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  1. #41
    Community Member CaptainPurge's Avatar
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    How does intimidate affect the dracolich? I was tanking him and a couple people yelled out to use intim, well that character isn't intim-built and was relying on hate. Can't seem intim to be very viable even if he's not immune to it since it would be rather easy to draw in other stuff running around.
    Cannith: Ortarr (leader of Killer Dwarfs) - Purge Bravely - Drunkungfu Master - Ortarrdo Son of Ortarr - *others*

  2. #42
    The Hatchery teh_meh's Avatar
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    Was tanking the SR this evening and SOMETHING sapped my PLIS from 45 charges to nothing instantly. I have heard others talk about this but it's the first time I've experienced it directly.

    There was no trash around me. I could not see any other party member in the vicinity, but not 100% certain. The Truthful One was on the far, opposite side of the chamber.

    I ended up dying and a the back up tank stepped in. Same thing happened to him.

    EH run btw.
    scrollfu! meowfu! +4fu! firstyfu!
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  3. #43

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    same happened to our main tank.

    As I had good view: just before charges were drained Ive seen sunburst on him(tank). Only two of us on reaver, nothing that could proc this effect so it suprised me.

    It was EH too.
    trixalai \o/ xirrantha \o/ trixilai //argonessen // Trolls Lair

  4. #44
    The Hatchery teh_meh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by khremlajn View Post
    same happened to our main tank.

    As I had good view: just before charges were drained Ive seen sunburst on him(tank). Only two of us on reaver, nothing that could proc this effect so it suprised me.

    It was EH too.
    Thanks for confirming your separate incident Trix.

    While I appreciate all the hard work that went into this guide, until we figure out exactly what is happening here, there's a huge hole in this guide. Any insight is appreciated.
    scrollfu! meowfu! +4fu! firstyfu!
    Maarl de Gutter (ret.) ~ Gnaaarl de Mutter (ret.) ~ Nineinch Rails (ret.)
    Intragreenis Druid - Human FvS [x2] Evoker ~ Guttural de Chanter - Elf Wiz [x4] PM
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  5. #45
    Community Member Robai's Avatar
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    A great guide, but I strongly disagree with one thing:
    - kiting Undead dragons all the time
    (at least, in pugs)

    I mean, a kiter should get 2 Dragons at first and the dps party should kill 1 (those dragons has LOW hp and die fast, and they don't respawn), then kill other two one by one.

    This tactics is so much easier, especially in pugs, because:
    - when kiter dies (which I've seen happening quite often when he is kiting all 3 Dragons) party gets additional problems from those 3 dragons
    - If Stormreaver tank dies (which also happens) then there is high chance that kiter will get 1-2-3-boom, which is again, an additional problem
    - When Truthful or Stormreaver are not killed at the same time (which is not rare in pugs, because the time is quite short) then you have to prep them again (without 3 dragons, it would be easier, less resources, etc.)
    - the kiter of 3 dragons is a waste of dps (i.e. if they are killed quickly then he could use his dps on Truthful or Stormreaver), especially when there are more kiters (yes, it happens quite often when the kiter has 2, and other random kiter has 1)
    - if lag hits (we know that "there is no lag ...") and those 3 dragons are still alive then it's an additional problem

  6. #46
    Community Member Blue_wizards's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainPurge View Post
    How does intimidate affect the dracolich? I was tanking him and a couple people yelled out to use intim, well that character isn't intim-built and was relying on hate. Can't seem intim to be very viable even if he's not immune to it since it would be rather easy to draw in other stuff running around.
    Intim works fine on him. Regarding dc it isn't high on EH, was making the check even on a roll of 1 on my barb. my mod (not including his size) was around 48 (23 ranks + 15 item + 4 gh + 6 cha item) so i'd say 49 is no fail.

    Regarding effectiveness, you have to keep in mind TTF (The Truthful One) has a verity of attacks and even when you have agro he will still be kinda slow to follow. If you are trying to drag him to the wall and party members are still dps'ing him then you might lose agro (unless you are ranging him and inflicting good damage compared to the 2nd hardest hitter).

    You could atract trash with you intim but this shouldn't happen unless he just spawned adds. If you do have trash on you that is best dealt withby insta kills/ranged party members/you if you can afford switching to the trash on you without losing agro.

    All in all, intim works fine and isn't hard to succeed at so go for it.

  7. #47
    Community Member Blue_wizards's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by teh_meh View Post
    Thanks for confirming your separate incident Trix.

    While I appreciate all the hard work that went into this guide, until we figure out exactly what is happening here, there's a huge hole in this guide. Any insight is appreciated.
    I haven't encountered this myself, it doesn't sound reasonable either.
    Keep in mind the SR does have other spells he can cast on you that drain charges from your PLIS. Namely Sunburst that alone will drain 8 charges. I suggest checking your combat log when such a thing happens, If it ever happens to me I will be sure to check mine and advise.

  8. #48
    Community Member Blue_wizards's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheRobai View Post
    A great guide, but I strongly disagree with one thing:
    - kiting Undead dragons all the time
    (at least, in pugs)

    I mean, a kiter should get 2 Dragons at first and the dps party should kill 1 (those dragons has LOW hp and die fast, and they don't respawn), then kill other two one by one.

    This tactics is so much easier, especially in pugs, because:
    - when kiter dies (which I've seen happening quite often when he is kiting all 3 Dragons) party gets additional problems from those 3 dragons
    - If Stormreaver tank dies (which also happens) then there is high chance that kiter will get 1-2-3-boom, which is again, an additional problem
    - When Truthful or Stormreaver are not killed at the same time (which is not rare in pugs, because the time is quite short) then you have to prep them again (without 3 dragons, it would be easier, less resources, etc.)
    - the kiter of 3 dragons is a waste of dps (i.e. if they are killed quickly then he could use his dps on Truthful or Stormreaver), especially when there are more kiters (yes, it happens quite often when the kiter has 2, and other random kiter has 1)
    - if lag hits (we know that "there is no lag ...") and those 3 dragons are still alive then it's an additional problem
    Thank you for your comment however I do not agree with it nor the points you made to reason it. In essence the longer a raid takes the more time there is for things to go wrong, resources to be spent and lag to hit. I do not believe the level of skill/gear in the raid party nor the difficulty in which the raid is done should reflect the method used. The strategy I suggest is the same for all cases (excluding tank requirements).

    Imo a party that can take down the 3 undead dragons without losses or additional resources spent can surely kite the 3 dragons until the raid has ended successfully.

    Regarding dragon kiter death: No issue here, just have a back up kiter assigned to pick off the instant the main kiter goes down. Set this roll well before the dragons appear and just remind the backup kiter should he need to act. The dragons can easily be tagged for initial agro and aren't particularly fast especially since they frequently pause for special attacks that have rather short range (trip, breath weapon).

    Regarding SR tank death: This issue has been addressed. A ranged toon (doesn't even have to be a ranged specialist) is positioned away from the party and dragon kiter in order to take immediate control over the SR should the tank die or lose agro (due to SR toss). No extra trouble here.

    Regarding TTF and SF don't die at the same time: This can happen regardless of kiting the dragons, in the case of a dragon kiter it just means the dragons are kited longer, should you choose to kill the dragons it means having the SR and TTF being tanked longer (which requires much more resources then the alternative).

    Regarding waste of dps due to kiting: Well flat out no here. Killing the dragons isn't required to complete the raid and whatever you gain by disposing of them is lost and then some in the process of killing them. Whatever DPS you put in to kill the dragons is a net loss of dps. Unless your kiter can contribute more or less the entire health of the 3 dragons put together in the form of damage to TTF or the SR then you aren't gaining any dps by disposing of the undead dragons. Lets say the dragons have 150k hp then your kiter will have to lay down 450k damage in order to "pay back" the party for eliminating his need to kite the dragons. That's roughly Elite Horoth hp. That sum is also assuming your kiter doesn't contribute at all to dps during his kiting. Should the kiter be a caster/ranged toon he can still dps TTF while kiting surely not to his full capability but every Arrow/thrown weapon/Meteor swarm/enlarged spell counts.

  9. #49
    Community Member legendkilleroll's Avatar
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    I play a pure fighter, most of my runs i tank the truthful one, try and get him as close to wall as possible so when he flies up his fireballs are blocked, some questions though

    1.I dont know if its just me losing aggro or when he does the spin attack it takes him away from the wall?, then his fireballs hit me when he flies up and with people beating on him cant always get him back to the wall.

    2.I have energy sheath elec and djinn ring, once his breath of lies hit me really hard, would it be worth making a cold absorb item? i could shield block while in sentinal to absorb, im guessing the sentinal ability stacks with the items?

    Thanks for any answers and great job on the guide

  10. #50
    Community Member Jeremiah179's Avatar
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    I tank storm reaver every time I run this quest... almost always EH.

    I also had all of my PLAV charges zapped in one instant... around 30 or more left when it happened. This was one time in over 20 runs...

    I do not know the details...but comparing to most of my runs... I only end up using about 25 charges the whole fight.

    ***

    I have seen a lot of poor kiting of the dragons. I have seen them break off and interfere with the reaver tank (me!!) and trash and become a mess.

    I don't mind when they decide to kill undead dragons right away. It seems to run cleaner...just my personal experience. Perhaps it is just that in Pug groups, you do not always have a skilled kiter for this job who can stay alive without support doing it - while also staying away from Reaver and Truth group and not spawning a bunch of trash...

    It would be my opinion. Storm Reaver Tank, CHECK. Truth Tank, CHECK. Dragon Kiter, CHECK? If no one states they can do it no problem, have done it before etc. I would strongly support killing the undead for the win...
    Jeremiiah - Isaiiah - Zephaniiah - Ghallanda - Old Timers Guild

  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by legendkilleroll View Post
    I play a pure fighter, most of my runs i tank the truthful one, try and get him as close to wall as possible so when he flies up his fireballs are blocked, some questions though

    1.I dont know if its just me losing aggro or when he does the spin attack it takes him away from the wall?, then his fireballs hit me when he flies up and with people beating on him cant always get him back to the wall.

    2.I have energy sheath elec and djinn ring, once his breath of lies hit me really hard, would it be worth making a cold absorb item? i could shield block while in sentinal to absorb, im guessing the sentinal ability stacks with the items?

    Thanks for any answers and great job on the guide
    Hi there,

    The TO will not turn his back on you as long as you maintain agro. It can be difficult to drag him to the wall and keeping agro with a melle toon if your party is ancy and starts damaging him before you got him in position and getting your hate up.

    To make your point clear, lay off the truthfull one till I get him in position, remember that caps lock is your friend! Combine caps lock with a good dose of enter-> up key-> enter (will repeat you last messege in party chat) and your messege will come out clear enough for most pugs. For courtesy add a none caps lock "plz" after the repeated messages and a "thank you" once your request has been answered.

    Regarding extra elemental abosrption items. Wouldn't bother, not for tanking the truthfull one. His AI dictates that he sticks to melle once you are toe to toe with him. He uses his breath weapon mainly when there is some distance between him and his target.

  12. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremiah179 View Post
    I tank storm reaver every time I run this quest... almost always EH.

    I also had all of my PLAV charges zapped in one instant... around 30 or more left when it happened. This was one time in over 20 runs...

    I do not know the details...but comparing to most of my runs... I only end up using about 25 charges the whole fight.

    ***

    I have seen a lot of poor kiting of the dragons. I have seen them break off and interfere with the reaver tank (me!!) and trash and become a mess.

    I don't mind when they decide to kill undead dragons right away. It seems to run cleaner...just my personal experience. Perhaps it is just that in Pug groups, you do not always have a skilled kiter for this job who can stay alive without support doing it - while also staying away from Reaver and Truth group and not spawning a bunch of trash...

    It would be my opinion. Storm Reaver Tank, CHECK. Truth Tank, CHECK. Dragon Kiter, CHECK? If no one states they can do it no problem, have done it before etc. I would strongly support killing the undead for the win...
    IMO it is easier to kite then to kill. There isn't much skill required to run in circles. If something unpredictable happens and the kiter goes down well just have a backup.

    It used to be hard to get someone to take Anna in CiTW. Not that there is much to it, people were just wary of taking a role that was important to the raid without doing it before. Any class can do the kiting. Some better then others (ranged, self healing, sprint boost, evasion, high reflex save are a + but not required).

  13. #53
    Community Member Tuberculozis's Avatar
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    Oh, how I wish I had seen this guide sooner.

    I run a PM Wizard, lvl 25. His Necro DCs are 53 and Enchant DCs are 47 (+1 to those if I have a Yugo pot). If I had to rate his gear I'd say it's about 8/10...so I probably won't be joining any EEs. I have had no freaking clue what I'm doing in FoTs I've joined so far. The guide answered many questions, but I still have a few:

    1. Boom! How far away do I need to be from party members to prevent the boom from spreading? I was in a FoT this morning and got boomed, but since I had learned from being yelled at in a previous FoT, I now knew that I had to get away from all the blue dots on the map. I did so, but I think someone died anyway. Or maybe it wasn't because of me because I wasn't NEAR near anyone and things were starting to fall apart anyway. But I still wonder: how far away do I have to be so that nobody else gets my boom germs?

    2. Wizard jobs: what is a PM Wizard supposed to be doing in FoT anyway? I know I need to be helping with trash, but when I do that (Finger, Wail, Undeath to Death, disint/polar) I usually out of SP by the time the last Dragon/Giant pair is down. Are there more effective ways to be a garbageman?

    3. How come some Air Elementals have DW and some don't? And is there a way to find out before I waste my SP trying to instakill the ones that do have DW?

    4. Crystal smackdown: speaking of saving SP, what's a good swap weapon for shooting the crystal? Because casting things at it just doesn't seem efficient. Also, what's the DR type on the crystal?

    5. I'm specced for Cold and Acid, with one point in force. I have no useful SLAs for this raid. What I usually do when TO is down and everything is under control is cast Black Dragon Bolt as much as I can. This is more of an opinion question: is just using BDB considered enough? Like will people generally think I'm doing my share of the work? What if I pull out a ranged weapon once I'm out of SP?

    6. Kiting the undead dragons: ...has resulted in a faceplant within 20 seconds every time. I either get one-shotted by (something?) or get stunned by (something?) and then killed slowly. It's like they're trying to rub it in. How do I stop failing at this?

    Any info about these points will be appreciated!
    Playing on Khyber, in guild Simple: now lvl 67!
    Main character: Naxius
    Support changes to armor kits! http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=356387

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