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  1. #1
    Community Member khamastus's Avatar
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    Default No support if you haven't spent x amount of dollars in x amount of time

    The whole point of free to play is to advertise your product. No support is bad advertisement.
    I could see people taking advantage of that, but you have to take it as a company. DDO might have been the big free to play pioneer (I dont know my gaming history, but I've heard that) but ftp is getting more and more common now.
    As a consumer with a plethora of options, the bitter taste in my mouth left after not being able to receive support for an in game bug might be enough to throw me off if I was checking your game out.
    How many people do you know who play ddo dont spend enough money to qualify for the support?
    Just remove the pay to receive support stipulation, it doesnt look good imo
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  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by khamastus View Post
    The whole point of free to play is to advertise your product. No support is bad advertisement.
    I could see people taking advantage of that, but you have to take it as a company. DDO might have been the big free to play pioneer (I dont know my gaming history, but I've heard that) but ftp is getting more and more common now.
    As a consumer with a plethora of options, the bitter taste in my mouth left after not being able to receive support for an in game bug might be enough to throw me off if I was checking your game out.
    How many people do you know who play ddo dont spend enough money to qualify for the support?
    Just remove the pay to receive support stipulation, it doesnt look good imo
    AFAIK you get support through the Website just not by GMs in game, which seems fair.
    It's much better than say GW2 you can pay as much as you want the game simply doesn't have in game GMs.

  3. #3
    Community Member PermaBanned's Avatar
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    I disagree. They already let us play this game for free. They give us these forums -where we continually bash the quality of their work- for free. It's not bad customer service if you only support paying customers. In fact, if you're not paying you're by definition not a customer, so what could they possibly owe you?

    Damn, I don't even feel that much a sense of entitlement, and I'm an American...


    Edit: Not that it matters, but I'm curious; How much has to be spent in what time frame to qualify for support?
    Last edited by PermaBanned; 06-12-2013 at 04:29 AM.
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  4. #4
    Community Member Ironclans_evil_twin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PermaBanned View Post
    Edit: Not that it matters, but I'm curious; How much has to be spent in what time frame to qualify for support?
    Ah the answer to that is "any amount" and the time frame is "ever"

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by khamastus View Post
    How many people do you know who play ddo dont spend enough money to qualify for the support?
    Just remove the pay to receive support stipulation, it doesnt look good imo
    Or just make a minimum purchase of Turbine Points, which for us in the UK in only £4.99, to become Premium?

    I'm not aware that you lose Premium status after a period of time, but maybe someone can confirm?
    Last edited by Deadlock; 06-12-2013 at 05:13 AM.

  6. #6
    Community Member Kayla93's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deadlock View Post
    Or just make a minimum purchase of Turbine Points, which for us in the UK in only £4.99, to become Premium?

    I'm not aware that you lose Premium status after a period of time, but maybe someone can confirm?
    Well I dont really know how it is now but... when I joined the game (like 2 years ago) I switched to premium immediately by SMS - it contained even lower prices. 3,69 zl which would be sth like 1 dollar. And its permanent from what I know.

    Also - I love DDO beeing F2P - because I hate buying cat in bag, in this game I can test it to maximum without paying anything. But Im also a person who - if loves game - spends some money of it - like on expansions - to support company (even if Im sick with their customer service and ignoring playerbase ... Ill admit tickets are better lately - because I remember times when my ticket was responded 1 month after sending - like ... really? Now I aited max 2 hours - and still was too long). I know not everyone can afford it, but certainly if u have time to play a game, computer to play it on and internet - you can spend this 1-5 dollars to get premium for eternity :P.

  7. #7
    Hero Gkar's Avatar
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    If you aren't contributing financially to the game, you shouldn't get in game support. I don't think that's unreasonable at all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Deadlock View Post
    Or just make a minimum purchase of Turbine Points, which for us in the UK in only £4.99, to become Premium?

    I'm not aware that you lose Premium status after a period of time, but maybe someone can confirm?
    Premium is never lost once you get it.

  8. #8
    Community Member msdesign's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PermaBanned View Post
    (...)
    Edit: Not that it matters, but I'm curious; How much has to be spent in what time frame to qualify for support?
    For your information, found this on another thread:

    Quote Originally Posted by HAL View Post
    Premium accounts only have access to in-game customer service for a number of days after making a cash purchase (i.e. purchasing TP/content with cash, not using TP to purchase an item):

    $1.00 - 15 days
    $14.99 - 30 days
    $30.00 - 90 days
    $60.00 - 180 days
    $100.00 - 365 days

    (From the Wiki: http://ddowiki.com/page/Premium_Account)
    And Premium account is not quite enough to get in-game support. ^ This is needed too. I'm premium for quite some time now, but been a while since I don't buy anything from store, I'm pretty sure I'm not qualified for in-game support.
    Last edited by msdesign; 06-12-2013 at 06:34 AM.
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by msdesign View Post
    For your information, found this on another thread:



    And Premium account is not quite enough to get in-game support. ^ This is needed too. I'm premium for quite some time now, but been a while since I don't buy anything from store, I'm pretty sure I'm not qualified for in-game support.
    Makes sense, to get the same support as a VIP you need to spend about the same amount of money. Again seems fair to me.

    Also as said support through the website should always be accessible.

  10. #10
    Community Member moomooprincess's Avatar
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    Default When I was paying VIP for two accounts

    I learned to not even bother with support. That is how Turbine has trained me.

    I played on the old beta server, Risia for months.

    Submit bug reports. Bug reporting tool did not work. You had to submit the bug report out of the game. Why bother?

    Submit bug report, no response. Next update, the bug still exists. The next five updates, the bug still exists. Why bother?

    Quest won't complete problem? Why send in a report, wait a long time. Drop group. Why bother?
    We all mostly learned to drop quest, drop group, reform. Much faster than waiting forever.

    I have not sent in a problem report or a bug report in years. When I see them, I just go along my merry way .

    When you are sent numerous signs that your information is not needed nor are your in game problems a priority and that major bugs are still released even though Lammannia has mentioned them numerous times, why bother?

    The forum changeover debacle. The last patch where Turbine actually released code so players could not play the game are just recent examples of support.

    And as I typed this, I timed out of course.
    Last edited by moomooprincess; 06-12-2013 at 07:16 AM.
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  11. #11
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    Been with ddo from day one, and over the years put in many help tickets, not always happy with the level of support but it has been there and 90% of the time quick. Been VIP and dropped a bit of cash on TP and xpacs overe the years, so i expect ingame support. If that goes away so does my support from my bank account.
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  12. #12
    Community Member Ryiah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by khamastus View Post
    No support is bad advertisement.
    Free to play "customers" have support. It is called the forums. In fact I've seen faster and better responses from other players than I have from customer service.
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  13. #13
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    Some people seem to be under the impression that once you go Premium you get support from then on - not true as someone has already posted the "terms" from the Wiki:

    http://ddowiki.com/page/Premium_Account

    Some people seem to think that its fair for Turbine to only support those people who are currently/recently paid for the game. Given how many people are cancelling subscriptions and/or refuse to purchase anything more because of the state of the game, and given that this same state of the game is probably why you need to contact support in the first place, I wonder if this is such a good idea on Turbines' part.

    It comes down to this: I don't want to pay for this mess, I want to wait and pay when it is fixed at least to some extent. But when I'm trying to deal with this mess in-game, I can't get support unless I've paid. So Turbine has the choice of either telling me that I am FORCED to pay for sub-standard product or they are not going to help me deal with problems in-game that are THEIR FAULT. This doesn't seem fair and I could see it causing players to leave.

    I think at the very least Turbine should institute a new support policy allowing players to create tickets when inside wilderness areas/quests which Turbine can decide how much to support based on whether the issue is caused by a bug. Yes it will be more work for them but maybe it will be an incentive to actually get rid of some of the bugs that have plagued this game for so long.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by HAL View Post
    It comes down to this: I don't want to pay for this mess, I want to wait and pay when it is fixed at least to some extent..
    Then you deserve no support. It takes money to put in place those fixes you want and all you are doing if you aren't putting any money into the game is adding server lag without helping to keep the lights on.

  15. #15
    Community Member Ironclans_evil_twin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HAL View Post
    It comes down to this: I don't want to pay for this mess, I want to wait and pay when it is fixed at least to some extent. But when I'm trying to deal with this mess in-game, I can't get support unless I've paid. So Turbine has the choice of either telling me that I am FORCED to pay for sub-standard product or they are not going to help me deal with problems in-game that are THEIR FAULT. This doesn't seem fair and I could see it causing players to leave.
    Your best option would be to go find a PC game that is bug free and support that... tell us how that works out for you next time you drop in if you don't mind.

  16. #16
    Hero AZgreentea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by msdesign View Post
    And Premium account is not quite enough to get in-game support. ^ This is needed too. I'm premium for quite some time now, but been a while since I don't buy anything from store, I'm pretty sure I'm not qualified for in-game support.
    I've always felt that there should be a tier above the $100.00 dollar mark. Those levels are the ones established when F2P and Premium were first launched. I've spent well over $100.00 on the game, and only ever asked for support once.

    I had recently purchased the Necro 1 pack, and I was confused on the way flagging worked(back in the day). I made the same mistake most people make at least once on those quests, and I set the quest for a repeat before running the main crypt. The answer to my ticket was basically, go ask on the forums, we cant help you (which I did, and someone explained). So I guess it dosent really matter how much I have invested in the game if the GM's cant even provide rudimentary support for actually intended game design.
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  17. #17
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gkar View Post
    If you aren't contributing financially to the game, you shouldn't get in game support. I don't think that's unreasonable at all.
    Yes and no. The freebies being in the game make it appear to be a more populated game. The spenders have others to play with. If the game is less populated, the spenders arent encouraged to spend as much.

    This is even true in the most extreme of scenarios - social games for example, where the freebies are well over 2/3rds of the people who play and the spenders are a much smaller percentage. Subtract the freebies from the equation and the spenders log in to see a ghost town.


    Quote Originally Posted by Gkar View Post
    Premium is never lost once you get it.
    But the support qualification is not based on being premium, but based on spending money = supported for a specific period of time, which does run out.

    $1.00 - 15 days
    $14.99 - 30 days
    $30.00 - 90 days
    $60.00 - 180 days
    $100.00 - 365 days
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  18. #18
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironclans_evil_twin View Post
    Your best option would be to go find a PC game that is bug free and support that... tell us how that works out for you next time you drop in if you don't mind.
    Bug free, no. Far less quantity of openly ignored issues for years of time - no prob. In fact, that is what you are seeing right now.

    An expansion is being released with no raid (timer bypass isnt gonna keep the lights on) - RIFT goes f2p soon - NW still has that new game smell (will wear off eventually).

    The issue with being "the pioneer" of transitioning from sub only game to f2p/premium model is that they have to take the good with the bad when they made that decision. Holding customer support hostage on a payment per time period basis doesnt hold up in the current market, where games eiher give full support to all, or require a minimum one time payment for support. If they arent competing with even the median average in the market and simply denying support for issues that are the company's fault in the first place, this can turn into an issue far more quickly than people are letting on here.

    Doing some research on Net Promoter Score lately, and finding out that product quality and customer support are two of the heaviest weighing factors in the equation.
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironclans_evil_twin View Post
    Your best option would be to go find a PC game that is bug free and support that... tell us how that works out for you next time you drop in if you don't mind.
    lol love this +1 and especially when it comes to mmo's every single mmo has bugs and always will as long as they keep adding content.
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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironclans_evil_twin View Post
    Your best option would be to go find a PC game that is bug free and support that... tell us how that works out for you next time you drop in if you don't mind.
    First, I have pumped plenty of money into this game. I was a subscriber when it first came out and went premium after F2P because I decided I would rather own the content than rent it. I own all the content, bought the collectors addition of MotU, and have purchased extra TP here and there.

    But I have not made a purchase in a while because of what happened with MotU, and what continues to happen with every patch. People talk about having to give the game money so they will fix it. The game didn't start out this way. Back when I was a subscriber the game was in much better shape. And during the time I was buying TP and content it only got worse and worse. So giving them money doesn't seem to help them fix the game.

    And I do subscribe to a MMO that has SUPERB customer service. There are several out there. I would like to continue to support DDO but I'm at a loss. Giving them money doesn't seem to work so I'm not sure why I should continue to do that.

    People can say that if you don't support the game you don't deserve customer service. I think its a huge PR mistake for Turbine to tell customers that they have to pay for crud Turbine created or else when that crud causes you problems in-game Turbine's not going to help you resolve it.

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