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  1. #181
    Community Member Hendrik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GlassJaw View Post
    Is this still class levels or will it be character levels? If it's class levels, it's an unnecessary penalty to multi-classed characters.
    Wouldn't it a 'fair' tradeoff since MC's get the benefits of those other classes?

    Quote Originally Posted by hsinclair
    I heard the devs hate all wizards, bards, clerics, fighters, and fuzzy bunnies and only want us to play halfling barbarian/paladin shuriken specialists!

    It's totally true, I have a reliable source. You better reroll now.
    Adventurer, Bug Reporter, Mournlander.

  2. #182
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hendrik View Post
    Wouldn't it a 'fair' tradeoff since MC's get the benefits of those other classes?
    Your argument is invalid.

    15/5

    10/5/5

  3. #183
    Community Member WruntJunior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hendrik View Post
    Wouldn't it a 'fair' tradeoff since MC's get the benefits of those other classes?
    Really, it hurts pure classes most. My own theorized build would be a 10 ranger/8 fighter/2 monk (for my TWF), and would have as much HP as a pure...some 10/10 splits are now really good, though, that would get even more HP than a pure.
    Eternal Infinity: Wruntjunior ~ DI Sorc // Youngwrunt ~ Survivalist Paladin // Wruntarrow ~ Monkcher // Wruntsonmonk ~ Wis-Based Monk

  4. #184
    Community Member Jacobius's Avatar
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    Ok I agree it should be character level not class level.

    But really if your build is going to be that bad because it has 10HP less, then its probably a build that shouldn't be made to begin with.

  5. #185
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thrudh View Post
    None of you give a rats ass about sorcs with less than 36+ build points... And they will just live with a "measly" 15 or 16 CON instead of an 18, so yeah still a buff to spell-power...
    My sorc is 32 points and even if I was to continue playing after this cluster I wouldn't tr that toon. So yeah I care about them.
    Quote Originally Posted by NaturalHazard View Post
    well thank you for making it clear the post I quoted was confusing to say the least. And actually I do give a rats ass for sorcs with less than 36 build points not all my characters are 3rd + lives. So don't throw random generalizations out there.
    He can't defend it otherwise.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    They are making people invest MORE to get back to the same capability they had before, which in effect is a nerf. The classes that get less skill points are going to be hit harder on this. Youve outlined the work arounds, but work arounds arent fixes. Youre basically shifting the nerf to another area.
    This

  6. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vargouille View Post
    The original 20 HP at level 1 has been improved to 25, in addition to +5 at class levels 5, 10 and 15.
    I really don't understand the class level split of 5, 10 and 15. Help us understand the decision for the 5/10/15 split? There are still plenty of viable reasons to splash levels in other classes. You have core requirements in the enhancement pass that don't fall into line with this split that are gained at levels 1/3/6/12/18/20.The 5/10/15 class split feels like socialism. Please don't make me lose out on 5 hit points because of my 1 or 2 level splash, or because I wanted to take 6 levels in a class for an additional core enhancement.

  7. #187
    Uber Uber Completionist
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    Quote Originally Posted by SirValentine View Post
    Can't be as an incentive for pure class, since they get less HP than the 15/5 or 10/5/5 splits.
    You would think. Hopefully we can hear why you don't get another installment of Improved Heroic Durabilty at 20.

  8. #188
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vargouille View Post
    The original 20 HP at level 1 has been improved to 25, in addition to +5 at class levels 5, 10 and 15.
    I've maybe been spending too much time looking into these enhancements, but now I'm seeing 30 HP from feats on a brand new character on lama land. Only place it could be coming from is Heroic Durability.

    Just rolled the exact same build on live and it's showing 20 HP from feats from Heroic Durability at level 1 as expected.

  9. #189
    Community Member PermaBanned's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironclans_evil_twin View Post
    Some people can't copy characters over, some people can't get Lam client to work, some might be busy or just not be tester types but still like to be informed of whats happening. I'm sorry but this "don't talk about this in general" seems to be certain people wanting squelch information to keep the playerbase uninformed. I'm not sure what their motive is, but I hate to think that the people who are okay with eating the mud sammich are intentionally trying to keep people who don't want to eat one from knowing about it before it hits their plate.
    My issue is not that information is being shared, my issue is with how it's being presented.
    "HP is getting nerfed." Really? My Dwarf Fighter has more on Lam than live.
    "Spell power's getting nerfed." Really? My Wizzard has more on lam than live.

    In almost every case, the question of wether something is a buff or nerf is a situational, build dependent perspective.

    Some of the nerf claims are genuine, accross the board nerfs, for instance spell crit multiplier. That is something that is being reduced.

    I have no interest in keeping information from people. I have voiced opinions of the pass in numerous threads, and in short I'm no fan of it. While it does present some interesting opportunities for trying new things, it also reduces the viability of some existing things and I call that poor design. Almost nothing being done in this pass is needed, and much of what is needed isn't being done. That is -however unfortunately- irrelevant, as no matter how much I may whine and complain the pass is coming.

    I don't want to take my ball and go home, so I'll learn the new rules of the game being played. I would however, appreciate a factual presentation of those new rules instead of the biased & exaggerated "my sorc is loosing 50-90% of it's damage" or "HP is dropping for everybody" hogwash that's getting perpetuated.
    Now excuse me while I wander off to arm myself with Grilled Cheese Sandwiches and hunker down behind my Armored Beer Refrigerator, while I have the UFO's take control of the Congresional Wives with the help of the International Cocaine Smugglers and the Evil Geniuses for a Better Tomorrow

  10. #190
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    Quote Originally Posted by PermaBanned View Post
    I would however, appreciate a factual presentation of those new rules instead of the biased & exaggerated "my sorc is loosing 50-90% of it's damage" or "HP is dropping for everybody" hogwash that's getting perpetuated.
    https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...nt-pass-thread
    The original thread (linked above), to which this one is a rejoinder, did attempt to state the "nerfs" / losses in a factual and concise manner. I won't copy the entire list but here is the first bit:

    Quote Originally Posted by Ironclans_evil_twin View Post
    1. many characters lose 20 to 80hps ( - Toughness enhancements + Heroic durability 5hp increases at class level 5, 10 etc.)
    2. Lore Items give massively lowered spell crit improvements (3% for greater lore it appears)
    3. Spell crits overall lose give or take 10% and lots of multiplier (+5% from magic training if your class gets that up to +6% from New enhancement "AP spent/Core abilities" best case, -10% from old enhancement lines -7% to -12% lore item nerf)
    4. All Spell Power losses 20 to 80 (exact break down left out due to the dozens of ways multiclassing can add spell power that will no longer be possible, and the many ways the new skills and AP spent in tree will add spell power, but not nearly as much as is being lost)
    5. Rangers no longer have a devotion line, or positive spell power booster
    6. Paladins no longer have a devotion line or positive spell power booster
    7. Bard spell singers mana proc reduced
    8. Barbarians lose X2 criticals from current Frenzied PrE
    9. Stalwart's can no longer be TWF or THF, must equip a shield to get PrE/Stance benefits
    10. Sword and Board no longer gets 20 passive PRR bonus from the defender PrE's just for equipping a shield (instead shield use is mandatory so they took the incentive bonus PRR away)
    11. Cleric lose Divine Might line
    12. Humans pay far more for healing amp
    13. Dwarves no longer have Faith mana lines

  11. #191
    Community Member FengXian's Avatar
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    A few things have been nerfed but we got a huge amount of new possibilities.

    What I can't understand is how people can even think about complaining about nerfs tho, since the game is so easy that you can play with the dumbest split and still be good in end game.

    "Some classes will disappear from DDO"? Really? The "meta" is not static in a MMORPG, doesn't mean everyone will be playing only the few builds you think are the best. "A buff to him is a nerf to me" is a childish argument in this case...
    Cannith - Juzam, Water Savant II Ranger 6 Monk 2 AA/ Orocarn, Stalwart Defender III Monk 2 / Taigongwanng, Sorc TRing - Guardiani di Eberron

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