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  1. #1
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    Default Solo Dwarf Ranger/Cleric/Rogue this any good

    I like running DDO solo as I usually don't have a lot of time to play and I've found that I like the ranger/rogue role disable traps and picking lock while popping things with arrows before they figure out what's happening. I find that fun... the only thing is this sort of character really has a hard time actually killing things as the levels or difficulty goes up. So I've been doing some research and it seems that any Char I play will need to have some good spell casting to truly solo.

    So I came up with this build. I did rogue first for the skills and then two levels of ranger to get TWF as soon as possible, because I like it. Followed by 8 levels of cleric for good spells and better healing, then finished with all ranger and putting all ability boosts into WI. I didn't add any equipment and set it up as a TR of my current character with a supreme tome +2 applied at level 7. (I have 32 point builds activated as well)

    Here it is:
    Code:
    Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.16.01
    DDO Character Planner Home Page
    
    RanClerd 
    Level 20 Lawful Good Dwarf Male
    (1 Rogue \ 11 Ranger \ 8 Cleric) 
    Hit Points: 278
    Spell Points: 799 
    BAB: 17\17\22\27\27
    Fortitude: 18
    Reflex: 15
    Will: 16
    
                      Starting            Ending          Feat/Enhancement
    Abilities        Base Stats         Base Stats         Modified Stats
    (34 Point)       (Level 1)          (Level 20)           (Level 20)
    Strength             14                 16                   16
    Dexterity            14                 16                   18
    Constitution         16                 18                   20
    Intelligence         14                 16                   16
    Wisdom               16                 23                   25
    Charisma              6                  8                   10
    
    Tomes Used
    +2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7
    
                      Starting            Ending          Feat/Enhancement
                     Base Skills        Base Skills        Modified Skills
    Skills           (Level 1)          (Level 20)          (Level 20)
    Balance               6                 12                   16
    Bluff                -2                  0                    0
    Concentration         4                 25                   25
    Diplomacy            -2                  0                    0
    Disable Device        6                 22                   22
    Haggle                0                  2                    2
    Heal                  4                 22                   24
    Hide                  2                  4                    4
    Intimidate           -2                  0                    0
    Jump                  6                  8                    8
    Listen                6                 10                   10
    Move Silently         4                  6                    6
    Open Lock             6                 15                   15
    Perform              n/a                n/a                   n/a
    Repair                2                  3                    3
    Search                6                 20                   22
    Spot                  7                 20                   20
    Swim                  2                  3                    3
    Tumble                3                  5                    5
    Use Magic Device      2                 15                   15
    
    Level 1 (Rogue)
    Skill: Balance (+4)
    Skill: Concentration (+1)
    Skill: Disable Device (+4)
    Skill: Haggle (+2)
    Skill: Heal (+1)
    Skill: Jump (+4)
    Skill: Listen (+3)
    Skill: Move Silently (+2)
    Skill: Open Lock (+4)
    Skill: Search (+4)
    Skill: Spot (+4)
    Skill: Tumble (+1)
    Skill: Use Magic Device (+4)
    Feat: (Selected) Dodge
    Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Ranger
    Feat: (Automatic) Attack
    Feat: (Automatic) Dwarven Stability
    Feat: (Automatic) Dwarven Stonecutting
    Feat: (Automatic) Heroic Durability
    Feat: (Automatic) Light Armor Proficiency
    Feat: (Automatic) Martial Weapon Proficiency: Rapier
    Feat: (Automatic) Martial Weapon Proficiency: Shortsword
    Feat: (Automatic) Martial Weapon Proficiency: Shortbow
    Feat: (Automatic) Orc and Goblin Bonus
    Feat: (Automatic) Poison Save Bonus
    Feat: (Automatic) Simple Weapon Proficiency
    Feat: (Automatic) Sneak
    Feat: (Automatic) Sneak Attack
    Feat: (Automatic) Spell Save Bonus
    Feat: (Automatic) Trapfinding
    Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Damage I
    Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
    
    
    Level 2 (Ranger)
    Skill: Concentration (+1)
    Skill: Disable Device (+1)
    Skill: Heal (+1)
    Skill: Open Lock (+1)
    Skill: Search (+1)
    Skill: Spot (+1)
    Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Undead
    Feat: (Automatic) Bow Strength
    Feat: (Automatic) Defensive Fighting
    Feat: (Automatic) Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Dwarven Waraxe
    Feat: (Automatic) Martial Weapon Proficiency (ALL)
    Feat: (Automatic) Shield Proficiency (General)
    Feat: (Automatic) Sunder
    Feat: (Automatic) Trip
    Feat: (Automatic) Wild Empathy
    Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage I
    Enhancement: Rogue Improved Trap Sense I
    
    
    Level 3 (Ranger)
    Skill: Concentration (+1)
    Skill: Disable Device (+1)
    Skill: Heal (+1)
    Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
    Skill: Search (+1)
    Skill: Spot (+1)
    Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
    Feat: (Selected) Oversized Two Weapon Fighting
    Feat: (Automatic) Rapid Shot
    Feat: (Automatic) Two Weapon Fighting
    Enhancement: Dwarven Constitution I
    Enhancement: Improved Heal I
    Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity I
    
    
    Level 4 (Cleric)
    Ability Raise: WIS
    Skill: Concentration (+1)
    Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
    Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
    Skill: Search (+0.5)
    Feat: (Automatic) Heavy Armor Proficiency
    Feat: (Automatic) Magical Training
    Feat: (Automatic) Medium Armor Proficiency
    Feat: (Automatic) Turn Undead
    Enhancement: Follower of the Sovereign Host
    Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic I
    Enhancement: Cleric Energy of the Zealot I
    
    
    Level 5 (Cleric)
    Skill: Concentration (+1)
    Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
    Skill: Search (+0.5)
    Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
    Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Attack I
    Enhancement: Dwarven Faith I
    Enhancement: Cleric Wisdom I
    Enhancement: Cleric Wand and Scroll Mastery I
    
    
    Level 6 (Cleric)
    Skill: Concentration (+1)
    Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
    Skill: Search (+0.5)
    Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
    Feat: (Selected) Extend Spell
    Enhancement: Dwarven Faith II
    
    
    Level 7 (Cleric)
    Skill: Concentration (+1)
    Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
    Skill: Search (+0.5)
    Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
    Enhancement: Improved Heal II
    Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic II
    Enhancement: Cleric Charisma I
    
    
    Level 8 (Cleric)
    Ability Raise: WIS
    Skill: Balance (+0.5)
    Skill: Concentration (+1)
    Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
    Skill: Heal (+1)
    Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
    Enhancement: Cleric Energy of the Zealot II
    Enhancement: Cleric Improved Turning I
    
    
    Level 9 (Cleric)
    Skill: Balance (+0.5)
    Skill: Concentration (+1)
    Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
    Skill: Heal (+1)
    Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
    Feat: (Selected) Mobility
    Enhancement: Cleric Wisdom II
    
    
    Level 10 (Cleric)
    Skill: Concentration (+1)
    Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
    Skill: Heal (+1)
    Skill: Search (+0.5)
    Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
    Enhancement: Dwarven Constitution II
    Enhancement: Cleric Divine Vitality I
    
    
    Level 11 (Cleric)
    Skill: Concentration (+1)
    Skill: Disable Device (+0.5)
    Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
    Skill: Search (+0.5)
    Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
    Enhancement: Cleric Charisma II
    
    
    Level 12 (Ranger)
    Ability Raise: WIS
    Skill: Balance (+1)
    Skill: Concentration (+1)
    Skill: Disable Device (+1)
    Skill: Heal (+1)
    Skill: Search (+1)
    Skill: Spot (+1)
    Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
    Feat: (Selected) Empower Healing Spell
    Feat: (Automatic) Diehard
    Enhancement: Cleric Radiant Servant I
    
    
    Level 13 (Ranger)
    Skill: Balance (+0.5)
    Skill: Concentration (+1)
    Skill: Disable Device (+1)
    Skill: Heal (+1)
    Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
    Skill: Search (+1)
    Skill: Spot (+1)
    Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
    Feat: (Automatic) Precise Shot
    Enhancement: Unyielding Sovereignty
    
    
    Level 14 (Ranger)
    Skill: Balance (+0.5)
    Skill: Concentration (+1)
    Skill: Disable Device (+1)
    Skill: Heal (+1)
    Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
    Skill: Search (+1)
    Skill: Spot (+1)
    Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
    Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Giant
    Feat: (Automatic) Archer's Focus
    Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Attack II
    Enhancement: Ranger Item Defense I
    
    
    Level 15 (Ranger)
    Skill: Balance (+0.5)
    Skill: Concentration (+1)
    Skill: Disable Device (+1)
    Skill: Heal (+1)
    Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
    Skill: Search (+1)
    Skill: Spot (+1)
    Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
    Feat: (Selected) Spring Attack
    Feat: (Automatic) Improved Two Weapon Fighting
    Feat: (Automatic) Manyshot
    Enhancement: Ranger Tempest I
    
    
    Level 16 (Ranger)
    Ability Raise: WIS
    Skill: Balance (+0.5)
    Skill: Concentration (+1)
    Skill: Disable Device (+1)
    Skill: Heal (+1)
    Skill: Open Lock (+1)
    Skill: Search (+1)
    Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
    Feat: (Automatic) Improved Wild Empathy
    Enhancement: Ranger Dexterity II
    
    
    Level 17 (Ranger)
    Skill: Concentration (+1)
    Skill: Disable Device (+1)
    Skill: Heal (+1)
    Skill: Search (+1)
    Skill: Spot (+1)
    Skill: Use Magic Device (+1.5)
    Enhancement: Cleric Divine Vitality II
    Enhancement: Cleric Extra Turning I
    
    
    Level 18 (Ranger)
    Skill: Concentration (+1)
    Skill: Disable Device (+1)
    Skill: Heal (+1)
    Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
    Skill: Search (+1)
    Skill: Spot (+1)
    Skill: Use Magic Device (+1)
    Feat: (Selected) Quicken Spell
    Feat: (Automatic) Evasion
    Enhancement: Dwarven Axe Damage II
    
    
    Level 19 (Ranger)
    Skill: Concentration (+1)
    Skill: Disable Device (+1)
    Skill: Heal (+1)
    Skill: Open Lock (+0.5)
    Skill: Spot (+1)
    Skill: Use Magic Device (+1.5)
    Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider
    Enhancement: Ranger Favored Attack I
    Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage II
    
    
    Level 20 (Ranger)
    Ability Raise: WIS
    Skill: Concentration (+1)
    Skill: Disable Device (+1)
    Skill: Heal (+1)
    Skill: Jump (+1)
    Skill: Search (+1)
    Skill: Use Magic Device (+1.5)
    Feat: (Automatic) Greater Two Weapon Fighting
    Feat: (Automatic) Improved Precise Shot
    Enhancement: Dwarven Armored Agility I
    Enhancement: Cleric Prayer of Life I
    Enhancement: Cleric Life Magic III
    Will this build be any good for what I want to do?

    UPDATE:
    First of all I forgot I had put this out there. Oops. Second, thanks for all the excellent feedback. Lastly, I think we can all agree the answer is "No.". Still lookin' for love in all the wrong builds. <grin>
    Last edited by AMADHA; 02-12-2017 at 11:21 PM.

  2. #2
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    You want to self-heal just go 15-18 levels of ranger. 8 levels of cleric is meh, more ranger will still have CSW.
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  3. #3
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    8 Cleric really isn't awful, and provides some real benefits over ranger:
    Death Ward
    Restoration
    Unyielding Sovereignty (this is seriously nice)
    Burst heals using regenerating turns (which also clear ability damage AoE)
    Nightshield (yes you can get a clicky, but personally I have so many clickies that I skip most of them most of the time because it's a pain)
    Divine Favor (+2/+2)

    But yes, you get most of the benefit of Cleric by just going with more ranger, and would have higher caster level on your heal spells and duration on your buffs. So, which is more valuable to you, the stuff above or 1 more FE, and tempest II (really ranger doesn't offer anything else in those levels).

    Personally I went ranger 12, fighter 8 for more damage output and tactical feats, which this build will lack. D-axe (when not used with shield) is **** compared to khopesh, using feats on extend, empower, quicken and losing feats you would gain from fighter mean that overall your DPS will take a significant hit (you ignored PA, cleave chain, imp crit, OC, and toughness just for a start, not even counting stunning blow).

  4. #4
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AMADHA View Post
    So I've been doing some research and it seems that any Char I play will need to have some good spell casting to truly solo.
    By "good spell casting" we mean, "make a caster," not "splash a bunch of caster lvls onto a melee build and hope for the best."
    Major build threads: Axesinger / Dwarven Defender / Drow Ninja / Drow Paladin / Elven Ranger / Monkcher / Sacred Vanguard / Cleric Domains / Kundarak Brigade / Iconic Builds
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    By "good spell casting" we mean, "make a caster," not "splash a bunch of caster lvls onto a melee build and hope for the best."
    It's a sliding scale though really. You could make a moncher and be a very viable solo toon with any official "caster" levels. With the right playstyle, build, equipment you could solo a pure 20 ftr build on EE. Generally speaking Divine builds struggle to solo even moderate endgame content unless built to melee (or so I gather) due to the very high DCs and lack of the needed combination of spell damage and spell points. Arcane's struggle in EE unless using the cookie cutter broken shiradi builds. Pure melee struggle for obvious reasons unless on a really good build with great equipment and good FPS skills.

    But yes, building a battle clonk or Juggernaut would probably be much more effective for what the OP wants.

  6. #6
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    Is your problem that you want to add survivability (via heals) or better damage output?

    If its the former then yes of course Cleric will give you some good self-heals

    If its the latter then maybe go 8 Sorc instead, and take Earth Savant. 8 Sorc will give you Acid Rain (or Burning Blood), Melf's, Haste, Displacement, and your choice of level 1 buffs. ES will let you cast your no-save DOTs at L10, which will give you a nice complement to your melee damage. Just have to slot one Corrosion/Acid Lore item (like Rock Boots), plus the Acid prereq enhancements for ES, and your DOTs will do some pretty reliable damage without slowing down your melee chain, so its pure bonus DPS.

    No-save acid DOTs make a great splash because you can basically dump CHA and still keep full casting effectiveness. Haste and Displacement really need no explanation.

  7. #7
    Community Member Kinerd's Avatar
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    Cure Critical Wounds on a level 8 cleric has a base of (4d6 + 8 + 8) = 30.
    Cure Serious Wounds on a level 18 ranger has a base of (3d6 + 6 + 15) = 31.5.
    Hence, for raw self-healing, an 18/2 or 18/1/1 (exploiter) is better than an 11/8/1.

    No matter which build you take, I would go Maximize over Empower Healing. As the above demonstrates, you're starting with small values and HP keeps going up, and SP keeps going up.

    Death ward (and resto) is no joke, but with the advent of energy drain immunity via ED it's not as compelling.

  8. #8
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kinerd View Post
    No matter which build you take, I would go Maximize over Empower Healing.
    Emp Heal is pre-req for Radiant Servant on the cleric version; and it works with Rejuvenation Cocoon for either build.
    Major build threads: Axesinger / Dwarven Defender / Drow Ninja / Drow Paladin / Elven Ranger / Monkcher / Sacred Vanguard / Cleric Domains / Kundarak Brigade / Iconic Builds
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  9. #9
    Community Member Talon_Moonshadow's Avatar
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    I have an Elf Rgr11/Clr9 AA...

    I don't like her much, actually.

    She can self heal ok.
    She has tons of buffs.... but even with Extend the cleric buffs seem to run out too often.

    Actually I feel like she has too many buffs. Not really that fun to play clicking all the time.

    But it is not a bad build IMO. (although most people disagree with my builds...lol)


    I do believe that Rgr11 gives you all the good Ranger feats.
    The Cleric levels give you FoM.

    Not really a lot of reasons to go above Rgr11.
    Some... just not a lot....lol


    My favorite build right now (other than looks. )
    is a Half Elf Ranger 20, AA, with Cleric Dillie.

    My Second favorite (and number one for looks! )
    is an Elf Ranger 20, AA, with Invis and Displace Dragon Marks.

    For solo, bring a hirling healer and things go just fine. (helps to be able to rez the hire....lol)
    Last edited by Talon_Moonshadow; 04-05-2013 at 07:45 PM.
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  10. #10
    Community Member Dawnsfire's Avatar
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    Sounds to me like you might want to try a melee druid. It will probably do want you are looking for. The Fruidonkulous build comes to mind. . .

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  11. #11
    Community Member Kinerd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    Emp Heal is pre-req for Radiant Servant on the cleric version; and it works with Rejuvenation Cocoon for either build.
    That's true, but would RS really give you much with only 8 cleric levels? It looks like 1d8 + 1 / level, or 12.5 base. With only one metamagic feat, are you even beating potions at that point? Not by a lot, anyway.

    Regarding Cocoon, I haven't played with it on builds that already had self-healing, but could it really be that big of an increase? And by "it" I mean (Cocoon and CSW) + EH vs. Cocoon and (CSW + Max).

  12. #12
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kinerd View Post
    That's true, but would RS really give you much with only 8 cleric levels?
    No - which is part of why I would never bother with so few cleric levels on a build. Just trying to get into the OP's head about why he did it.

    It's not clear what the OP expects from cleric 8. Better healing? He gains CCW and RS bursts; but as you say, with so few cleric lvls and only one meta to boost them, they won't provide much healing. Presuming OP's TRing a mostly-rgr build, he knows they get CSW and can access Rejuvenation Cocoon; with some SP regen gear, that provides a fair bit of self-healing, with UMDing Heal scrolls for good measure. Better buffs & restores? Rgrs already get FOM, Death Ward comes in clickie form, Divine Power is largely superfluous to a rgr, most if not all of the rest come in pots or can be UMDed from wands or scrolls. DPS? He'll get Nimbus & Searing Light, but not Divine Punishment; and again the low # of cleric lvls lowers their power; and his DCs will be too low for everything else.

    Oh, and in the process he stopped at rgr lvl 11, which means no Tempest II, which costs him 10% offhand, which is, what, about a 4% DPS loss right off the bat?
    Major build threads: Axesinger / Dwarven Defender / Drow Ninja / Drow Paladin / Elven Ranger / Monkcher / Sacred Vanguard / Cleric Domains / Kundarak Brigade / Iconic Builds
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  13. #13
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    You can get much of this advantage from Druid as well. Plus with in FoTW you also get a +5CL to both Druid and Ranger spells.

    So 7 or 8 Druid gets CSW+FOM, but no deathward. Plus Fatal Harrier works well with TWF.

    12 or 13 CSW is pretty close to max: 3d6 + 6 + 12 = 28.5
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  14. #14
    Founder Mellkor's Avatar
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    A "cleric" without the heal spell will be ok up until lev 16 or so. I suspect this build will only perform well up until then. After that forget about EE quests. you MIGHT be ok in EN quests tho with a build like this. It is simply splashed too deep to be good at the things you want to be good at after lev 16 or so, IMO.
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  15. #15
    Community Member voodoogroves's Avatar
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    You'd be in a better spot with Ranger 6 / Cleric 12 / Monk-or-Fighter 2 ... how badly do you want the trap skills?
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by voodoogroves View Post
    You'd be in a better spot with Ranger 6 / Cleric 12 / Monk-or-Fighter 2 ... how badly do you want the trap skills?
    Tempest/6 Ranger requires 3 feats + GTWF. At that point it would seem better to just do a standard clonk 1 fighter/2 monk or the good old Valiance [1] 1 rogue/2 monk.

    Deep splash cleric might function better in EE as with Paladin levels.

    [1] http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=292100
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    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    Just trying to get into the OP's head about why he did it.
    I looked at the spells granted at that level and thought, "Hey, those might be handy.". Overall, I thought this might be a fun build to play but it obviously has problems.

    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    It's not clear what the OP expects from cleric 8. Better healing? He gains CCW and RS bursts; but as you say, with so few cleric lvls and only one meta to boost them, they won't provide much healing. Presuming OP's TRing a mostly-rgr build, he knows they get CSW and can access Rejuvenation Cocoon; with some SP regen gear, that provides a fair bit of self-healing, with UMDing Heal scrolls for good measure. Better buffs & restores? Rgrs already get FOM, Death Ward comes in clickie form, Divine Power is largely superfluous to a rgr, most if not all of the rest come in pots or can be UMDed from wands or scrolls. DPS? He'll get Nimbus & Searing Light, but not Divine Punishment; and again the low # of cleric lvls lowers their power; and his DCs will be too low for everything else.

    Oh, and in the process he stopped at rgr lvl 11, which means no Tempest II, which costs him 10% offhand, which is, what, about a 4% DPS loss right off the bat?
    Yup and those are the problems. That last one is a really good point. BTW not much interest in +20 levels from my side. The hardest thing I've found about DDO is that its really hard to find a character build you have fun playing that at the same time is fairly efficient at bringing death and destruction to those that would prevent you from completing your quest. :-)
    Last edited by AMADHA; 02-12-2017 at 11:13 PM.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by voodoogroves View Post
    You'd be in a better spot with Ranger 6 / Cleric 12 / Monk-or-Fighter 2 ... how badly do you want the trap skills?
    Due to time restraints, I solo a lot, and I have discovered that I REALLY like being able to disarm traps.

  19. #19
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AMADHA View Post
    I looked at the spells granted at that level and thought, "Hey, those might be handy."
    First off: great self-thread necro, OP!

    Second: obviously, there have been a lot of changes in the four years since you started this thread. Rgr 12 is the "sweet spot" for some MCed rgr builds, which provides access to lvl 12 cores (+1 crit range & multiplier). Rgr 12 / cleric 7 / rog 1 still works for a self-sufficient toon (see my outdated-but-still-doable Tempest Warpriest thread); but rgrs are so strong these days that it's hard to argue against either pure or 18/1/1 splits like Tempest Trapmonkey.
    Major build threads: Axesinger / Dwarven Defender / Drow Ninja / Drow Paladin / Elven Ranger / Monkcher / Sacred Vanguard / Cleric Domains / Kundarak Brigade / Iconic Builds
    My Build Index: a Motley Menagerie of Original Rapscallions, Pugilists, and Gimps!

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