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  1. #1
    Community Member Shmuel's Avatar
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    Default too many APs to get a racial PRE

    Having to spend so many action points in a racial enhancement chain to unlock the racial PRE ruins them. I can understand the PRE enhancements costing more than they would for a class, but there is so little of value in most of these racial trees that spending 10-14 AP just to unlock the tree for those chains ruins the viability of a huge number of builds that would use those racial PREs if they didn't cost so much.

    Please consider making racial PRE tree unlocking a first tier, 1 or 2 AP enhancement in the racial lines.
    Shmuel Xadin Xadins Errand Mohnster Yitzhak

  2. #2

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    /signed

    Racial trees should not compete with class trees. They should complement class trees while including their own choices.

    It would be nice if racial APs were separate from class APs - then races could be greatly customized around a core theme.

  3. #3
    Community Member Ironclans_evil_twin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Singular_is_annoyed View Post
    /signed

    Racial trees should not compete with class trees. They should complement class trees while including their own choices.

    It would be nice if racial APs were separate from class APs - then races could be greatly customized around a core theme.
    agreed far too much restriction of choice caused by spending requirements. On the bright side no one but Elfs will have any race PrE's anyway.

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironclans_evil_twin View Post
    agreed far too much restriction of choice caused by spending requirements. On the bright side no one but Elfs will have any race PrE's anyway.
    +1

    hahahahahahaha!!!

  5. #5
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    Default

    It is a lot, but I think they're understandably concerned with allowing mulitclass toons access to class capstones.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by SerPounce View Post
    It is a lot, but I think they're understandably concerned with allowing mulitclass toons access to class capstones.
    It's not like the capstones are actually that powerful anymore, especially to the person with a near maxed out ED who is also L20.
    Addicted to DDO since 2006
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  7. #7
    Community Member Dreppo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Singular_is_annoyed View Post
    It would be nice if racial APs were separate from class APs - then races could be greatly customized around a core theme.
    I don't think this is a good idea. Think about it for a moment. As it stands now we get 4AP/level which we can spend in any combination on racial and/or class enhancements. What you're suggesting is something like (say) 3AP/level to be used only for class enhancements, and 1AP/level to be used only for racial enhancements. That's worse than what we have now because it forces a certain split and we lose flexibility. Or maybe what you're suggesting is 4AP/level to be used only for class enhancements and an additional 1AP/level that we never had before to be used only for racial enhancements. Well... ok... obviously that would be stronger, but only because we'd be getting more APs. And a simple 5AP/level would again be better since it doesn't force a certain split.

    To summarize, I don't think there's any advantage in having separate APs for class vs racial enhancements. For greatest customization we should be able to spend APs however we decide. But nor do I think there's any inherent need to change the total APs we are given. It's a matter of scale. We could achieve the same effect by simply costing the enhancements appropriately. As it stands now a lot of the proposed enhancements have an AP cost that is out of proportion with the benefits, so our 80AP aren't going quite as far as we would like for the builds we have in mind.

  8. #8
    Community Member Entelech's Avatar
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    /signed.

    Having to waste 17 AP's just to get access to the racial PrE, then waste another 4 AP's on the actual racial enhancement that grants the tree, then progress down a gimped version of the ranger tree is absurd.

    As things stand on the live servers, racial PrE's (that is, Arcane Archer) have access to the abilities delayed by 2 levels, but in every other respect the costs and abilities granted are the same that a pure-class Ranger would get.

    There is no reason for the massive triple-dip nerfage. Two levels of delayed gratification is the only cost of going Ranger versus Racial on live, and nobody complains. It's not a balance issue.

    It's not like they can pick four class trees. The limit is the same for everyone.

    It's not like a minimal splash does not grant nearly as much access to a tree as taking it for a racial choice. And a deep splash pretty much gives everything worth having.

    It's not like you cannot get access to the top-level "not really autogrants" without putting the same number of points in the tree. And it's not like you can get multiple trees at Tier 5 if one is racial.

    It's not like the tiering and gating requirements don't already constitute a nerf to every build in the game compared to what is on live. Why exacerbate the problem? If it were up to me I would move racial PrE access to Tier 1 with no prerequisites, make them cost 2 AP's each, and leave the delayed-but-character-level based requirements the same as they are for Elf Arcane Archer.
    Last edited by Entelech; 05-02-2013 at 11:40 PM.
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