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  1. #1
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    Default New Player, need a tank build and dps build

    I am about to start playing DDO with a friend of mine. However we don't really know how to build our characters.

    I'd like a tanking class (dwarf) with as many points in other classes as possible (as mixed as possible) and for my friend a fast attacking dps build (either dual wield or ranged)

  2. #2
    Community Member Soulfurnace's Avatar
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    You want a tank, that splashes as much as possible?
    Can you restate what you mean? Given that there are 20 possible levels, with a max of 3 classes, and a prestige at 18 and a capstone at 20, pure/lightly splashed make more sense.

    So, please: Redefine what you want your dwarf to do - if it's purely tanking, level 20 Stalwart Defender fighter, or 18/2 Defender of Syb paladin/fighter (for feats) would be my suggestion. If it involves healing, that's more like paladin. If you want evasion, again, a different build.

    *Note. Being a tank and nothing else will make DDO harder. There's an emphasis on multiple roles these days, sadly enough.

    Your friend wants a "fast attacking dps build", using TWF or ranged?

    Okay, I'll be honest. Ranging is lower dps than anything else, aside from 20 seconds every 2 minutes. (That's to say, 1/6th of the time it's great dps, 5/6th of the time it's bad)

    The most common way around this is a monkcher - A build that has manyshot and 10k stars (with zen archery) to keep up a 2-3 arrow per shot average (Well. Give or take). However, that requires monk and preferably Helf, along with tome requirements and a lot of stat requirements - not easy for a 28 pt build.

    However, as you also mention TWF, I'd be inclined to say go Ranger.
    Easy to make, they get lots of free feats (less requirement of stat points), self healing, dps, can use Manyshot+IPS and GTWF for good over-all dps.

    Use manyshot when available (highest dps in game if geared, casters aside), swapping over to TWF for more dps when it's on timer. Typical directions are Tempest (for more melee dps), or arcane archer (for slaying arrows, which give an avg of +25 dmg per hit)

    (Yes, I could just assume you want X and give it to you, but where's the fun in that? ^^)

  3. #3
    Community Member Lauf's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greggthegrim View Post
    I am about to start playing DDO with a friend of mine. However we don't really know how to build our characters.

    I'd like a tanking class (dwarf) with as many points in other classes as possible (as mixed as possible) and for my friend a fast attacking dps build (either dual wield or ranged)

    for 2 new players, I'd say go with a paladin and a ranger. that way if you join a party there'll be fewer expectations of you (no special must have buffs/roles for those classes) yet each can self heal and do nice damage.

    if your friend would take 1 level of rogue (18 ranger /1 fighter / 1 rogue) he could do traps as well.

    I'll try and find time to flesh out builds later on, if no one gets to it first

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soulfurnace View Post
    You want a tank, that splashes as much as possible?
    Can you restate what you mean? Given that there are 20 possible levels, with a max of 3 classes, and a prestige at 18 and a capstone at 20, pure/lightly splashed make more sense.

    So, please: Redefine what you want your dwarf to do - if it's purely tanking, level 20 Stalwart Defender fighter, or 18/2 Defender of Syb paladin/fighter (for feats) would be my suggestion. If it involves healing, that's more like paladin. If you want evasion, again, a different build.

    *Note. Being a tank and nothing else will make DDO harder. There's an emphasis on multiple roles these days, sadly enough.

    Your friend wants a "fast attacking dps build", using TWF or ranged?

    Okay, I'll be honest. Ranging is lower dps than anything else, aside from 20 seconds every 2 minutes. (That's to say, 1/6th of the time it's great dps, 5/6th of the time it's bad)

    The most common way around this is a monkcher - A build that has manyshot and 10k stars (with zen archery) to keep up a 2-3 arrow per shot average (Well. Give or take). However, that requires monk and preferably Helf, along with tome requirements and a lot of stat requirements - not easy for a 28 pt build.

    However, as you also mention TWF, I'd be inclined to say go Ranger.
    Easy to make, they get lots of free feats (less requirement of stat points), self healing, dps, can use Manyshot+IPS and GTWF for good over-all dps.

    Use manyshot when available (highest dps in game if geared, casters aside), swapping over to TWF for more dps when it's on timer. Typical directions are Tempest (for more melee dps), or arcane archer (for slaying arrows, which give an avg of +25 dmg per hit)

    (Yes, I could just assume you want X and give it to you, but where's the fun in that? ^^)
    Thanks for the reply.

    I'm just a fan of multiclasses, which is why I want to have a characters that is as mixed as possible. However, if there isn't anything like that available I'd go for a tank that can pull off some decent dps (mostly for solo play; don't want to take years just to finish a quest).

    I found the dps builds you mentioned on the forum so I just sent them to my friend.

  5. #5
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    Default Find out what you like, FIRST!

    I assume you have some experience with other MMOs. Be very careful!

    It is not just that DDO allows you to create characters whose flaws don't show until much later. I am sure everyone has already told you this.

    It is that there is a bewildering range of possible sound characters, that work perfectly well in the right hands, BUT which need special gear or play style to be effective.

    I really really recommend that you play something fairly obvious, not just until you know how it all works, but until you find out how YOU like to work. But then almost every new player deletes their first character and starts again, so don't get too worried about it.

    Lastly, shallow splashes are much commoner because they are easier to get right, although unusual builds with deep splashes can be great fun (Niwareka is 12 Ranger /7 Rogue / 1 Fighter).
    www.LegendsGuild.eu - on Thelanis
    Brunhildha (Stroppy healer); Niwareka (Sneaky Ranger); Hiacynthe (Happy Monk); Juss (Hitty Healer); Sharkee (Dirty old Shenanigan); Kawariki (Confused drow wizzy)

  6. #6
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    Hi, welcome to DDO.
    Quote Originally Posted by Greggthegrim View Post
    I'd like a tanking class (dwarf) with as many points in other classes as possible (as mixed as possible) and for my friend a fast attacking dps build (either dual wield or ranged)
    For your friend, have a look at my Tempest trapmonkey; it's got dual-wielding and archery, trap skills, UMD, and other goodies, all w/out requiring any tomes or special gear.

    As for your build...well, let's get a few things outta the way:
    • Most DDO vets will tell you that a dedicated tank isn't required for most content. And that's true...once you're a DDO vet who knows what they're doing. But I actually think a good tank build is useful for newcomers: partly because emphasizing survivability (vs pure DPS) gives you a larger margin for error when you're learning the ropes; and partly because you learn important lessons about aggro mgmt, tactics, etc. as a tank that you might not learn from a pure DPS build. The only tactic a barb learns is "hit `em `til they stop twitching!"
    • Good tanks have both good survivability and good DPS (partly to kill things quicker, ofc, but also to maintain aggro); I usually go for about 75% DPS / 25% tanking split with my feats etc. but that can vary.
    • Ftr and pally are the obvious classes for "classic" S&B tanks; ftrs have better DPS & a lot more feats, pallies have better survivability & self-sufficiency. MCing tank builds are doable, but tricky, partly because the third-tier PrEs are pretty nice and partly because ftrs & pallies get +10% doublestrike bonuses at higher lvls that you may lose by MCing (ftrs get it by staying pure, pallies get it from the Zeal spell @ lvl 14). So for a newbie tank, pure ftr or pal 18 / ftr 2 are your best options, IMHO.
    • There is a major overhaul of the Enhancements in the works (currently in closed beta); you can read about the alpha preview here. It seems clear that this is going to have major implications for how we optimize our builds; so much of the build advice we offer now may be rendered obsolete by the end of the month. The good news is dwarves are supposed to finally get Dwarven Defender racial PrE (knock on wood), which will be a huge boon for MCed / unconventional dwarven tanks.

  7. #7
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    Here's one example of a dwarven tank:
    Code:
    Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.16.01
    DDO Character Planner Home Page
    
    Level 25 True Neutral Dwarf Female
    (20 Fighter \ 5 Epic) 
    Hit Points: 557
    Spell Points: 0 
    BAB: 20\20\25\30\30
    Fortitude: 18
    Reflex: 8
    Will: 5
    
                      Starting          Feat/Enhancement
    Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
    (28 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 25)
    Strength             16                    27
    Dexterity            12                    14
    Constitution         18                    22
    Intelligence         12                    13
    Wisdom                8                     8
    Charisma              6                     6
    
    Tomes Used
    +1 Tome of Intelligence used at level 11
    +2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 17
    +2 Tome of Strength used at level 20
    +3 Tome of Constitution used at level 23
    
    Level 1 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Power Attack
    Feat: (Selected) Toughness
    
    
    Level 2 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Cleave
    
    
    Level 3 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Selected) Shield Mastery
    
    
    Level 4 (Fighter)
    Ability Raise: STR
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Great Cleave
    
    
    Level 5 (Fighter)
    
    
    Level 6 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Selected) Stunning Blow
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Two Handed Fighting
    Enhancement: Fighter Armor Class Boost I
    Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost I
    Enhancement: Dwarven Armor Mastery I
    Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Damage I
    Enhancement: Dwarven Spell Defense I
    Enhancement: Fighter Armor Mastery I
    Enhancement: Fighter Stalwart Defender I
    Enhancement: Fighter Strategy (Stunning Blow) I
    Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
    Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
    Enhancement: Improved Intimidate I
    Enhancement: Improved Intimidate II
    Enhancement: Fighter Strength I
    Enhancement: Fighter Toughness I
    Enhancement: Fighter Toughness II
    
    
    Level 7 (Fighter)
    
    
    Level 8 (Fighter)
    Ability Raise: STR
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Critical: Slashing Weapons
    
    
    Level 9 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Selected) Improved Shield Mastery
    
    
    Level 10 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Two Handed Fighting
    
    
    Level 11 (Fighter)
    
    
    Level 12 (Fighter)
    Ability Raise: STR
    Feat: (Selected) Combat Expertise
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Improved Trip
    Enhancement: Fighter Armor Class Boost II
    Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Damage II
    Enhancement: Dwarven Spell Defense II
    Enhancement: Dwarven Spell Defense III
    Enhancement: Fighter Stalwart Defender II
    Enhancement: Fighter Item Defense I
    Enhancement: Fighter Strength II
    Enhancement: Fighter Strength III
    
    
    Level 13 (Fighter)
    
    
    Level 14 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Greater Two Handed Fighting
    
    
    Level 15 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Selected) Improved Sunder
    
    
    Level 16 (Fighter)
    Ability Raise: STR
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Focus: Slashing Weapons
    
    
    Level 17 (Fighter)
    
    
    Level 18 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Selected) Dodge
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Mobility
    
    
    Level 19 (Fighter)
    
    
    Level 20 (Fighter)
    Ability Raise: STR
    Feat: (Fighter Bonus) Weapon Specialization: Slashing Weapons
    Enhancement: Fighter Armor Class Boost III
    Enhancement: Fighter Extra Action Boost I
    Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost II
    Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost III
    Enhancement: Fighter Haste Boost IV
    Enhancement: Fighter Weapon Alacrity
    Enhancement: Dwarven Constitution I
    Enhancement: Dwarven Tactics I
    Enhancement: Fighter Stalwart Defender III
    Enhancement: Fighter Dwarven Waraxe Specialization I
    Enhancement: Fighter Greataxe Specialization I
    Enhancement: Fighter Item Defense II
    Enhancement: Racial Toughness III
    Enhancement: Fighter Toughness III
    
    
    Level 21 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Selected) Overwhelming Critical
    
    
    Level 22 (Fighter)
    
    
    Level 23 (Fighter)
    
    
    Level 24 (Fighter)
    Feat: (Selected) Epic Toughness
    
    
    Level 25 (Fighter)

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