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  1. #1
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Default ATTN Devs: DDO's current raiding situation

    I'll keep this brief so i don't delve too far to the d000m!!! side . . .

    There are two raids that are routinely run at this time, FOT and CiTW. All the other stuff is barely run, even Shrouds take 30-45 minutes to fill.

    The old raid loot just isn't worth pursuing, and the pursuit of loot is what makes people run things more than once.

    Quite frankly raiding is dead in DDO. The the new "expansion" coming out without a raid makes this look like it's not going to change anytime soon.

    My question to the powers that be is . . . are you aware how screwed up the current situation is, do you care, and is anything going to be done to re-sexify the old content so it's worth running again?

    Raiding is fun, the current situation leaves a big hole in the end-game.

  2. #2
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    Old content doesn't matter in the slightest to them.

  3. #3
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    I'll keep this brief so i don't delve too far to the d000m!!! side . . .

    There are two raids that are routinely run at this time, FOT and CiTW. All the other stuff is barely run, even Shrouds take 30-45 minutes to fill.

    The old raid loot just isn't worth pursuing, and the pursuit of loot is what makes people run things more than once.

    Quite frankly raiding is dead in DDO. The the new "expansion" coming out without a raid makes this look like it's not going to change anytime soon.

    My question to the powers that be is . . . are you aware how screwed up the current situation is, do you care, and is anything going to be done to re-sexify the old content so it's worth running again?

    Raiding is fun, the current situation leaves a big hole in the end-game.
    This I can't describe my disgust at learning no new raid in the expansion. If it wouldn't ban my account (I still enjoy playing) I'd do a charge back on this pos they're passing off as an expansion.

    Shame on me for being fooled twice.

  4. #4
    Community Member Raithe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    ...and the pursuit of loot is what makes people run things more than once.
    There is another reason (I, for instance, do NOT repeat content because it contains loot, if its not fun I don't repeat):

    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    Raiding is fun, ...
    Raiding is not that fun for me. Raids (the quests themselves) can be fun, but generally they are only fun for me if the group is of size 6-8 players. The problem with old raid content is the combination of:

    1) Old raid loot is (generally) not useful at cap
    2) Old raids have been run to death (the typical need-new-content argument)

    The actual solution for YOUR problem is not to "resexify" old content, but to completely revamp it so that it poses more of a challenge (as well as adding loot for you to grind). That would require man-hours.

    Man-hours they don't have. They'll be straining their overtime clocks to get the next expansion out without a colossal number of bugs.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raithe View Post
    There is another reason (I, for instance, do NOT repeat content because it contains loot, if its not fun I don't repeat):



    Raiding is not that fun for me. Raids (the quests themselves) can be fun, but generally they are only fun for me if the group is of size 6-8 players. The problem with old raid content is the combination of:

    1) Old raid loot is (generally) not useful at cap
    2) Old raids have been run to death (the typical need-new-content argument)

    The actual solution for YOUR problem is not to "resexify" old content, but to completely revamp it so that it poses more of a challenge (as well as adding loot for you to grind). That would require man-hours.

    Man-hours they don't have. They'll be straining their overtime clocks to get the next expansion out without a colossal number of bugs.
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  6. #6
    Community Member ycheese123's Avatar
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    There are old raids that I see that never have trouble filling (even super late, like Midnight-6AM est)... Von, ADQ, ToD, even Abbot, which I have seen more posts for (and ran more myself) than even CitW in the last few weeks. FoT doesn't seem to be posted much when I'm looking. I have noticed Shrouds taking long to fill or just short-manning. And of course there are some raids that are deader-than-dead: Titan, HoX, VoD. NOBODY does these. Maybe channels, but you might see 1 VoD pug lfm in a month. You could even add Reaver's Fate in there. I sometimes post Reaver's for fun, but I very rarely see anyone else post it anymore. As for LoB and MA... I see LoB posted a bit, maybe a few times a week, and MA is rarely posted. Oh and Chrono... same issue as Shroud usually. That's just from my point of view anyway, and only on one server. Maybe the addition of heroic comms to epic raids would be some incentive. and for heroic raids, maybe like, scraps of heroic comms. Also, they confirmed there's no raid?
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  7. #7
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raithe View Post
    There is another reason (I, for instance, do NOT repeat content because it contains loot, if its not fun I don't repeat):



    Raiding is not that fun for me. Raids (the quests themselves) can be fun, but generally they are only fun for me if the group is of size 6-8 players. The problem with old raid content is the combination of:

    1) Old raid loot is (generally) not useful at cap
    2) Old raids have been run to death (the typical need-new-content argument)

    The actual solution for YOUR problem is not to "resexify" old content, but to completely revamp it so that it poses more of a challenge (as well as adding loot for you to grind). That would require man-hours.

    Man-hours they don't have. They'll be straining their overtime clocks to get the next expansion out without a colossal number of bugs.

    The new crappy expansion won't save this game, vibrant raiding will.

  8. #8
    Community Member Cetus's Avatar
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    Only raids I run today are fot and citw...

    citw very infrequently, as that has been milked to oblivion throughout this past rough year.

    its been a YEAR since a new raid, and we'll be working on the second year as this new expansion gets released in august.

    Thats...what like 14, 15 months with no raid?

    Sorry, fot is getting boring. End game is getting boring, TR'ing for the 50th time is getting boring.

    Maybe its just time for a break, the only non-boring part of this game is the social aspect so far.
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  9. #9
    Community Member Dreppo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cetus View Post
    Only raids I run today are fot and citw...
    its been a YEAR since a new raid, and we'll be working on the second year as this new expansion gets released in august.
    You mentioned FoT yourself. That was released just 3 months ago.

  10. #10
    Community Member Ivan_Milic's Avatar
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    Shroud is still run a lot, will be run till they make tr obsolete.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ivan_Milic View Post
    Shroud is still run a lot, will be run till they make tr obsolete.
    It'll be run even after that because its fun and as long as new players trickle in, there will be people who haven't done it before.

  12. #12
    Community Member FestusHood's Avatar
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    I play on Argonessen. Our guild runs shrouds every Sunday and Tuesday. We usually pug about half the slots, and they fill within minutes. Granted, they are run during US primetime, but they do fill quickly.

    We were also easily filling subterrane groups to go on Garamol runs a few nights ago. Seriously, turning people away. I personally have never done the raid Vision of Destruction, but would like to see it someday. Run Hound of Xoriat once.

    There is a huge part of the playerbase that doesn't do raids at all. Except possibly shroud. Probably because they are intimidated by them.

  13. #13
    Community Member Ivan_Milic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FestusHood View Post

    There is a huge part of the playerbase that doesn't do raids at all. Except possibly shroud. Probably because they are intimidated by them.
    I stopped doing them too.
    Only do Shroud and Citw now.
    Vod is actually not bad raid, better than hox.

  14. #14

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    Quote Originally Posted by FestusHood View Post
    I play on Argonessen. Our guild runs shrouds every Sunday and Tuesday. We usually pug about half the slots, and they fill within minutes. Granted, they are run during US primetime, but they do fill quickly.

    We were also easily filling subterrane groups to go on Garamol runs a few nights ago. Seriously, turning people away. I personally have never done the raid Vision of Destruction, but would like to see it someday. Run Hound of Xoriat once.

    There is a huge part of the playerbase that doesn't do raids at all. Except possibly shroud. Probably because they are intimidated by them.
    VOD is fun. My guild runs it occasionally just to mix things up a bit. Our schedule, also on argo:

    fot twice a week
    citw twice a week
    lob/adq once a week (alternates)
    tod, vod, ma, shroud: every once in a blue moon (though we do run shroud, just not during guild raid time)

    We generally end up only pugging a few spots, though.

  15. #15
    I <3 DDO wey4lust's Avatar
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    I think you ppl are just lazy :P I wanted to raid some old raids i started to put lfms daily for vod/shroud hox/reavers lob/ma also i join Item (notable great raid leader) Titans + gulid raids and im on timer all the time for all raids ^^ Just start posting groups and learn ppl i take first 11 always and almost never fail i had maybe 1 hox and 1 lob fail in history. Hardest to fill from my expirence is hox but it takes 30 min top.
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  16. #16
    Community Member Cetus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreppo View Post
    You mentioned FoT yourself. That was released just 3 months ago.
    umm...

    I know I mentioned it. That's why I wrote it. Not sure I understand your point here.
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  17. #17
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    Lack of endgame content results in a lack of people playing. This can already be felt in DDO. And with this second expansion showing Turbine's direction things will only get worse.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cetus View Post
    its been a YEAR since a new raid, and we'll be working on the second year as this new expansion gets released in august.
    I know I mentioned it. That's why I wrote it. Not sure I understand your point here.
    His point is that when you know something is false, and yet say it regardless, it makes it sound like over the top whining rather than rational criticism. There is a valid point to what you are saying, but you make it hard to be taken seriously when you transition from "Look at this raid that was added 3 months ago." to "We haven't had a new raid in a year now!"

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cetus View Post
    umm...

    I know I mentioned it. That's why I wrote it. Not sure I understand your point here.
    Maybe because you wrote "no new raid in 14, 15 months" yet FoT has only been out 3 months.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    I'll keep this brief so i don't delve too far to the d000m!!! side . . .

    There are two raids that are routinely run at this time, FOT and CiTW. All the other stuff is barely run, even Shrouds take 30-45 minutes to fill.

    The old raid loot just isn't worth pursuing, and the pursuit of loot is what makes people run things more than once.

    Quite frankly raiding is dead in DDO. The the new "expansion" coming out without a raid makes this look like it's not going to change anytime soon.

    My question to the powers that be is . . . are you aware how screwed up the current situation is, do you care, and is anything going to be done to re-sexify the old content so it's worth running again?

    Raiding is fun, the current situation leaves a big hole in the end-game.
    Agreed.

    I had a lot of fun when my guild used to run back-to-back-to-back (usually elite) ToDs every Monday and Thursday a few years ago. It wasn't even so much about the loot, more so about hanging out with guildies and having a good time with something that was at least slightly challenging at the time (especially if I was drunk). Even doing ReVods with a certain guildy and ten pugs was a lot of fun.

    Nowadays, not so much fun. I haven't run ToD in over a year and I don't think any of my characters are flagged for Shroud or DQ. Even an attempted ReVod where I pulled aggro on my bard wasn't much fun.

    It would be awesome if something could change to make raiding fun and worthwhile again.

  20. #20
    Community Member Cetus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikarddo View Post
    Maybe because you wrote "no new raid in 14, 15 months" yet FoT has only been out 3 months.
    Sorry, I see the obvious source of contradiction - I'll elaborate:

    I don't consider CITW and FOT to be equal as far as raids go.

    The latter is completed in 10 minutes while fighting in a circle. CITW was actually a run that had several encounters, with physical RUNNING through a map.

    We haven't had, what is to me, a real raid in over a year. FOT was just a quick "here, lets throw a buncha bosses into a large room and have players take them down at the same time, kinda shroud part 2 style".

    FOT is a throw away raid, probably took nothing to design and code in comparison to CITW, LOB, or MA.

    Is that a more substantive explanation?
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