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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charononus View Post
    No they're spread out among 8 servers instead of the 2 or 3 ddo can realistically support at proper levels compared to other mmos that aren't dying.
    both are true, unfortunately...

  2. #22
    Community Member Qhualor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PermaBanned View Post
    First, a disclaimer:
    I am not recomending or suggesting the following should happen, as I absolutely believe it would do more harm than good, it's purely hypothetical...


    I find it interesting that a metric many people use to determine population (loss) is the LFM panel. What if all the guild & channel only folks were forced to strictly use the LFM system and soloing wasn't possable due to a grouping requirement that also somehow prevented multiboxing? Essentially, a system where the entire questing population was visable beyond the "who" list? Would we have this same impression of a growing emptiness?

    As I said, it would be terrible to implement, but I've often noticed that even when LFMs are lean, the who list rarely is... On Thelanis anyways...
    there is a lot of guild/alliance channels used to group with to avoid or mostly avoid pugging. unfortunately, not all guilds are created equal. some are large, some are small. some even have their own TR groups that stick together and level with. even asking in guild/alliance channels if people want to run a quest doesn't always work. if players are spread out in the levels, it still may be difficult to get a group together. if you cant find people to group with through that, than you resort to the lfm if you really want to group with others. if the lfm is weak and hard to fill, it can be frustrating for people and think the worst and doesn't matter if its true or not.

    that is how the players have shifted over time due to changes in game. avoiding the pugs as much as possible, while some others are still trying to pug for company, too difficult for them to solo or whatever the reason may be. when people don't have the luxury of falling back to guild/friends or as easily as others, they have the lfm to gauge how the game is doing with activity.

    one of the biggest causes I believe to be is DS making it so any skilled or semi skilled player can easily run solo and having friends along if they wanted to go along that are fun to play with regardless if they occasionally die or not or are considered better than a pug stranger. increase the difficulty of quests and watch the lfm activity increase. HE and EH are the expected norm for completing most quests today and BB restricts activity even more. a lot of people wont bother re-running the same quest on elite if they already completed it. so, there are many things that affect activity, including the lfm beyond someone standing around waiting for groups to join on the lfm.

  3. #23
    Community Member tralfaz81's Avatar
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    I find that the biggest problem is <string table error; tableDID [0x00000000] token [0x00000000]>. Hope that helps.
    "Shut up and die like a wizard"

  4. #24
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tralfaz81 View Post
    I find that the biggest problem is <string table error; tableDID [0x00000000] token [0x00000000]>. Hope that helps.
    Don't mock my battle cry, it's catching on, it'll be the new leeeeerrrrooooyyyy jenkins soon. =P

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironclans_evil_twin View Post
    You must play during peak hours, I can only play during off hours, I spend 2/3rd of my available play time not playing DDO even though I want to. This time is composed of: filling, waiting to fill my or others LFM's, looking at 1 or 2 highlighted LFM's in various level ranges that are undesirable for any number of my 14 alts in various level ranges, and often enough: watching movies checking the LFM panel occasionally not seeing anything to do.

    On the bright side I'm catching up on my back catalog of unwatched movies... As this plays out I expect I'll start catching up on my back catalog of steam games and other MMO's.

    The sad part is there are clearly still people in the game, they are just spread out thin and diced up into Elite BB sized 3 level ranges.
    I've gathered from other posts that you don't like to be told you're doing it wrong. So I'll put it this way: It seems the vast majority of DDO players choose to play the game differently than you and not utilize the LFM panel at all. Since you don't want to change the way you play, how do you force these other players to do it your way? Do you get rid of channels/guilds/friendlists? Do you make the toons cookie cutter builds that need a full party to complete content? How exactly do you see Turbine making us use the LFM panel?

  6. #26
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PermaBanned View Post
    First, a disclaimer:
    I am not recomending or suggesting the following should happen, as I absolutely believe it would do more harm than good, it's purely hypothetical...


    I find it interesting that a metric many people use to determine population (loss) is the LFM panel. What if all the guild & channel only folks were forced to strictly use the LFM system and soloing wasn't possable due to a grouping requirement that also somehow prevented multiboxing? Essentially, a system where the entire questing population was visable beyond the "who" list? Would we have this same impression of a growing emptiness?

    As I said, it would be terrible to implement, but I've often noticed that even when LFMs are lean, the who list rarely is... On Thelanis anyways...
    Just wanted to clear up my point on this. I'm not using the lfm list, I'm using ddoracle's log in reports, which while not completely accurate give a rough outline at the very least. The numbers on each server seem very low and if consolidated on a server that could handle it without the hamsters screaming out the same way the inhabitants of alderan did when the death star blew it up, I think that would be a great thing for the game.

  7. #27
    Community Member Ironclans_evil_twin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLegendOfAra View Post
    Wait, let me get this right, for a while now you've been complaining on any thread that even slightly brings this issue to bear that the game is dead, server population is down, and that it's impossible to fill a group.

    And you're not even playing the damn game?
    Reading is fundamental (hint read my post where I SAY "my LFM" I wonder what that means?) the number of single player LFM's that never fill is another complaint I have and have been openly talked about among those of us here who actually take this subject seriously and not mockingly as you apparently do... They are endemic on Thelanis during off peak times. Suffice to say your condescending advice is just you being "loud confident and wrong". The world is not as simple as "everyone become a leader and an initiator" It's not how the world works. People are by in large joiners not leaders, this is a basic fact of social science. Your pep talk is not going to change that. People are complaining constantly here about "nothing to do" and "no good LFM's to join" saying to "just do it yourself" is nice ideal world scenario, but in the real world those people just move on to other games, which is exactly what DDO is suffering from right now.

    Quote Originally Posted by PermaBanned View Post
    Rofl too right... If a quarter of the people watching & waiting for an lfm would post one, the pug scene would explode!
    This gets extremely repetitive as you two are just saying the same silly and pointless things others have already said a million times. No more applicable to the real world situation than the last hundred times someone didn't actually read my post and responded with another mind numbing rendition of "just start your own LFM's".

    Huray for you guys, you've solved all of DDO's PUG problems! Wow! All we had to do was get everyone to take initiative! It's so simple it can't possibly be realistic LOL Sorry if I seem irritated but it was a simplistic and unobservant contribution the first hundred times. as is clear from my post I do start my own LFM's I actually LIKE playing MMO's with other people. I imagine many of the droves of people who leave DDO also expect this in an "MMO"

    "the solution to the PUG problem is for everyone to suddenly become comfortable leading quests and initiating" is just hopeless wishful thinking and not worthy of further comment.
    Last edited by Ironclans_evil_twin; 07-06-2013 at 08:34 PM.

  8. #28
    Community Member Ironclans_evil_twin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jalont View Post
    I've gathered from other posts that you don't like to be told you're doing it wrong. So I'll put it this way: It seems the vast majority of DDO players choose to play the game differently than you and not utilize the LFM panel at all. Since you don't want to change the way you play, how do you force these other players to do it your way? Do you get rid of channels/guilds/friendlists? Do you make the toons cookie cutter builds that need a full party to complete content? How exactly do you see Turbine making us use the LFM panel?
    *facepalm* oh look you've been here since April I take it? In the far distant eon's of DDO's past, back during a fabled time known as "epic Giant hold" it was easy to pug, a scant few months before that likewise... a year ago when I first came back from a nerf induced year long break (nerf induced yes people do actually leave games when their characters get nerfed) I was actually posting about how I was not having a hard time finding groups and I was DISAGREEING with people about how the game seems to be declining. Didn't take long for me to see the same things.

    Please don't lecture me about how I'm supposedly trying to force others to play my way when that way was the standard a few months ago and indeed for most of the games existence. In fact you seem to be pushing a "specific" way to play the game, not me. You've clearly got little to no understanding of how the game was when it was healthy, and apparently your current outlook is based entirely on being in a guild.

    If you would like to catch up on this subject please search the "whats the excuse for no players" thread and then the "whats the excuse for no players part II" thread. I believe even the most die hard ostriches involved in this discussion no longer are denying what is obvious to most of us.
    Last edited by Ironclans_evil_twin; 07-06-2013 at 07:01 PM.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironclans_evil_twin View Post

    "the solution to the PUG problem is for everyone to suddenly become comfortable leading quests and initiating" is mind just hopeless wishful thinking and not worthy of further comment.
    This is a better solution than the one you propose, which seems to be, "I only want to pug, so everyone must be forced to pug, when they don't want to." Here's a hint. I'm not going to be forced to pug. If Turbine ever implemented a system that would make you happy, I'd probably leave.

  10. #30
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jalont View Post
    This is a better solution than the one you propose, which seems to be, "I only want to pug, so everyone must be forced to pug, when they don't want to." Here's a hint. I'm not going to be forced to pug. If Turbine ever implemented a system that would make you happy, I'd probably leave.
    That's why a good solution is to massively merge the servers together into 2 or 3 servers. More people on one server equals more puggers for people like ironclan with no downside to gameplay for people like you. Assuming they can get the server to handle it, which well.... but it would solves the problems.

  11. #31
    Community Member Ironclans_evil_twin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PermaBanned View Post
    As I said, it would be terrible to implement, but I've often noticed that even when LFMs are lean, the who list rarely is... On Thelanis anyways...
    First off the LFM list is never lean, according to some of you that's never happened

    The LFM list mimics most observations in sociology. It's an "ice berg" the tip of the ice burg is visible, the "tip"is the LFM's on the list, the rest of the ice berg are people who are kicking back doing bank stuff, chatting, browsing the AH, and yes in many cases waiting for something they want to do to pop up on the LFM panel (yes yes I know all of humanity should shed it's follower ways and become bold and initiate and start their own 1 man groups that take forver to fill. Now that we have that out of the way we can return to reality) Guilds and solo'ers of course. In other words we should never expect the LFM panel to show more than a fraction of the logged in players even when thriving.

  12. #32
    Community Member Ironclans_evil_twin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jalont View Post
    This is a better solution than the one you propose, which seems to be, "I only want to pug, so everyone must be forced to pug, when they don't want to." Here's a hint. I'm not going to be forced to pug. If Turbine ever implemented a system that would make you happy, I'd probably leave.
    Getting large portions of people to change how they behave is a realistic solution to you?

    Perhaps you'd like to direct some of this wisdom to fat people:

    "hey you guys stop eating so much"

    and maybe mean people:

    "you guys stop being so mean"

    Good luck with that, tell us how it works out for you.

  13. #33

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLegendOfAra View Post
    I've noticed a distinct increase in activity on Argo in the past 2 weeks or so. Full LFM's for all level ranges. Most of which had 4-6 people in them.
    Yeah, the Argo LFM exploded in the past week or two. Not sure what happened; maybe a large guild decided to take the initiative and liven up the LFMs?

    I've also seen in the past few weeks

    At least 2 Shroud a day
    At least 3-5 FOT a day
    At least 3-5 CITW a day
    At least 3 VOD a week
    At least 2 HoX a week
    1-2 TODs a week
    SO MANY TITAN RUNS! (Seriously, I know of at least 40ish runs in the last 3 weeks alone.)
    At least 2 EADQ
    At least 5-10 VON a week

    And these are just the raids I've seen while I'm online.
    Yeah, seriously, Titan (Titan?!) has been all over the LFM panel, as has Ascension Chamber (Abbott?!). It's madness, I tells ya!

    hehheh.

  14. #34
    Community Member NaturalHazard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charononus View Post
    That's why a good solution is to massively merge the servers together into 2 or 3 servers. More people on one server equals more puggers for people like ironclan with no downside to gameplay for people like you. Assuming they can get the server to handle it, which well.... but it would solves the problems.
    be a lot of run during crystal cove and mabar.

  15. #35
    Community Member ushram's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironclans_evil_twin View Post
    You must play during peak hours, I can only play during off hours, I spend 2/3rd of my available play time not playing DDO even though I want to. This time is composed of: filling, waiting to fill my or others LFM's, looking at 1 or 2 highlighted LFM's in various level ranges that are undesirable for any number of my 14 alts in various level ranges, and often enough: watching movies checking the LFM panel occasionally not seeing anything to do.

    On the bright side I'm catching up on my back catalog of unwatched movies... As this plays out I expect I'll start catching up on my back catalog of steam games and other MMO's.

    The sad part is there are clearly still people in the game, they are just spread out thin and diced up into Elite BB sized 3 level ranges.
    Don't know what time you are playing, I play usually from 8am EST until 4pmEST (around 8pm my time) and two days ago at 8amEST there were over 20 LFM's up.....
    Ainur Wer'lak Thelanis

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    Yeah, the Argo LFM exploded in the past week or two. Not sure what happened; maybe a large guild decided to take the initiative and liven up the LFMs?

    Yeah, seriously, Titan (Titan?!) has been all over the LFM panel, as has Ascension Chamber (Abbott?!). It's madness, I tells ya!

    hehheh.
    I believe the Helm of Free Will or some such is what draws the renewed interest in Titan raids.
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  17. #37
    Community Member TheLegendOfAra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironclans_evil_twin View Post
    Reading is fundamental (hint read my post where I SAY "my LFM" I wonder what that means?) the number of single player LFM's that never fill is another complaint I have and have been openly talked about among those of us here who actually take this subject seriously and not mockingly as you apparently do... They are endemic on Thelanis during off peak times. Suffice to say your condescending advice is just you being "loud confident and wrong". The world is not as simple as "everyone become a leader and an initiator" It's not how the world works. People are by in large joiners not leaders, this is a basic fact of social science. Your pep talk is not going to change that. People are complaining constantly here about "nothing to do" and "no good LFM's to join" saying to "just do it yourself" is nice ideal world scenario, but in the real world those people just move on to other games, which is exactly what DDO is suffering from right now.



    This gets extremely repetitive as you two are just saying the same silly and pointless things others have already said a million times. No more applicable to the real world situation than the last hundred times someone didn't actually read my post and responded with another mind numbing rendition of "just start your own LFM's".

    Huray for you guys, you've solved all of DDO's PUG problems! Wow! All we had to do was get everyone to take initiative! It's so simple it can't possibly be realistic LOL Sorry if I seem irritated but it was a simplistic and unobservant contribution the first hundred times. as is clear from my post I do start my own LFM's I actually LIKE playing MMO's with other people. I imagine many of the droves of people who leave DDO also expect this in an "MMO"

    "the solution to the PUG problem is for everyone to suddenly become comfortable leading quests and initiating" is just hopeless wishful thinking and not worthy of further comment.
    I'll let you in on a secret; It really is that simple. I'm not a leader of any kind. In fact I really don't like leading anything, especially not raids. I don't like having to tell other people what they need to do, or delegating roles to a group of people. But I lead pugs all the time. Why? Because I being in a group with other people. I throw up and LFM, put IP(sometimes BYOH, but usually just IP) and start heading to the quest. I never fail to fill a group. and you know what? I almost never, ever have to actually lead anyone.

    Oh sure, sometimes I have to explain how to get to the quest, or that this boss dispels buffs, or this item will be helpful or w.e. But I never tell anyone, go here do this, or this is your role in this quest. I just let people do what they want, and it work 95% of the time.

    So, yes. the solution to your pug problem, and the people who think like you do is to get off your butt and be proactive about your questing experiences in this game. I, nor the devs, nor any other player can help you. It's your own personal problem if you aren't willing to put up and LFM.

    And if you put up one and it doesn't fill a few times, that's bad luck. If it doesn't fill often, there is something else at work here. Either people purposely avoiding you in game, bad timing, or the population is in fact going down and if that is the case there is very little that we, as players can do about that.

    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    Yeah, seriously, Titan (Titan?!) has been all over the LFM panel, as has Ascension Chamber (Abbott?!). It's madness, I tells ya!

    hehheh.
    Hehehe Exactly! It's been years since I've even heard anyone mention Titan, and there have been tons of people running it and Abbot lately. I seriously can't understand anyone who plays on Argo thinking it is dying.
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  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLegendOfAra View Post

    And these are just the raids I've seen while I'm online.
    I've also noticed my friends list has an average of 20-30 people online at any given time.
    11-12 people in Guild on at any given time.
    Well aren't you miss popular.

    Actually I play on argo as well, you may know me by the name of docpeppers. Most the lfm's I see don't usually fill or they just fill slowly. When epic gianthold came out the server was very full of lmf's running it of course but, since than it has steadily declined from what I can see. Even chat channel runs seem to be down and there are people leaving constantly. These things may be just because I'm not miss popular, but I'm not quite sure.

  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLegendOfAra View Post
    Hehehe Exactly! It's been years since I've even heard anyone mention Titan, and there have been tons of people running it and Abbot lately. I seriously can't understand anyone who plays on Argo thinking it is dying.
    To be fair 95% of those abbot groups wipe and those titan runs are lead by the same person using bypasses each time.

  20. #40
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    I have a few issues with this game, and I know for a fact that at least some people would agree.

    Problem #1 & 2:

    The problem with this game is lack of content, I can live with bugs, but content is just blah. There is no reason to run content outside of gianthold and eveningstar, except for a few certain quests which are worthy of running for loot. Old epic items need a complete overhaul first of all, most people got their loot from gianthold 2 + months ago. Whats to run after that with gear out there that is just ****. Secondly, content doesn't come often enough. Epic Gh came out about 4 months ago I think. 4 months time and we have 11 total dungeons to run, woohoo. Since gianthold just added 1 new dungeon it didn't even feel like a new update. To me, it feels like we haven't had much to do since update 16, and even than only 5 whole quests were added.

    Problem #3 :

    The addition to Epic destiny's a few update's ago ruined the fun of the game. Instead of running content 1-2 times every so often we get to run the same quest 50 000 times per toon. Hurray, good fun. If they wanted to implement epic destiny's in the first place, experience for level 5 of that destiny should have been cut way way down. The only way that this was even slightly a good idea, is if they thought everyone was gonna make a toon, get them to level 20, complete 1 destiny, than tr. No one does this thought unfortunately, its 60X faster if you just get to level 25 in a good destiny that you have done in the past and than grind 1 quest.


    Problem #4 :

    Quests xp. I have a great idea lets make a bunch of quests and have them give half as much xp as the other quests at the same level and make them take 3 times as long. Seriously, I have met 3 total people in this game that run quests 1 time each. I would love to do so myself but running every quests once would take far to long when tr ing. When I see people doing mutliple tr lives they farm certain quests and skip 65% - 75% of the game content. When we get to certain level, for instance level 9 : people farm shadow crypt and von3, and they skip everything else, because everything else is **** in comparison to xp.

    Pretty much everything I said makes the game boring and makes people want to look for a different game.

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