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  1. #1
    Community Member AzB's Avatar
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    Default Couple druid ques

    Had such a blast playing the druid life on my TR, I decided to roll a druid.

    Casting part is pretty straightforward, although I can't make rhyme or reason out of when and where fatal harrier stops being active. I can log out and back in hours later, and it's still active. I can die, and it's still active when I release or get rezzed. But I can be incapacitated, and it becomes inactive. Or change instances, and it becomes inactive. It would to be consistent so I can keep up with this ability.

    Many of the special melee attacks are spells. They are removed by dispel magic. Ok, but it costs me 5sp to change into animal form. Why isn't that a spell subject to dispel magic?

    Stacking; does the 15% speed boost from wolf form stack with striding? It does not appear to, so it's a pointless ability much past 5th level when you can find striding boots everywhere. It makes no sense that a monk can run twice as fast as a wolf with striding 30%. Wolves can run up to 38mph in natural form...

    And melee speed; does it stack with alacrity items? I've got so much going on with melee attack speed... from the frenzy enhancement, to fatal harrier, etc. It's impossible to keep track of what the melee speed is supposed to be at any given time. Has anyone done any testing? Seat of the pants guesses?

    TIA. Just trying to figure out the best way to play this. So far it's a blast.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AzB View Post
    Many of the special melee attacks are spells. They are removed by dispel magic. Ok, but it costs me 5sp to change into animal form. Why isn't that a spell subject to dispel magic?
    Its a stance, not a spell. It just costs SP to activate - some stances do, some don't.

    Quote Originally Posted by AzB View Post
    Stacking; does the 15% speed boost from wolf form stack with striding? It does not appear to, so it's a pointless ability much past 5th level when you can find striding boots everywhere. It makes no sense that a monk can run twice as fast as a wolf with striding 30%. Wolves can run up to 38mph in natural form...
    Wolf form gives you an Enhancement bonus to runspeed. Striding does too, so like bonuses do not stack. Fast Movement (Monk and Barb) are untyped enhancements, and so they do stack, but the majority of runspeed bonus (including all the item/spell based ones) are Enhancement type.

    Quote Originally Posted by AzB View Post
    And melee speed; does it stack with alacrity items? I've got so much going on with melee attack speed... from the frenzy enhancement, to fatal harrier, etc. It's impossible to keep track of what the melee speed is supposed to be at any given time. Has anyone done any testing? Seat of the pants guesses?
    Alacrity is also an Enhancement boost to melee speed. Fatal Harrier is as well, so only the higher of the two will apply. Blood Moon Frenzy also is an Enhancement type, but that only applies to your pets/hirelings/etc. anyway, not to you...but, for instance, it wont stack with Haste, if someone cast it on your minions.

  3. #3
    Community Member AzB's Avatar
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    Couple more ques about combat and combat feats; does thf or twf help at all? I know natural fighting is a must. What about improved crit bludgeon?

    It also does not seem to matter what weapon I choose to hold, so I just use whatever has the most advantageous procs for the situation. Most times a thaum staff with frostbite tossed on it is as good as anything else and gives a little boost to the spells. Any experience with specific weapons is appreciated... I feel like I must be missing something here.

    Thanks!

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    2015 DDO Players Council FuzzyDuck81's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzB View Post
    Couple more ques about combat and combat feats; does thf or twf help at all? I know natural fighting is a must. What about improved crit bludgeon?

    It also does not seem to matter what weapon I choose to hold, so I just use whatever has the most advantageous procs for the situation. Most times a thaum staff with frostbite tossed on it is as good as anything else and gives a little boost to the spells. Any experience with specific weapons is appreciated... I feel like I must be missing something here.

    Thanks!
    2hf & 2wf don't make any difference at all when in animal form so unless you're fighting in elemental form they're wasted feats. ic:bludgeon includes unarmed & natural attacks (ie. when shapeshifted) so if you're fighting in animal form that's the one you'll want.

    Most people will go for sword & board as the PRR & boost to doublestrike will persist while shapeshifted & only passive effects like vertigo, seeker(?) etc. will apply for an off-hand weapon while shifted, the damage etc. effects on your main hand weapon are the only ones that will effect your attacks. As you've already noticed, the base weapon type is pretty irrelevant meaning you can often find some good weapons very cheap if they happen to be on an undesirable weapon type, like light hammers, handaxes or even scepters.

    As for specific weapons the fang of siberys (end list from the xoriat chain in the 12) is a great piece of kit, the cloudburst effect procs pretty regularly & combined with reaving roar will let you take out entire crowds in pretty short order from level 16-20+ (tails off somewhat in epic, but depends on diff & scaling if you're soloing or lowmanning). The crit profile on wolf attacks is pretty nice too, so a radiance greensteel (since you mentioned being a tr) is also very nice so you can get that extra sneak attack damage in.
    I don't mean to come across as unsympathetic - but I am, so I do.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AzB View Post
    Couple more ques about combat and combat feats; does thf or twf help at all? I know natural fighting is a must. What about improved crit bludgeon?

    It also does not seem to matter what weapon I choose to hold, so I just use whatever has the most advantageous procs for the situation. Most times a thaum staff with frostbite tossed on it is as good as anything else and gives a little boost to the spells. Any experience with specific weapons is appreciated... I feel like I must be missing something here.

    Thanks!
    You sound like you haven't read the DDO Wiki entry on Druids - that should answer a lot of your questions about the class

    Neither THF nor TWF help, since Druids in animal form count as Unarmed attacks. IC:Bludgeon does help, as does anything else that benefits unarmed combat, like WF: Unarmed.

    Your mainhand weapon will still apply its affixes to your attacks (Flaming, Righteous, etc.). Your offhand weapon/shield will still apply any general bonuses (Seeker, Parrying, Spellpower, stats, etc. - anything that applies to your character, not your attacks). Using a two handed weapon usually means you're wasting a slot (unless its got a whole slew of beneficial mods), since you don't benefit from glancing blows, and using a shield will still grant you PRR and AC (and double strike if you have the Shield Mastery/ISM feats). I think the common wisdom is to use a shield with spellpower; they're easy to craft and apply the most benefits from your offhand slot.

    For mainhand weapons, all the usual twinking candidates apply, except the ones that are based on crit profile like Carnifex or Deathnip. But Greensteel, naturally, or Cannith khopesh/rapier, and paralyzing/disruption/banishing/smiting at L10, and your crafted options like Holy of Pure Good and Screaming of Bleed. I'm not sure if Impact on your mainhand will carry over to your unarmed attacks or not, before you take IC:Bludgeon. Once you do get IC:B and that juicy 17-20/x3 crit profile on Winter Wolf, Improved Ribcracker is a good random lootgen mod that will add almost 10 average damage to your attacks, untyped so it works on everyone, even crit-immune mobs

    Star of Irian and Shrieking Star (L8) are good options for DPS, if you have the tproficiency, while Timeblade (L4) is a good defensive weapon since Slowburst actually sticks at low levels, and doublestrike is the main way to increase your melee DPS.
    Last edited by droid327; 06-20-2013 at 02:45 AM.

  6. #6
    Community Member AzB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post

    Star of Irian and Shrieking Star (L8) are good options for DPS, if you have the tproficiency, while Timeblade (L4) is a good defensive weapon since Slowburst actually sticks at low levels, and doublestrike is the main way to increase your melee DPS.
    That brings up another question, does proficiency really matter in animal form? Just from playing around with different weapons, it does not appear that non proficiency penalties really make a dent.

    Thanks for the info, it's clearing up a lot of loose ends for me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AzB View Post
    That brings up another question, does proficiency really matter in animal form? Just from playing around with different weapons, it does not appear that non proficiency penalties really make a dent.

    Thanks for the info, it's clearing up a lot of loose ends for me.
    Not quite sure on that one - but, aside from the -4 to hit penalty, you don't get grazing hits if you're not proficient.

    Also, I remember reading about a base 25% Miss chance with non-proficient weapons...not sure if that's currently Live or if that was something to be added during Enhancement Pass.

    Regardless, easy to test - if you're getting a lot of -Miss- and no grazing hits, then proficiency matters

  8. #8
    2015 DDO Players Council FuzzyDuck81's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzB View Post
    That brings up another question, does proficiency really matter in animal form? Just from playing around with different weapons, it does not appear that non proficiency penalties really make a dent.

    Thanks for the info, it's clearing up a lot of loose ends for me.
    Been meaning to check this out myself since i'm hoping to pick up Nightmare for my own druid... will have a look when i get home & see if i notice any difference between a plain weapon im proficient in (most of them thx to the fighter splash) vs. a plain bastard sword.
    I don't mean to come across as unsympathetic - but I am, so I do.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FuzzyDuck81 View Post
    Been meaning to check this out myself since i'm hoping to pick up Nightmare for my own druid... will have a look when i get home & see if i notice any difference between a plain weapon im proficient in (most of them thx to the fighter splash) vs. a plain bastard sword.
    can confirm for you that Nightmare will not have a proficiency penalty when in wolf form. I was lucky enough to pull a nightmare in a run earlier this week. and I tested it on the training dummy.

    when in human form, I got the -4 TH penalty. when in wolf form, I did not. I also use a named dwarven axe and confirmed the same was true for it. human -4, wolf no penalty

    of course, the flip side is also true. in wolf form, the +W bonus from the nightmare does not carry over to wolf form. it's still a good item and the procs all carry over to wolf form but the biggest issue I see with animal forms scaling into epic content is you only get your base wolf attack damage, 1d10. you get the +7 TH/damage but not the 2.5 multiplier from nightmare.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kendo View Post
    can confirm for you that Nightmare will not have a proficiency penalty when in wolf form. I was lucky enough to pull a nightmare in a run earlier this week. and I tested it on the training dummy.

    when in human form, I got the -4 TH penalty. when in wolf form, I did not. I also use a named dwarven axe and confirmed the same was true for it. human -4, wolf no penalty

    of course, the flip side is also true. in wolf form, the +W bonus from the nightmare does not carry over to wolf form. it's still a good item and the procs all carry over to wolf form but the biggest issue I see with animal forms scaling into epic content is you only get your base wolf attack damage, 1d10. you get the +7 TH/damage but not the 2.5 multiplier from nightmare.
    It was my understanding that if you wield an Epic weapon (ML20+) you get 2[1d10] base die. Granted, that means you wont benefit any from 2.5-3[w] weapons other than the affixes, but I guess that's the price you pay for being able to take a dagger and turn it into a khopesh that does piercing too

  11. #11
    2015 DDO Players Council FuzzyDuck81's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kendo View Post
    can confirm for you that Nightmare will not have a proficiency penalty when in wolf form. I was lucky enough to pull a nightmare in a run earlier this week. and I tested it on the training dummy.

    when in human form, I got the -4 TH penalty. when in wolf form, I did not. I also use a named dwarven axe and confirmed the same was true for it. human -4, wolf no penalty

    of course, the flip side is also true. in wolf form, the +W bonus from the nightmare does not carry over to wolf form. it's still a good item and the procs all carry over to wolf form but the biggest issue I see with animal forms scaling into epic content is you only get your base wolf attack damage, 1d10. you get the +7 TH/damage but not the 2.5 multiplier from nightmare.
    Cool thx And tbh the weapon dice & crit ranges etc. aren't really an issue, i'm perfectly used to that from other gear but the main reason i want nightmare is basically as an upgrade to the sacrificial dagger, so i can get the vampirism & entropic effects as well as the yummy woowoos
    I don't mean to come across as unsympathetic - but I am, so I do.

  12. #12
    Community Member AzB's Avatar
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    So playing with a shield and a weapon... does the shield mastery feat do anything for animal form.

    Thanks.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by AzB View Post
    So playing with a shield and a weapon... does the shield mastery feat do anything for animal form.
    Yes: the AC, doublestrike & PRR bonuses will carry over into animal form; as well as any passive bonuses on the shield itself (Spellpower, Protection, Seeker, etc.). Which is why so many shapeshifter builds take SM+ISM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    It was my understanding that if you wield an Epic weapon (ML20+) you get 2[1d10] base die. Granted, that means you wont benefit any from 2.5-3[w] weapons other than the affixes, but I guess that's the price you pay for being able to take a dagger and turn it into a khopesh that does piercing too
    I will try to do some more testing and report back. I was mainly focused on what the TH numbers were doing but it would be great if you do get boosted to 2[1d10] when using an epic weapon. still puts you behind the curve compared to other melees but I still like the over-all swiss army knife abilities of my little wolf.

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