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  1. #61
    Community Member dlsidhe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silverleafeon View Post
    Aye this a huge boon for you.

    A big part of a Legend Life is the planning that goes into it to avoid painting yourself into a corner.
    Now, with these changes if you find yourself painted into a corner, simply wait for the paint to dry.

    Huge, huge for Epic XP as you can wait for reset of quests you did on heroic.
    That second part is better news than the first; letting timers reset on Epic XP helps with the fewer quests available at that level.

    And, honestly, I doubt there will be much "exploiting" of the XP reset - people who do speed TRs (like a couple of my guildies) have their pattern down to a science - why wait for the ransack to expire when you can be through a TR in a week? People like me who flowersniff through it will benefit more; as an example, my monk on her legend life would love to go run Kobold's New Ringleader again (both for the XP and because it's a fun quest), but it's no longer feasible. I've put her on hiatus while I level destinies on my rogue and paladin; but, if I could go back and run fun quests again, I would. I hate planning every bit of XP; this makes it more likely I'll TR again.
    Thelanis - Dragons of the Shire
    Naeryna (Sun Elf 24 FvS Evoker) // Dianocia (Drow 11 Buckler o' Swashes) // Valissia (Elf 22 Shiradi Druid)
    Nae haz a story. Go read it.

  2. #62

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    Quote Originally Posted by dlsidhe View Post
    That second part is better news than the first; letting timers reset on Epic XP helps with the fewer quests available at that level.

    And, honestly, I doubt there will be much "exploiting" of the XP reset - people who do speed TRs (like a couple of my guildies) have their pattern down to a science - why wait for the ransack to expire when you can be through a TR in a week? People like me who flowersniff through it will benefit more; as an example, my monk on her legend life would love to go run Kobold's New Ringleader again (both for the XP and because it's a fun quest), but it's no longer feasible. I've put her on hiatus while I level destinies on my rogue and paladin; but, if I could go back and run fun quests again, I would. I hate planning every bit of XP; this makes it more likely I'll TR again.
    Aye, Cloey would shrug and say, a week ~ "I did three lives in one week..."

  3. #63

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    I think you are right, the biggest part of this is to Epic Xp.

    I wonder...

    What happens when you allow Epic Xp in Quests to reset?

    This would allow a huge loop hole in the game to be examined.

    What I mean is this, when you hit level cap your quest completion
    counters stop, to prevent Epic Quest from eventually hitting 0 XP.

    Now that this is no longer a threat, it is quite possible that being
    at level cap will no longer protect quest completion counters.
    That protection can be removed.

    This means that farming out Rusted Blades after 12 completions
    would result in zero xp until next week.

    All theory, but...

  4. #64

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    Also if there is a daily timer on each quest, then the ransack rules might be different.

  5. #65
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thrudh View Post
    Oh noes! Now getting to level 15 is only easy instead of super-easy

    Only TrollusMaximus could have nothing positive to say about these much asked-for changes.

    Kudos Turbine...
    I am TrollusMaximus . . . and even I can't find anything bad to say about this.

    But . . . the devils' in the details and I'd like to know all of the details before I call off the hounds of d000mm.

  6. #66
    Community Member UurlockYgmeov's Avatar
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    First: Excellent Communication! Keep it up!

    Players hate to be mushrooms - and those that volunteer time on Lammania really don't deserve to be mushrooms.

    Second: TRing is a good source of revenue - making it easier (and the XP curve) and smoother only helps the game and the bottom line.

    Third: Encouraging players to do entire chains with carrots - I like; daily bonuses - I like; Grace period - I like (but most TR's aren't a single level long enough to enjoy it - so it needs to be a very short grace period (20 hours or so). These things are a massive paradigm shift and as others have said devil's in the details (and we wait with baited breath to(and drooling tongues) see the details)

    Fourth: Overall XP needed for 3rd life and beyond needs to be reduced from the current 4.3 million....

    Keep it up! Am looking forward to seeing what is coming for sagas!
    Last edited by UurlockYgmeov; 06-20-2013 at 01:30 PM. Reason: my kobold powered spell checker is on Union Break

  7. #67
    Community Member Systern's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silverleafeon View Post
    Woot, once per quest not once per toon!

    I think they just took care of ransack abuse right there.

    I have watched once and done vs farming and seen it preform well already.
    Pretty sure they mean that each day there will be a featured, showcase quest...

    Monday: Run HiPS for the Daily bonus.
    Tuesday: Run Raiding the Giant's Vault for Daily Bonus.
    etc,
    etc...

    Not, every quest gets a bonus the first time you run it each day.


    Quote Originally Posted by PurpleFooz View Post
    Next a new daily bonus is being added to quest completions. Every day, (We'll pick) a quest (that) will have a bonus added to the base XP value. Playing (that) quest on any difficulty level qualifies for this daily bonus.
    Last edited by Systern; 06-20-2013 at 01:37 PM.

  8. #68
    Community Member dlsidhe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silverleafeon View Post
    I think you are right, the biggest part of this is to Epic Xp.

    I wonder...

    What happens when you allow Epic Xp in Quests to reset?

    This would allow a huge loop hole in the game to be examined.

    What I mean is this, when you hit level cap your quest completion
    counters stop, to prevent Epic Quest from eventually hitting 0 XP.

    Now that this is no longer a threat, it is quite possible that being
    at level cap will no longer protect quest completion counters.
    That protection can be removed.

    This means that farming out Rusted Blades after 12 completions
    would result in zero xp until next week.

    All theory, but...
    Yeah, it's just theoretical that the removal of counters at cap will be removed, but there's no reason for them anymore if you can run a variety of quests, then come back to them later. That would encourage people farming destinies to run a variety of content rather than the same fast, high XP quests repeatedly, which would lead to more groups in Epic content. In theory.
    Thelanis - Dragons of the Shire
    Naeryna (Sun Elf 24 FvS Evoker) // Dianocia (Drow 11 Buckler o' Swashes) // Valissia (Elf 22 Shiradi Druid)
    Nae haz a story. Go read it.

  9. #69
    Community Member dlsidhe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Systern View Post
    Pretty sure they mean that each day there will be a featured, showcase quest...

    Monday: Run HiPS for the Daily bonus.
    Tuesday: Run Raiding the Giant's Vault for Daily Bonus.
    etc,
    etc...

    Not, every quest gets a bonus the first time you run it each day.
    ^This.

    So, one day it might be "Bonus XP on Misery Peak!"

    Then, the next, "Trial by Fire is today's Bonus Quest!"

    That's how I read it.
    Thelanis - Dragons of the Shire
    Naeryna (Sun Elf 24 FvS Evoker) // Dianocia (Drow 11 Buckler o' Swashes) // Valissia (Elf 22 Shiradi Druid)
    Nae haz a story. Go read it.

  10. #70
    Community Member redspecter23's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dlsidhe View Post
    Yeah, it's just theoretical that the removal of counters at cap will be removed, but there's no reason for them anymore if you can run a variety of quests, then come back to them later. That would encourage people farming destinies to run a variety of content rather than the same fast, high XP quests repeatedly, which would lead to more groups in Epic content. In theory.
    I would have to assume that the situation we have on live right now that allows for unlimited completions with no additional penalty will no longer be the case when this change goes live. I really don't think Turbine ever factored that in the first place and probably assumed we would TR to reset our completions and farm more destinies. Their new TR system combined with this new xp system remove the need for unlimited completions at cap anyway. You will however have to wait for your quest xp ransack to wear off if you enjoy farming just a few specific quests (or buy the timer reset that will inevitably end up in the store).
    Kaarloe - Degenerate Matter - Argonnessen

  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by dlsidhe View Post
    ^This.

    So, one day it might be "Bonus XP on Misery Peak!"

    Then, the next, "Trial by Fire is today's Bonus Quest!"

    That's how I read it.
    That's not how I read it so I'd love to see a developer comment on this one. I read it as the first time on ANY quest every day you get a bonus. Like I ran Kobold's New Ringleader on Monday, get bonus, run it again, no bonus, run Misery's Peak bonus, run it 2 more times no bonus, then run Kobold's New Ringleader 24+ hours after the first run on Monday and get the bonus again. I could see the wording he had taken to mean either one though.

    Quote Originally Posted by redspecter23 View Post
    I would have to assume that the situation we have on live right now that allows for unlimited completions with no additional penalty will no longer be the case when this change goes live. I really don't think Turbine ever factored that in the first place and probably assumed we would TR to reset our completions and farm more destinies. Their new TR system combined with this new xp system remove the need for unlimited completions at cap anyway. You will however have to wait for your quest xp ransack to wear off if you enjoy farming just a few specific quests (or buy the timer reset that will inevitably end up in the store).
    I really hope you're wrong on this. Some people will really not want to Epic TR to continue getting ED xp - even after the new changes for ED xp. They may really like the life they're on. Maybe they just want to farm gear and get occasional ED xp in an off destiny. There could be any number of reasons someone would want to stay at the cap for a prolonged period of time. Creating a system where they're now limited in the number of times they can run a certain quest at cap in a certain time period would be less than ideal.

    That said, the fact that we will have ransack-style rather than permanent xp penalties far outweighs even that downside. I'd much prefer it if you're not right - especially given the emphasis at cap on gear over xp farming (which requires repeating on quests until you're ransacked from a loot perspective) - but even if you're right worst-case means you have to wait whatever the ransack timer on that quest is to rerun it for xp. Under the current system where there's basically two quests worth running (rusted blades/impossible demands) that's pretty bad. When we keep in mind though that with the new cap of 28 those quests would be far from ideal I don't see it as being a killer - just not a perfect solution.
    Tajawuka 9 monk/8 ranger/3 arti AA (3 ranger/monk/fighter pl's) - Toolbots working on Morninglord Cleric life #2 (3 wizard/sorc/druid pl) - Evisra 28 rogue

  12. #72
    Community Member Systern's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkrok View Post
    That's not how I read it so I'd love to see a developer comment on this one. I read it as the first time on ANY quest every day you get a bonus. Like I ran Kobold's New Ringleader on Monday, get bonus, run it again, no bonus, run Misery's Peak bonus, run it 2 more times no bonus, then run Kobold's New Ringleader 24+ hours after the first run on Monday and get the bonus again. I could see the wording he had taken to mean either one though.
    Doesn't that sound too good to be true to you? I also recalled that a player suggested the premise of featuring lesser run quests with a daily bonus a few months back and it was received well by Turbine. I figure it's more likely they took a good idea to give less popular stuff a temporary boost rather than they are rewarding farming a quest over the course of a week rather than a day.


    Quote Originally Posted by Darkrok View Post
    I really hope you're wrong on this. Some people will really not want to Epic TR to continue getting ED xp - even after the new changes for ED xp. They may really like the life they're on. Maybe they just want to farm gear and get occasional ED xp in an off destiny. There could be any number of reasons someone would want to stay at the cap for a prolonged period of time. Creating a system where they're now limited in the number of times they can run a certain quest at cap in a certain time period would be less than ideal.

    That said, the fact that we will have ransack-style rather than permanent xp penalties far outweighs even that downside. I'd much prefer it if you're not right - especially given the emphasis at cap on gear over xp farming (which requires repeating on quests until you're ransacked from a loot perspective) - but even if you're right worst-case means you have to wait whatever the ransack timer on that quest is to rerun it for xp. Under the current system where there's basically two quests worth running (rusted blades/impossible demands) that's pretty bad. When we keep in mind though that with the new cap of 28 those quests would be far from ideal I don't see it as being a killer - just not a perfect solution.
    People rage and complain about soul-numbing, boring, repetitive grinding. I can see Turbine putting in a system to discourage that quite easily. "I don't do this because it's fun! I do it because it works!!!" "Fine, it won't work anymore. Go play other quests and have fun."

  13. #73
    Community Member Systern's Avatar
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    Hey Fooz, one thing that I would really like to see added in addition to all the awesome stuff you've mentioned coming down the pipe...

    Can your trip past heroic to epic rest Bravery Bonus Flags, maybe? My girlfriend really likes heroic Gianthold. I like having the streak while Epic to push to cap easier. It'd be nice if we were both happy.

    Of course, with the curve adjustment (are you just flattening the arc, or adjusting its length btw?) and introduction of sagas and daily quest bonuses, I'm not sure it'll still be that big of an issue in the future.

    The current bravery streak mechanics really do make players choose to do content either at heroic or elite, and dissuades from doing both.

  14. #74
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    Sorry, my own stupidity ate a longer post so these will be short answers.

    Quote Originally Posted by Systern View Post
    Doesn't that sound too good to be true to you? I also recalled that a player suggested the premise of featuring lesser run quests with a daily bonus a few months back and it was received well by Turbine. I figure it's more likely they took a good idea to give less popular stuff a temporary boost rather than they are rewarding farming a quest over the course of a week rather than a day.
    Would depend on the bonus involved but I could see it being workable either way. The wording definitely didn't make it clear to me...I could read it either way and see it as workable either way depending on the details.

    Quote Originally Posted by Systern View Post
    People rage and complain about soul-numbing, boring, repetitive grinding. I can see Turbine putting in a system to discourage that quite easily. "I don't do this because it's fun! I do it because it works!!!" "Fine, it won't work anymore. Go play other quests and have fun."
    I definitely agree with their goals here...just saying that at cap there really isn't enough content to have ransack timers for xp, especially with some of the more active players in the game.

    In my specific case I have a toon that's likely to stay at cap for a long time. I love pulling him out once a week to loot ransack rusted blades and the deal and the demon. Current system I can get ED xp for all the runs while I'm doing loot ransack. Under the new system if they have less runs to xp ransack than to loot ransack I couldn't do that...I'd probably sacrifice 25-50% of the xp gained depending on how the quest xp ransack rules were structured. It's cases like this that make me think they'd be better off just leaving cap as-is.
    Tajawuka 9 monk/8 ranger/3 arti AA (3 ranger/monk/fighter pl's) - Toolbots working on Morninglord Cleric life #2 (3 wizard/sorc/druid pl) - Evisra 28 rogue

  15. #75

  16. #76
    Community Member Grosbeak07's Avatar
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    I like these changes in general. Of course I reserve final judgement until we see how they actually work on Lamannia.
    Magical Rings are well... magical. - Gandalf

  17. #77
    Community Member Qhualor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Systern View Post
    People rage and complain about soul-numbing, boring, repetitive grinding. I can see Turbine putting in a system to discourage that quite easily. "I don't do this because it's fun! I do it because it works!!!" "Fine, it won't work anymore. Go play other quests and have fun."
    i really hope that's what happens. for about 3 years i have been watching the lfm unofficially during my down times in the game. i would see what players were running for quests, how many in groups, group makeup, quantity of lfms, how many in what level range etc. over time i saw many changes and ups and downs in activity, but one thing i saw more and more of was the same xp farming quests. i saw less and less lfms for the more unpopular quests and watched how long someone would leave the lfm up for, check to see if they end up soloing by checking the Who, look to see if they were short manning, look to see where the party leader was at that moment and what he/she was doing while trying to fill the group by hovering over the lfm, look to see if the lfm stayed active and he/she would attempt to solo but still accepting join requests, etc.

    a change is definitely needed when all you see are the same good xp farming quests on the lfm and little of everything else. boosting the xp in some of the less popular quests would be a start.

  18. #78
    Community Member Hokiewa's Avatar
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    The lovefest will come to a rapid end when the other shoe drops. Book it!
    Hilarious Princess....Sorry your life is so medicore after all this time..Lol, you are scared of a farmer? with a tractor....?

  19. #79
    Community Member btolson's Avatar
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    Are you also considering divorcing Heroic Completions from Epic Completions for epic'able content?

    Purposefully avoiding epic'able content during heroic levels is the most un-fun meta-gaming mechanic in the game, IMO. XP ransack will help with this, but it doesn't sound like it will preserve Bravery Bonus for epic content that was completed during heroic levels, which is what I at least am really after.

  20. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thrudh View Post
    Only TrollusMaximus could have nothing positive to say about these much asked-for changes.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hokiewa View Post
    The lovefest will come to a rapid end when the other shoe drops. Book it!
    OK, just stop! Calling me TrollusMaximus was Thrudh's best attempt at trying to say something funny in a long time, and now you are just going to ruin everything!

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