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  1. #1

    Default UMD selfheals for warrior type classes

    Okay, so fighters and barbarians are lots of fun to play right? yes! but it sucks that they can't seem to heal at all. Reliant on others, chugging down thousands of platinum worth of cure serious wound potions. Well it's not necesary, you can use scrolls instead, they are also a LOT cheaper.

    Comparation:
    Cure serious wounds Potion costs 7087 per 100 potions - healing 15 to 35
    Heal scrolls cost 15.592 per 100 scrolls - healing 223 damage
    If you compare the costs healing yourself 100.000HP, at BEST healing 35 per potions you'd spend 202.485Plat on potions. If you want to do the same with heals it'll cost 69.914plat (and Heal scrolls always heal the same).

    Also, healing 1000 HP cure serious wound potions take 28 chugs at best and 67 chugs at it's worst where Heal scrolls will heal well over 1000 HP in 5 casts.

    For good umd you can consider getting the following:
    It may not be fun but you will need 1 rogue level at least (2 rogue levels will give you at least 16 skill points, scroll and wand mastery for 30% better heal effects, evasion for traps and aoe, access to full UMD levels)
    Race bonus: Half elf: Artificer Delittante +2 UMD
    Human: versatility +5 UMD and extra feat for potential +3 UMD skill feat

    +23 umd from skill points
    +4 Morale bonus at level 9 (Greater Heroism)
    +1 luck bonus at lvl 5 (voice of the master, ship buff(no ml))
    +2 luck bonus at lvl 13 (head of good fortune)
    +3 competence bonus at lvl at 16 (spyglass)
    +5 competence bonus at level 9 (seven fingered gloves)
    +3 from +6 charisma item
    +1 from +2 charisma ship buff

    potential temporary buffs:
    Rogue skill boost +2
    Inspire Excellence (bard) +2
    walk of the sun monk finisher +2


    Base UMD every 4 levels:
    4 - 9 UMD
    8 - 15 UMD (at level 9 this jumps up to 24 UMD)
    12 - 29 UMD
    16 - 33 UMD
    20 - 37 UMD

    Offcourse if you choose to go with artificer delittante and UMD skill feat you get to 34 sustainable UMD at level 12, 38 UMD at 16 and 42 UMD by the time you hit 20, which greatly increases your chances to properly cast wands/scrolls.

    the following are the no-fail lvls for scrolls:
    Cure serious wounds/repair serious damage: 29 UMD required (can start these at level 9)
    Cure critical wounds/repair critical damage: 31 UMD required (can start these at level 12)
    Raise dead/teleport: 35 UMD
    Heal: 39 (can start these at level 16 if you picked the required feats as well, will heal well over 100 hp making it a lot better then potions)

  2. #2
    Community Member Soulfurnace's Avatar
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    Few things I'd like to point out: Instead of one rogue, one Artificer is more often a better choice, if you're after UMD. (+2 to scroll UMD)

    You didn't mention +6 from greensteel (exceptional charisma bonus), but you mentioned seven finger gloves. I'm STILL trying to get those. God damn my luck! lol

    Also, no mention of S.F pots. I call them suicide pots for a reason (and a good one at that!), but they still deserve a mention. Not for a first lifer, no. But later in the game (when UMD is more viable), you can use them. Worth considering. (I mean, hey. Who actually uses cure serious? Comparing S.F to heal scrolls is a lot fairer.)

    Irrc, you have a concentration roll for scrolls if you get hit. While heal scrolls are better outside of combat in comparison to cure serious pots, in combat, if you lack concentration, they'll fall flat. I'd drop a mention in regards to that, but that's just me.

  3. #3

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    never had much trouble casting heal scrolls myself, been doing it a few melee lives now, as for the artificer level instead of rogue, that would mean you don't want to stack the UMD helf artificer delittante gives.

    You are right about the gs cha though I didn't mention that yet.

    I guess I can add SF pots to be more complete but personally I never bothered to unlock them let alone bank em for a next life

  4. #4
    Community Member Soulfurnace's Avatar
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    Yes, but go arti and human instead of H-elf. Take skill focus: UMD (unless arti dill is also for rcbows) and you net +3 UMD.

    My first life (monk, with cleric dilettante) struggled with heal scrolls in EE. 1) He wasn't ready, at all. 2) His concentration, though maxed, with an item, just wasn't high enough. 3) He sucked, but that doesn't affect concentration rolls! Was just a thought to include.

    And S.F, eh. They aren't great, but more than one barb has thanked Lolth for them. (Wait, we can't be evil any more? Damn!) Mainly due to the way rage stops scrolls/spells/clickies. Not much fun turning off rage every 30 seconds. (and if ya ain't raging, ya be doin' it wrong!)

    All in all, they're the only points I could come up with, and they're minor. (Oh, destiny twists. Eh. Can't be bothered thinking of what they require gear-wise)

  5. #5
    Community Member Raoull's Avatar
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    For feat heavy classes (fighter, and somewhat monk), one interesting feat is Magical Training. It gives you Echos of Power, just enough to use Rejuvenating Cocoon every 18 seconds or so if you twist it in.

    And in EEs... I've found Cocoon makes a good combo with heal scrolls. Cocoon yourself up, and then scroll, and you'll probably get the scroll off, as the first whack will mainly drain temp HP (which doesn't seem to affect concentration).

    (Being able to also twist in Energy Sheathe for FoT is just gravy.)
    Cannith Server :Vice Sovereign of The Guild of Calamitous Intent

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  6. #6
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    Another nice way to get a +3 competence bonus to UMD is a crafted [hat/goggles/trinket/ring] of Persuasion (+3 comp. bonus to all cha skills). Far easier to get than seven fingered gloves (but smaller bonus), and you don't need to wait for the next CC event to acquire it.

    For example a Charisma +4 ring of Persuasion (regular ML 11, ML 9 with masterful craftsmanship) effectively gives a +5 bonus to all cha skills, including UMD (and the highest shard level is 50, so you don't need to be a master crafter to make one of these ).

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raoull View Post
    For feat heavy classes (fighter, and somewhat monk), one interesting feat is Magical Training. It gives you Echos of Power, just enough to use Rejuvenating Cocoon every 18 seconds or so if you twist it in.
    Well, even fighter have not enough feats ( eat that paladins ! ) these days and you still have to wear sp item to get any use from cocoon, sheath, sigil or whatever you twist.
    I admit I never tried Magical training on fighter though, but 80 sp even with regen must go fast. I got 300 sp on GS and Torc occasionally.

  8. #8
    Community Member Vellrad's Avatar
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    I love the new HoT potions.

    They're awesome.

    I don't remember where to get high lvl versions, but each seem to have separate cooldown, so you can chug few at time.

    Sure, heal scroll is better, but, anyone can drink pot fast and only trip can stop you.

  9. #9
    Community Member Ungood's Avatar
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    Just wondering why you would use Half Elf Dill Arti as opposed to Cleric Dill to get scroll healing?

  10. #10
    The Mad Multiclasser Failedlegend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AidanRyuko View Post
    Okay, so fighters and barbarians are lots of fun to play right? yes! but it sucks that they can't seem to heal at all. Reliant on others, chugging down thousands of platinum worth of cure serious wound potions. Well it's not necesary, you can use scrolls instead, they are also a LOT cheaper.

    Comparation:
    Cure serious wounds Potion costs 7087 per 100 potions - healing 15 to 35
    Heal scrolls cost 15.592 per 100 scrolls - healing 223 damage
    If you compare the costs healing yourself 100.000HP, at BEST healing 35 per potions you'd spend 202.485Plat on potions. If you want to do the same with heals it'll cost 69.914plat (and Heal scrolls always heal the same).

    Also, healing 1000 HP cure serious wound potions take 28 chugs at best and 67 chugs at it's worst where Heal scrolls will heal well over 1000 HP in 5 casts.

    For good umd you can consider getting the following:
    It may not be fun but you will need 1 rogue level at least (2 rogue levels will give you at least 16 skill points, scroll and wand mastery for 30% better heal effects, evasion for traps and aoe, access to full UMD levels)
    Race bonus: Half elf: Artificer Delittante +2 UMD
    Human: versatility +5 UMD and extra feat for potential +3 UMD skill feat

    +23 umd from skill points
    +4 Morale bonus at level 9 (Greater Heroism)
    +1 luck bonus at lvl 5 (voice of the master, ship buff(no ml))
    +2 luck bonus at lvl 13 (head of good fortune)
    +3 competence bonus at lvl at 16 (spyglass)
    +5 competence bonus at level 9 (seven fingered gloves)
    +3 from +6 charisma item
    +1 from +2 charisma ship buff

    potential temporary buffs:
    Rogue skill boost +2
    Inspire Excellence (bard) +2
    walk of the sun monk finisher +2


    Base UMD every 4 levels:
    4 - 9 UMD
    8 - 15 UMD (at level 9 this jumps up to 24 UMD)
    12 - 29 UMD
    16 - 33 UMD
    20 - 37 UMD

    Offcourse if you choose to go with artificer delittante and UMD skill feat you get to 34 sustainable UMD at level 12, 38 UMD at 16 and 42 UMD by the time you hit 20, which greatly increases your chances to properly cast wands/scrolls.

    the following are the no-fail lvls for scrolls:
    Cure serious wounds/repair serious damage: 29 UMD required (can start these at level 9)
    Cure critical wounds/repair critical damage: 31 UMD required (can start these at level 12)
    Raise dead/teleport: 35 UMD
    Heal: 39 (can start these at level 16 if you picked the required feats as well, will heal well over 100 hp making it a lot better then potions)
    While I'm not sure how your ending up with decimal places in your cost calculations (which im pretty sure 100 heal scrolls is way more than 15.5 plat I am sure its not required to dip a rogue, arty or bard level for UMD. Just like any other skill if you invest in getting it high enough than you can get by with .5 marks. Oh and to clarify there's no such thing as no fail as you always fail on a 1 unless there's any ability that says otherwise.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan
    There is little value in getting into an edition debate; as with anything, we create what we believe works best for DDO.

  11. #11
    Community Member Paryan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ungood View Post
    Just wondering why you would use Half Elf Dill Arti as opposed to Cleric Dill to get scroll healing?
    Was thinking the same thing.....
    Agro - Paryan, Pary, Parrii, Parriahh
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Failedlegend View Post
    While I'm not sure how your ending up with decimal places in your cost calculations (which im pretty sure 100 heal scrolls is way more than 15.5 plat
    Not everyone uses a period as a decimal place. Many countries use comma for the decimal place and period as a thousands separator.

    15 thousand plat for 100 heal scrolls sounds just about right.

  13. #13
    Community Member Ungood's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ancient View Post
    Not everyone uses a period as a decimal place. Many countries use comma for the decimal place and period as a thousands separator.
    Well live and learn, never saw a Calculator with a , symbol on it, but then again I am from America, so we use "." for decimal and "," for the thousand separation, but even then, we would have written that as 15.5K plat, for sake of eliminating confusion.

    But good to know, and yah 15.5K plat for 100 scrolls, sounds about right for a low Haggle Toon.

  14. #14
    Hero JOTMON's Avatar
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    Also,

    Craft a 3x Positive Healing Amp Greensteel offhand weapon. (added bonus of a raise dead clickie)
    Combine slot with scroll as a weaponset

    This way you maximize your healing amp from gear in one nice package with a quick hotbar click..
    Jotmon - Let's not forget why we play these games - to have fun - ~
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    Argo-Jotmon(Completionist - before the Otto's/XP pots easymode), Jotmonheals(Clr17/Rog2/Mnk1-Epic Completionist), Whatthetruck.. and many many more alts..

    Update 24: Champions... "whew, it's ok, it's only a red name" .. sad day when trash spawn Champions and their one-shot ignore fort attacks instill more party fear than the Red named bosses.

  15. #15
    Community Member Phidius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Failedlegend View Post
    ... Oh and to clarify there's no such thing as no fail as you always fail on a 1 unless there's any ability that says otherwise.
    You're thinking of saves. Skills can succeed on a "1" if you have enough bonuses to make up for it.
    "I require a reminder as to why raining arcane destruction is not an appropriate response to all of life's indignities" - Vaarsuvius, OoTS #674

  16. #16
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    TWFing? Just TR into a ranger.

  17. #17
    The Mad Multiclasser Failedlegend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phidius View Post
    You're thinking of saves. Skills can succeed on a "1" if you have enough bonuses to make up for it.
    I'm pretty sure you're mistaken...if that's how its supposed to work than its bugged because my Spellsinger Bard/Arty has a really UMD and still occasionally fails with wands/scrolls that rely on UMD and says 95%
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan
    There is little value in getting into an edition debate; as with anything, we create what we believe works best for DDO.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Failedlegend View Post
    I'm pretty sure you're mistaken...if that's how its supposed to work than its bugged because my Spellsinger Bard/Arty has a really UMD and still occasionally fails with wands/scrolls that rely on UMD and says 95%
    You are wrong.

    You can roll a 1 on a skill check and still succeed.

  19. #19
    The Mad Multiclasser Failedlegend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bridge_Dweller View Post
    You are wrong.

    You can roll a 1 on a skill check and still succeed.
    Well I'm off to submit a bug report on my Bard than
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan
    There is little value in getting into an edition debate; as with anything, we create what we believe works best for DDO.

  20. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by Failedlegend View Post
    I'm pretty sure you're mistaken...if that's how its supposed to work than its bugged because my Spellsinger Bard/Arty has a really UMD and still occasionally fails with wands/scrolls that rely on UMD and says 95%
    There is nothing inconsistent going on; you're just misunderstanding what the % means.

    Let's say a heal scroll with 40 UMD. If you have...

    39 UMD, it will say 100% chance
    38 UMD, it will say 95% chance
    37 UMD, it will say 90% chance
    etc...

    The 39 is 100% because when you roll a 1 it adds to 39 to make 40, which passes the UMD check.

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