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  1. #1
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    Angry All of my enhancements are gone and my class is not a choice!

    I'm like really annoyed, dissapointed and ****ed. I thought the idea of being invited to the beta was to actually PLAY on it; but no! All of my enhancements are gone and now there's a WoW tree (one of the reasons I stopped playing WoW, I might add) AND to make matter worse, Virtuoso of the Sword isn't even a class. So, am I now suppoed to spend 3 hours reading wiki and searching through forums to find out what a spellsinger/warchanter is, what enhancements are good for them, and what stuff I will lose? Then another 3 hours picking enhancements and trying to figure out how to use this tree since everytime I mouse onto something I can't pick it because I have to have at least "x" amount of points alreay picked?

    Is this what DDO is going to do? All of my current characters will have to be redone? Because I don't want to do that. How do I get my $99 back because I'm not going to play if I have to redo all 10 of my characters.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by zagler View Post
    Is this what DDO is going to do? All of my current characters will have to be redone? Because I don't want to do that. How do I get my $99 back because I'm not going to play if I have to redo all 10 of my characters.
    This is indeed the shape of things to come. Many have been very critical of the dumbed down Enhancement Trees, but this is what will be happening.

    The only thing that I can really say is "Start at the bottom and work up." A lot of your familiar Virtuoso abilities have been folded into the Spellsinger Tree. A lot of new possibilities opened up. In general, the more 'simple' classes like Rogues come out a lot further ahead of classes like Favored Souls.

  3. #3
    Community Member Atremus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zagler View Post
    Is this what DDO is going to do? All of my current characters will have to be redone? Because I don't want to do that. How do I get my $99 back because I'm not going to play if I have to redo all 10 of my characters.
    I hate to tell you that this enhancement pass has been 2 years in the making. How did you not expect to have to redo all of your characters? If you quit, dont post about it. Just go.
    Last edited by Atremus; 08-01-2013 at 02:36 PM.
    Characters: Celemia / Tukson / Thau (Broken link) / Atremus

    “A pessimist is one who feels bad when he feels good for fear he'll feel worse when he feels better.”

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by zagler View Post
    I'm like really annoyed, dissapointed and ****ed. I thought the idea of being invited to the beta was to actually PLAY on it; but no! All of my enhancements are gone and now there's a WoW tree (one of the reasons I stopped playing WoW, I might add) AND to make matter worse, Virtuoso of the Sword isn't even a class. So, am I now suppoed to spend 3 hours reading wiki and searching through forums to find out what a spellsinger/warchanter is, what enhancements are good for them, and what stuff I will lose? Then another 3 hours picking enhancements and trying to figure out how to use this tree since everytime I mouse onto something I can't pick it because I have to have at least "x" amount of points alreay picked?

    Is this what DDO is going to do? All of my current characters will have to be redone? Because I don't want to do that. How do I get my $99 back because I'm not going to play if I have to redo all 10 of my characters.
    Change can be inconvenient, even scary. Vent, scream, and beat up a pillow. Then grab a pint of ice cream, log in, and explore your options. Take the time to see where everything is in the new tree. Use this time to figure out just how you will adjust your live character after beta.

    You will be okay. Just breathe.
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  5. #5
    Hero AZgreentea's Avatar
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    Meh, I actually like the new tree system better. It feels less like looking at an excel sheet and more like... well every computer game I have played for the last 10 years or more. A tree system is hardly unique to "the game that shall not be named".
    The problem is never how to get new, innovative thoughts into your mind, but how to get old ones out. Every mind is a building filled with archaic furniture. Clean out a corner of your mind and creativity will instantly fill it.
    Dee Hock

  6. #6
    Community Member Grosbeak07's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zagler View Post
    I'm like really annoyed, dissapointed and ****ed. I thought the idea of being invited to the beta was to actually PLAY on it; but no! All of my enhancements are gone and now there's a WoW tree (one of the reasons I stopped playing WoW, I might add) AND to make matter worse, Virtuoso of the Sword isn't even a class. So, am I now suppoed to spend 3 hours reading wiki and searching through forums to find out what a spellsinger/warchanter is, what enhancements are good for them, and what stuff I will lose? Then another 3 hours picking enhancements and trying to figure out how to use this tree since everytime I mouse onto something I can't pick it because I have to have at least "x" amount of points alreay picked?

    Is this what DDO is going to do? All of my current characters will have to be redone? Because I don't want to do that. How do I get my $99 back because I'm not going to play if I have to redo all 10 of my characters.
    Guess you have been under a rock for awhile.
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  7. #7
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    What's wrong with an enhancement UI that makes picking what you want easier? On live, one of the most annoying things is having to scroll through the entire list of unavailable enhancements, just to see what I need for a particular enhancement. With the trees, everything you need to know is in a format that's easier to read. (It's really only the insistence that a player need spend a total of 40 points in a specific tree for all of the core enhancements that makes it more restrictive than it needs to be.)

    I AM sorry that they seemed to have changed things so much that Virtuoso is not a prestige in its own right, anymore. Learning the new trees is an inconvenience, but you may find that your bard ends up much better than she was, on live. And if not, try bringing this up to the devs during the Lamannia events. In addition, submit a bug report on it. I recently found out that suggestions submitted as bug reports are apparently accepted. They may not follow through on the suggestion, but at least it's there.
    Power corrupts. Absolute power is really kinda neat.

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  8. #8
    Community Member Wanesa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zagler View Post

    Is this what DDO is going to do? All of my current characters will have to be redone? Because I don't want to do that. How do I get my $99 back because I'm not going to play if I have to redo all 10 of my characters.
    Start your 11th toon. Game on

    Thelanis: Shewind the Airbender (Sorc20/Epic5 -> Bard20/Epic8 -> Rog20/Epic8/Epic2 -> Harper_FvS20/Epic4 -> Art19), Azaxe (Rog18/Wiz2 -> Sorc20/Epic6)

  9. #9
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    I haven't checked out the beta yet, but if it's anything like the way EDs work, I welcome it. Trying to figure out enhancements right now is a morass of scrolling and clicking/unclicking "show all" -- very confusing and unintuitive.

    Change can be difficult and annoying but the alternative is stagnation. Give it a chance.

  10. #10
    RangerDangerGrrl Kawai's Avatar
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    yes...
    this just in...

    Bards have no enhancements because...
    ...well, Timmy... because Bards get none.
    *shrug

    they get to stand around and play lute.

    ~snaps fingers~
    garcon!

    chop chop! play something!
    TKSK - Thelanis ("Best Server" -NyTimes).

  11. #11
    RangerDangerGrrl Kawai's Avatar
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    sorry...
    that was lame.
    im sleepy.
    TKSK - Thelanis ("Best Server" -NyTimes).

  12. #12
    The Front Side Gratch's Avatar
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    OP warbled the same rant on Lama earlier for an hour.
    OP refused other people there (not me) who were willing to take time and help them out.

    If you want a game with no changes I hear buying a coin-op box for the living room is all the rage. Woo Dig Dug!

    You don't have to go "Wiki" the new enhancements. Most of them have descriptions of what they do and what pre-reqs they have even though it's a Beta setup. (Icons seem to be the biggest thing they are missing).

    A virtuoso missing their enhancements... how is that in any game changing way different than the current live server?

    I'd only compare the new UI to WoW in the way I would compare the previous UI to doing taxes.
    Last edited by Gratch; 08-01-2013 at 06:27 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan View Post
    DO NOT DO THIS. We are investigating.

  13. #13
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zagler View Post
    I'm like really annoyed, dissapointed and ****ed. I thought the idea of being invited to the beta was to actually PLAY on it; but no! All of my enhancements are gone and now there's a WoW tree (one of the reasons I stopped playing WoW, I might add) AND to make matter worse, Virtuoso of the Sword isn't even a class. So, am I now suppoed to spend 3 hours reading wiki and searching through forums to find out what a spellsinger/warchanter is, what enhancements are good for them, and what stuff I will lose? Then another 3 hours picking enhancements and trying to figure out how to use this tree since everytime I mouse onto something I can't pick it because I have to have at least "x" amount of points alreay picked?

    Is this what DDO is going to do? All of my current characters will have to be redone? Because I don't want to do that. How do I get my $99 back because I'm not going to play if I have to redo all 10 of my characters.
    Why do have to read the wiki... what each enhancement does is right there in front of you. And also what pre-reqs are needed as well

    If you could do the old enhancements okay, you shouldn't have any problems with this UI... It's much cleaner.

    Also, since this is beta, it's okay to mess up... You don't have to make your guy perfect on Lamannia and you can reset enhancements over and over if you want to.
    Last edited by Thrudh; 08-01-2013 at 06:41 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gary_Gygax
    No single character has all the skills and resources needed to guarantee success in all endeavors; favorable results can usually only be achieved through group effort. No single player character wins, in the sense that he or she defeats all other player characters; the goal of the forces of good can only be attained through cooperation, so that victory is a group achievement rather than an individual one.

  14. #14
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tscheuss View Post
    Change can be inconvenient, even scary. Vent, scream, and beat up a pillow. Then grab a pint of ice cream, log in, and explore your options. Take the time to see where everything is in the new tree. Use this time to figure out just how you will adjust your live character after beta.

    You will be okay. Just breathe.
    This is what I did... I wasted a few hours over the weekend checking out all my characters enhancements, but with a few beers, it was quite fun and interesting.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago.
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gary_Gygax
    No single character has all the skills and resources needed to guarantee success in all endeavors; favorable results can usually only be achieved through group effort. No single player character wins, in the sense that he or she defeats all other player characters; the goal of the forces of good can only be attained through cooperation, so that victory is a group achievement rather than an individual one.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gratch View Post
    OP warbled the same rant on Lama earlier for an hour.
    OP refused other people there (not me) who were willing to take time and help them out.

    If you want a game with no changes I hear buying a coin-op box for the living room is all the rage. Woo Dig Dug!

    You don't have to go "Wiki" the new enhancements. Most of them have descriptions of what they do and what pre-reqs they have even though it's a Beta setup. (Icons seem to be the biggest thing they are missing).

    A virtuoso missing their enhancements... how is that in any game changing way different than the current live server?

    I'd only compare the new UI to WoW in the way I would compare the previous UI to doing taxes.
    Sometimes angry people get target fixation. We just need to let her have her vent, and then be there to help pick up the pieces. Who hasn't felt the need for a good sulk?
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  16. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gratch View Post
    You don't have to go "Wiki" the new enhancements. Most of them have descriptions of what they do
    Quote Originally Posted by Thrudh View Post
    Why do have to read the wiki... what each enhancement does is right there in front of you.
    In fairness, there are several hidden "rank 3 only" enhancements sprinkled around the trees, and they're usually pretty sweet. I will never plan a build without verifying what all the rank 3 abilities are, and for that wiki is far quicker than trying to squeeze that info out of the new UI.

    Quick example: Arcane Archer spell point enhancement grants Magical Training on rank 3. That would be super easy to never see and a downer to miss out on.

  17. #17
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    Default I Have "issues" with leggo directions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gratch View Post
    OP warbled the same rant on Lama earlier for an hour.
    OP refused other people there (not me) who were willing to take time and help them out.

    If you want a game with no changes I hear buying a coin-op box for the living room is all the rage. Woo Dig Dug!

    You don't have to go "Wiki" the new enhancements. Most of them have descriptions of what they do and what pre-reqs they have even though it's a Beta setup. (Icons seem to be the biggest thing they are missing).

    A virtuoso missing their enhancements... how is that in any game changing way different than the current live server?

    I'd only compare the new UI to WoW in the way I would compare the previous UI to doing taxes.
    What's OP mean? And that was probably me. I was not singing softly with a succession of changing notes. You need to look up the definition of warbled. I believe the term you're looking for is desultory. It's one thing to redo your enhancements. It's quite another thing to have your entire character line up disappear. I don't even know what a spellsinger or a warchanter IS. And, yeah, I was too aggravated to "party" with someone who would just tell me what to pick without [me] having any understanding of what or why. Moreover, I won't know how to play the character that I end up with. What if you were a rogue and you picked the assissin path and then all of a sudden it's gone. How would you redo your enhancements for a path that you know nothing about? Tschüs ist korrect! ich werde meckern und stöhnen!

    And what does "A virtuoso missing their enhancements... how is that in any game changing way different than the current live server" mean?

    And why are most of you so rude in your responses? I have a legitimate complaint and my post was intended to let the developers know that I'm not happy about my path being obsolete suddenly. Also, SOME of us don't do "lego" directions very well!

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheKeeper1981 View Post
    What's wrong with an enhancement UI that makes picking what you want easier? On live, one of the most annoying things is having to scroll through the entire list of unavailable enhancements, just to see what I need for a particular enhancement. With the trees, everything you need to know is in a format that's easier to read. (It's really only the insistence that a player need spend a total of 40 points in a specific tree for all of the core enhancements that makes it more restrictive than it needs to be.)

    I AM sorry that they seemed to have changed things so much that Virtuoso is not a prestige in its own right, anymore. Learning the new trees is an inconvenience, but you may find that your bard ends up much better than she was, on live. And if not, try bringing this up to the devs during the Lamannia events. In addition, submit a bug report on it. I recently found out that suggestions submitted as bug reports are apparently accepted. They may not follow through on the suggestion, but at least it's there.
    As someone who has a 23rd level Virtuoso and tried out Spellsinger, I am delighted they merged them. Neither one of the prestiges offers enough on its own to be worthwhile. Together, they make a pretty good prestige that offers enough to keep the character fun and interesting.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by zagler View Post
    What's OP mean? And that was probably me. I was not singing softly with a succession of changing notes. You need to look up the definition of warbled. I believe the term you're looking for is desultory. It's one thing to redo your enhancements. It's quite another thing to have your entire character line up disappear. I don't even know what a spellsinger or a warchanter IS. And, yeah, I was too aggravated to "party" with someone who would just tell me what to pick without [me] having any understanding of what or why. Moreover, I won't know how to play the character that I end up with. What if you were a rogue and you picked the assissin path and then all of a sudden it's gone. How would you redo your enhancements for a path that you know nothing about? Tschüs ist korrect! ich werde meckern und stöhnen!

    And what does "A virtuoso missing their enhancements... how is that in any game changing way different than the current live server" mean?

    And why are most of you so rude in your responses? I have a legitimate complaint and my post was intended to let the developers know that I'm not happy about my path being obsolete suddenly. Also, SOME of us don't do "lego" directions very well!
    You need to just settle down and have a look at the new enhancements. The merged spellsinger/virtuoso tree is pretty good, in my opinion. There are even some things in the warchanter tree that I took on my bard. It's actually quite a lot of fun to explore the new enhancements. All the stuff you had before is still there. It just looks different. Most of the feat pre-reqs are gone. You no longer need toughness feat. There is a lot to like. Chill out and have some fun with it.

  20. #20
    Community Member die's Avatar
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    If it's any thing like the neverwinter Tree's Ill be very Sad indeed
    Kahzadoom~Xzr~Irondoom~Doomlord~XvKing DoomHammer~
    Xoriat Born~Doompriest~Doom~DoomTusk~Legion of Doom~Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering.

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