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  1. #1
    Community Member
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    May 2010
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    Default Looking for advice and input!

    So I'm on my final life as a fighter, and this time decided to add a splash of monk to it (big splash really, more like a flood, 7 levels xD), and allow me to say how much more absolutely awesome it is than just a pure 20 fighter. I survive better, don't face plant traps, and just all around having a great time, so decided I'm skipping barbarian for my next 3 lives and going monk.

    Yes, I said three lives, on my third life as a fighter now, and I intend to go three lives as a monk.

    The reason I make this request is I'm debating going monk and splashing rogue so I can get rid of those pesky traps entirely and get that oh so pretty sneak attack bonus. But, I've run into a snag, and while trying to use the ddo planner to make the build...I'm finding it much more difficult than I thought.

    My first idea was to go 14monk/6 rogue, then I realized that 1% to dodge wasn't worth it, but figured 5 levels would be great, getting that sneak attack to 3d6. But the more I looked, the more that just didn't seem good, so I finally settled at 17monk/3rogue, because the extra 2d6 and trap sense seemed worthwhile, while the last 3 levels really weren't spectacular for monk (unless capstoning).

    However, with only 3 rogue levels, I found getting my DD up was really painful, and I wasn't sure I could get it high enough.

    So, my question is this...would it just be more worthwhile to forget about traps for now, and just go for the pure monk setup? Or is there a way to make this work, and still fork out some nasty looking numbers on the damage side?

    To give a heads up on what I have to work with, I have a 36 point build (obviously), and I do have a +4 tome of supreme ability on this character. I'm really not looking to do epic content, as I usually TR shortly after hitting 20 (this is my TR toon after all), I may finish up legendary dreadnought though as I'm at about 2 bubbles from maxing it out, but really that's all, and I may not even do that.

    I'm using hand wraps, because I think monks should smash things in the face with their fists, and I like the animation xD

    I have access to all races, though I think I'm going to stick with halfling...there's something amusing about the little guy doing the smashing...though I'd be lieing if I said I haven't debated a dwarf monk...because they look hilarious...doing that horizontal flip kick thing...go physics!

    As far as light/dark monk, I'm not picky, but I'm pretty sure I'm going to go shintao, which seems to require light monk unless I'm reading the wiki incorrectly? It just seems to be the choice with all it's shiny goodness, also as I'm not going too far into epic content, it seems to be more effective in the mid to later levels (what with all it's smashing tainted in the face).

    Any advice would be awesome, just remember I'm still new to the monk goodness, I can't believe I've been playing so long and haven't tried them before. D:
    Pure Fighter build - http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=408856 - Solvera on Ghallanda (TR2), feedback is welcomed!

  2. #2
    Community Member Todkaninchen's Avatar
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    Nov 2011
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    Default

    This close to the enhancement pass--and the variability that's going to have on halfling, rogue, and monk enhancements--I might wait for a couple weeks.

    The big reason why is shift of some of the feat-type abilities (like Weapon Finesse) to enhancements in certain restricted situations (like Ninja Spy with short swords and kama) plus the access of trapping skill boosts in the rogue mech enhancement sets which might help make your trapping more viable without a high level of added INT.

    I'm not a monk expert, my first is at level 15 right now, but I play a lot of trappers. Because monk isn't particularly skill point rich without a high INT, you're going to have to balance your rogue levels and your INT score (plus other means of boosting skills like gear and enhancements) to get a viable set of rogue skills. While it sounds like a ninja spy/rogue might be a nice fit, the pressure between rogue skills and the sneaky skills needed for ninja (unless you forgo sneaking) might not make that viable without a deep rogue splash.

    So, for each level of rogue--assuming a static INT--you get 4 extra skill points. However, concentration will be half-levels (so save that for your monk levels). If you consider skipping--mostly--open locks and restrict your trapping skills to just Disable Device, Spot, Search and your monk skills to Spot, Concentration, and maybe balance, that means--to keep full levels in those skills, you would need:

    For each monk level: 7 skill point
    For each rogue level (after 1st): 6 skill points with the surplus going into open lock.

    Given the higher value (7 Skill points), you'll need a starting INT of 16 for a +3 INT mod.

    If you want sneak skills, you can try to fill them in at higher levels (as your tome kicks in) or you can go higher INT lower or you can skip open locks all together and throw your surplus rogue level points (5 points per rogue levels at lower levels) into other skills.

    Alternatively, at INT 14 or maybe even 12 or 13, you could just skip open locks and make up the deficits in one or more skills on your monk levels.

    Under the current enhancements, if you went 14 monk/6 rogue, you could either get +2 to all your trapping skills (and another +2 and +2 skill boost in the requirements) as a mechanic or a bonus 1d6 sneak attack and +2 to your sneak skills as an assassin on top of the 6 levels of rogue granted feats (3d6 sneak attack, mainly, and some trap sense).

    However, if you can get the skill levels you want at 5 levels of rogue, level 15 monk has a nice save-or-die strike called Quivering Palm. I have't used it much yet, but it's cheaper than Touch of Death (30 vs. 50 ki) although Deathblock resists it. With a decent WIS score, it lands on enemy casters pretty often.

    So, good luck and I hope I helped a tiny bit (or start an informative discussion).

  3. #3
    Community Member
    Join Date
    May 2010
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    93

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Todkaninchen View Post
    This close to the enhancement pass--and the variability that's going to have on halfling, rogue, and monk enhancements--I might wait for a couple weeks.

    The big reason why is shift of some of the feat-type abilities (like Weapon Finesse) to enhancements in certain restricted situations (like Ninja Spy with short swords and kama) plus the access of trapping skill boosts in the rogue mech enhancement sets which might help make your trapping more viable without a high level of added INT.

    I'm not a monk expert, my first is at level 15 right now, but I play a lot of trappers. Because monk isn't particularly skill point rich without a high INT, you're going to have to balance your rogue levels and your INT score (plus other means of boosting skills like gear and enhancements) to get a viable set of rogue skills. While it sounds like a ninja spy/rogue might be a nice fit, the pressure between rogue skills and the sneaky skills needed for ninja (unless you forgo sneaking) might not make that viable without a deep rogue splash.

    So, for each level of rogue--assuming a static INT--you get 4 extra skill points. However, concentration will be half-levels (so save that for your monk levels). If you consider skipping--mostly--open locks and restrict your trapping skills to just Disable Device, Spot, Search and your monk skills to Spot, Concentration, and maybe balance, that means--to keep full levels in those skills, you would need:

    For each monk level: 7 skill point
    For each rogue level (after 1st): 6 skill points with the surplus going into open lock.

    Given the higher value (7 Skill points), you'll need a starting INT of 16 for a +3 INT mod.

    If you want sneak skills, you can try to fill them in at higher levels (as your tome kicks in) or you can go higher INT lower or you can skip open locks all together and throw your surplus rogue level points (5 points per rogue levels at lower levels) into other skills.

    Alternatively, at INT 14 or maybe even 12 or 13, you could just skip open locks and make up the deficits in one or more skills on your monk levels.

    Under the current enhancements, if you went 14 monk/6 rogue, you could either get +2 to all your trapping skills (and another +2 and +2 skill boost in the requirements) as a mechanic or a bonus 1d6 sneak attack and +2 to your sneak skills as an assassin on top of the 6 levels of rogue granted feats (3d6 sneak attack, mainly, and some trap sense).

    However, if you can get the skill levels you want at 5 levels of rogue, level 15 monk has a nice save-or-die strike called Quivering Palm. I have't used it much yet, but it's cheaper than Touch of Death (30 vs. 50 ki) although Deathblock resists it. With a decent WIS score, it lands on enemy casters pretty often.

    So, good luck and I hope I helped a tiny bit (or start an informative discussion).
    That's actually very helpful! Thank you very much for that input! I'll definitely have this post bookmarked to reference in the future!

    I wrote this completely forgetting how close the new enhancements really are, and still being at a low level on the TR toon...you are correct, it'll probably be out before hand, but the input is really nice and I do appreciate it!
    Pure Fighter build - http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=408856 - Solvera on Ghallanda (TR2), feedback is welcomed!

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