Page 2 of 10 FirstFirst 123456 ... LastLast
Results 21 to 40 of 194
  1. #21
    Community Member eachna_gislin's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    706

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    Human unarmed monks who want to use Great Cleave. Details here.

    This would prevent taking aura, which to me a dealbreaker. (Without aura I see no advantage to taking cleric instead of FVS.)

    Aura requires 30 points spent in tree, costs 2 AP (32 AP minimum)
    DD capstone requires 40 points spent in tree, costs 1 AP (41 AP minimum)
    +
    I'm not asking in a snarky way, but have you tried playing a Divine Disciple cleric without the aura (just the burst)? I have...it plays quite nicely. It took me 3 days to stop hitting the 'aura' hotkey. Now I don't miss it.

    What (still) makes cleric "better" than FvS for this type of build is the number of spell slots. Even if FvS had the prestige, they couldn't afford the spell slots for the full lines of light and necromantic spells.

    I've been playing with Sunbeam, Sunbolt, Sunburst, Enervation, Necrotic Ray, and Word of Balance. All FANTASTIC spells that go in the spell book, which means they replace other spells. I'm also squeezing in (at epic levels) a full range of long-casting buffs. .

    I can still do full raid buffs/heals, both single tanks and massed group heals/cures. I don't really "miss" the aura. Yes, it eats into my spellpoints for healing to give it up, but frankly on a 1st life cleric with minimal gear aura doesn't get good for healing till level 17-18 or so, and I take two mental toughnesses on my first life runs (I'm using clerics to unlock favored soul on each server so my 1st life clerics are truly poor and gearless). I need that much mental toughness to get through Shroud healing _with or without_ the aura.

    Burst really does work 'just fine'.

  2. #22

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by eachna_gislin View Post
    I'm not asking in a snarky way, but have you tried playing a Divine Disciple cleric without the aura (just the burst)? I have...it plays quite nicely.
    You mean drop aura for +1 DC?

  3. #23
    2014 DDO Players Council
    SirValentine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Eastern USA
    Posts
    5,770

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    You mean drop aura for +1 DC?
    And +2 to saves and 5 more spells in your spell book and another SLA and +2 to your caster level & max caster level. But, yeah, for +1 DC, too.

  4. #24

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SirValentine View Post
    And +2 to saves and 5 more spells in your spell book and another SLA and +2 to your caster level & max caster level. But, yeah, for +1 DC, too.
    Where do the 5 more spells come from? What other SLA? And you mean caster level / max caster level for healing spells only?

  5. #25
    Community Member
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    975

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    Where do the 5 more spells come from? What other SLA? And you mean caster level / max caster level for healing spells only?
    I think they mean the T5 and capstone DD enhancements... according to the PDF I have here, Divine Empowerment is +1 CL, and +1 max CL light/negative/fire; Transcendence is +2wis, +1 CL, +1 max CL light/negative/fire, a bunch of spells to your spellbook, and a bit of other stuff...


    Or are you saying that it's not actually feasible to get to play with those? I wouldn't know...
    Last edited by mna; 08-24-2013 at 04:00 PM.
    No longer completely f2p as of November 2014. Father of 3 more DDO players so far (I do have more children than that).
    Away from the game most of 2015.

  6. #26

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mna View Post
    I think they mean the T5 and capstone DD enhancements... according to the PDF I have here, Divine Empowerment is +1 CL, and +1 max CL light/negative/fire; Transcendence is +2wis, +1 CL, +1 max CL light/negative/fire, a bunch of spells to your spellbook, and a bit of other stuff...


    Or are you saying that it's not actually feasible to get to play with those? I wouldn't know...
    Ah, yeah, I missed the Divine Empowerment. So +1 DC and +1 caster level to the slas. In his zeal to be dismissive he seems to have forgotten that this build takes the capstone too.

    SirValentine, by all means post your own build. You clearly dislike this one.

  7. #27
    2014 DDO Players Council
    SirValentine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Eastern USA
    Posts
    5,770

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    Ah, yeah, I missed the Divine Empowerment. So +1 DC and +1 caster level to the slas.
    And the additional SLA itself, if you care, yes.

    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    he seems to have forgotten that this build takes the capstone too.
    Yup, missed that.

    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    In his zeal to be dismissive...
    <snip>
    You clearly dislike this one.
    Not at all. I was trying to take into account all the considerations of one of the sub-topics under discussion, namely whether to take Tier 5s from DD or RS.

    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    SirValentine, by all means post your own build.
    On live, my Cleric is not currently on a Cleric life.

    I don't remember every exact ability I took, but on Lama when I TRed to a Cleric, my tree breakdown was something like:

    DD 41 points (lots of stuff; Dark side, skipped SLAs, +2 Necro DC, Spell Pen, +2 Wis capstone, etc.)
    RS 24 points (Positive Energy Burst, +2 Wis, Endless Turning, Wand Mastery, etc.)
    Prot 12 points (Toughness, Efficient Metamagic, +1 Wis)
    Human 3 points (Skill Boost & +1 Wis)

    That's not a complete detailed build, but that's what I remember.

  8. #28
    2014 DDO Players Council
    SirValentine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Eastern USA
    Posts
    5,770

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    Where do the 5 more spells come from?
    Whoops, missed you already having the capstone.

    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    What other SLA?
    Mass Inflict Moderate Wounds

    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    And you mean caster level / max caster level for healing spells only?
    No, Light, Negative & Fire. And only +1, not the +2 I said earlier, because of course you already have the capstone.

  9. #29

    Default

    After further testing I'm going to go ahead and drop the lightside SLAs entirely at level 20. Mainly because they kind of suck compared to necrotic ray & sunbeam for single-target rays. They are so good they make even avenging light suck.

    Necrotic ray & sunbeam with no metas at all do twice the damage of avenging light and quadruple the damage of the lightside slas, and since they don't need metas they only cost 10 & 15 SP, both well within the echoes range of 30.

    This means I can switch to darkside for another +1 necro DC (losing +1 evo DC) and can save 3 AP for other stuff in DD. My first thought is efficient meta, but I'll take a closer look.

    Quote Originally Posted by SirValentine View Post
    No, Light, Negative & Fire.
    My experience makes me skeptical that adding caster levels does anything at all for damage spells. Adding MCL is highly bugged and has no effect for most damage spells in the game (frost lance & scorching ray never get a 4th ray, for example) and adding to CL is irrelevant without a functional increase to MCL.

    +1 spell pen to slay living & destruction is nice, but not particularly needed. As written this build hits 39 spell pen anway, which is the magic number. (Won't work on EE drow, but the DC on a build like this won't work for EE anyway.)

    I also never saw where that +2 saves came from, unless you meant the second DD core enhancement. Which again, I take too.

  10. #30

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SirValentine View Post
    RS 24 points (Positive Energy Burst, +2 Wis, Endless Turning, Wand Mastery, etc.)
    This hurts, even beyond sacrificing aura. Your turns regen slower (due to only being able to take endless turning to II instead of III) and you lose 25 spell power & 1% crits for your heals. Admittedly, healing crits are way less relevant without aura, but it's still a loss of 25 positive spell power.

    You also lose on MCL for burst & aura, which did seem to increase aura when testing on lama. However, this is much less relevant without aura and I only take it to II (as opposed to III) anyway, so meh.

    Given the overall breakdown:

    DD: I lose -1 necro DC
    RS: You lose aura, 25 spell power, +1% healing crits, slower turn regen, lower CL/MCL on burst
    Prot: You gain +15 HP, -2 empower heal cost, +1 wisdom

    I'd rather have aura than +1 wisdom, +15 HP and -2 emp heal cost. That extra necro DC is pretty sweet, though, but still I think I'd rather have aura.

    EDIT: Is Mass Inflict Moderate Wounds any good at all? How much damage does it do? My impression is that all inflict spells are worthless. I'm dropping ALL slas from my build @ 20 due to them sucking in epics.

  11. #31
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    1,075

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Varus View Post
    Same bug. Having to hunt down the holes in the tree where I had points is annoying as he'll. I didn't catch it the first time and was wondering where my searing light SLA went. Cost me some plat.
    This is a common bug when picking points. For some reason the tree's forget that you put in those last few points you spent.

    This works every time:

    Spend your points
    hit accept
    hit cancel
    reopen enhancement tree
    put the points that it took away back to where they need to be
    hit accept
    Done. All of your points should be working now.

    I think what is happening is that it is having trouble tracking things across multiple tree's. Best thing to do is spend points in one tree - hit accept. Spend points in the next tree, hit accept. Etc.

  12. #32
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    1

    Default

    Since this is for new players...some questions..

    Why so much Int for the 28pt-built, just for the skillpoints? After Update 19 the Int Multiplier also adds up to spellpower, I think?
    Why don´t you put the attribute points into Const or Str?
    With my present Cleric I never had much skillpoints to spend, so I wouldn´t miss them.

    What exactly are the 11 ranks in UMD good for? Sry, I never used UMD.

    Thanks.

  13. #33
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Great White North
    Posts
    101

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by varadi View Post
    Since this is for new players...some questions..

    Why so much Int for the 28pt-built, just for the skillpoints? After Update 19 the Int Multiplier also adds up to spellpower, I think?
    Why don´t you put the attribute points into Const or Str?
    With my present Cleric I never had much skillpoints to spend, so I wouldn´t miss them.

    What exactly are the 11 ranks in UMD good for? Sry, I never used UMD.

    Thanks.
    As of update 19, heal and spellcraft skills are valuable to clerics. Heal skill boots your cure/heal spells and spellcraft boost you force/fire spells (one of them also boots light spells i think). I agree that on a 28 pts build i would probably lower int to 12 and drop jump skill, but that is a personal choice.
    Str is not needed on this kind of caster build, starting at 10 with eventual tomes and items is enough to carry gear. He could boost Con to 16, but would need to drop say Int to 12 and Cha to 10, or just drop Int to 10. Personal choice again here, as long as Con is min 14 and Int 10, any choice is valid in my opinion.
    UMD is really good for any character, if only for scrolls: fire/ice shield, invisibility, blur/displacement, greater heroism, teleport.

  14. #34

    Default

    Yep, you can drop int some if you like.

    Jump is invaluable for blade barrier kiting while soloing, and also is just all-around useful to have for a variety of reasons. Several quests have a jump check of 30 to avoid annoying parts. (Undermine, Schemes of the Enemy, etc...)

    I mainly use UMD to use greater heroism and teleport scrolls. Fear can be annoying, and any alt without teleport makes me a sad panda.

    Try to keep full ranks on heal and spellcraft, though. Heal buffs your positive and negative damage, and spellcraft buffs your light and force damage. After playing this build for real for a couple weeks (as opposed to just testing it on lama) I've settled on Necrotic Ray and Sun Bolt as my two main ray spells, dropping the SLAs (including Avenging Light from Exalted Angel) entirely. I need to update the enhancements to reflect this.

  15. #35
    Community Member Rinani's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    3

    Default Feats

    Any particular reason for Quicken at 6 instead of 9?
    I am about to do my first TR from a wizard, and was thinking of following this, but was wondering about Quicken compared to grabbing Arcane Initiate at 6 and Quicken at 9.

  16. #36

    Default

    Good question; the original incarnation of this build took quicken later and arcane initiate earlier.

    I found that I didn't use DC spells in any meaningful way until I got access to level 5 spells. (Slay Living, Greater Command) Clerics get level 5 spells at 9, so 9 is s a natural fit for the DC-boosting past life feat.

    Quicken is a super nice to have for burst, which you can get as early as 6. (This build takes burst at 7, but same idea.)

    EDIT: I should probably explain why this build doesn't take burst until 7 when 6 seems like a much better way to go.

    By level 6 you can have a maximum of 24 AP spent. There is a very high priority on getting both nimbus of light and searing light SLAs as soon as possible. Maxing both costs 13 AP, leaving 11 points available by level 6. This is just enough to squeeze burst in at the end of 6, but I decided to add in the second Divine Disciple core (+2 to all saves) as early as possible without delaying the SLAs.

    I could be convinced to move +2 saves to level 7 and bump burst up to the end of level 6.

    When I plan out these builds I imagine running content on elite for bravery streak and choose what seems like the best for the level based on that. At level 6 an elite streaker is likely running level 4 elites. Irestone, proof is in the poison, freshen the air, the last two waterworks, maybe even Sharn. I asked myself which I'd rather have for those quests: burst or +2 to all saves. I decided +2 saves.

    EDIT 2: I'm now thinking maybe take both +2 saves AND burst by level 6 and pushing either spell points III or universal spell power III back to level 7. I know why I frontloaded spell power and spell points, but maybe getting burst a level earlier might be worth it. Then again, when I think of those level 4 elite quests I'm not sure how useful burst would actually be compared to just using cure spells. Keep in mind that turns will NOT regenerate until much later.

  17. #37
    Community Member DemonMage's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    1,365

    Default

    I even went so far as to push for Holy Smite SLA before bothering to start dipping into Radiant Servant at all. Having an AE SLA is just too important for leveling. Nimbus/Searing are nice, but being single target is a sizable limitation. It's maybe a little less important for a new player but for 3 more SP you can do damage to an infinite amount of mobs, and most fights in DDO are 5+ mobs early on, way more than that if you're not new and happy to risk dungeon alert.
    Caisha Stormweaver - Some class split dependent upon TR needs - Argonnessen
    Twitch, YouTube, Builds

  18. #38

    Default

    I've never bothered with holy smite in any meaningful way, same with flame strike and cometfall. My primary form of aoe damage while leveling is blade barrier.

    How good is the holy smite sla? How much damage does it do to each target at, say, level 9?

  19. #39
    Community Member DemonMage's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    1,365

    Default

    At level 6 it's doing about 80ish damage non crit.
    Caisha Stormweaver - Some class split dependent upon TR needs - Argonnessen
    Twitch, YouTube, Builds

  20. #40
    2014 DDO Players Council
    SirValentine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Eastern USA
    Posts
    5,770

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    I've never bothered with holy smite in any meaningful way, same with flame strike and cometfall. My primary form of aoe damage while leveling is blade barrier.
    I don't much use Holy Smite AFTER I have Blade Barrier...but you get it earlier. It's useful in that time frame of levelling.

    Cometfall, though...I only nuke with it if I have lots of SP to spare, but I use it much more than that, for CC. Heighten on, Maximize & Empower off. Great for those enemies Clerics that cast Death Ward and have high Will & Fort saves, but crappy Reflex. Or against things with too much Spell Resistance, which covers even more mobs on a first-lifer than someone with Wiz/FvS PLs to back them up.

Page 2 of 10 FirstFirst 123456 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

This form's session has expired. You need to reload the page.

Reload