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  1. #1
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    Default Cleric questions

    So I have a couple of questions about playing a generalist cleric, i have never been a healer class before in ddo before, though i have played melee and caster classes before.

    1. Are clerics still good soloers.

    2. Is it possible to use mace and shield and still be able to do okay melee at later levels so i can save mana sometimes. If so, how could I build an Elven one, i am not sure what feats to take besides the meta magic feats like extend, empower, and quicken. I prefer the Mace and shield style over the THF only because using a THF weapon does not feel right on a cleric to me. I want to use elf for the spell pen enhancement.


    Thanks for any help
    Last edited by Bluemage21; 04-29-2013 at 08:23 PM. Reason: Adding some more Information

  2. #2
    Community Member Brightheart245's Avatar
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    Default Cleric Recommendations/Suggestions

    Hello,

    Although this is my first time posting in the forums, I have some experience with clerics and favored souls.
    I am not too sure of the future enhancement changes might affect the cleric's ability to solo efficiently, but as of now on the live servers, they are still very much able to solo if geared/built well for that purpose. Honestly, my cleric is not much of a soloer since she is more dependent as opposed to my main (and even then, my main is not all that great at solo'ing ^^"). In my opinion, I think that casting might be easier for damage rather than melee'ing, since the stats would be spread out. Since this is your first time playing a healer, it is important to heal in a pug (unless you run with guildies or friends) because you have to strongest ability to do so. It's just assumed that if you are a divine class, then you should be able to fill that responsibility (although some people have the courtesy to ask you if you heal or not. The question is more frequent if you are a Favored Soul rather than a Cleric because of the different views on the two classes). That said, it is easier to stay back from the front lines to help heal the party and side cast. Not only that, Wisdom, the cleric's important stat, determines spell DC's so I think that would be also good in terms of stat flexibility.

    Yes, it is still possible to build a melee'ing cleric as I have read from previous posts from others who are experienced in that area, but in my experience, I have never built one specifically for mediocre melee DPS. To me, casting has always been easier to manage damage-wise. However, you can still invest some points into strength if you really want to do some mace swinging to clean up the mobs that you have left over from spell casting (if you do go that route).

    Also, mana is not much of an issue for a cleric at all if you have the right gear. Clerics have another healing ability with their Prestige (Radiant Servant, I also strongly encourage doing some research about Clerics if this is your first time playing one) and with that, your mana is basically used for casting if your healing bursts are strong enough to sustain a whole party.

    Some gear I strongly suggest to get for a cleric is a weapon with devotion and healing lore on it. Thaumaturgy staffs are great for casting (important properties for a cleric would be Impulse for Blade Barrier/Cometfall and Combustion for Fire Storm) and Heavy Fortification items (Nightforged Gorget, Minos Legens) are highly recommended. And if you ever level a cleric to at least level 23, Forgotten Light (http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Forgott...%28Level_23%29) at Epic Normal version, it uses your Wisdom modifier for damage and attack modifier, making your cleric not only able to hit harder, but also increases your healing/light power. And it's a mace. :D A nice shield to go with that would be Light and Darkness (http://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Light_and_Darkness). I hope you are VIP or have the Path of Inspiration & Netherese Legacy packs. However, Forgotten Light can be purchased from the Auction House too for sometimes a large price. A cleric should have good survival so that s(he) is able to keep the party up and cast alongside them.

    I'm sorry I wasn't much help to your question for melee mace-shield cleric type build, but I do recommend going to the caster side of the cleric since you do have some background of what it's like to play as a caster (I see you play melee classes too, but its really all up to you which play-style you prefer). Thanks for bearing with me and my long text - let me know what you think! :) I really hope you enjoy the divine classes - get in touch with the Favored Soul class if you really enjoy casting alongside with healing. Favored Souls also have some sweet perks for a melee based soul. =D
    Last edited by Brightheart245; 04-30-2013 at 12:26 AM.

  3. #3
    Community Member chance2000's Avatar
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    Thumbs up My Cleric running alone

    My Clerics that run alone, take a tank hireling. At level 20 the halfling Pally Vilgo is great.
    At level if you have the coin you can solo water works elite with a tank hireling. I have done this many times wand whipping.
    Buy some heal wands and drag them to the tool bar. In the entire WW chain had less than 20 kills while the pally had way more.
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluemage21 View Post
    So I have a couple of questions about playing a generalist cleric, i have never been a healer class before in ddo before, though i have played melee and caster classes before.

    1. Are clerics still good soloers.
    Yes they are great at solo, more so after level 11 when they get blade barrier.

    2. Is it possible to use mace and shield and still be able to do okay melee at later levels so i can save mana sometimes. If so, how could I build an Elven one, i am not sure what feats to take besides the meta magic feats like extend, empower, and quicken. I prefer the Mace and shield style over the THF only because using a THF weapon does not feel right on a cleric to me. I want to use elf for the spell pen enhancement.


    Thanks for any help
    You can use mace and shield if you want, I would try to get the mace from invaders quest (20 invader tokens if I remember right) as that uses Wisdom for to hit and damage.

    scepter of healing

    then at higher levels you can hunt for forgotten light

    There might be more that have the wisdom mod for to hit and damage, but those are the two that I know of that should keep you from mid levels to high levels. Before that just use whatever you have.

    I personally if going elf use the faith weapon scimitar. It has a better crit profile and does a bit more damage if you build a little for melee.

  5. #5
    Community Member Fleckislaupir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluemage21 View Post
    1. Are clerics still good soloers.
    Yes (depending on how you build it).
    2. Is it possible to use mace and shield and still be able to do okay melee at later levels so i can save mana sometimes.
    Define "okay." Maces & morningstars are relatively low DPS weapons to start with; and if you don't invest some melee feats (e..g., Power Atk, Shield Mastery, etc.), your S&B DPS will always be pretty poor. But of course feats you put into melee you're not putting into metamagics. There are a couple of maces which use WIS instead of STR for dmg and seem geared towards clerics - namely Scepter of Healing from Invaders! and Forgotten Light from Rest Stop - but neither is what I would consider a "real" DPS weapon.

    Think of it this way: the longer it takes you to kill something, the longer it gets to hit you, which means the more dmg you're taking and thus the more healing you need to use on yourself. So how often will swinging a mace be more SP-efficient than just, say, zapping critters with Searing Light or kiting them thru Blade Barrier?
    I want to use elf for the spell pen enhancement.
    Elven Arcanum is only available to wizards; so going elf doesn't help you on a cleric.

  6. #6
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    Clerics can solo quite well, even without using feats/equipment too specifically at low levels.

    I recently leveled a cleric 1-10, a fair bit of soloing, with 8 strength, 8 dex, 16 con, 8 int, 18 wis, 10 cha. Some twinking, but not crazy.

    From 1-6, you can just selfbuff+mace+wandwhip. An Elemental-PureGood-D8 weapon (heavy mace, morningstar, longsword if you're Sovereign host) is fine. Divine Favour boosts strength, and get the best strength item you can. Ship buffs are immensely influential here as well.

    Levels 7-10 are harder to pull off this way. But at level 6, you get Radiant Servant one. If you've got Max+Emp+Emp Healing and some heal enhancements and a devotion item, your bursts can do 200-300 damage. A focused enhancement respec with some extra turning, heal crit (does this work on burst?) and a charisma item and you can do some stuff easily; grab huge swarm, burst, clean up extras with an Elemental-Puregood-D8 weapon. (Though you might be able to find an Elemental-Puregood-D6 weapon cheaper; clubs often get ignored for melee).

    At level 11 you get blade barrier. That sorts out your soloing. Max+Emp and a Radiance scepter triple stacking divine light for ~100 damage every few seconds can take down your bosses quick enough. Soloing this way can go all the way to the end, though I found it trickled down at 16 or so on my first cleric.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluemage21 View Post
    1. Are clerics still good soloers.
    Absolutely. I am running a third life F1P2C17 and have soloed (real solo, no hires) every sub L20 quest elite at level (other than those that require more than one person, and Nurse Ratchet, whose self healing I could never seem to overcome). I did the same last life on an M2C18 clonk. First life was pure, and pugged. Key equipment from first life was GS Conc Opp and a Torc. Having crafting levels sufficient to build any equipment up to ~L15 was a big help as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bluemage21 View Post
    2. Is it possible to use mace and shield and still be able to do okay melee at later levels so i can save mana sometimes. If so, how could I build an Elven one, i am not sure what feats to take besides the meta magic feats like extend, empower, and quicken. I prefer the Mace and shield style over the THF only because using a THF weapon does not feel right on a cleric to me. I want to use elf for the spell pen enhancement.
    This requirement might be more of an issue. Monk fists and dwarven THF axe wielder produced enough melee for the vast majority of cases (sure, some battles were not as fast as they could have been). Overcoming self healing opponents might be more of an issue, especially those not doing physical damage (if you have conc opp/torc). As I was dropping cleric levels I neglected spell pen and relied on BB and DP (though the occasional destruction/implosion that lands is very satisfying).

    Extend is useful early but soon enough you will want to swap it out for maximise (depending on what order you take maximise, empower and quicken). I delayed taking quicken until L18 as aura and burst worked fine until then.

    I would warn you though, soloing a cleric build to cap may well induce laziness on you part as far as looking after others is concerned when you group up for raids. I used to be the most conscientious of healers, but having solo capped a number of different divine builds I find my concentration wanders...

  8. #8
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    I'm currently leveling my necro cleric build, up to level 17 now. It is a very strong soloer. I do not use hires. Blade barrier, slay living & destruction, and banishment combine to make a crazy-effective arsenal. (For undead I use bb + burst.)

    While grouping -- which I have been doing more at later levels due to laziness -- he mostly just insta-kills all casters, keeps aura running, and occasionally banishes groups of mephits or greater commands overly large groups of melee.
    Last edited by Ellis_Dee; 05-05-2013 at 10:02 AM.

  9. #9
    Community Member ~kruemeli's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thlargir_ View Post
    I would warn you though, soloing a cleric build to cap may well induce laziness on you part as far as looking after others is concerned when you group up for raids. I used to be the most conscientious of healers, but having solo capped a number of different divine builds I find my concentration wanders...
    That is a very good point, and I have found it to be true!
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluemage21 View Post
    So I have a couple of questions about playing a generalist cleric, i have never been a healer class before in ddo before, though i have played melee and caster classes before.

    1. Are clerics still good soloers.

    2. Is it possible to use mace and shield and still be able to do okay melee at later levels so i can save mana sometimes. If so, how could I build an Elven one, i am not sure what feats to take besides the meta magic feats like extend, empower, and quicken. I prefer the Mace and shield style over the THF only because using a THF weapon does not feel right on a cleric to me. I want to use elf for the spell pen enhancement.

    Thanks for any help
    I prefer half elves and so my experiences are limited to that race.

    My clerics take fighter dilettante at lower levels and run around with Carnifex or the heroic Antique Greataxe. At higher levels with the elven faith enhancement they use scimitars, then I swap over to Paladin dilettante for the saving throw boost. With a Min2 scimitar (chosen to break the widest range of DR and have a good crit range) Clerics are very effective at killing the stragglers their blade barrier or implosion don't take out. The Min2 is weak in epic levels, but there are usually nice epic lootgen options in the AH.

    I would refrain from usin a mace (or at best, save it for skelly bashing). It just doesn't do enough damage. I understand it fitting the theme of the cleric, it just feels like the practicalities of damage get in the way.

    On a first life cleric, here are the feats I take:

    1-Toughness ( + Fighter Dilettante)
    3-Power Attack
    6-Empower Healing
    9-Maximize
    12-Quicken
    15-Mental Toughness
    18-Improved Mental Toughness
    21-Spell Focus: Evocation
    24-Greater Spell Focus: Evocation

    You could easily swap power attack for extend or empower. The mental toughnesses are important to supplement your spell points. In later lives, when your spellpoint boosting gear is maxed out, you can change them for spell penetration, useful past life feats, etc.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by ~Ellis_Dee View Post
    I'm currently leveling my necro cleric build, up to level 17 now. It is a very strong soloer. I do not use hires. Blade barrier, slay living & destruction, and banishment combine to make a crazy-effective arsenal. (For undead I use bb + burst.)
    How about swapping in Undeath to Death for undead-heavy quests?

    Currently on a FvS life, I sure miss all the awesome spells Clerics get to play with.

  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by SirValentine View Post
    How about swapping in Undeath to Death for undead-heavy quests?

    Currently on a FvS life, I sure miss all the awesome spells Clerics get to play with.
    Yep, that too. Just forgot to mention it. Also mass cure critical.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by ~Bluemage21 View Post
    So I have a couple of questions about playing a generalist cleric, i have never been a healer class before in ddo before, though i have played melee and caster classes before.

    1. Are clerics still good soloers.

    2. Is it possible to use mace and shield and still be able to do okay melee at later levels so i can save mana sometimes. If so, how could I build an Elven one, i am not sure what feats to take besides the meta magic feats like extend, empower, and quicken. I prefer the Mace and shield style over the THF only because using a THF weapon does not feel right on a cleric to me. I want to use elf for the spell pen enhancement.


    Thanks for any help
    A great way to go Elf cleric is to take Undying Court enhancments for Scimitars or Rapiers. Then use Keen Scimitars or Rapiers. WIth S&B or TWF. Eventually Improved Critical feat instead of keen.

    Another boost to divine melee are Divine Power items (ml5) and if you can find a racial then ML3. Saves spell points. All I play are divines and they all have a few Divine Power items, so they never run out of clicks and never really use the spell for it.

    Cursespewing at mid lvl and Paralyzers are great weapons for Divines. With or without Martial prof.
    Last edited by firemedium_jt; 06-07-2013 at 01:06 PM.
    Your lack of healing amp not my problem. Please buy and use your own remove curse pots in combat, so I don't waste mana. Not my job.

  14. #14
    Community Member susiedupfer's Avatar
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    If you intend to actually be able to run quests, I would strongly recommend going anonymous(look at bottom of who page for check box) unless you are applying to an LFM. Otherwise, you will receive so many blind invites and tells, it will be difficult to function.
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    Community Member Sarzor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by susiedupfer View Post
    If you intend to actually be able to run quests, I would strongly recommend going anonymous(look at bottom of who page for check box) unless you are applying to an LFM. Otherwise, you will receive so many blind invites and tells, it will be difficult to function.
    This used to be the case. I've gone through nearly a full cleric life (25k from cap) and never been blind invited. Maybe I'm just a mean person and noone wants to play with me?

    Could also be I suck at healing. While that's true, only those who play with me know that.

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    If you want a melee cleric for starting out, that's perfectly understandable.

    I recently made a helf cleric, fighter dilly -- 16 str and wis, 14 con and cha. And it's performing admirably well so far -- there may come a day/level where I'd prefer to go casting, and that's what the free LR is for!

    Don't bother swinging a mace and going melee with a half-arsed strength. There are perfectly viable battle cleric builds where you can splash a level of fighter (or go helf dilly, as I did); crank up the strength, grab a greataxe, and cleave your way through dungeons.
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  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sarzor View Post
    This used to be the case. I've gone through nearly a full cleric life (25k from cap) and never been blind invited. Maybe I'm just a mean person and noone wants to play with me?

    Could also be I suck at healing. While that's true, only those who play with me know that.
    Depends on a lot of things, but I still think it is that way in general. A lot of healers I know that are above 20 and annon are so because of tells from random players. The level, server population, alphabetical rank of name on who list, etc are all factors too. It is a social game but I dont know how many tells from randos asking the same thing a person can take.

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