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  1. #1
    The Front Side Gratch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Sunnyvale, Cactus Area

    Default Varg - Wizzies need SLA free metas - numbers for you

    I keep bugging devs (mostly Pilo+Varg) during the chats about Wizard SLA lack of metas. So here's the #'s.

    Testing Notes:
    • Evil == Negative (as Dark Fire is listed as Evil in its description)
    • Only counted non-crits and non-saves and non-helpless (though Dojo is laggy and has other peoples constantly "testing".
    • Stopped testing if any bard or other buffs appeared on character
    • No destiny or twists activated. No other enh/abilities used to weaken target.
    • L20 Wizard/8epic vs L20 Sorc/8epic
    • Most spell power sources show up in character sheet I'm hoping... at least item equip wise that seemed correct.
    • Damage Range shown is across 8 damage test values (non-crit/non-save/non-helpless).
    • Spell Power is from character sheet is shown as (XX) after each damage range.
    • Did not wipe Sorc heroic enhancements to test the low ball spell power as it's tough to get the SLA's w/o also having much higher spell power from the tree. Hence NA. Similar NA for Arcane Blast low spell power damage.
    • Both characters had max spellcraft ranks (though ungeared wizard's int items) and no GH.
    • Equipped L28 Force item on wizard and L28 electric item on sorc: +150 spell power (Necro item on wiz was only L25).

    SLA: Chill Touch Dark Fire Arcane Bolt Arcane Blast Necro Touch Necro Bolt Shocking Grasp Electric Loop Lightning Bolt
    Cost: 2 sp 5 use/rest 2 sp 6 sp 2 hp 5 hp 2 sp 4 sp 6 sp
    Cooldown: 6 6 3 8 6 6 4 5 6
    Element Negative Evil Force Force Negative Negative Electric Electric Electric
    Damage Low 35-41 (46) 186-233 (46) 70-100(61) NA 75-97(46) 71-103(46) NA NA NA
    Damage Low M+E 85-127(46) 193-224(46) 83-104(61) NA 81-96(46) 83-110(46) NA NA NA
    Damage High 126-142(251) 361-420(251) 126-179(285) 144-191(285) 137-168(251) 142-171(251) 145-159(263) 101-123(263) 228-257(263)
    Damage High M+E 145-159(251) 355-418(251) 129-175(285) 147-193(285) 136-170(251) 133-172(251) 205-258(263) 170-205(263) 372-417(263)

    Sorcerers get free Maximize and Empower metas. Wizard Chill Touch (and other AM core abilities) also get some amount.
    Drow Dark Fire isn't that bad though also doesn't pickup metas and only has 5 uses but it's just a few AP. (Also it's 2 of those missiles at L11 and 3 at L21 though still single target).
    Sorc Lightning Bolt wins even when not meta'ed.
    All the wizzy SLA's with L28 +150 spell power are still under 200 damage.
    The one wizard SLA tested with area damage has an 8 second cooldown.

    While I think Sorcs should be the damage dealers, I always thought that was from more spell points, faster cooldowns. I'm not saying wizards SLA's should equal sorcs, but they aren't even halfway right now despite more spell power on the force spells. I'd think you are also less worried about AM's damaging themselves faster now that they have a lot more HP with higher levels even though their SLA's.

    If you can only meet halfway... At least give Wizards maximize free.

    Other Issue:
    I should note as a separate topic... devs said they didn't realize SLA Fireball and SLA Acidblast (etc) target differently (WRONGLY) compared to the nonSLA versions of those spells. Hopefully someone more enterprising can give a good video example of that issue. Or KookieKobold can note they have good bugs on that issue. I believe they target the same if you have a target... it's when you don't have a target the SLA's sometimes (always) fire ~45 degrees too high from reticle.
    Last edited by Gratch; 07-31-2013 at 08:17 PM. Reason: Clarifications
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan View Post
    DO NOT DO THIS. We are investigating.

  2. #2
    Developer Vargouille's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Flying overhead


    Nice post! ... and we'll look into some numbers.

  3. #3
    Community Member redspecter23's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Toronto, Ontario


    Thanks for putting the numbers together. I think regardless of the math involved all SLA's should follow the same rules. Either allow appropriate metamagics or not. If there is an extremely compelling reason for a specific SLA to not have metamagics applied, it should be very clearly stated in the SLA description so players don't assume it can apply when it doesn't. If an SLA would be unbalanced with free metamagics then there are a number of options including tweaking the base SLA itself, adding it to the spell list so metamagics raise the cost appropriately or just removing/reworking it from the ground up. My inner OCD goes nuts over inconsistencies like these.
    Kaarloe - Degenerate Matter - Argonnessen

  4. #4
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2012


    Regarding the fireball/acidblast, Im pretty sure Hellball has the same exact issue.

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