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  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zibowskij View Post
    BYOH means Bring Your Own Heals.
    I agree, but I have had a ton of people join and pop a cleric hireling..

    So my question to everyone..Is that BYOHeals or BYOHireling? Different or the same?

  2. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charononus View Post
    Right what was presented was one side saying I incapped and the mean cleric didn't heal me. Hardly an unbiased version of events. It could be true, but most likely isn't the whole story as things like this rarely are.
    Yes. In which case, obviously the assessment would be different.

  3. #103
    Community Member Vellrad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qaliya View Post
    I will blacklist on sight anyone I see who is that selfish or spiteful. You guys can make your own choices.
    Entire server(s) tremble with fear...

  4. #104
    Community Member Zibowskij's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drwaz99 View Post
    I agree, but I have had a ton of people join and pop a cleric hireling..

    So my question to everyone..Is that BYOHeals or BYOHireling? Different or the same?

    You don't know how many people joined my BYOH LFMs trying to tell me that BYOH means BYOHireling... After a while I stopped caring, as long as they don't bother me for heals

  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nightmanis View Post
    They're as obligated to do something as a rogue is obligated to be a trap monkey. And I'll have you know, my rogue is a terrible trap monkey.
    When my rogue is in party with arti, neither of us can get to a trap soon enough. We compete for disables, in addition to helping the party kill mobs. It's fun. When my cleric is in party with another healer, we divide up party (re healing), keep an eye on each other, and help kill mobs. It's still fun.

    When one joins a group for quest, one implicitly agrees to look out for the team. Therein lies obligation.
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  6. #106
    Community Member Ungood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zibowskij View Post
    or because you have your pair of vampiric stonedust wraps and you think you're selfhealing.
    Woah dude. No dissing the Stone dust man, that is just uncool.

  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by PsychoJester View Post
    +1 Definitely approve!

    Yesterday I saw a party in Orien LFM, with cleric and BYOH.
    The cleric was the leader and no, he was nor ironic....

    Next time i'll reply with not fight (if melee) or not cast (if caster).
    Lazy or stupid clerics exist......
    Sigh... not this thread again.

    I will put that sort of lfm up on my cleric if say I'm on my clonk and I predominantly want to fight and not heal - she has a tiny spell pool and normally I would just be soloing or running with self sufficient people. It doesn't mean I won't heal during hard battles, it just means *don't rely on me or you will die as I don't have enough for us both and I'm going to keep myself alive first*.

    How do you get it that not fighting and not casting is NOT the equivalent? If I was on my clonk (and possibly just soloing everything but I wanted company so I tossed up an lfm) and got a wizard or a caster like that I would politely ask them to leave the party.

    Not healing is NOT the equivalent of not doing anything.
    ~Thelanis ~ Khyber ~

  8. #108
    Community Member Ungood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zibowskij View Post
    You don't know how many people joined my BYOH LFMs trying to tell me that BYOH means BYOHireling... After a while I stopped caring, as long as they don't bother me for heals
    if a hire is how you have to heal, then that is how you have to do it.. just don't be the sixth person to join and remember you took up two slots, make yourself worth it.

  9. #109
    Founder Laggin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tscheuss View Post
    When my rogue is in party with arti, neither of us can get to a trap soon enough. We compete for disables, in addition to helping the party kill mobs. It's fun. When my cleric is in party with another healer, we divide up party (re healing), keep an eye on each other, and help kill mobs. It's still fun.

    When one joins a group for quest, one implicitly agrees to look out for the team. Therein lies obligation.
    When I'm in a group with other healers I just let them heal because it just ends up me or the other cleric wasting mana.
    Don't be mean to me or my guild leader will kick your ^*&
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  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drwaz99 View Post
    I agree, but I have had a ton of people join and pop a cleric hireling..

    So my question to everyone..Is that BYOHeals or BYOHireling? Different or the same?
    Different slightly - I would ask the leader if it's ok to pop a hireling first. A lot of the time they may likely be ok with it but sometimes they need that party spot for a real player.
    ~Thelanis ~ Khyber ~

  11. #111
    Community Member AzB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drwaz99 View Post
    I agree, but I have had a ton of people join and pop a cleric hireling..

    So my question to everyone..Is that BYOHeals or BYOHireling? Different or the same?
    I generally could care less, but you do have to consider that some classes don't really have an option other than a hireling.

    I do think it's pretty silly to see a cleric with a healer hire in tow, but hey, whatever makes you happy.

  12. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by Laggin View Post
    When I'm in a group with other healers I just let them heal because it just ends up me or the other cleric wasting mana.
    What?! Then your cleric is just piking! We have all seen that clerics MAIN JOB is healing and they are just second rate if they're not doing that. Amazing that someone that complains about a cleric not healing in a BYOH group would come out with this LOL.

  13. #113
    Community Member Qhualor's Avatar
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    joined a group running Eyes of Stone chain 2 days ago. party leader popped a cleric hire with a cleric in the group. the cleric was like "LOL! REALLY!?!?" the cleric dropped after completing Diplomatic Impunity. I was glad to have him in the party, but he didn't do much using maybe 1/4 of his sp and never shrined.

  14. #114
    Community Member Ungood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MeliCat View Post
    How do you get it that not fighting and not casting is NOT the equivalent? If I was on my clonk (and possibly just soloing everything but I wanted company so I tossed up an lfm) and got a wizard or a caster like that I would politely ask them to leave the party.
    You are right. Not healing is not the same as not doing anything.

    But it is the same as an Arcane not buffing.

    So, lets put a more reasonable situation here, If you asked the Arcane for haste, Rage, FF, Blur, G Hero, or pretty much any buff, and they just scoffed at you and ran off and started to do the dungeon saying "I'm not a buff bot, noob! learn to play!" would you be all like "Oh yah, you are so right, I am so wrong to expect you to give me anything, I should totally provide all my own stuff" or would you think the person was being a jerk?

  15. #115
    Founder Laggin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HAL View Post
    What?! Then your cleric is just piking! We have all seen that clerics MAIN JOB is healing and they are just second rate if they're not doing that. Amazing that someone that complains about someone not healing in a BYOH group would come out with this LOL.
    Calm down Hal. If the players laying incapped I'll sling a heal, but remember its BYOH.

    As I said I have six divine healer types, only one is a unabashed nannybot. All the other do other stuff. If I'm playing my healbot, then I'll let the other know I'm healing.

    All I'm asking for is a heal if I'm incapped. Why is that not sinking in?
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  16. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drwaz99 View Post
    I agree, but I have had a ton of people join and pop a cleric hireling..

    So my question to everyone..Is that BYOHeals or BYOHireling? Different or the same?
    If he can handle the hireling I don't care. You want to attract people, who are very familiar with the content. Thus, you aim at reliable people, who might fail only at the natural 1 on anything. A hireling is a -5% risk and not reliable. While at current xp levels that does not have a big impact it is uncalled. I'd expect to be asked at least.

    I usually post *There may be no healer, ip* since I take the first 5, who apply and take off. Those people, who have to rely on other sources for healing than themselves avoid these LFMs, the majority of people joining are self healing. In case nobody but one person joins I don't even care if that person pops a hireling.
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  17. #117
    Community Member AzB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tscheuss View Post
    When my rogue is in party with arti, neither of us can get to a trap soon enough. We compete for disables, in addition to helping the party kill mobs. It's fun. When my cleric is in party with another healer, we divide up party (re healing), keep an eye on each other, and help kill mobs. It's still fun.

    When one joins a group for quest, one implicitly agrees to look out for the team. Therein lies obligation.
    Agreed. It can be a lot of fun to try to be the best at what you're expected to do.

    And I did try to heal while I was doing my divine lives... I really did.

    But I solo for the most part, and the toon was set up for soloing. Major damage bonuses, and not so much in the healing power. And I gotta say, the few times I did heal a group with my FvS, (cleric was much easier to lazy heal with aura and bursts) I really noticed that I was using mana far faster keeping those two barbs up than it would be used if I just killed the monsters myself. But those guys were always out front, and it was difficult for me to get ahead and kill so they wouldn't get so banged up. But in the big battles, I pretty much just stood there and tossed heals constantly. Not what I'd call fun.

    That's why I left the divines for last on my completionist. I was not looking forward to playing them. On the plus side, I actually had a lot of fun with them when I wasn't being someone's red bar nanny. Both cleric and FvS are amazingly versatile classes. They don't have to be nannybots, they can do some major dps on their own. And boy, are they hard to kill.

    So while I feel for the fighters and especially barbs with their odd self hurting program, I also understand why a cleric would post a byoh lfm. And part of the problem is that so many people use hireling healers, they get into the bad habit of expecting the divine to follow them around and heal them. It's unfair to expect everyone to play a divine like a robot. Some people do, and do it well, and enjoy it. But not everyone does.

  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ungood View Post
    You are right. Not healing is not the same as not doing anything.

    But it is the same as an Arcane not buffing.

    So, lets put a more reasonable situation here, If you asked the Arcane for haste, Rage, FF, Blur, G Hero, or pretty much any buff, and they just scoffed at you and ran off and started to do the dungeon saying "I'm not a buff bot, noob! learn to play!" would you be all like "Oh yah, you are so right, I am so wrong to expect you to give me anything, I should totally provide all my own stuff" or would you think the person was being a jerk?
    Seriously who cares about people not buffing these days if you are on a self sufficient character? I have everything I need most times. I have zero expectation of being buffed. Sure it's nice, but no way would I expect it. And I don't understand why others are so demanding to expect it either when so many of us can be so self sufficient. Rather I am more likely to think that they are wasting their sp on buffs when they could be using it to kill or CC stuff.

    It's out of kindness I and others will notice that someone doesn't have a high enough level ship and give the resists they need, or can see they need a GH in whatever situation, or a deathward, fom or blur. And we are always willing to give out when asked (when reasonable - GH in the shroud by a level 25 barbarian?) as we can't always see what is needed (fom for example).

    So I don't find your argument valid at all.
    ~Thelanis ~ Khyber ~

  19. #119
    Community Member Ungood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MeliCat View Post
    Seriously who cares about people not buffing these days if you are on a self sufficient character? I have everything I need most times. I have zero expectation of being buffed. Sure it's nice, but no way would I expect it. And I don't understand why others are so demanding to expect it either when so many of us can be so self sufficient. Rather I am more likely to think that they are wasting their sp on buffs when they could be using it to kill or CC stuff.

    It's out of kindness I and others will notice that someone doesn't have a high enough level ship and give the resists they need, or can see they need a GH in whatever situation, or a deathward, fom or blur. And we are always willing to give out when asked (when reasonable - GH in the shroud by a level 25 barbarian?) as we can't always see what is needed (fom for example).

    So I don't find your argument valid at all.
    It wasn't an argument, it was a question.

    Maybe the real problem is people are looking for a fight that does not exist. LOL.

  20. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ungood View Post
    You are right. Not healing is not the same as not doing anything.

    But it is the same as an Arcane not buffing.

    So, lets put a more reasonable situation here, If you asked the Arcane for haste, Rage, FF, Blur, G Hero, or pretty much any buff, and they just scoffed at you and ran off and started to do the dungeon saying "I'm not a buff bot, noob! learn to play!" would you be all like "Oh yah, you are so right, I am so wrong to expect you to give me anything, I should totally provide all my own stuff" or would you think the person was being a jerk?
    First, I don't remember anyone saying that a cleric who preferred not to heal told someone "I'm not a heal bot, noob! learn to play!"

    Second, buffs are not necessary to play this game. They are a nice perk but by no means required. And since we are talking about people being more self-sufficient, they are really not required.

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