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  1. #41
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    AoV tree looks fairly decent.

    Its mostly missing +30 hp (on Live my human FvS can get +70 hp from enhancements, on Lam currently only +40 hp). Suggested fix is to add 3 levels of +10 hp cost 2 ap to tier 5 of both FvS trees (tier 5 so noone can access it in both trees).

    It may also be missing Unyielding Sov though I am uncertain if thats somehow autogranted with picking a faith as I havent done a TR or LR on Lam with my char copied FvS.

    Wand and Scroll Mastery appears to be bugged - it adds nothing to my heal scrolls atm - but thats a simple bug to be fixed and not a design issue.

    Apart from that the tree looks workable without anything out of the ordinary.


    Protection on the other hand looks extremely boring. I dont see anyone using that much. Maybe add Greater Command as a tier 4 og tier 5 SLA but more than that is needed.


    And definitely atleast one more tree is needed specifically designed for the FvS.

  2. #42

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    it potentially frees up some AP that can go into dex to qualify for TWF
    Except enhancements don't let you qualify for feats.

    Feelings on the FvS tree:

    1) Protection. This can't be right, can it? It's a terrible tree almost completely without any redeeming features whatsoever for clerics, and you just copy/pasted it in to FvS? Remainder of comments will be on the AoV tree, as the entire Protection tree needs to be nuked from orbit. It's THAT bad. No class should have to endure such steaming pile of blighted misery.

    2) Shield of Condemnation: A toggle? Really? Can anyone name for me any possible (not likely or probably...POSSIBLE, because I cannot think of any time or any place where I would received any benefit of any kind from having it turned off) circumstances where you would ever NOT want this ability active? At least with things like Power Attack, there might occasionally be a reason to turn it off. But this? Unfathomable. This is just more hotbar space taken up for NO REASON AT ALL.

    3) On the other hand, finally turning the Aura of Menace into a toggle is long, long overdue. Thank you!

    4) Scourge...oh joy, another timer to keep track of. Like this mechanic isn't hated enough in the Exalted Angel ED, you have to stick it into heroic levels as well? At least when you have ExAng, you've got the shoulder cannon to keep stacks going. At level 1? not so much. Please stop this.

    5) Inquisition. +Intimidate? That's not a class skill. What is this doing?

    6) Just Reward - This is actually not awful. A flavorful ability that's completely passive and provides a tangible benefit.

    7) Efficient Metamagic - I like being able to take something besides just Improved Empower. Enlarge seems a bit strange though. Do any FvS actually have that meta?

    8) Articles of Faith - Nice idea, but the implementation is...not as great. If you want to cast, then you're going to be using an actual implement with spellpower on it. The miniscule amount of +spellpower you get from only an implement bonus is going to be unnoticeable. To keep the flavor, and utility? "If using your deity's weapon, any implement bonus the weapon has is considered +1/+2/+3 higher than listed". This gives incentive for FvSs to find casting-statted weapons of their deity's type, or to get such weapons with red slots and slot them with spellpower crystals.

    9) Vengeful magic is severely underwhelming. When I'm at low health, as the one with the Heal spell, my first thought is not "Oh goody, think of how much better my spellcasting will be", it's "Time to heal myself". In practice, this ability will see almost zero use. This is not tier3 of the AoV line, it's point-padding fluff.

    10) Spell Penetration - 1 rank? Why have it at all?

    11) Intense Faith. +Caster Level seems nice, until you remember that all of the spells it lists (maybe not Firestorm, but I'm trying to keep this to spells people actually use) are hard capped and the Caster Level doesn't actually do anything. Which leads us to...

    12) Zealous Faith. Soooo...I just spend 6 points on Intense Faith, and now I need to spend 6 more here just to get any actual benefit from it? And of course, Positive spells aren't included.

    13) Where are the favored weapon damage enhancements?

    I tried to duplicate my current live FvS with this, and simply couldn't. Some areas ended up better (spell crit chance, metamagic cost reducers), others ended up far worse (hitpoints from FvS toughness). I also had to waste a great many AP on stuff I had no interest in and will never notice or use in order to reach the things that I was interested in.
    Last edited by Matuse; 04-19-2013 at 01:47 AM.
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  3. #43
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    Wrt Intense and Zealot faith - have you tested their effect on ED SLA (Avenging Light etc) or on Blade Barrier? I wonder if and how it works exactly for those.

  4. #44
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    Articles of Faith: should be implement to the any weapon you use or so as to keep the flavor keep it a deity weapon .BUT Deity weapons as said lots and lots of times on fvs should be linked to racial weapons . Do not pigeon hole anymore the melee fvs in specific races . Make Dwarf to have diety weapons axes and hammers and Horc in any twohanded weapon. If developers support flexibility this is a good step forward.

    Protection Tree: Enough has been said , its worthless bad designed tree completely useless that noone devine would ever take for any reason .

    FVS Tree: In general very good implementation imo needs some slight improvements though .
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  5. #45
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    Lots of good things in AoV tree. Some prices are quite steep but in general its not bad.

    Protection is copy pasted dog dung that smells just as bad after copy paste as it did before it.

    Divine Avenger. I'm assuming you took the favored weapon damage increases and hp increases and put them in here? But I'm also assuming you FORGOT to add Divine Avenger and ACCIDENTALLY added protection. Now apologise and insert Divine Avenger and all is good again.

    In case you have forgotten Divine Avenger was supposed to be the next released Prc about a year...or more ago and in DDO wiki it seemed like it was almost finished. I understand you did not want to release it before this enhancement update so you would have to rebuild it but now is the time.

  6. #46

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    What I as player would most like to see added to both favored souls and clerics is:

    Cure Light Wounds as a metamagical spell like ability.
    Spell Point cost 6/4/2 sp.
    Cooldown 5/4/3 seconds.

    Nimbus of light as a metamagical spell like ability.
    Spell Point cost 6/4/2 sp.
    Cooldown 5/4/3 seconds.

    I don't care how much action points its cost.
    I don't care whether it requires 17+ class levels.
    I feel that cheap light spells and heals are badly overlooked, and are very important.

    Just PLEASE grant me this.

  7. #47

    Default

    It seems that you folks are getting the multiclass stuff moving forward, but are having trouble with the pure class stuff.

    Here is a bit of help for you ~ realize that tier 5s are exclusive

    DOUBLE and Triple all Tier Five groups.

    Pack them with goodies not junk.

    Every blue bar tier five ought to have +1/+2/+3 Spell Pen, because one can only have a single tier five,
    thus assuring all blue classes can get spell pen once from anywhere.

  8. #48
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    Default ADD SLAs and fix terrible AoV tier 3

    Angel Of Vengeance is rather decent tree but it lacks one thing : SLAS! Nowadays on Lama every offensive caster Pre tree have powerfull SLAS . Only Fvs caster lacks them which is main flaw of this tree. AoV archon is rather for flavor not a really dps boost so i don't consider it as a true SLA. We need a SLA spell that could bring AoV tree closer to Druid/Sorc/Wiz SLAS. Turbine please delete this monstrous AoV tier 3:

    Vengeful Magic: You gain a +1% Sacred bonus to Spell Critical chance when below 50% health, and a +50% Sacred bonus to Spell Critical Damage Multiplier with Fire, Force, Light, and Physical damage spells when below 25% health.

    And replace it with something like : Flame strike , Holy Smith, Nimbus of light , and aura additional -1 to saves for enemy mobs.
    Vengeful magic is complicated mechanism and could be a source of many hard to resolve bugs . Simply adding some SLAs and little more save debuff to aura would be far easier to implement , less time consuming.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silverleafeon View Post
    What I as player would most like to see added to both favored souls and clerics is:

    Cure Light Wounds as a metamagical spell like ability.
    Spell Point cost 6/4/2 sp.
    Cooldown 5/4/3 seconds.

    Nimbus of light as a metamagical spell like ability.
    Spell Point cost 6/4/2 sp.
    Cooldown 5/4/3 seconds.

    I don't care how much action points its cost.
    I don't care whether it requires 17+ class levels.
    I feel that cheap light spells and heals are badly overlooked, and are very important.

    Just PLEASE grant me this.
    /signed ,

  10. #50

    Default

    Its the bottom of the 9th, one out (alpha) and chicken little is two runs ahead.
    There is a wizard on first base, and a sorcerer on second base.
    The Devs are the home team, and time out has been called.

    Will the Devs pull it off, or will they lose the game to chicken little?



    Speaking as someone who has played every class and race the old fashion way,
    I am distressed and upset at the current events playing out in this enhancement alpha.


    You, the Devs, are about to implement a nerf to every class in the game except two.
    That is a pretty strong charge, let's talk it over.


    Archmage wizards probably need some more flexablity.
    Other than that, the arcane powerhouses (Sorcerer and Wizard) almost always come out on top.

    The enhancements for the melee is coming along, until one considers that melees exist in
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Symbiosis
    with other classes. When those classes suffer, the melee classes suffer.

    Most melees have gotten to the point of realizing that sorcerers and wizards often don't care.
    That is why we melees carry haste clickies, haste potions, and melee aclarity items.
    That is why we melees carry permanent blur items.
    We can get along if we have to without them.

    But we melees have another Symbiosis, a strong greater one that is much more important.
    If this group is weak, we melee are also weak.
    It is the group of classes that can cast mass curative spells.

    This group includes Bards, Druids, Clerics, and Favored Souls.
    The games fate and destiny are interwoven with their destiny.

    These four classes have some else in common.
    All four of them currently only have tier two prestige classes.
    Since three tier should exists, one can obviously concluded that each of these classes
    should be increased in enhancement power by 50% during this enhancement update.

    Bards also suffer as already needing upgrades in many forms.
    They sit at the bottom of all the classes, needing much love.
    I will not list in detail what should be changed as you the Devs already have my very
    details notes on the subject documented for later access.

    While some will say, the spellsinger looks kinda nice, I say you have a long way to go.
    The bard needs a lot of work, you know what it is, do it.


    Fifty percent is a lot of power addition.
    Fear is the original sin.
    Be bold, be creative, show us how smart you can be.

  11. #51
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    Default dont nerf the Faith lines O_O

    ok, Faith lines, spacifically The Undying court- At level 6 a FS is supposed to get Undying call, i have the 2 feats and at lv6 Undying call is supposed to be available as an enhancement. And my build is based off one im doing on live, the new system has apparently nerffed the enhancement part of this faith line couse Undying call is no where to be found. i just recently got FS on live and what atracted me to it was the faith lines, if these get nerffed then whats the point of FS. It gave them a uniqe flavor in my humble opinion why should i be forced to take a Feat to pick a fith line when the enhancement parts of those lines are gone and nerf the whole point of each line. unfortunately i am finding that i can only express the same sentaments as the majority of what i have read on the forums so fat, and that is:

    Im not Liking what im seeing thus far, and after 3+ years of playing this game i fail to see what was wrong with the enhancement system the way it is now on live ?? O_o

  12. #52

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    Overall, a request for all enhancement trees.

    Varity is the spice of life.

    Use the epic destinies as a model.

    Less prerequisites, more nice stuff (even if it costs more to buy).

    Let us choose and give us plenty to choose from that several reasonable paths are available.

  13. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uudlaric View Post
    Angel Of Vengeance is rather decent tree but it lacks one thing : SLAS! Nowadays on Lama every offensive caster Pre tree have powerfull SLAS . Only Fvs caster lacks them which is main flaw of this tree. AoV archon is rather for flavor not a really dps boost so i don't consider it as a true SLA. We need a SLA spell that could bring AoV tree closer to Druid/Sorc/Wiz SLAS. Turbine please delete this monstrous AoV tier 3:

    Vengeful Magic: You gain a +1% Sacred bonus to Spell Critical chance when below 50% health, and a +50% Sacred bonus to Spell Critical Damage Multiplier with Fire, Force, Light, and Physical damage spells when below 25% health.

    And replace it with something like : Flame strike , Holy Smith, Nimbus of light , and aura additional -1 to saves for enemy mobs.
    Vengeful magic is complicated mechanism and could be a source of many hard to resolve bugs . Simply adding some SLAs and little more save debuff to aura would be far easier to implement , less time consuming.
    Description from DDO site: Wielding divine magic to both heal and destroy!!!!
    So where is our SLA ? Now even Artis have SLAs.
    Give us some fun from playing divines!!!

  14. #54

    Default On Strike

    My divine characters who typically heal raids and epics are officially on strike,
    to protest the new enhancement changes for Divines as they feel the changes
    are very poorly done.

    If you a player find less and less divines willing to heal your raids,
    consider what will happen if the Developers do not GREATLY rework
    and improve this situation.

    In the meantime, no epic/raid heals from me.

    I have TRed these divine characters and they now sit in Korthos.

  15. #55
    Community Member Xeno5k's Avatar
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    Seriously what the hell were they thinking? I mean this is a straight up nerf to melee fvs and healbot fvs.

    My melee fvs doesn't depend on his enhacements for his DPS but he does depend on them for his HP/SP/Spell Power with this new line he stands to lose 45 HP and 30 SP. Not to mention the stupidity of forcing me to waste 40 points in the AoV tree I'm hardly even going to use just so I can have my healing word. I like the current system because it doesn't force me to go through hell to get a decent SLA, but apparently that's exactly what the devs want.

    My proposal would be a healing tree that also grants healing word and other healing spell buffs, that would be way better for melee fvs than the current system.

    In fact the only things I like about the current system are the Close Wounds SLA in Protector and Toughness in Protector the rest is just garbage.

  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silverleafeon View Post
    If you a player find less and less divines willing to heal your raids,
    consider what will happen if... In the meantime, no epic/raid heals from me.
    .
    In other games that have driven off the PC healer, the Devs just added better and better NPC mercenaries and PC self/Alt healers.

  17. #57
    2014 DDO Players Council Flavilandile's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FlashG800 View Post
    In other games that have driven off the PC healer, the Devs just added better and better NPC mercenaries and PC self/Alt healers.
    In DDO Drones are not allowed in Raids... And Self Healing for non Divine is going to be hurt even more than the divines are hurt...
    On G-Land : Flavilandile, Blacklock, Yaelle, Millishande, Larilandile, Gildalinde, Tenalafel, and many other...

  18. #58
    Community Member Henky's Avatar
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    I said on surveys and reported as bugs. Please devs:

    Vengeful Magic (core FvS level 18) is USELESS. Change it.

    Something like 20 spell power to light/physical/fire damage or some SLA based on a light spell or give us SunBeam druid spell with its full sp cost and cooldown, whatever, just change it.
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  19. #59
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    Vengeful Magic:

    Waiting four years for the Vengeful Magic core enhancement is a poke in the eye. I'll never purchase an ability with a mechanic that requires you to be at less than 100% HP. It's is a terrible and unwanted direction. Also, what's the point of getting rid of spell crit damage multipliers across the board just to add them back in? Pick a direction and stick with it, please.

    Consider replacing Vengeful Magic with a light spell SLA such as Divine Punishment. Casting Divine Punishment for a total of 25 SP with Maximize, Empower and Quicken active would be very welcomed and inline with the AoV flavor.
    Last edited by Carpone; 07-03-2013 at 06:48 PM.
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  20. #60
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    Exclamation

    Let Turbine bring the changes, be it good or bad. We the consumer have the ultimate power in choosing not to play divine classes or any other for that matter.

    As those of us who play divines die off, so will those that can not self heal.

    Devs, you have this unique chance to listen to all of the divine players, get your house in order before it is too late. A success will see DDO flourish, similarly a bad implementation and not listening to the user base will see DDO fail.

    Keep in mind that your jobs are dependent upon us to keep playing and likewise with every other DDO player. If we stop playing, stop spending cash on TP and stop buying content that you work hard to develop; its game over man!

    Take heed and do the right thing by the players.
    Last edited by redcastle73b; 07-03-2013 at 08:07 PM.

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