wild or perhaps for twisting.

    @Multiclassing: I never doubted that there are multiclasses that might be more powerful. Every Shiradi Sorc already is! But if you want a pure thrower (No damage spells! No Melee or other ranged weapons!) and have DPS, EE survivability and CC then you probably will have a harder time to find a better build. The comparison with a Shiradi Archmage that uses shuriken while on cooldowns is not a fair one if you ask me since MM already has a higher attack speed and CM even does AOE damage. And it wouldn't even play and feel like a throwing weapon build except maybe in cases where you run out of spellpoints.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firewall View Post
    @Multiclassing: I never doubted that there are multiclasses that might be more powerful. Every Shiradi Sorc already is! But if you want a pure thrower (No damage spells! No Melee or other ranged weapons!) and have DPS, EE survivability and CC then you probably will have a harder time to find a better build.
    I'll try:

    12 Monk 5 Ranger 3 Pali Halfling

    Str 10 (4)
    Dex 17 (8)
    Con 14 (6)
    Int 14 (6)
    Wis 14 (6)
    Ch4 14 (6)

    Base Saves 15, 12, 10

    Unbuffed Permanent Saves 75 (No Fail 1, disease Immune), 78 (Improved Evasion), 75 (No Fail 1, Fear Immune)

    Pali Aura +1 All
    Halfling +1 All
    Luck +2 All
    Pali Aura Enh. +3 All
    Halfling Enh. +3 All
    Master Water Stance +4 All
    Insight +4 All
    Epic Levels +4 All
    30 Charisma +10 All
    Resist +10 All
    Bulwark/Resilience +6 All

    +48 All

    30 Con +10 Fort
    46 Dex +18 Reflex
    30 Chr +10 Will

    +10/18/10

    ED Impreg. Mind +6 Will No fail 1
    Epic Fort. +2 Fort, No fail 1
    Improved Evasion +0, Half damage on failed reflex

    +2/0/6

    -------

    Skills from (Conc, UMD, Balance, Jump, Heal, Hide, MS, Spot)

    -------

    Feats 3 Monk + 10 Base = 13

    Deflect Arrows Monk Free
    Resilience (Con 13) Monk Free
    10k Stars Monk Free

    Quick Draw 1 After Lvl 1 Ranger for skills
    Shuriken Expertise 3 After Lvl 1 Ranger Lvl 1 Monk for Shuriken Proficiency
    PBS 6
    Dragon Mark Heal 9
    IPS (Dex 19 BaB 11) 12 After 5 Ranger 3 Pali 4 Monk
    IC:Thrown 15
    Force of Person 18
    Bulwark 21
    Combat Archery 24
    Great Fortitude 27

    Free Feats, TWF, Rapid Shot, Precise Shot, Magical Training (AA Enh.), Improved Evasion
    ED Feats Doubleshot/Epic Mage Armor

    TWF Weapons: Any returning shuriken / Kama +++ HAMP/Revive
    _______________
    Enhancements

    AA 4 Magical Training Feat
    Shintao 1 HAMP
    Ninja 13 Dex Shurikens, Extra Shurikens, Ki Regen, poison, incorporeal
    DWS: 34 Lots of Good Stuff, Leg Shot, Faster Sneaking, Ranged attacks
    SD 13 Pali Aura +3 All saves
    Halfling 15 +3 Saves, Dex, Leeches, Dragonmarks
    ____________

    ED Shiradi Twists Impreg. Mind, Cocoon, Sense Weakness (4-1-1)
    ED Non-Shiradi Rainbow, double rainbow, Cocoon (4-2-1)

    ------------
    Pali 6 StD with a shield also would be interesting, but moves at normal speed.
    Last edited by Tilomere; 11-10-2013 at 07:05 AM.

  4. #44
    Community Member Firewall's Avatar
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    Nice build but to be honest i didn't want to start a competition on builds that can beat the shuricannon in one way or the other in this thread. If you want your build discussed by people please start a separate thread. It will surely get more attention that way anyway. I would like to keep this one for discussions about the shuricannon. Thank you.
    Last edited by Firewall; 11-10-2013 at 05:09 PM.

  5. #45

    Default Gear for the build

    I'm extremely enjoying this build and have played it all weekend. Like Hawkeye in "The Avengers," it prefers a little distance to its target, but with high Spot, wilderness areas like the Fens are total killing fields.

    Wide areas such as in "Frame Work" were also great.

    But its the Ninja Poison DoTs that really help, too. I had generated 70+ DoTs per 3 seconds on all the bosses there. I'm surprised how many bosses aren't poison immune, even on Elite. I was DoTting Hesstess in "Eyes of Stone" before she got ticked at getting killed by her own game and hit me with Medusa poison for 25 CON damage and instant death there. Poison is a mother.

    That said, I'm quickly realizing that the Shuricannon requires more ranger-style gear than an unarmed Monk. I've added the Wind Howler Bracers to the mix, putting the Jidz-Tet'ka bracers to the side for situational jumping (rarely leave Wind Stance), and wear a DEX +6 ring (that stat is currently 38). WIS is at 25 but expect to add a point to it with an upgraded Terasa's Perfect Sight (which will help against displacement-using foes).

    That said, what gear should I seek out as she reaches Level 14 and enters into Lordsmarch, Gianthold and beyond? (I do want a Ring of Shadows for Blurry and more miss chance).

    Also...I've noticed that the inventory panel shows my crit range at 15-20. Is that a typo? She has IC: Thrown, but that range seems pretty insane. I'd expect 17-20 at this stage, perhaps.
    Last edited by Spencerian; 11-11-2013 at 09:21 AM.
    Editor, The Book of Syncletica: An unofficial DDO Monk Guide, and Stormreach Shadows: An unofficial DDO Stealth Guide
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  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firewall View Post
    @Vorpal: I'm not overrating but simply telling what it does in other words. If you have a vorpal hit on a monster that has 999 HP you will instakill it and have the same effect as if you would do 999 points of damage in that one hit. If it has 678 HP then you will do the equivalent of that amount of damage. That's how vorpal works plain and simple.
    Just wanted to add, that if vorpal works like manslayer, it deals 100 damage and THEN if the mob is below a 1000, it insta-kills.

  7. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by ArcaneArcher52689 View Post
    Just wanted to add, that if vorpal works like manslayer, it deals 100 damage and THEN if the mob is below a 1000, it insta-kills.
    Correct. Even a standard L20 Ninja Spy sees this (and serious poison DoTs) with a typical star.
    Editor, The Book of Syncletica: An unofficial DDO Monk Guide, and Stormreach Shadows: An unofficial DDO Stealth Guide
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  8. #48
    Community Member Firewall's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spencerian View Post
    That said, what gear should I seek out as she reaches Level 14 and enters into Lordsmarch, Gianthold and beyond? (I do want a Ring of Shadows for Blurry and more miss chance).

    Also...I've noticed that the inventory panel shows my crit range at 15-20. Is that a typo? She has IC: Thrown, but that range seems pretty insane. I'd expect 17-20 at this stage, perhaps.
    @crit range: You have to be using the Snowstar to be having such a high crit range. The Snowstars normal crit range is 18-20 and is doubled with IC:Thrown so you end up with a range of 15-20. If the Ninja Spy capstone bonus would work you would have 13-20 but that's still not working.

    @gear: It heavily depends on what you have available. First of all get the highest item with Deadly on it. This will boost your basic damage considerably. Add Accuracy on an item if you like.
    I can list you quite a few named items that are useful and their minimum levels and you can choose which ones are worth taking:

    Ring of the Stalker(!!!) (ML 12-20): MANSLAYER, Exceptional Sneak Attack bonus, Seeker
    Quiver of Poison(!!!) (ML 12-14): Poison damage on each attack

    Frozen Tunic (ML 4-20): Freezing Ice, AC,...
    Minos Legens (ML 11): +20 Vitality, Heavy Fort
    Kael's Touch (ML 11): DR 5/Evil
    Cloak of the Zephyr (ML 11): Blurry, Invis
    Jeweled Cloak (ML 12-14): Elemental Resistance, Spell Absorption, Slot
    Ring of Shadows (ML 13-15): Blurry
    Greensteel Shuriken (ML 12): various effects
    Treason (Offhand)(ML 14): Deception, Sneak Attack, Armor Piercing,...
    Shadowsight (ML 14-16): WIS, Accuracy, Slot
    Pale Green Ioun Stone (ML 15): +40 Vitality

    Wheloon end rewards (easy to get):
    Guardian's Girdle (ML 15): +40 HP (=Superior False Life)
    Skirmisher's or Guardian's Locket (ML 15): Natural Armor +8 or 8% Dodge
    Skirmisher's or Guardian's Bracers (ML 15): +8 DEX or Riposte VIII
    Guardian's Gauntlets (ML 15): +8 CON

    (Offhand) Crafted Seeker +8 Kama, Red augment Slot, Masterful Craftsmanship

    Ethereal Bracers, Planar Gird, Silver Flame Talisman, Windhowler Bracers, Rock Boots,...

    Just a selection of things that you can benefit of during those levels...
    Last edited by Firewall; 11-11-2013 at 06:14 PM.

  9. #49
    Community Member Firewall's Avatar
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    New Insights: With the U20 raid box i was finally able to get a Celestia and to my surprise the Greater Sunburst and Fiery Detonation also proc on my shuriken throws. A guildie said that this was known for some time that the AOE effects of cormyrian weapons in the offhand also work on throwing weapons. So it seems that Celestia is able to add two nice AOE procs in addition to the planar focus set bonus to my attacks which makes it a lot harder to choose between Celestia and Rebellion. Very nice!
    Last edited by Firewall; 11-12-2013 at 05:38 PM.

  10. #50
    Community Member voodoogroves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firewall View Post
    New Insights: With the U20 raid box i was finally able to get a Celestia and to my surprise the Greater Sunburst and Fiery Detonation also proc on my shuriken throws. A guildy said that this was known for some time that the AOE effects of cormyrian weapons also work on throwing weapons. So it seems that Celestia is able to add two nice AOE procs in addition to the planar focus set bonus to my attacks. Very nice!
    This, if nothing else, kills non-monk throwers. A rune-arm imbue is one of the few additional enablements - but if we can grab that from an off-hand weapon - well, why wouldn't you ...
    Ghallanda - now with fewer alts and more ghostbane

  11. #51
    Community Member Firewall's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by voodoogroves View Post
    This, if nothing else, kills non-monk throwers. A rune-arm imbue is one of the few additional enablements - but if we can grab that from an off-hand weapon - well, why wouldn't you ...
    As a monk you always could get a lot of stuff from your offhand weapon. Rebellion is the best example. And non-monk throwers can benefit from this too. They just won't be centered with a shortsword (and don't need to since they are non-monks). So this is just nice additional damage for all throwers.

  12. #52

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    Quote Originally Posted by Firewall View Post
    New Insights: With the U20 raid box i was finally able to get a Celestia and to my surprise the Greater Sunburst and Fiery Detonation also proc on my shuriken throws. A guildie said that this was known for some time that the AOE effects of cormyrian weapons in the offhand also work on throwing weapons. So it seems that Celestia is able to add two nice AOE procs in addition to the planar focus set bonus to my attacks which makes it a lot harder to choose between Celestia and Rebellion. Very nice!
    In all my years of playing Monks, I can't recall if it is possible to carry a shuriken in the off-hand. It would look nice.

    It doesn't matter what the off-hand weapon is, but the effects as you noted. So, then, wielding two Cormyrian weapons (one off-hand, one main) with multiple effects produced from both through the star?

    If the effects do transfer or even double...wow. Just wow. I'm betting no, but I'm dreaming of it all.
    Editor, The Book of Syncletica: An unofficial DDO Monk Guide, and Stormreach Shadows: An unofficial DDO Stealth Guide
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  13. #53
    Community Member Firewall's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spencerian View Post
    In all my years of playing Monks, I can't recall if it is possible to carry a shuriken in the off-hand. It would look nice.

    It doesn't matter what the off-hand weapon is, but the effects as you noted. So, then, wielding two Cormyrian weapons (one off-hand, one main) with multiple effects produced from both through the star?

    If the effects do transfer or even double...wow. Just wow. I'm betting no, but I'm dreaming of it all.
    Do you mean if the spelltouched effect works if you would carry a thrower in the offhand? No it does not. One reason being that you cannot carry a throwing weapon in the offhand. What i was talking about is that if you have a Cormyrian Kama with Fiery Burst on it then this affects your mainhand if you carry it in the offhand. To my knowledge this only works with AOE effects but of course i haven't testet it thoroughly since i use my ingredients to craft shuriken. But if someone has such a weapon it would be nice to test if it works with other effects too.

  14. #54
    Community Member voodoogroves's Avatar
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    Well, traditionally tactics boosters didn't add to the weapon, they added the effect to YOU. Stunning 10, etc. - so it worked with any weapon.

    I wonder if the new ones do, similar to the AoE procs - like if they are coded differently.
    Ghallanda - now with fewer alts and more ghostbane

  15. #55

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    Quote Originally Posted by Firewall View Post
    Do you mean if the spelltouched effect works if you would carry a thrower in the offhand? No it does not. One reason being that you cannot carry a throwing weapon in the offhand. What i was talking about is that if you have a Cormyrian Kama with Fiery Burst on it then this affects your mainhand if you carry it in the offhand. To my knowledge this only works with AOE effects but of course i haven't testet it thoroughly since i use my ingredients to craft shuriken. But if someone has such a weapon it would be nice to test if it works with other effects too.
    Thanks. I realized what you were mentioning were the Raider's Boxes I found on all of my higher level characters (I'm slow on the uptake sometimes). Oh, my.

    Aside from the joy at adding Antipodes to my other Monks and a Sireth to my Mystic, I picked a Celestia and used it with my non-thrower Ninja at a training dummy, just to test it out. It's like throwing a det-pack! Sadly my thrower Ninja didn't get one of these. The off-hand imbuement is a real game changer for diversifying thrower tactics.
    Editor, The Book of Syncletica: An unofficial DDO Monk Guide, and Stormreach Shadows: An unofficial DDO Stealth Guide
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  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Firewall View Post
    New Insights: With the U20 raid box i was finally able to get a Celestia and to my surprise the Greater Sunburst and Fiery Detonation also proc on my shuriken throws. A guildie said that this was known for some time that the AOE effects of cormyrian weapons in the offhand also work on throwing weapons. So it seems that Celestia is able to add two nice AOE procs in addition to the planar focus set bonus to my attacks which makes it a lot harder to choose between Celestia and Rebellion. Very nice!
    And now i know what i'm using my raider's box for!


    So, i finally got my VIP points to reincarnate my lvl 4 arti into this. Also, as a side note, if you have one of the snow stars from BEFORE U17, it's the best! min lvl 4, 1.5[1d4], 18-20 crit range w/ +2enh and icy burst... now lvl 6, and it still kills everything from a safe distance.



    Thanks again for the great build idea!

  17. #57
    Community Member Firewall's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spencerian View Post
    Thanks. I realized what you were mentioning were the Raider's Boxes I found on all of my higher level characters (I'm slow on the uptake sometimes). Oh, my.

    Aside from the joy at adding Antipodes to my other Monks and a Sireth to my Mystic, I picked a Celestia and used it with my non-thrower Ninja at a training dummy, just to test it out. It's like throwing a det-pack! Sadly my thrower Ninja didn't get one of these. The off-hand imbuement is a real game changer for diversifying thrower tactics.
    Don't worry. You will get one on your thrower toon too. Cordovan statet here:

    https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...ue#post5166069

    that with an upcoming patch they intend to give every character a raidbox since they had problems with the delivery of raidboxes for characters that qualified for one.

    Edit: Looks like they just did!
    Last edited by Firewall; 11-14-2013 at 04:20 PM.

  18. #58
    Community Member voodoogroves's Avatar
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    Popping into one of my favorite build threads ... with the double-shot hit after 10k stars, what's your experience w/ the shuriken?
    Ghallanda - now with fewer alts and more ghostbane

  19. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Urjak View Post
    as Master Thrower is broken anyways (and probably wont get fixed)
    Bug report it! I just did.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kmnh View Post
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  20. #60

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    Quote Originally Posted by Firewall View Post
    Don't worry. You will get one on your thrower toon too. Cordovan statet here:

    https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...ue#post5166069

    that with an upcoming patch they intend to give every character a raidbox since they had problems with the delivery of raidboxes for characters that qualified for one.

    Edit: Looks like they just did!
    Got one. Will be awhile before I can use it--but I'm filled with glee.

    Been more on the hunt for some of the old kamas I thought I had with Freezing Gale and other effects that went the way of the last major update, just when I realized their significance.
    Editor, The Book of Syncletica: An unofficial DDO Monk Guide, and Stormreach Shadows: An unofficial DDO Stealth Guide
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