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  1. #1
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    Default Damage roll details - weapon multiplier?

    Hi all,

    I was just wondering... and the wiki page http://ddowiki.com/page/Damage_roll didn't help much...

    In what order are the various things actually calculated, specifically multipliers from weapon (named, vorpals, greensteel, whatever) and tactical moves (cleave, great cleave, ...) and ... well, criticals too if there's a difference?

    I mean, does the STR mod (or whatever stat applies) get multiplied by the weapon multiplier, for example?

    I started wondering after trying both the Sickle of Sypheros and Dueling Schlager against a training dummy with my human rogue-splashed wizard... (yes, both bought from the AH.) The sickle was doing more "base" damage fairly consistently for those couple of minutes but I didn't think to try without my +STR item... and the sickle has a theoretically lower base damage but higher multiplier ( 1.50[1d6] vs 1.25[1d8] ). It could be just a random thing with my small sample, but... how does that thing really go?

    http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Sickle_of_Sypheros http://ddowiki.com/page/Itemueling_Schlager

    Those two also have the same +3 enhancement bonus, but that at least comes after the weapon multiplier has been applied, right?


    And, the various morale and such buffs and bonuses (Heroism, Divine favor, Inspire courage, &c) get added before critical multiplier but after weapon multiplier... I think... maybe? Or do those vary?
    Last edited by mna; 07-04-2013 at 04:51 AM.

  2. #2
    Community Member BigSlugger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mna View Post
    Hi all,

    I was just wondering... and the wiki page http://ddowiki.com/page/Damage_roll didn't help much...

    In what order are the various things actually calculated, specifically multipliers from weapon (named, vorpals, greensteel, whatever) and tactical moves (cleave, great cleave, ...) and ... well, criticals too if there's a difference?

    I mean, does the STR mod (or whatever stat applies) get multiplied by the weapon multiplier, for example?

    I started wondering after trying both the Sickle of Sypheros and Dueling Schlager against a training dummy with my human rogue-splashed wizard... (yes, both bought from the AH.) The sickle was doing more "base" damage fairly consistently for those couple of minutes but I didn't think to try without my +STR item... and the sickle has a theoretically lower base damage but higher multiplier ( 1.50[1d6] vs 1.25[1d8] ). It could be just a random thing with my small sample, but... how does that thing really go?

    http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Sickle_of_Sypheros http://ddowiki.com/page/Itemueling_Schlager

    Those two also have the same +3 enhancement bonus, but that at least comes after the weapon multiplier has been applied, right?


    And, the various morale and such buffs and bonuses (Heroism, Divine favor, Inspire courage, &c) get added before critical multiplier but after weapon multiplier... I think... maybe? Or do those vary?
    When you score a critical hit it multiplies last, so it doubles (or triples and so on) weapon damage bonuses such as a +3 enhancement bonus, strength bonus, good hope, weapon specialization, class enhancements, divine favor, etc. and the weapon's base damage.

    1.5[1d6] means that the game rolls the weapons base damage of 1d6 then multiplies by 1.5. It takes the result then adds bonuses. So you would roll 1.5 "dice" or when using great cleave roll 3.5 dice. Great cleave with the dueling schlager would be 3.25 dice.
    Last edited by BigSlugger; 07-04-2013 at 07:06 AM.

  3. #3
    Community Member PsychoBlonde's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mna View Post
    Hi all,
    In what order are the various things actually calculated, specifically multipliers from weapon (named, vorpals, greensteel, whatever) and tactical moves (cleave, great cleave, ...) and ... well, criticals too if there's a difference?
    Bonus weapon damages, i.e. the 1.50 part of 1.50[2d6] do not *ever* multiply each other, they stack *additively*. So if you take that weapon--1.50[2d6]--and cleave with it, you're doing 2.50[2d6] damage. If you throw deadly weapons on it and cleave with it, you're doing 3.50[2d6].

    This type of bonus damage doesn't multiply ANY bonus damage, it ONLY affects the base die roll of the weapon. So, if you do all that above and you have +10 damage from strength, you are doing 3.50[2d6]+10 damage, not 3.50[2d6+10] damage. BIG difference and also why +X[W] bonuses are not usually all that big unless the weapon itself has a fairly large die type. +1[1d6] only adds 3.5 damage on average, you're probably not going to be able to tell. +1[2d6] on the other hand adds an additional 7 damage on average so you should be able to tell.

    A critical multiplies ALL of the damage done by the weapon except anything that displays as a separate number (although some of those have their own critical bonuses). This is why you will sometimes hear people refer to "primary damage"--that's the first number you see when you hit. That's the number that gets strength (or whatever) bonus and is multiplied by a crit. Bonuses to THAT number are usually better than bonuses that appear as a separate number because they help overcome DR and also are multiplied by a critical.
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  4. #4
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    Basically, the order of operations is like this:

    [(All damage bonuses added together) x crit mult on crits] + all weapon affix damage (Flaming, Bloodletter, etc.)

  5. #5
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    first up weapon damage multipliers vs critical damage multipliers, they are 2 completely different things, i wont go into more detail just now

    the advice above is solid, but i thought you might like a little list on how to calculate your damage, maybe that will make things easier to understand

    • work out your total weapon damage multiplier. take the base number from the weapon then add on any other bonuses you get eg from the cleaves. i believe vorp is already added to the number you see on the weapon
    • roll your damage dice
    • multiply that roll by your total weapon damage multiplier. this is how much the lump of metal hurt
    • add on your damage bonuses, the +3 on the weapon, your STR bonus (more if it's a 2-hander, less if it's in the off hand), any magical buffs you have like a bards song. this is how much the lump of metal hurt with you swinging it
    • if it was a crit you get to add a seeker bonus if you have one to the damage then multiply the whole lot by the crit multiplier
    • roll up any extra damage the weapon does, eg flaming. if it was a crit you might have extra effects kick in, like flaming burst, the burst does extra damage on crits
    • watch the damage numbers float up the screen and smile


    there, i hope that helps, as you can see there is quite a bit going on

    there is also more going on with the crits. there is the threat range, which dictates how often a weapon crits, then there is the multiplier which as you know determines how much it hurts.

    as a wizard, see if you can get your mits on the masters touch spell, then you can pick up something heavy like a greataxe. that got my wiz from lvl1 to 12 when the magic really took over . it's an annoying spell as regular vendors dont sell it, so you need to teleport to the portable hole to find a vendor that does. it's a lvl1 spell so don't blow tons of plat on it. depending on your level it may be easier to buy some teleport scrolls then try a few times if you're almost at the right level for them.
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