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  1. #1
    Community Member Postumus's Avatar
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    Default Crazy turn-in rates for augments: no change in U18?

    I'm not noticing any changes to the ridiculously high collectible turn-in rates for the augments. Didn't they say these would be re-adjusted to sane levels when U18 rolled out?


    Anyone notice any changes for the turn in ratios? Did any get adjusted? Did this get tabled (or forgotten)?

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Postumus View Post
    I'm not noticing any changes to the ridiculously high collectible turn-in rates for the augments. Didn't they say these would be re-adjusted to sane levels when U18 rolled out?


    Anyone notice any changes for the turn in ratios? Did any get adjusted? Did this get tabled (or forgotten)?
    I think the rates for the random augments were always meant to be at those levels....I think the problem was they originally had them set too low, but then had to crank them up at the last minute before they went Live. They could only do that by raising universal turn-in prices, and I think now they've corrected everything else (Elixirs and what have you) back to their intended prices.

    Whether or not those prices are fair is debatable (not really, they're not fair), but I think its what the devs wanted them pegged at. So on goes the hunt for Executioner Beetles and hoping for a Deathblock topaz :P At least you can pull Drowshoods while you're at it.

  3. #3
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    the turn ins for the random augment stuff is absurd, gamble months of collecting for a randomized augment. whats it good for? taking up an inv slot. no thx.
    at least they fixed the turn in rates for the other stuff.

    i would rate it a 1/2 to 3/4 finished, so in turbine terms its done. the developers are probably reworking barkskin pots by now.

  4. #4
    Community Member redspecter23's Avatar
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    The costs for collectible trade ins are extremely high. I have a couple issues with this.

    1. Most augments for level 1/4/8 are things you can live without. Putting enough effort into gearing a sub level 12 toon isn't something that is considered necessary by many players who actually have the collectibles to do more than a couple barters.

    2. For the augments that are unique or possibly useful at later levels when gearing becomes more important, you are more likely to pull it in random loot than you are to get it through a random barter. You might be able to do one swap every couple lives if you pick up every collectible along the way. You'll probably pull a couple "rare" augments in that same time (deathblock, heavy fort, etc.)

    3. Starting at level 12, augments are significantly easier to acquire through bartering and this is also the point where you start to get gear you are more inclined to augment from Gianthold and older updated items. I don't care so much about a +2 stat in my level 4 item (certainly not enough to "spin the wheel" for a shot at it), but +4 stat for a reasonable price in relics goes a long way for my mid game gearing needs.

    I guess my point is, most lowbie augments are just not worth it. It's easier to just live without it than spend an insane amount of collectibles for a shot at it. I'm not going to spend AS or collectibles on the "common" augments that I'm outleveling in a day or two. I have bought some of the rares for AS as they fit my endgame gear setups and were worth the cost. I really hope nobody is spending TP on AS bundles just so they can buy a +1 stat augment at level 1. Hit the AH to get the lowbie augments and skip the AS and collectible gouging. The only argument for using the collectible random barter is that you might get one of the rare augments, but your odds are pretty slim and certainly not worth the cost in collectibles unless you have been collecting for years.
    Last edited by redspecter23; 05-30-2013 at 06:55 PM.
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  5. #5
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    "Originally Posted by Cordovan
    As of today's update (Update 17.1), Collector NPCs now function with a Barter Shop interface. We think this increases their accessibility and ease-of-use, compared to the "old" conversation-based interface. We also saw this as an opportunity to give players the ability to purchase low-level augments.

    The intention was to increase the price of Augments to properly manage their supply in-game, but due to a technical constraint, all collectible turn-ins had their price increased. For upcoming releases we will be adjusting prices based on the barter value or availability of items, among other factors.

    We hope to bring new and more interesting items to offer as well. What would you like to see Collectors offer? We'd love to get your feedback. Thanks!"

    http://ddowiki.com/page/Collectable

  6. #6
    Intergalactic Space Crusader
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    Default Gianthold Vendors

    I was in GH last night looking at augments from the level 12, 16, 20, and 24 augment vendors and they seemed to be the same amounts for the trade-ins.

    Here is the collectable list from DDO wiki if someone wants to see if the amounts have changed for the other vendors around Ebberon:

    http://ddowiki.com/page/Collectable

    I may check tonight in House J to see if this fella's trade-in amounts have changed:

    Talisman Collector : Verisgante


    Random ML 8 Sapphire (30 Amulet of the Lost Empire, 10 mulet of the Six, 5 Amulet of the Archbishop)
    ML 8 Sapphire Augments (Blue, Green or Purple Slot; 12 Astral Shards each)
    - Sapphire of Natural Armor +3
    - Sapphire of Protection +3
    - Sapphire of Resistance +3
    - Sapphire of Physical Resistance +6
    - Sapphire of False Life +15
    - Sapphire of Heavy Fortification

    I'm geeked on the Sapphire of Heavy Fortification and I can't get one in GH.
    Last edited by Livmo; 05-30-2013 at 07:19 PM.

  7. #7
    Community Member Postumus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Livmo View Post
    I was in GH last night looking at augments from the level 12, 16, 20, and 24 augment vendors and they seemed to be the same amounts for the trade-ins.

    Here is the collectable list from DDO wiki if someone wants to see if the amounts have changed for the other vendors around Ebberon:

    http://ddowiki.com/page/Collectable

    I may check tonight in House J to see if this fella's trade-in amounts have changed:

    Talisman Collector : Verisgante


    Random ML 8 Sapphire (30 Amulet of the Lost Empire, 10 mulet of the Six, 5 Amulet of the Archbishop)
    ML 8 Sapphire Augments (Blue, Green or Purple Slot; 12 Astral Shards each)
    - Sapphire of Natural Armor +3
    - Sapphire of Protection +3
    - Sapphire of Resistance +3
    - Sapphire of Physical Resistance +6
    - Sapphire of False Life +15
    - Sapphire of Heavy Fortification

    I'm geeked on the Sapphire of Heavy Fortification and I can't get one in GH.

    Well the Kundarek Trooper's shield is an option. It has a sapphire of heavy fort in it. But then you have to extract it.

    Do you get to pick which sapphire you get from Verisgante for the 12 shards? That's a good deal if you can. For some reason I thought it was random.


    I guess my point is, most lowbie augments are just not worth it. It's easier to just live without it than spend an insane amount of collectibles for a shot at it. I'm not going to spend AS or collectibles on the "common" augments that I'm outleveling in a day or two. I have bought some of the rares for AS as they fit my endgame gear setups and were worth the cost. I really hope nobody is spending TP on AS bundles just so they can buy a +1 stat augment at level 1. Hit the AH to get the lowbie augments and skip the AS and collectible gouging. The only argument for using the collectible random barter is that you might get one of the rare augments, but your odds are pretty slim and certainly not worth the cost in collectibles unless you have been collecting for years.
    Yeah I just purchase augments from the AH for my regular characters, but on some of my static groups we allow turn in rewards, but the turn in rates are so crazy for the random augments (still 10 deadly feverblanche) that it's basically pointless.

  8. #8
    Community Member moomooprincess's Avatar
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    Default What Postumus is complaining

    And complaining about virtual items being turned in for more virtual items.

    I just don't get it. I guess complaining about items that cost real dollars is not near as important about complaining about virtual items that are obtained for free.
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  9. #9
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    Default Shards

    Quote Originally Posted by Postumus View Post
    Well the Kundarek Trooper's shield is an option. It has a sapphire of heavy fort in it. But then you have to extract it.

    Do you get to pick which sapphire you get from Verisgante for the 12 shards? That's a good deal if you can. For some reason I thought it was random.




    Yeah I just purchase augments from the AH for my regular characters, but on some of my static groups we allow turn in rewards, but the turn in rates are so crazy for the random augments (still 10 deadly feverblanche) that it's basically pointless.

    You got me!!!

    I used shards to get the last one, because I spent all my collectables and didn't get the augment I wanted when I tried random. However, I'm gonna try random again since I have 7 toons now and have built up more collectables for trade-in.

    I would be stoked to see the amount of collectables needed to trade in for random go down. I got a little frazzled last week running quests for collectables in preparation for this.

    Also, thank you for tip on the shield. Most my toons don't use shield and I heard that jewelers kits can now drop in chests. I don't know if that is true or not, but that may be an easier way to grind for the augment. Grind for shield, then kit to remove the augment, rather than trying to get all those collectables for a random shot at the augment I want.

    --

    On a side note I was saving up the random shards I got with no real plan for them and after I got the fortification augment I went and spent the last of them on a blindness immunity and feather fall augment for future use. Also I just wanted to have them in case I can consolidate gear when I TR.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by moomooprincess View Post
    And complaining about virtual items being turned in for more virtual items.

    I just don't get it. I guess complaining about items that cost real dollars is not near as important about complaining about virtual items that are obtained for free.
    Some people value their time that they spend doing something. Virtual items also have value within the game. Collectibles can be used for crafting. This gives them a certain value. If you compare that value to the value of turning them in for a random augment, the "cost" for the random augment is too high.

    See? Simple.

  11. #11
    2016 DDO Players Council UurlockYgmeov's Avatar
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    exactly what I've been saying in numerous threads - including the ones where I compiled all the data on Lammania.

  12. #12
    Community Member redspecter23's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Livmo View Post

    Also, thank you for tip on the shield. Most my toons don't use shield and I heard that jewelers kits can now drop in chests. I don't know if that is true or not, but that may be an easier way to grind for the augment. Grind for shield, then kit to remove the augment, rather than trying to get all those collectables for a random shot at the augment I want.
    I'm not sure if the shield is a good way to go unless you're desperate. At least on Argo right now, unbound jeweler's kits are worth about double what a heavy fort augment is on the auction. To me it would seem wasteful to use an item worth double a heavy fort augment just to get a heavy fort augment. There are other factors at play here like the TP value of a kit and a heavy fort augment as well. Jeweler's kits will cost you 150 TP (95 each if you buy in bulk) and heavy fort augments are 75 TP. If you happened upon a bound jewelers kit from a chest (not sure they drop there, unbound ones can drop in silver daily dice though), that might be the only reason I'd bother unslotting a heavy fort augment.
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    [QUOTE=redspecter23;5012757]1. Most augments for level 1/4/8 are things you can live without. Putting enough effort into gearing a sub level 12 toon isn't something that is considered necessary by many players who actually have the collectibles to do more than a couple barters.
    [QUOTE]

    Not only that, but remember that an Augment slot adds +2 to the enchantment level - so it adds 4 to the ML on an item, and there are very few named and slotted items under L12 that are worth using over a lootgen or crafted alternative. Below L12, that's going to make a HUGE difference in the efficacy of the mods on the item itself. There's an active DISincentive to using the augment system at lower levels...every possible augment is going to fall into one of two categories:

    1) The augment is not worth using over an unslotted alternative with better innate mods (ie, Devotion 42 over Devotion 30, or Holy over 1d3 elemental damage)
    2) The augment is too valuable to slot into an item that you wont be able to use at mid- and endgame (ie, slotting Heavy Fort into a piece of loot at L8)

    Its not till midgame (L12 to 16 or so) that you begin to "cap out" on the enchantment level (ie, hit +5 with a good prefix/suffix on a weapon) and can afford to start spending enchantment levels on augment slots. But by then you're not collecting the right collectables for the desirable low-level augments, anyway...

  14. #14
    Community Member redspecter23's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    Not only that, but remember that an Augment slot adds +2 to the enchantment level - so it adds 4 to the ML on an item, and there are very few named and slotted items under L12 that are worth using over a lootgen or crafted alternative. Below L12, that's going to make a HUGE difference in the efficacy of the mods on the item itself. There's an active DISincentive to using the augment system at lower levels...every possible augment is going to fall into one of two categories:

    1) The augment is not worth using over an unslotted alternative with better innate mods (ie, Devotion 42 over Devotion 30, or Holy over 1d3 elemental damage)
    2) The augment is too valuable to slot into an item that you wont be able to use at mid- and endgame (ie, slotting Heavy Fort into a piece of loot at L8)

    Its not till midgame (L12 to 16 or so) that you begin to "cap out" on the enchantment level (ie, hit +5 with a good prefix/suffix on a weapon) and can afford to start spending enchantment levels on augment slots. But by then you're not collecting the right collectables for the desirable low-level augments, anyway...
    Yeah, I'm completely baffled as to why a red augment on lootgen is +4 levels. Even at level 25 it would be better if those +4 levels were put toward holy as a prefix instead. 1 damage at level 1 is a joke for the level cost. The damage augments at low levels don't take into account the fact that the weapon itself "pays" for the augment by being a higher min level. The augments could have been a static 1d6 for heroic (1/4/8/12/16) and 2d6 for epic (20/24/28). Tiering the augments works for spellpower somewhat but it breaks down for the damage bonuses. For these reasons, red/purple/orange slots on named gear is significantly more useful as it doesn't really add the +4 levels per slot. It's all just factored into one single cost.

    When I pull a lootgen weapon with a red slot, I'm almost always disappointed as I know that 99.9% of the time, the weapon would have been better without the slot at all and having +4 levels worth of additional lootgen mods. Creating a situation where getting an item with an augment is so often a bad thing means that the system is broken at least in this particular area.
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    Community Member Postumus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by redspecter23 View Post
    Yeah, I'm completely baffled as to why a red augment on lootgen is +4 levels. Even at level 25 it would be better if those +4 levels were put toward holy as a prefix instead. 1 damage at level 1 is a joke for the level cost. The damage augments at low levels don't take into account the fact that the weapon itself "pays" for the augment by being a higher min level. The augments could have been a static 1d6 for heroic (1/4/8/12/16) and 2d6 for epic (20/24/28). Tiering the augments works for spellpower somewhat but it breaks down for the damage bonuses. For these reasons, red/purple/orange slots on named gear is significantly more useful as it doesn't really add the +4 levels per slot. It's all just factored into one single cost.

    When I pull a lootgen weapon with a red slot, I'm almost always disappointed as I know that 99.9% of the time, the weapon would have been better without the slot at all and having +4 levels worth of additional lootgen mods. Creating a situation where getting an item with an augment is so often a bad thing means that the system is broken at least in this particular area.
    True enough for loot gen items. For named items though... Lets just say my static group cleric is happy to have the new ml8 Retribution with a devotion ruby slotted in it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Postumus View Post
    True enough for loot gen items. For named items though... Lets just say my static group cleric is happy to have the new ml8 Retribution with a devotion ruby slotted in it.
    Yeah named items are clearly the intention of the Augment system, give you some flexibility to eliminate those cases of "That named item is almost usable, except it doesnt have ____". Or "I'd really like to use XXX, but I need that slot for Deathblock/Striding/Feather Fall/etc."

    That being said, up to maybe L12 or so, you're STILL better off with lootgen/crafted than at-level named items with augments, 90% of the time. Even though they avoid the ML increase, the extra 1d2/1d3 damage on weapons doesnt outweigh Bleed or Screaming, and there's very very few low-level weapons (you cited one of the exceptions) that come prebuilt with two good affixes and a slot....and same goes for jewelry/armor too.

  17. #17
    Community Member RavenAmazing's Avatar
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    I'm gonna revive this thread for a moment.

    I have been trying for the blue augment since I was lvl 8, I am currently lvl 12. In the time it took me to make 4 levels, (I am no power leveler by any stretch.), I have collected:

    81 Amulets of the Lost Empire
    24 Amulets of the Six
    2 Amulets of the Archbishop

    Not enough for the level 8 random blue. Need 5 Archbishops.

    However, I have collected enough Relics in Gianthod for any, lvl 12 blue from the GH trader. I did that in 3 slayer runs. Seems to me the level 8 random needs some looking into. Either the drop rate for the Archbishop needs to be increased or the trade amount lowered. That is a ton of farming for a rapidly obsolete, random augment.

    Carry on
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    Quote Originally Posted by RavenAmazing View Post
    I'm gonna revive this thread for a moment.

    I have been trying for the blue augment since I was lvl 8, I am currently lvl 12. In the time it took me to make 4 levels, (I am no power leveler by any stretch.), I have collected:

    81 Amulets of the Lost Empire
    24 Amulets of the Six
    2 Amulets of the Archbishop

    Not enough for the level 8 random blue. Need 5 Archbishops.

    However, I have collected enough Relics in Gianthod for any, lvl 12 blue from the GH trader. I did that in 3 slayer runs. Seems to me the level 8 random needs some looking into. Either the drop rate for the Archbishop needs to be increased or the trade amount lowered. That is a ton of farming for a rapidly obsolete, random augment.

    Carry on
    If you've received 2 Amulets of the Archbishop within 4 levels, it sounds like you've had pretty good luck with the Amulet of the Archbishop drop. It's a pretty rare collectible. Not Lightning Split Wood rare, but rare enough that if you get 3 of them within a heroic life, you're doing really good. At least that's my experience.

  19. #19
    Community Member RavenAmazing's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oradafu View Post
    If you've received 2 Amulets of the Archbishop within 4 levels, it sounds like you've had pretty good luck with the Amulet of the Archbishop drop. It's a pretty rare collectible. Not Lightning Split Wood rare, but rare enough that if you get 3 of them within a heroic life, you're doing really good. At least that's my experience.
    To be fair, I gained them in 12 levels, not 4. I had already had 1 by level 8, and gained the other since. I picked it up in GH.

    Rare? Indeed, thus my point. why qualify something random for a level 8 on such a rare item, when, in the period of less than 1 evening I can get any level 12 item I choose.

    I believe the term is; "Boggles the mind."



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    Community Member Coyopa's Avatar
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    As I recall, players told them they were insane to set the amounts as high as they did, but they did it anyway. Personally, I wouldn't have a problem with such a pricey turn-in if I were able to choose the augment. However, since they are random, there is no way in hell I am going to waste my time on it - and clearly most other people feel the same way.

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