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  1. #21
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Id rather see an increase in relevance of loot in old raids. Its kind of sad that the epiced versions of old world raids loot is obsolete save for a few items, and even those are depreciating in worth. If epic DQ and epic VON, and even eChrono loot were brought up to the standard we see in newer raids, those would get run a lot more again.
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  2. #22
    Community Member Ryiah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    Its kind of sad that the epiced versions of old world raids loot is obsolete save for a few items, and even those are depreciating in worth.
    Unsurprisingly as the old Epic items require obtaining the base item, a scroll, a seal, and a shard. Really this entire system should be thrown out. Upgrading the gear won't mean anything when other items are far easier to obtain.
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  3. #23
    Community Member Munkenmo's Avatar
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    I'd like to see Turbine Points or Astral shards added to 20th lists (not taking up a current loot slot)

    That would certainly make me consider joining lfm's that are up despite already having all the loot I'd need.

  4. #24
    Community Member SilkofDrasnia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tscheuss View Post
    Oi! Silk is not that old, really.

    Are you?

    Sir?
    Well.... :P

    Seriously making older content irrelevant is going to come back to bite them in the arse if they are not careful.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jendrak
    Somebody should definitely explain to Turbine that when they roll up a new GM that INT is not dump stat.

  5. #25
    Community Member ZeebaNeighba's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vellrad View Post
    I bellive that a single clicky with useful, hard to get and new ability would be enough to encourage older raids runs.
    Clickies don't have to be compared with newer items for best in slot loot, they will never become obsolete.

    Imagine a 2/rest clicky with all artificers DR breaking clicky + deadly and enchant (choose 1 from list like staff from zawabis revenge) dropping from elite VoD and HoX, and suddenly, everyone and their's dog is running theese 2 old raids.

    Imagine 3/rest CL 40 (so very hard to dispel and longer duration) displacement clicky dropping from Titan.
    Add similiar haste clicky there, and we will see this raid beign run.

    Imagine a FoM clicky, imagine clicky increasing DCs and/or spellpen for few seconds, imagine clicky boosting doublestrike for 45 seconds, imagine clicky giving +20 seeker for 20 seconds, 2/rest, and all the effects devs can come up with. Place them into outdated raid loot table, and those raids will be run again.

    (extra points if clickies will be like key/pin: activate straight from inventory)
    This does have some effect, as I still see people run abbot for vile blasphemies and some of the other clickies that are exclusive (so you get them once and don't need them any more). And madstone boots, though that seemed more popular back in the level 20 days.

    But yes, it's totally possible to have loot that's not overpowered for its level and still be useful for some characters. Niche loot like torc for meleeing blue bars (and other casters too), +45 HP / +150 SP / exceptional skills greensteel, and litany for +1 profane bonus to stats are some more popular ones.
    Quote Originally Posted by fTdOmen View Post
    I'd like to see Turbine Points or Astral shards added to 20th lists (not taking up a current loot slot)

    That would certainly make me consider joining lfm's that are up despite already having all the loot I'd need.
    Dream on... Ok, maybe it was worth a try, I'll admit.

  6. #26
    Community Member Ironclans_evil_twin's Avatar
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    Look at the old stuff that is still run and ask yourself why?

    In every case it's that the loot is still viable in some way.

    Look at all the dead ones... in every case the loot is outmoded.

    As much as I like being able to buy things I would once have grinded for (because I like the AH mini game, and I like twinking characters out and my play time is limited) I must admit that BtCoE is a failure as a loot mechanic... it leads to quickly satiating the demand for the items. and low to no motivation to run the quests "I'll just buy one, I already have the first time XP bonus for that quest on E,H and N".

    You know how hard it is to find a group to flag for CitW? (pug) Only Impossible Demands (gee I wonder why) is frequent in the LFM window, now that it's more popular than Rusted Blades. Why? because every character is "one and done" with all those. The only exceptions are the rare Ring or Lolth trinket loot farms... they are rare because you can BUY THOSE so most people never farm those quests. And that's completely ignoring the last part of the quest arc. Those last three quests are rare as hens teeth on the LFM panel.

    To paraphrase an old saying (and not aimed at anyone it's a saying): it's the loot stupid.

  7. #27
    Community Member Ryiah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironclans_evil_twin View Post
    You know how hard it is to find a group to flag for CitW? (pug)
    Pugging is going to be bad. You should know this quite well by now. We could sit here all day and continuously blame Turbine for this. But the fact remains they have also provided alternative methods to obtain groups through. Using these methods I can generally get a group formed within a few minutes. Though it does depend on the time of day and weekends are definitely ideal.
    Last edited by Ryiah; 07-22-2013 at 05:01 PM.
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  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryiah View Post
    It took 40 completions for my main to gain one, 20 for one alt, and 16 for another. Once again though this is really just twink gear. Especially for anyone running Epic Elite as the enemies hit far too hard to risk trying to regain SP in this manner.
    People keep saying this, but it's just not true for melees with blue bars and decent defense. On my paladin for example I'm going to get hit in EE. I use all the miss stuff I can get, but I still get hit, and with 1k HP, 90PRR and 15 DR it's not that bad when you get hit, and 12 SP heals ~600 HP. I get plenty of SP from torc to make it worth wearing in EE.

    Yes, it's not the universal best-in-slot for all blue bars anymore, but it definitely has an end game niche.
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  9. #29
    Community Member ZeebaNeighba's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SerPounce View Post
    People keep saying this, but it's just not true for melees with blue bars and decent defense. On my paladin for example I'm going to get hit in EE. I use all the miss stuff I can get, but I still get hit, and with 1k HP, 90PRR and 15 DR it's not that bad when you get hit, and 12 SP heals ~600 HP. I get plenty of SP from torc to make it worth wearing in EE.

    Yes, it's not the universal best-in-slot for all blue bars anymore, but it definitely has an end game niche.
    This. You're not going to be able to shield block in mobs and have a net gain after healing any more, but it will make your SP bar last much longer if you are already getting hit a lot.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Delacroix21 View Post
    The problem is that as DDO grows as a game and new raids are introduced, old raids are left behind and forgotten. The worst of which are raids requiring crafting ingredients (thinking dragontouched and alchemical armor), as there are just far to few LFMs for these raids to ever craft the item you want at an appropriate level.


    What I suggest is taking a solid look at some old raids, and DRASTICALLY increasing drop rates, or at the very least severely reducing the number of completions for a named item from 20 to 5.
    No, please don't do that. I am sure somebody already mentioned it but if you simply increase the drop rate of the very outdated items even the 2-3 people that still want them will get them in 1-2 runs and then absolutely no one will run any. Much better solution is to bump them up in power a little bit (not make them as powerful as EE items, of course), add unique properties (similar but maybe weaker to the torc) and then reduce ML to what green steel items are.

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