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  1. #41
    Hatchery Hero Sonos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dorian View Post
    Yes, I noticed the Owlbear's saves were junk as well. Fighting giants, it was constantly getting knocked down (not sure if it was from command or the boulder toss). The other hireling was doing fine.

    I just don't want to bombard Turbine with everything that sucks with the Owlbear (defense, dps, saves, etc). lol... what does it do well? anyone?

    I think the best bet is to just focus on getting PRR fixed and see how it does after that. 200 PRR would be 56.29% less physical damage. It might be useful after that gets fixed.

    Yes and please stop comparing the Owlbear to the Panther, for some reason, this logic scares Dorian.

  2. #42
    Founder Dorian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonos View Post
    Yes and please stop comparing the Owlbear to the Panther, for some reason, this logic scares Dorian.
    The logic doesn't scare me... I was the first person to make a thread comparing them.

    What scares me is that all of the Owlbear complaint and confirmed bugs threads will be ignored.
    Dorian

  3. #43
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    You all seem to miss one point:

    Making the panther or owlbear on par with a hireling is the last thing Turbine wants to do.
    It would cost them money in the long run because players would buy less gold seal hires for TP if they can summon the panther/owlbear for free all the time.

    That was the reason why the panther didn't get upgraded and it is the reason why the owlbear is weak.

    And the only thing that complaining about the owlbear will accomplish is: The panther will be nerfed to become weaker than the owlbear with the next patch.

    (I also expect Turbine to eventually make the panther figurine and owlbear whistle "breakable" if the character takes damage, much like xp pots etc. can be destroyed, but that's another matter.)

  4. #44
    Community Member burningwind's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BansheeGirl View Post
    You all seem to miss one point:

    Making the panther or owlbear on par with a hireling is the last thing Turbine wants to do.
    It would cost them money in the long run because players would buy less gold seal hires for TP if they can summon the panther/owlbear for free all the time.

    That was the reason why the panther didn't get upgraded and it is the reason why the owlbear is weak.

    And the only thing that complaining about the owlbear will accomplish is: The panther will be nerfed to become weaker than the owlbear with the next patch.

    (I also expect Turbine to eventually make the panther figurine and owlbear whistle "breakable" if the character takes damage, much like xp pots etc. can be destroyed, but that's another matter.)

    not exactly.. i mean why do you think both owlbear and panther are fighter class? why they never give us perm cleric or rogue? because no many people actually buy melee gold seal... they are not much useful..

    if turbine keep owlbear like this, at least i know ill not be getting collector edition next time. though i don't usually use any hire, but they are cute, i like to have them out once a while without having it die multiple times per run which reduce my exp.

    p.s. the owlbear is gold seal level 25 hireling, it should par with any level 25 fighter, if not it is not a gold seal. its just a level 20 hireling thats say level 25 and require level 23 to use. that is called lying to customer, and that is not acceptable in my standard.

  5. #45
    Community Member burningwind's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BansheeGirl View Post
    You all seem to miss one point:

    Making the panther or owlbear on par with a hireling is the last thing Turbine wants to do.
    It would cost them money in the long run because players would buy less gold seal hires for TP if they can summon the panther/owlbear for free all the time.

    That was the reason why the panther didn't get upgraded and it is the reason why the owlbear is weak.

    And the only thing that complaining about the owlbear will accomplish is: The panther will be nerfed to become weaker than the owlbear with the next patch.

    (I also expect Turbine to eventually make the panther figurine and owlbear whistle "breakable" if the character takes damage, much like xp pots etc. can be destroyed, but that's another matter.)

    not exactly.. i mean why do you think both owlbear and panther are fighter class? why they never give us perm cleric or rogue? because no many people actually buy melee gold seal... they are not much useful..

    if turbine keep owlbear like this, at least i know ill not be getting collector edition next time. though i don't usually use any hire, but they are cute, i like to have them out once a while without having it die multiple times per run which reduce my exp.

    p.s. at least four of my friend did not buy this expansion pack, because they have seem the poor performance of panther compare with these updated hireling.. several of them are still looking.. btw just to say.. if they refuse to buff owlbear it will be sorta cheating on customer. if owlbear cannot par with it's level, then it doesn't belong to the level. it is just a level 20 fighter hireling thats says level 25 and have the requirement level raise to 23.. therefor it is not a gold seal.

  6. #46
    Hatchery Hero Sonos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dorian View Post
    The logic doesn't scare me... I was the first person to make a thread comparing them.

    What scares me is that all of the Owlbear complaint and confirmed bugs threads will be ignored.
    One need only glance at the forums and see this complaint all over it, so it's not something that is being "ignored", in fact, as you saw, Tolero chimed in with stats. WAI or not is debatable.

    But, when you type something like:
    Quote Originally Posted by Dorian View Post
    The Panther (battlecat) is level 20.... the Owlbear is level 25... the fact that you dont understand the performance issues between a heroic level 20 hireling and an epic lvl 25.... it scares me.
    knowing full well that there are 20 and below hires that at one time or another outperformed epic level hires, you turned someone that was on your side into someone that doesn't care if that owlbear catches AIDS and dies in a fire.
    Last edited by Sonos; 05-28-2013 at 05:55 PM.

  7. #47
    Community Member Postumus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BansheeGirl View Post
    You all seem to miss one point:

    Making the panther or owlbear on par with a hireling is the last thing Turbine wants to do.
    It would cost them money in the long run because players would buy less gold seal hires for TP if they can summon the panther/owlbear for free all the time.

    That was the reason why the panther didn't get upgraded and it is the reason why the owlbear is weak.

    And the only thing that complaining about the owlbear will accomplish is: The panther will be nerfed to become weaker than the owlbear with the next patch.

    (I also expect Turbine to eventually make the panther figurine and owlbear whistle "breakable" if the character takes damage, much like xp pots etc. can be destroyed, but that's another matter.)
    I see the point quite clearly... on the top of your tinfoil hat.

  8. #48
    Community Member burningwind's Avatar
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    has been so long have they actually done anything about it?? is this how turbine punish people for supporting them?

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by burningwind View Post
    has been so long have they actually done anything about it?? is this how turbine punish people for supporting them?
    Yep basicly !

  10. #50
    Community Member relenttless's Avatar
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    Tiger versus polar bear is much more interesting
    "IM-PLO-SION: For when you just HAVE to kill every M**********R in the room"-
    (Samuel L Jackson)

    "Some are insane, and the're in charge"
    (GoF)

    Sarlona: Mercilless, Maliciouss, Relenttless. Plus others.....

  11. #51
    Community Member LightBear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dorian View Post
    That's the problem. How do we test 200 PRR and have combat logs to backup our results? I'm all ears if you have a suggestion. (even the people that like the current owlbear agree that PRR is NOT working)
    Can you summon an owlbear in a pvp instance? If so have someone summon one on the other team and beat it down and check your own combat log for damage output perhaps?

    Quote Originally Posted by chrisdinus7 View Post
    Short Version: The DR 15/- works, the 200 PRR does not.

    Test:
    I summoned the level 25 owlbear, and went to EE Bargain of Blood. I then had the owlbear aggro the lone kobold at the very begining of the quest, and capture a video using fraps. I determined the damage from each hit by subtracting the owlbear's life post-hit from its pre-hit life. I then repeated this process using the cleric (to keep us from dying during the process) I was playing, after removing his armor, shield, and other defensive gear. So, I had no DR, and no PRR.

    Note - the kobold does not have doublestrike or the like. Every attack animation against the cleric produced just a single damage number. My apologies on the small sample size (only about ~25 hits each), due to limited time. However, the sample is sufficiently strong to conclude that the PRR does not work.

    Against 0 PRR, 0 DR Cleric:
    Avg Damage: 95.5
    Std Dev: 12.6

    Against the 200 PRR, 15 DR Owlbear
    Avg Damage: 73.7
    Std Dev: 14.3

    200 PRR should result in a reduce of 56.29% damage. That alone should have reduced the average damage to 41.74 for the owlbear. Since DR is applied first, we would expect (95.5 - 15) * (1 - .5629) = 35.2 for the average damage. We found that it is actually 73.7, a difference of 38.5, 2.7 standard deviations away. The odds of this occuring by chance are worse than 1 in 81 (assuming a normal distribution). While I'd repeat more for a formal publication, this is still good evidence that the PRR is not 200. Note that the average damage was 7 lower than expected for a 0 PRR. But that is only a half a std dev away, so this is not unexpected.

    Or do it as chrisdinus7 did more then half a year ago.

    Edit:
    I wonder what the changes to prr/mrr and barbarian did for the owlbear as well.
    Last edited by LightBear; 01-28-2015 at 04:56 AM.

    One, two! One, two! and through and through. The vorpal blade went snicker-snack!
    He left it dead, and with its head. He went galumphing back.

  12. #52
    Community Member burningwind's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LightBear View Post
    Can you summon an owlbear in a pvp instance? If so have someone summon one on the other team and beat it down and check your own combat log for damage output perhaps?
    you can't summon hireling in public area



    Quote Originally Posted by LightBear View Post
    Or do it as chrisdinus7 did more then half a year ago.

    Edit:
    I wonder what the changes to prr/mrr and barbarian did for the owlbear as well.
    ill do another test and open up a new thread these days.. though i doubt they will do much good. it seem turbine does not care at all

  13. #53
    Community Member LightBear's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by burningwind View Post
    you can't summon hireling in public area





    ill do another test and open up a new thread these days.. though i doubt they will do much good. it seem turbine does not care at all
    We'll probably get a new gold seal hire if we pre order the next update or so. Maybe they'll have time to fix the owlbears on the way.
    Maybe they'll equip them with a hidden towershield and give them things to select from the vanguard tree (looks at tier five shield charge)?

    One, two! One, two! and through and through. The vorpal blade went snicker-snack!
    He left it dead, and with its head. He went galumphing back.

  14. #54
    Community Member burningwind's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LightBear View Post
    We'll probably get a new gold seal hire if we pre order the next update or so. Maybe they'll have time to fix the owlbears on the way.
    Maybe they'll equip them with a hidden towershield and give them things to select from the vanguard tree (looks at tier five shield charge)?
    i doubt ill pre order again if they don't fix them before the release. first pre order- everything great, panther is good at the time..

    Then second expansion came, everything a mess. the wizard hat make you look like a hairless ape nothing like the demonstration picture with pretty hair under the hat. the hireling are useless......

    then revamp came, panther and owlbear get left out.. and i quit the game.. this happened around one and half years ago. i just return recently for the new warlock.. likely will quit again if they decide not to do warlock or did it poorly

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