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  1. #1
    Community Member Ironclans_evil_twin's Avatar
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    Default In other news DDO players down 25% Whats the excuse for no players pt II

    cont. from a previous thread.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ironclans_evil_twin View Post
    In Feb peaks [logins] were near 20000, by april they are roughly 2500 less at 17500 at the end of April heading downward, we're two months further along now.
    That describes the last DDO tracker quarterly graph with peak logins when eGH was released dropping from 20k to 17.5k (does anyone have a cashed copy or a saved version of the last graph? If anyone has it could you post it Please?) Links to DDO tracker all updated to the new graph In the newest graph we see the same dramatic trend downward.



    As we can see the trend continued downward. The Shadowfell prelude quests released in the last update lead to only a minor and very temporary bump up for obvious reasons. Peaks are now very close to 15k or lower for the majority of servers which is a very symmetrical decline from the 20k, and 17.5k marks.

    That's approximately a 2500 drop in the last DDO tracker update, followed by another 2500 drop. 2500 out of 20,000 is over 11%, and in the new graph 2500 out of 17500 is over 15%...

    Even a 15% decline should be startling. a 25% decline on the other hand is pretty massive. A loss of over a quarter of the logins from the peaks at the release of eGH.

    So now that it's clear the game is dramatically less populated since it's last interest generating update, and even significantly less populated than it was in the dead of winter long after last years final interest generating update. Maybe we can get into some productive discussion of how to deal with the reality instead of denying what's obvious and trying to make excuses (though I'm sure someone will point out that it's summer... interestingly that's a contextual distinction, which is something some of you were not willing to give to the previous graph (where the late winter months after the last update were pointed at and context was intentionally ignored) which was cherry picked as evidence that the last graph was "flat" based on only two data points in the entire graph... but people will rationalize anything if they don't wish to believe it enough.

    I wonder if anyone had the old DDO tracker quarterly plots from Motu onward? It would be very interesting to see and compare to the upcoming expansion.

  2. #2
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Have no fear . . . the "all is fine" fanbois will be here soon enough to dispel you're d000m!

  3. #3
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    Have no fear . . . the "all is fine" fanbois will be here soon enough to dispel you're d000m!
    Ironically they were the ones telling everyone else that if they dont like DDO they should go do something else. Maybe 25% of those who got told in such a manner actually listened.
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  4. #4
    Community Member HotMaarl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    Ironically they were the ones telling everyone else that if they dont like DDO they should go do something else. Maybe 25% of those who got told in such a manner actually listened.
    I sure hope so. Let all the whinebois go play GW2 where they can pew pew with bows that literally fire rainbows.

    It's called taking out the trash. Servers are cleaner now, with a greater percentage of dedicated, quality players. That's how i choose to spin it.

  5. #5
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HotMaarl View Post
    I sure hope so. Let all the whinebois go play GW2 where they can pew pew with bows that literally fire rainbows.

    It's called taking out the trash. Servers are cleaner now, with a greater percentage of dedicated, quality players. That's how i choose to spin it.
    Your spin and reality are apparently not acquainted. On my server the new players by far out-number the old and "quality" is down. it's almost like we got a second wave of F2Pers.

  6. #6
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    Ironically they were the ones telling everyone else that if they dont like DDO they should go do something else. Maybe 25% of those who got told in such a manner actually listened.
    Dead on. The "take it or leave it" chimps give people an option . . . and rather play a game they no longer find fun they left (I still am having fun, hence still being here).

    My personal opinion in short . . . is end-game is completely dead right now and some are just bored of TRing. I'm in a 70ish account guild, the serial TRers (which I've become lately, though I'm more of an end-gamer) are still active and the end-gamers are gone. Will they come back for this "expansion" . . . of level 16-18 quests with an epic option and NO RAID . . . I doubt it.

    This game's been on a downward spiral since U11. Can it recover? I'd like to hope so, but how i have no idea.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    Ironically they were the ones telling everyone else that if they dont like DDO they should go do something else. Maybe 25% of those who got told in such a manner actually listened.
    Hopefully they did leave. The forums have been less packed with crazies as well, which is a good thing. Perhaps players will come to the forums now and they can lose the reputation as a place for drama queens that don't actually play the game.

  8. #8
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    [QUOTE=jalont;5028532]Hopefully they did leave. The forums have been less packed with crazies as wellQUOTE]

    Did you no read this thread...

  9. #9
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    Have no fear . . . the "all is fine" fanbois will be here soon enough to dispel you're d000m!
    Honestly don't see the problem with the graph, my memory is that the last graph showed an average of just under 15k. That said if you want to know where some players are going, look to the etr/htr enhancment pass nge, combined with the spell crit lowering bug that will soon be wai when they do the eh pass. Many of us are just fed up with bad decisions. I haven't logged on in about 2 weeks, I just stay on the forums because I do love this game and I keep thinking maybe I'll read a dev post where things turn around as this really is the best mmo I've found because of the character customization. Too bad the devs are going to kill it the way things are going.

  10. #10
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charononus View Post
    Too bad the devs are going to kill it the way things are going.
    Flag on the play.

    Premature d000m!.

    15 yard penalty.

    first down.

    Wait until we see the beta of the ENH before calling d000m on that.

  11. #11
    Scholar Of Adventure & Hero Missing_Minds's Avatar
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    1. New games got released/open betas.
    2. Some people don't stay around in one game for long periods.
    3. End of April onward signifies end of semester test times, to summer vacations, sports, etc. till August in the U.S. As a good chunk of players are in the U.S. it is logical to see a drop here.
    4. People leaving due to quality of the last updates.

    I think that about covers it fairly. Did I miss any other reasonable/logical points of significant value?

  12. #12
    Community Member little_me's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Missing_Minds View Post
    1. New games got released/open betas.
    2. Some people don't stay around in one game for long periods.
    3. End of April onward signifies end of semester test times, to summer vacations, sports, etc. till August in the U.S. As a good chunk of players are in the U.S. it is logical to see a drop here.
    4. People leaving due to quality of the last updates.

    I think that about covers it fairly. Did I miss any other reasonable/logical points of significant value?
    My reason is likely an anomaly, I'm refusing to play since they refuse to fix a bug. Truth be told though.. I think I'm losing this battle though, servers will close before it will be fixed. Others might be skipping the playing for Bug reasons though even if not the same bug.
    Amazing, they actually managed to fix forum account post count and stuff without me bug reporting it!
    O.o there is hope out there yet!

  13. #13
    Community Member Hendrik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Missing_Minds View Post
    1. New games got released/open betas.
    2. Some people don't stay around in one game for long periods.
    3. End of April onward signifies end of semester test times, to summer vacations, sports, etc. till August in the U.S. As a good chunk of players are in the U.S. it is logical to see a drop here.
    4. People leaving due to quality of the last updates.

    I think that about covers it fairly. Did I miss any other reasonable/logical points of significant value?
    Your reason and logic does not contain enough Hate for this thread and will be summarily dismissed as the crazed rantings of a fanboi.

    Everyone may now continue to hate the game you play.

    Enjoy.



    I will await the OPs post about the bumb in numbers come August.

    Quote Originally Posted by hsinclair
    I heard the devs hate all wizards, bards, clerics, fighters, and fuzzy bunnies and only want us to play halfling barbarian/paladin shuriken specialists!

    It's totally true, I have a reliable source. You better reroll now.
    Adventurer, Bug Reporter, Mournlander.

  14. #14
    Founder & Hero Uska's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Missing_Minds View Post
    1. New games got released/open betas.
    2. Some people don't stay around in one game for long periods.
    3. End of April onward signifies end of semester test times, to summer vacations, sports, etc. till August in the U.S. As a good chunk of players are in the U.S. it is logical to see a drop here.
    4. People leaving due to quality of the last updates.

    I think that about covers it fairly. Did I miss any other reasonable/logical points of significant value?
    I think you got the major ones

    The ANTI-Realms FANBOI NUKE THE REALMS ITS THE ONLY REAL WAY TO BE SURE

  15. #15

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    I'm not a fanboi so please take this as a simple observation; without a year-over-year comparison these data mean relatively little about the overall number of players in the game or give any indication of what has produced a downward, quarterly slope. Presenting those data, if available, may lend some insight.
    The newest computer can merely compound, at speed, the oldest problem in the relations between human beings, and in the end the communicator will be confronted with the old problem, of what to say and how to say it. - Edward R. Murrow (1964)

  16. #16
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sebastianosmith View Post
    I'm not a fanboi so please take this as a simple observation; without a year-over-year comparison these data mean relatively little about the overall number of players in the game or give any indication of what has produced a downward, quarterly slope. Presenting those data, if available, may lend some insight.
    We don't have this data, but do you think for a second that the game population is anywhere near it's peek which was pre-U11?

    U11 is when things started going down hill. I mean the best thing about DDO in 2011 was the bag-bug.

    Can this be reversed? I'm not sure.

    Biggest issue now is end-game is dead. how does Turbine bring it back? Epic TR sure ain't gonna do it with people starting again at level 1.

  17. #17
    Community Member FlaviusMaximus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sebastianosmith View Post
    I'm not a fanboi so please take this as a simple observation; without a year-over-year comparison these data mean relatively little about the overall number of players in the game or give any indication of what has produced a downward, quarterly slope. Presenting those data, if available, may lend some insight.
    I'm glad at least one intelligent person is posting in this thread.

  18. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironclans_evil_twin View Post
    snip
    And your point is?
    You post an approximative estimate and present it in a completely biased way to prove what is self evident, for the purpose of...?
    I really don't get it; some people have left, some will join, some more will leave. Is this a reason to put some blame on Turbine? Granted, there's plenty of blame to be tossed in their direction. But I don't think you have a logical argument there, sorry.
    I mean, you actively spend time looking for numbers that say that DDO is leaking users to come here and tell us that the game is dying? What is that behaviour supposed to tell us?

    As you can see, your post opens up more questions than the answers it provides.

  19. #19
    Community Member shibe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironclans_evil_twin View Post
    cont. from a previous thread.


    That describes the last DDO tracker quarterly graph with peak logins when eGH was released dropping from 20k to 17.5k (does anyone have a cashed copy or a saved version of the last graph? If anyone has it could you post it Please?) Links to DDO tracker all updated to the new graph In the newest graph we see the same dramatic trend downward.



    As we can see the trend continued downward. The Shadowfell prelude quests released in the last update lead to only a minor and very temporary bump up for obvious reasons. Peaks are now very close to 15k or lower for the majority of servers which is a very symmetrical decline from the 20k, and 17.5k marks.

    That's approximately a 2500 drop in the last DDO tracker update, followed by another 2500 drop. 2500 out of 20,000 is over 11%, and in the new graph 2500 out of 17500 is over 15%...

    Even a 15% decline should be startling. a 25% decline on the other hand is pretty massive. A loss of over a quarter of the logins from the peaks at the release of eGH.

    So now that it's clear the game is dramatically less populated since it's last interest generating update, and even significantly less populated than it was in the dead of winter long after last years final interest generating update. Maybe we can get into some productive discussion of how to deal with the reality instead of denying what's obvious and trying to make excuses (though I'm sure someone will point out that it's summer... interestingly that's a contextual distinction, which is something some of you were not willing to give to the previous graph (where the late winter months after the last update were pointed at and context was intentionally ignored) which was cherry picked as evidence that the last graph was "flat" based on only two data points in the entire graph... but people will rationalize anything if they don't wish to believe it enough.

    I wonder if anyone had the old DDO tracker quarterly plots from Motu onward? It would be very interesting to see and compare to the upcoming expansion.
    So whats the point of this discussion? I want more players to join and play and keep playing. Do you have something that you/we can proactively do to make sure that this game stays alive and we all can keep playing and enjoying it? If not what kind of result would you like to get from this discussion? I would like more posts pointing out the finer points of the game over the others, maybe convince those on the fence this a great game. Clearly you put a lot of time and thought into this. Lets shift that effort into something positive. Hmm?

  20. #20
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    Throw a DDO convention?

    I guess you could throw a general MMO convention (since no one does that).

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