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  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    You're reading it wrong.

    As stated in the first post all TRs go through that "epic advantage" garbage where your ED levels get traded for heroic ranks.
    Hey, good to see you again. I just thought I'd leave this here from our conversation a couple days ago...

    Quote Originally Posted by Citzen_Gkar View Post
    I didn't hear this from someone who plays on the server that can't be named but its possible that by coincidence the server that can't be named might be testing a version of Epic TR where you have to max out all ED destiny XP bars, then you Epic TR which resets your ED to 0 XP in all destinies. You have to level the EDs from scratch, but for your first Epic TR you unlock the new 4th twist slot and get 1 twist point, and for each subsequent Epic TR you get another twist point (up to a total of 3 extra twist points). For Epic Completions you need to complete 3 Epic TRs and then when you start that 4th life you get a free Epic feat (counts as L21 epic feat)
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    I give this troll an 8.5 out of 10.

    There is no way Turbine would make this a re-level of destinies, even they cannot be that stupid. That's the insane/inane level of grind that'll make people quit.
    Ok, so maybe it wasn't exactly as we heard about today but pretty darn close eh? lol

    Boy I must be a good guesser.

  2. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glin View Post
    I am excited to start sharing our plans for the future of the Reincarnation system! Later this year (targeting Update 20) we look forward to introducing two new TR destinations, Epic Destiny True Reincarnation and Iconic True Reincarnation. We’ve got some minor improvements involving Lesser and Greater Reincarnation in store, as well.


    We’ve seen a number of questions and discussions about TR, Iconics, and the TR / end-game gap. For the expansion pack, we are focused on ensuring that the new races are fun and playable, the content is fun and beautiful, and that the enhancement system changes launch as expected! With that, we plan to build out the TR system later in the year. The team is also taking the time to get your early feedback as the designers and engineers lock down feature plans. - How does this fit (or change) your playstyle? Read on for details, then let us know!

    A few goals for Epic Destiny TR:


    • Extend Reincarnation system to allow for 38-point builds
    • Include Epic Destinies in the TR cycle (with Epic Destiny Past Life Feats)
    • Reward you for additional investment in Epic Destinies (with starting ranks after TR)
    • Adjust the XP curve in Epic levels for multi-life TR to avoid the dramatic escalating grind
    • Include Iconics in the TR cycle (with Iconic Past Life Feats)
    • Allow you to TR into and out of Iconics (if you own Iconics)


    How does this system look in practice?

    Heroic True Reincarnation


    • Heroic TR remains primarily unchanged at level 20 or above
    • Grants a Class Past Life Feat that can stack up to 3x
    • Adds 2 build points up to a 36 point build
    • Benefits from the Epic Advantage if you earn Epic Destinies before TR (below)


    Epic Destiny True Reincarnation


    • Can be taken at Level Cap (Level 28 with Shadowfell Conspiracy)
    • Grants an Epic Destiny Past Life Feat
      • Feat based on active, maximized Epic Destiny

    • Karmic Bond -The active ED’s experience is now bonded through each ED True Reincarnation going forward
    • Grants a Class Past Life Feat (same as Heroic TR)
    • You must have a maximized, non-bonded ED to complete this TR
    • Adds 2 build points up to a 38 point build


    Epic Advantage


    With any type of True Reincarnation, all Epic Destiny Levels earned will give you an advantage when you rebuild your character, by converting Destiny Levels into Heroic Ranks. Every level of Epic Destiny you have earned will count toward ranks earned for your next life. (Epic Destinies will not carry over to your next life, except those destinies that you have bonded in previous lives with ED TR.)

    Iconic True Reincarnation

    That’s right; Iconics will have their own form of True Reincarnation, earning their own unique set of past-life feats. You will also be able to TR from any character into an Iconic, which begins at level 15, like normal. Epic Advantage also works on both ends, as well, transferring ED XP earned in your Iconic life, and, if you TR into an Iconic, adding XP on top of your level 15 starting XP.Can be taken at Level Cap (Level 28 with Shadowfell Conspiracy)


    • Grants an Iconic Past Life Feat that can stack up to 3x
    • Adds 2 build points up a 36 point build
    • Earns ranks from Epic Advantage


    What else?

    Here are some changes we’re currently exploring:


    • Reincarnation cooldown timer reduced to 3 days.
    • Reincarnation XP curves smoothed to ease penalties for multiple lives.
    • Lesser Reincarnation will allow a Heroic character to reincarnate as a Champion. Greater Reincarnation will no longer be sold, in favor of an improved Lesser Reincarnation.
    • Iconic characters will be able to Lesser Reincarnate


    We are eager to begin production on this system and appreciate the many players that are eager to see us fulfill the end game potential that the TR system presents. With these changes we are also keeping a long-term view for TR, such as how to expand the Epic Destiny system and continue to support level cap growth in the future.


    Our sincere intentions are to provide these features to you, and the DDO community at large. We invite you response to these details and thank you for your support and fortitude while we roll these changes out in support of this year’s expansion pack. The team is thrilled that DDO continues to grow, innovate, and provide a great D&D experience.
    Focusing on the "new races", emphasis on the plurality. What new races? :O Are the iconic heroes being labeled 'races' for some reason?

  3. #103
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eonfreon View Post
    I just hope since this is an update by a Producer, a type of person who is generally rather clueless about the game mechanics, that he just misunderstood what the developers are really doing and that it won't really work like Glin thiinks it will. Sort of the old "take paralyzing from this weapon and put it on that weapon" type of mistake. This time I'll actually be happy that a Producer gets the mechanics wrong.
    LOLz . . . it's true that our greatest hope lies in the general cluelessness of the producers. I'm hoping this is another paralyzing weapon thingy and he just got the talking points wrong.

    If Epic "Advantage" is optional this is all fine and good. If this is mandatory they've just killed TRing which means they killed their game.

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charononus View Post
    Complete failure, I'd never ever want to grind out all my ed's again and it sounds like I'd only be able to bond one per tr. This means I'd have to regrind the entire mess of xp out without the nice easy farm of id and rusted blades. Your proposal sounds like it completely kills tr'ing.
    Except for everyone who didn't spend time grinding out every single ED. The problem is people do things and make assumptions about the future - If I do this unecessary grind now, I'll never have to do it again! Obviously the devs job is to add incentive to continue playing, if they endlessly let people keep and stack up more and more of this stuff there's less incentive.. I'm frankly not surprised, and from the standpoint of anyone who hasn't already wasted a bunch of time grinding a bunch of EDs they don't need/use, it makes a lot of sense. Someone with a few EDs worked heavily on won't lose much at all and would see the merit of the system. TRing has never been anything BUT a continued grind, so I don't know what people expected really.

  5. #105
    Uber Completionist luvirini's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glin View Post
    (Epic Destinies will not carry over to your next life, except those destinies that you have bonded in previous lives with ED TR.)
    Ouch, So if we have EDs in use today, we just lose that 27+ million XP?

    And if we have few destinies at level 4, we just lose it?

    So you want people to just stop TRing?

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by eonfreon View Post
    It would be nice if the same old heroic TR is still there. But from the sound of it, they want to change that as well. Because from the sound of it a TR will wipe away all of my Epic Destiny progress as well. Which is NOT how it works in the "old heroic TR" currently..
    Yeah, this would break the game for me. I currently am enjoying running a character up to 23-25 while running some epic quests, then TRing using the hearts I have earned from epic tokens, running up another past life, then restarting epic grinding with fresh repeat/first time counters and a long break since I was in those quests.

    After this... I'm not even sure if I want to log in tonight. It just makes any ED progress I make completely pointless and it basically prevents you from TRing at any point from 20-27 unless you want to lose all ED progress that life.

    Yeah, this is a game stopper.

  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by losian2 View Post
    Focusing on the "new races", emphasis on the plurality. What new races? :O Are the iconic heroes being labeled 'races' for some reason?
    Yeah, that's exactly what they are calling them. You pick them from the race selection screen in the game. The "WF Bladeforge" is considered as separate a race as Elf is from Helf.

  8. #108
    The Front Side Gratch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by losian2 View Post
    Focusing on the "new races", emphasis on the plurality. What new races? :O Are the iconic heroes being labeled 'races' for some reason?
    Given he's talking about the expansion pack he mean's the new iconics.. which are technically D&D sub-races++ (they modify starting stats but use enhancements of a primary race but also give level up benefits for certain classes). I don't think DDO is adding any entirely-their-own races or classes until they finish the enhancement redo on the current race/class set they have.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan View Post
    DO NOT DO THIS. We are investigating.

  9. #109
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post

    If Epic "Advantage" is optional this is all fine and good. If this is mandatory they've just killed TRing which means they killed their game.
    Especially since they're releasing nge I mean the enhancement pass at pretty much the same time. I can make myself kind of accept the nge I mean enhancment pass even though I think it's pretty bad, this on top of it.............

  10. #110
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by luvirini View Post
    So you want people to just stop TRing?
    I think that is there goal. I don't think Turbine's happy that the Motu and FR stuff isn't played as much because to be quite honest TRing is more fun. This might be the poison pill for TR.

  11. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by Glin View Post
    Iconic True Reincarnation

    That’s right; Iconics will have their own form of True Reincarnation, earning their own unique set of past-life feats. You will also be able to TR from any character into an Iconic, which begins at level 15, like normal. Epic Advantage also works on both ends, as well, transferring ED XP earned in your Iconic life, and, if you TR into an Iconic, adding XP on top of your level 15 starting XP.Can be taken at Level Cap (Level 28 with Shadowfell Conspiracy)


    What else?

    Here are some changes we’re currently exploring:


    • Reincarnation cooldown timer reduced to 3 days.
    • Reincarnation XP curves smoothed to ease penalties for multiple lives.
    • Lesser Reincarnation will allow a Heroic character to reincarnate as a Champion. Greater Reincarnation will no longer be sold, in favor of an improved Lesser Reincarnation.
    • Iconic characters will be able to Lesser Reincarnate
    These things btw are good. It's just TR/Epic TR that you have totally destroyed.

  12. #112
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by losian2 View Post
    Except for everyone who didn't spend time grinding out every single ED. The problem is people do things and make assumptions about the future - If I do this unecessary grind now, I'll never have to do it again! Obviously the devs job is to add incentive to continue playing, if they endlessly let people keep and stack up more and more of this stuff there's less incentive.. I'm frankly not surprised, and from the standpoint of anyone who hasn't already wasted a bunch of time grinding a bunch of EDs they don't need/use, it makes a lot of sense. Someone with a few EDs worked heavily on won't lose much at all and would see the merit of the system. TRing has never been anything BUT a continued grind, so I don't know what people expected really.
    Anyone who wants sense Weakness on any melee toon that isn't gonna be FoTW needs to pretty much max out every destiny. A 4-2-1 twist setup requires this.

    I'm sorry, to be all you could be this was needed.

    and now it'll all get flushed away . . . if you TR?

    People simply won't TR.

  13. #113
    2014 DDO Players Council Flavilandile's Avatar
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    *popcorn*

    You know what ?

    You just killed TR...

    Nobody is going to TR once this hits live as they are going to loose all their destinies.

    Personally I don't care, I don't TR, I TRed once, and it was because the PnP Character is a Druid... I made her a Cleric as Druid wasn't available, and I TRed her as a Druid when it became available.
    But seriously :

    are those that take the decision to implement things like that play the game ? ( the way it should be played, with god mode deactivated, on a live server )
    On G-Land : Flavilandile, Blacklock, Yaelle, Millishande, Larilandile, Gildalinde, Tenalafel, and many other...

  14. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by losian2 View Post
    Focusing on the "new races", emphasis on the plurality. What new races? :O Are the iconic heroes being labeled 'races' for some reason?
    The Iconic Heroes are considered races. They all must start as a specific race and class, although they can be leveled up in different classes.

    Bladeforged are WF Paladins at level 1.

    It appears that Morninglords will be Elf Clerics at level 1, Purple Dragon Knight will be Half-Orc Fighters at level 1, Shadar-kai Assassin will be Human (?) Rogues at level 1. At level 2, you can change each of these to another class, but the first level and race will always start the same.

  15. #115
    Community Member SilkofDrasnia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by losian2 View Post
    Except for everyone who didn't spend time grinding out every single ED. The problem is people do things and make assumptions about the future - If I do this unecessary grind now, I'll never have to do it again! Obviously the devs job is to add incentive to continue playing, if they endlessly let people keep and stack up more and more of this stuff there's less incentive.. I'm frankly not surprised, and from the standpoint of anyone who hasn't already wasted a bunch of time grinding a bunch of EDs they don't need/use, it makes a lot of sense. Someone with a few EDs worked heavily on won't lose much at all and would see the merit of the system. TRing has never been anything BUT a continued grind, so I don't know what people expected really.
    No one made any assumptions, it was tried and tested and found that Destiny XP remains when you TR.

    It's like saying anyone that has completionist will have to regrind all the classes to reacquire completionist because they have decided you NEED to choose a new added option and bond those past lives and you can only bond one per life.


    There is no good reason to defend this massive..... bleh
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan
    Insulting the development team is not allowed.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jendrak
    Somebody should definitely explain to Turbine that when they roll up a new GM that INT is not dump stat.

  16. #116
    Community Member Ragons's Avatar
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    Thumbs up Can't wait to hear more on the new epic ED TR

    After reading a couple of pages seems that I am among the few who is looking forward to this. I see this as extending the game for me. I was happy when they added the Heroic TR to game. I never liked the rinse and repeat the same few quest, I try to run the different quests at level while doing the optionals within those quest. This new epic ED TR gives me a wider range of charactor development to work with, this does make me happy. I will be taking advantage of the ED TRing.

  17. #117
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SilkofDrasnia View Post
    There is no good reason to defend this massive..... bleh
    I think the only explanation for somebody defending it is they are either trolling or don't understand it.

  18. #118
    Community Member omeganeg1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by losian2 View Post
    Except for everyone who didn't spend time grinding out every single ED. The problem is people do things and make assumptions about the future - If I do this unecessary grind now, I'll never have to do it again! Obviously the devs job is to add incentive to continue playing, if they endlessly let people keep and stack up more and more of this stuff there's less incentive.. I'm frankly not surprised, and from the standpoint of anyone who hasn't already wasted a bunch of time grinding a bunch of EDs they don't need/use, it makes a lot of sense. Someone with a few EDs worked heavily on won't lose much at all and would see the merit of the system. TRing has never been anything BUT a continued grind, so I don't know what people expected really.
    The goal of most games is to make yourself as powerful as the system allows. I would bet that a lot players would argue that grinding out EDs to make themselves more powerful wasn't a waste of time. Also, I think its a fair assumption that the developers of a game aren't going erase a player's progress in a mechanic that was intended to require grinding.
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  19. #119

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    Give us 1 level per rank in all ED's so we can start again at level 20 and work the work our heroic TR past life feats completely in epic levels and then those additional destinies we lose have value. That would be nice, if possible. Not likely, but nice.

    Just for something different...

    Quote Originally Posted by Glin View Post
    ...For the expansion pack, we are focused on ensuring that the new races are fun and playable...
    What is it that will make these new races fun?
    Quote Originally Posted by Turbine
    a powerful ally able to play in any role that the group needs
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zonbLF-NMZg

  20. #120
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    Thumbs down

    Like a kick in your face.

    1st they let us grind all the ED and sell there XP portions.
    and they say. ha lets clear them out again.

    If i will loose my ED's while i TR Heroic i will quite the game.
    Maybe the other new games are good for a look and a try.
    3 years playing this game... it's a shame.

    Turbine you will maybe loose a lot of loyal paying players!

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